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Does anybody else ever feel...

Old 04-15-2011, 10:42 PM
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Does anybody else ever feel...

that you failed the alcoholic by not keeping them on their pedestal, and that you lost the faith, not them...
that you just couldn't keep up, some kind of shortcoming of yours...
that you, in your desire for peace, calm, and serenity, were the problem because you weren't embracing the constant search for thrills...
that you were the problem because you wanted life to make sense, and the secret of life that all alcoholics know but that you don't is that life's purpose isn't to make sense, but to embrace the senselessness...hence, you're the drag, you just don't get it...dummy...
that your desire for straight honest answers is so boring, and shows how low your IQ score is and how simple minded you are, when they are so interesting and complex and lies help them along in that regard...
that they are a mystery to be admired but never understood...
that straight up intimacy is boring, simplistic, and not a high enough goal, whether on the emotional or physical side...that things have to be twisted or out of the norm in order to be again, admired in their uniqueness...
That if you had half the intelligence they did, that you would smartly become an alcoholic too...because that's where it's at!

Yes...I am getting better. I don't feel all these things today, but I know at one point or another, they were the message.
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Old 04-15-2011, 10:59 PM
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Originally Posted by brokenheartfool View Post
that you, in your desire for peace, calm, and serenity, were the problem because you weren't embracing the constant search for thrills...
I can relate to this one. Yep, I'm a big ole party pooper. I don't care for loud music that disturbs the neighbors. I don't feel the instinctual desire to holler WOOO HOO for no apparent reason. And I don't find the appeal of losing control of my senses by either getting drunk or smoking weed.
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Old 04-15-2011, 11:02 PM
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Whoa. I go to Al Anon but am really beginning to think maybe I am an alcoholic as well. But then I think that is just because I am trying too hard to be more complex and wounded than I really am. Ha! I think that I am always on the search for the thrills of an alcoholic. But I will NEVER be exciting enough to hold anyone's love. Where does this total unloveability come from? I am working Step 2 right now and really am excited to foster a relationship with my higher power and myself. It is hard for me to know when I really need companionship or when I am just trying to fill a void within myself by distracting myself with someone else's stuff.

Thanks for this post. That is really really illuminating. I love the enigmatic alcoholic. What the Heck! Hearing you express these feelings so well makes me realize that I am totally predictable. This is me and how I feel, as well. I always thought the "mystery" was so exciting and special. I am now trying to see things differently. I always thought that I would want to be with a RA from now on, but I am beginning to see that maybe all that "excitement" really isn't good for me.
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Old 04-16-2011, 04:28 AM
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Yup, there is a definite archetype of the wounded, misunderstood, brilliant alcoholic, that nobody else understands. I bought into that for a long time.

I think it was only when I DID become a for-real alcoholic that I realized what a lie that really IS. I didn't feel tragic or romantic or brilliant inside--I felt like a complete mess.
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Old 04-16-2011, 07:18 AM
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This was all true for me in the past.

So brilliant, so misunderstood.

Now, it just looks, in retrospect, like...So drunk.

I cringe when I think about osme of the healthy people in my life who had to watch me play those tapes to myself, and the horror they must have felt when they realized that their smart friend, sister, or coworker was believing it...off and on.

I lost a lot of self respect, the respect of my loved ones, and some friendships over that abuse, which I allowed and danced with.
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Old 04-16-2011, 10:35 AM
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I think I felt slightly different things though relate to the feeling that somehow I did or did not do something by the script.
I think that this is the part we do our recovery. Learning to untwist our thinking and see things as they really are.
I did choose to learn from my AH, not to take life too seriously or personally. I learned that I can sit down and relax. I can let things go sometimes and not feel everything has to be done now!
I now have the time to take myself to the doctor's, get things repaired, and relax or take a day off because I choose to and not to take care of some other crises at the time.
So while in your recovery you may want to take what you can learn about taking care of yourself and your needs and leave the rest to him.
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Old 04-16-2011, 11:25 PM
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I spent the better part of a year second guessing and feeling guilty.
Who knows how much I was right about. Is he really that sneaky and untrustworthy? Who knows with someone sneaky and untrustworthy?
Ultimately, it wasn't working for me, obviously, since we are divorcing and all the rest of that craziness is irrelevant.

Don't think too hard. Consider using that energy of self doubt, and putting back into self BELIEF. Listen, honor and trust you and your instincts.

Hugs, p
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Old 04-17-2011, 03:32 PM
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Yeah, I've felt all those feelings and more.

I don't think they're true. But I still feel them.
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Old 04-17-2011, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted by LexieCat View Post
Yup, there is a definite archetype of the wounded, misunderstood, brilliant alcoholic, that nobody else understands. I bought into that for a long time.

I think it was only when I DID become a for-real alcoholic that I realized what a lie that really IS. I didn't feel tragic or romantic or brilliant inside--I felt like a complete mess.
This, is the post I needed. Thank-you.
All the posts are good though, not to leave anybody out of my thanks!
Sometimes to go forward, we need to examine backwards, as we can't wrap our head around things, and that takes time, sometimes years. It is progress to examine the behavior of the alcoholic because we need to understand. Well, speaking for myself only, I need to understand. Pick it apart like a good shrink. I'm fighting on here for my survival just as much as anybody else, and it's very painful sometimes, and this is a need of mine--to disect what he has done to me, and to understand why he did it.
Almost a year of separation and today I receive two emails that are biting, purposely, maliciously, riddled, and passive-agressive.
I almost, but not quite, felt pity for the man, then reconsidered and decided not to. It is HIS cold world, he owns it, not me, and if he so chooses to alienate everyone who has ever loved him, so be it.
He is a very smart man. But like many that are smart, he lacks common sense.
He apparently doesn't see that it is extremely obvious that those who try to inflict pain, are in fact, in pain.
So his latest rejection of me when I didn't even ask for his acceptance is yet another example of how he can't trust, can't be vulnerable, must one-up everybody, and hence can never truly love, while he throws away everyone who has ever loved him.
Sad. My pity though...nope...not anymore.
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Old 04-17-2011, 06:12 PM
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Basically blaming yourself for their addiction...yes that's me in a nutshell. ((((Hugs))))
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Old 04-17-2011, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by strengthtobeone View Post
Whoa. I go to Al Anon but am really beginning to think maybe I am an alcoholic as well. But then I think that is just because I am trying too hard to be more complex and wounded than I really am. Ha! I think that I am always on the search for the thrills of an alcoholic. But I will NEVER be exciting enough to hold anyone's love. Where does this total unloveability come from? I am working Step 2 right now and really am excited to foster a relationship with my higher power and myself. It is hard for me to know when I really need companionship or when I am just trying to fill a void within myself by distracting myself with someone else's stuff.

Thanks for this post. That is really really illuminating. I love the enigmatic alcoholic. What the Heck! Hearing you express these feelings so well makes me realize that I am totally predictable. This is me and how I feel, as well. I always thought the "mystery" was so exciting and special. I am now trying to see things differently. I always thought that I would want to be with a RA from now on, but I am beginning to see that maybe all that "excitement" really isn't good for me.
That is an interesting response.
What I explained above is very painful.
Do you not feel pain if you feel the same things?
I bought into the enigmatic alcoholic too, for a long time, because he was so successful, and knew so many things, I thought he had things to teach me.
Turns out what I needed was already inside me, it was things I know, and I am quite sure he doesn't know.
These things are the opposites of the things I posted above.
Things like:
straight forward honesty, openness, true intimacy, vulnerability, equality, and respect.
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Old 04-17-2011, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by FindingPeace1 View Post
I spent the better part of a year second guessing and feeling guilty.
Who knows how much I was right about. Is he really that sneaky and untrustworthy? Who knows with someone sneaky and untrustworthy?
Ultimately, it wasn't working for me, obviously, since we are divorcing and all the rest of that craziness is irrelevant.

Don't think too hard. Consider using that energy of self doubt, and putting back into self BELIEF. Listen, honor and trust you and your instincts.
Hugs, p
Ah...
this too I needed.
My instincts over his "superior intelligence".
He might be mensa, but he doesn't have a shred of common sense, and I'm not uneducated myself.
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Old 04-17-2011, 06:21 PM
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I don't know how I missed this thread before! But, man oh man... I've thought ALL of those things... because that's what I was told, repeatedly. And up until recently, I still believed some of them!

The last one to fall, for me, was the "if you just had more faith in me. you never supported me" BS. I truly believed that it was my job to stand by him, and "support" him by working my Al-anon program. And if I worked my program well enough, then he would get sober. I believed that. I honest to god did. I wanted to hope, and I did... but I hoped on the wrong thing.

All things for a reason. I stayed as long as I did because I didn't hit my bottom. Now I'm there, and it's time to go. The veil of denial has been lifted. I see clearly how sick and distorted all those lines are. He's still using them too. Just the other day, he said, "Well, if YOU would have take your vows seriously, we wouldn't be getting a divorce. You never supported me. Never, ever."

I know differently. And while I hear his words, I try hard not to listen and feel them... because they can and will hurt me.

Thanks for letting me share!
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Old 04-17-2011, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by GettingBy View Post
I know differently. And while I hear his words, I try hard not to listen and feel them... because they can and will hurt me.

Thanks for letting me share!
Well GettingBy...you're going through the toughest part now, simply because of the adjustment. I've been separated for a year and I'm still hearing this stuff!
Interesting FIRST FOR ME PEOPLE...
just got another email.
Instead of the usual guilt trip I go to because that's his aim...I LAUGHED!
What he wrote was...so...stupid!
It was meant to show me once again that I am the problem, and he always was the solution, but that I'm the thing that just can't be fixed!
Gettingby...if I can laugh at the latest manipulation, you will too...and hopefully a lot sooner than I did.
Those words didn't hurt me today!
Oh...shhh...keep this a secret...
he wrote more manipulative stuff, and I said "those things hurt me" ...
but honestly...shhhh....I was lying...I WAS LYING...those things didn't touch me this time!
my own form of manipulation...lol
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Old 04-18-2011, 12:30 AM
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Originally Posted by brokenheartfool View Post
That is an interesting response.
What I explained above is very painful.
Do you not feel pain if you feel the same things?
I bought into the enigmatic alcoholic too, for a long time, because he was so successful, and knew so many things, I thought he had things to teach me.
Turns out what I needed was already inside me, it was things I know, and I am quite sure he doesn't know.
These things are the opposites of the things I posted above.
Things like:
straight forward honesty, openness, true intimacy, vulnerability, equality, and respect.
Broken, I did not mean to make light of your pain. I lived with a verbally and emotionally abusive alcoholic for 6 years. I drank heavily during the last year of our marriage, and I am struggling with my tendencies on both sides of the spectrum of the disease. It is like an ah-ha moment to see myself on both sides of your post. I want peace, but can't stand to be still. I want things to be simple, yet create chaos. Intimacy is hard, I care too much or not enough. I see that I think I am superior, yet have terrible self-esteem. Thanks again for your post.
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Old 04-18-2011, 06:45 AM
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I've experienced a variation of this. Whenever I or my daughter confront AW about her drinking, she gets all indignant and says "What's the big deal? I can handle it."

Of course, she can't "handle it", but either can't see it or refuses to acknowledge it. She has a drinking buddy that visits once a week, and they talk on the phone every day. The Drinking Buddy apparently is able to hold her liquor a little better and operates as the classic enabler, telling AW that we have no right to control her life.

AW definitely plays the persecuted, misunderstood drinker and tries to lay the guilt on me.
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Old 04-20-2011, 11:25 AM
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oh gawd yes, I'm supposed to "support" him. Support what? His right to get s*** faced every day? His right to ignore his family while he spends all of his paychecks on whatever he wants, forgetting that his kids need heat, electricity and food? His right to bitch, yell, belittle, terrorize me whenever he gets "in the mood"?

No frakking thank you, I refuse to SUPPORT him anymore. I put my foot down, I'm done.
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by TeM View Post
The Drinking Buddy apparently is able to hold her liquor a little better and operates as the classic enabler, telling AW that we have no right to control her life.
Good god... they are a force to be reckoned with when they band together!!!! (kind of like us?!?!?! )

All of my AH's drinking buddies have circled the wagons for him, and are bracing him up against my recovery!! Encouraging him that he doesn't have a drinking problem... just a wife problem!!

:rotfxko
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