"Not Fair!"
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 1,637
"Not Fair!"
Last night, for the first time in 10 yrs, we had an honest conversation about the drinking. Not a conversation where I rant and rave, and he blames and deflects... open, honest communication where we each LISTENED to what the other was saying.
AH has started the whole conversation by saying, "What you're doing - it's NOT FAIR. You can't just run out on me." Rather than get all b&tchy and snippish, I very calmly responded - "What's not fair is that I am on the receiving end of all the bad behavior from your drinking. I'm the one who has to deal with you coming home mean, and dissoriented. I'm the one who has to listen to you rant and rave about how "not fun" I am. I'm the one who has to explain to the kids why you won't be home when you decide to stay at the bar for a "few more drinks". I'm the one that somehow magically balance the checkbook so you have money to spend on your drinking. I'm the one who has to sit home at night and worry about how much you've been drinking and whether or not you should even be driving. All of that - that is what's not fair. It's not fair, it's not loving, and it sure isn't respectful to me, at all. It certainly doesn't foster love in a marriage. And I've stayed, for 10 years, and yet, the behavior continues - and so now, I've decided - I'm worth more. I deserve more. I deserve to live a life without having to deal with a drunk tyrant."
He talked about how he felt the problem was the "binges" where he mixes beer and liquor - and if he just cut out the liquor - all those "bad" things would go away. "Because you see Shannon, it's the liquor - not the beer." Me, "But it's not just the liquor - you go out and you drink 5-6 glasses of wine or beer and then you drive home. That's illegal and irresponsible. You say you will control your drinking and moderate it - but that's an illusion - we both know it. You haven't yet been able to control it, and I don't see that changing anytime soon because you aren't ready to acknowledge the true problem."
He said he knows he has a drinking problem... but... (always a but!)... he just isn't ready to stop drinking beer, because he likes it. And so the conversation ended by me saying, "Well, as long as you continue to drink, you will continue to slip into binges... and as long as I'm around - I'll be the target of your frustration during those binges. And that is why I won't be around anymore."
He's just not ready to let go. I think he's bumping up against it - but the fear of not being able to drink ever again - has got him stuck. The pain of drinking does not yet outweigh the pain of not drinking for him.
Whereas for me... the pain of staying outweighs the pain of leaving.
P.S. On a side note, my baby girl graduates from pre-school today! It seems so bizarre to me that 5 years ago I was on here posting about her birth. Time flies.
AH has started the whole conversation by saying, "What you're doing - it's NOT FAIR. You can't just run out on me." Rather than get all b&tchy and snippish, I very calmly responded - "What's not fair is that I am on the receiving end of all the bad behavior from your drinking. I'm the one who has to deal with you coming home mean, and dissoriented. I'm the one who has to listen to you rant and rave about how "not fun" I am. I'm the one who has to explain to the kids why you won't be home when you decide to stay at the bar for a "few more drinks". I'm the one that somehow magically balance the checkbook so you have money to spend on your drinking. I'm the one who has to sit home at night and worry about how much you've been drinking and whether or not you should even be driving. All of that - that is what's not fair. It's not fair, it's not loving, and it sure isn't respectful to me, at all. It certainly doesn't foster love in a marriage. And I've stayed, for 10 years, and yet, the behavior continues - and so now, I've decided - I'm worth more. I deserve more. I deserve to live a life without having to deal with a drunk tyrant."
He talked about how he felt the problem was the "binges" where he mixes beer and liquor - and if he just cut out the liquor - all those "bad" things would go away. "Because you see Shannon, it's the liquor - not the beer." Me, "But it's not just the liquor - you go out and you drink 5-6 glasses of wine or beer and then you drive home. That's illegal and irresponsible. You say you will control your drinking and moderate it - but that's an illusion - we both know it. You haven't yet been able to control it, and I don't see that changing anytime soon because you aren't ready to acknowledge the true problem."
He said he knows he has a drinking problem... but... (always a but!)... he just isn't ready to stop drinking beer, because he likes it. And so the conversation ended by me saying, "Well, as long as you continue to drink, you will continue to slip into binges... and as long as I'm around - I'll be the target of your frustration during those binges. And that is why I won't be around anymore."
He's just not ready to let go. I think he's bumping up against it - but the fear of not being able to drink ever again - has got him stuck. The pain of drinking does not yet outweigh the pain of not drinking for him.
Whereas for me... the pain of staying outweighs the pain of leaving.
P.S. On a side note, my baby girl graduates from pre-school today! It seems so bizarre to me that 5 years ago I was on here posting about her birth. Time flies.
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Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NC
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Good for you, GB.
When I was drinking I had a few conversations like that with my then GF. It sounds like your husband nominally understands that this is an either/or situation but is struggling to get you to accept a "little of both." You obviously understand that he is deluding himself about liquor vs. beer. And you're also right that he is stuck - the prospect of not drinking to an alcoholic is like giving up your core, your id. It's extremely difficult to voluntarily do this, which is why so many of us get so far down before we choose to quit. And because he is an alcoholic, if the impetus comes from you or is an attempt on his part to appease you, it will fail eventually. He has to make the decision to quit, and it sure doesn't sound like he's there yet. You put it as simply as possible - you cannot live with him while hes drinking, and yet he's still sticking to "I need to drink, this is unfair."
Don't fall for it. And unfortunately, there is no guarantee that he will ever be able to quit, no matter how much pain it brings him. That's the sad reality.
When I was drinking I had a few conversations like that with my then GF. It sounds like your husband nominally understands that this is an either/or situation but is struggling to get you to accept a "little of both." You obviously understand that he is deluding himself about liquor vs. beer. And you're also right that he is stuck - the prospect of not drinking to an alcoholic is like giving up your core, your id. It's extremely difficult to voluntarily do this, which is why so many of us get so far down before we choose to quit. And because he is an alcoholic, if the impetus comes from you or is an attempt on his part to appease you, it will fail eventually. He has to make the decision to quit, and it sure doesn't sound like he's there yet. You put it as simply as possible - you cannot live with him while hes drinking, and yet he's still sticking to "I need to drink, this is unfair."
Don't fall for it. And unfortunately, there is no guarantee that he will ever be able to quit, no matter how much pain it brings him. That's the sad reality.
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 1,637
Thanks Eddie! You hit the nail on the head - he knows his choices are drink or don't drink, and you're right - he wants me to agree to a third option... "How about we both pretend I can control it?!?!?"
I'm not buying it. I know that isn't a real option.
I'm not buying it. I know that isn't a real option.
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: CA
Posts: 428
Well now I would say you are back into full recovery! What you said was just perfect. I believe once we see exactly what the reality is making decisions are much easier. It is pretty simple drink and be divorced or stop, find recovery and get your family life back to where it should be. Much easier said than done to an A, but for those of us feeling the fall out of drinking it really is that simple. Love your strength and clear mindedness! I am trying to carve out my path as well, but it is just not as easy for me at this point.
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,542
Calm heads explain the stale mate, it is what it is . I remember like it was yesterday when Mel and I had the exact same conversation. It turned out eliminating red wine didn't fix anything, eliminating vodka didn't fix anything, but admitting that we were both at an impasse did fix one persons problem. She wasn't going to quit and I wasn't going to pretend like it didn't bother me.
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 1,637
Originally Posted by Jazzman 
She wasn't going to quit and I wasn't going to pretend like it didn't bother me.
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Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 338
i still had work to do....things about me to figure out. and i had to figure them out in my own way. HE couldn't fix me. just me stopping drinking was not going to make everything ok, because i wasn't ok. and i didn't have anything left to GIVE to a relationship...with him. and so i left. and got on with my life. and he with his.
Thank you so much for your honesty. I suspect this is exactly how my AH feels. My therapist always tells me how I need to stay out of his head and not try to imagine his motives or feelings unless he is actually sharing them with me. But I think that trying to look at things from his perspective helps me to understand how much hurt he is really dealing with.
Thank you so much for your honesty. I suspect this is exactly how my AH feels. My therapist always tells me how I need to stay out of his head and not try to imagine his motives or feelings unless he is actually sharing them with me. But I think that trying to look at things from his perspective helps me to understand how much hurt he is really dealing with.
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