I can't do it
 

How can I be around my AH at all (we are separated and on the fast track to divorce path) when anything I do results in snide remarks from him IN FRONT OF OUR KIDS.

Anything I do other than coddle him, tell him I forgive him and will give him more chances etc... results in NASTY behavior.

And when I say it's not okay and tell him to stop he launches verbal crap at me and makes accusations in front of our kids that I feel compelled to respond to so that they don't believe that what he says is true.

Today was a nightmare.

I told him I had taken steps like talking to a realtor about selling our house, asked what he wanted to do about the house if he didn't like my suggestion, told him we needed to talk about finances (bc he doesn't want to involve lawyers) and bc I brough this up it got me nasty behavior that was unrelated to anything we were talking about.

Accusations:
- I am trying to micromanage his life
- I am abusive and controlling
- I have no idea what normal honesty in a relationship is about and that his lying by ommission or lying about things he has done (like drinking, stealing money from our family, etc..) aren't really that bad... "it's not as though I've cheated on you or am a drug user and you really need to get a handle on yourself" (was the exact quote)...
- repeatedly told me that I am making it impossible for him to recover bc I am behaving in ways that make it impossible for him to do so..


I know intellectually that when I change the rules of the game by changing my behavior he is bound to react poorly-- but I did not think it would be this bad...

I really thought that he'd take his recovery seriously (as he claims he "wants" to-- if I had a dollar for all the things he "wants" to do but never does I'd be a billiionaire) and we'd never be at this point-- and I also thought that if we reached this point, that whatever love we'd had when we began would mean that he wouldn't try and HURT me as much as possible... I never saw this side of him and never imagined he'd be so mean...
:c021:

I'm sorry. I relate to what you're going through. My husband has been doing that prior to my moving out; can't imagine it getting *worse*, but it seems the more alcohol controls them, the crazier the behavior will be.

The worst is that I can't blame it on his drinking bc he has been sober for a few weeks now... He's worse than ever sober bc he is able to be a lot meaner and think more clearly and be much faster with his nasty remarks... I hate it...

I'm sorry. Yes, when we upset their apple cart, they can turn downright vicious. If it were me, I'd get a lawyer, and let him deal with it. If your husband doesn't want to get a lawyer, fine. If he refuses to be cooperative, then he can just deal with your attorney. Stop trying to accommodate him. Do what is best for you and the kids and let him figure the rest out on his own.

suki you deserve an SR award or something.

wanttobehealthy, please tell me you are contacting a lawyer... please take care.

Suki is right. This is why you get a lawyer. And inquire about a restraining order to keep him away from you, the kids and the house while this is being worked out.

I'm sorry you have had such a hard time today! I hope you can keep in mind that all his talk is what we call "quacking", an active alcoholic deflecting any and all attention he can away from his problems/behavior by accusing the nearest person....in this case, you.

I hope you are able to hire an attorney. It seems as though there will be no productive way to negotiate with your AH directly. Certainly, it would take a lot of the verbal abuse out of the mix.

Hugs, HG

I would consider telling him that the next time he tries to have a conversation about the relationship in front of the kids, he is no longer welcome in your home.

Of course, the only way to keep him out is a court order. You can get an interim order, in most cases, fairly quickly. As between you and the kids, and him, I doubt whether a judge is going to make YOU move out.

You already have the prior court charges re the domestic violence. There is documented history. I don't believe he would have a prayer of staying in the house with the kids, under the circumstances.

Please talk to a lawyer and find out what your options are.

This is so hard...nothing makes me more angry than someone acting a fool in front of my kids, especially if they could in any way perceive it might be my fault. I like LexieCat's plan. I often wonder how I would handle this situation...sometimes I wonder if it is reasonable to expect to work out separating from/divorcing an alcoholic in a rational manner. I mean, if we were contemplating separating from/divorcing someone whose brain was actually functioning at full capacity, it would be different. We could actually expect coherency when discussing all the things that go along with such a decision. I kind of think if it gets to that point for me, I'll have to get everything into place financially, etc. behind his back (easy in my situation, not the same for everyone, I know) and then just move out while he's at work one day. No warning, just see you later...NOT!

Truth be told, how do you know he is sober? Are you with him 24/7?

Mine STILL claims a 3 month sobriety period. The max I have documented is 10 DAYS! Most of the time it's more like 3.

more than likely he is still drinking. I noticed a complete change in mine after the 10 day spell. And even that 10 days is generous. It may have only been 5. Regardless, history tells us all he is probably still drinking.

Try to remember:

It is futile to argue ANYTHING with an alcoholic. It is actually futile to argue with anyone, most of the time. But normal people will behave much more "normal". Alcoholics lash out, and divert attention. You can't even have a discussion with them. The don't listen, they hear what they want to hear, then they attack YOU to keep you on the defensive and off what ever it is YOU want to talk about. might this sound familiar?

I've heard all the crapola you list. It is just the delusion rantings of a madman. Really. That is all. don't waste your time. In fact, I suggest this: Give it back. This is hard for us to do. We don't think like this. But it is fun after you learn how. When he re-directs, counter with another re-direction. I used, "Give me back my sweater". I just blurted this out as soon as mine threw out a smoke screen or a pointless attack. it was great. I used this a hundred times. She never caught on. When she took the bait, with a "What are you talking about?" reaction I hit back with more nonsense. I'd say, "Don't even act like you don't know what I'm talking about. I want my darn sweater back. Today. You've had it too long". I never once gave her any details. I just kept accusing her of having my sweater. I don't even own any sweaters.

Try it. It's fun. Or try my favorite line for females; "I never did worry bout the little things", and just move one.

Really, you can't have a reasonable conversation with an unreasonable person. His behavior is unreasonable. So accept it. Lower your expectation to fit the reality at hand. Realize you can't do a darn thing about how he behaves.

the above sweater story is 100% true. Really. But it is better to just not talk to them anymore. Lawyer up, make him use email. Don't answer the phone, make him leave messages.

Read your last paragraph again. He "likes" you. He "lusts" for you. But you don't treat someone you love the way he treats you, in my opinion. He loves himself and does what he wants to do. You druthers are not important.

accuse him of taking your sweater. Report back.

wantto, He may be sober, but he's still an alcoholic. The way I see it, there's three types of A's: active alcoholics, alcoholics, and an actively recovering alcoholic.

In my experience, and alot of what I see on here, they get alot worse when they're sober and not up to their elbows in recovery (sounds like he is not even ankle deep). It's like taking a burn victim off their pain meds. Having to deal with the agony of reality, which they have become dependant on alcohol to keep them from doing, is bound to cause alot of trouble.

And to add to his misery, you're leaving him and moving on with your life. How dare you?

I'm glad you dare to. I'm right there with you. :grouphug:

Oh, and I'm also familiar with the "you're making it impossible for me" routine. The idea that since they've made the half *** decision to sober up, the rest of us are supposed to put them on a pedestal, wash their feet and wipe their rear to make the process as easy as possible for them. That always makes me mad. Obviously not going to any meeting because I know they talk about whose responsibility their recovery is in those rooms, same way we Al Anons talk about who's responsible for our recovery.

Can you tell i'm a little bitter? :c004: yeah, yeah, i'm workin on it :c016:

i'm also working on using more smiley face characters, as you can see.

Good Luck, stay strong, we can do it!

And heyimme, the moving out while he's at work thing, you just defined the next week or two of my life, that's what I've got to figure out how to do. Get out as quick as possible, and just leave a note...

How are you today wanttobe?

I'm exhausted today mentally, emotionally, physically.

Getting the girls ready this morning, even though they were both tired (as was I) and even though it was earlier than normal bc I will now be bringing them to school daily instead of their father, it was peaceful. They didn't fight with each other, they did what they were asked, they got along and seemed happy despite the early hour, being tired etc...

It really struck me as remarkable bc doing this alone is actually 100X easier than when AH is around...

As long as I do not have to interact with him in any way I'll manage...

Any progress on the lawyer front? It seems that you may need some legal representation to keep your AH in check.

I have a lawyer on retainer to represent me in the trial from when my H assaulted me this winter.

I was told that it would be best to have a lawyer speak for me so that if my H tries to make it seem that it was a false arrest or spin doctor facts from that day, I have someone else who can deal with it...

He is not a family law attorney and right now I can not afford to hire a second lawyer... I am not sure what to do.

I guess I will call my current lawyer and ask him if he can help with both issues and go from there...

Hugs to you Wanttobehealthy!

I am often surprised how much easier it is to go it alone with the two kids. I think part of it is the knowing - knowing that I have only myself to depend on (be let down by!). When my AH is in the mix, there's a good chance I'll be dissappointed. The only guarantee with him is there is NO GUARANTEE. I learned years and years ago to not hold up dinners for him. I don't send text reminders, no phone calls... just get on with what I need to do.

Please talk to a lawyer. There are so many things that can be done legally to minimize the stress and crap you are dealing with.

I'm not sure why you have a lawyer representing you on the criminal charge. Your interests in that case are represented by the prosecutor, whose job it is to handle his lawyer. If it is a criminal case, your lawyer would have no role in the case and couldn't participate at all.

I think your money would be better spent on a family lawyer for purposes of getting an interim order giving you and the kids the right to stay in the house (and requiring him to stay out unless invited).

wanttobe,

That is the best-kept secret of single parenting. What you have to do in physical exertion is easily made up for by the predictability and autonomy that you will experience by not having your children twisted up like pretzels and yourself subject to derailment at any time.

The prosecutors office is the one who recommended it. It's a long story. In part it's bc I got scared when the police came and gave them contradictory statements. My H's lawyer is all over that and trying to make this into a case of false arrest (even though there was obvious evidence that he assaulted me). It's a long story as to why I decided to hire a lawyer but it was a decision made after weighing a lot of options...

I'm so sorry you are going through this. So much of it sounds so familiar :( There is so much good advice given already. Stay strong and let us know how everything works out.