Narcissist and his children
 

A court order dictates that my two children (6 and 11) talk to their father--an alcoholic with narcissistic personality disorder--on Skype every week. Skype is a computer program that enables people to have phone conversations with video. When our kids talk to their father using Skype they do so without headsets. What they say and hear is on a loudspeaker.

Tonight, the conversation was quite boring until my babysitter overheard three disturbing points:

1) When our 6-year old son asked him "what did you do today dad?" my AXH said: "I'm trying to survive."

2) Then, AXH asked our son: "Do you see [mom's boyfriend]?" He asked this at least three times; each time our son ignored the question.

3) Then, my 11-year old daughter was describing my new computer to which he said: "Have mom send the old computer to Grandma (his mother). Don't ask your mom, just tell her."

In #1, he is trying to get our son to feel sorry for him.
In #2, he's inappropriately questioning our child.
In #3, I have long suspected covert incest. My AXH has often put our daughter in a position that is higher than mine. He has told her that she doesn't have to listen to what I say. This explains why I have been having such discipline problems with her.

This is the kind of man I have to deal with. Sometimes, I wonder if no contact at all would be better. Is there a point when no contact is better than some, even limited contact?

Yes. You are at that point.

My two cents.

Cyranoak

I know exactly what you are talking about. My xah has done lots of things just like that (except for point #3). It is terrible and it did affected the kids but I didn't realize how much I guess. Sometimes I still can't figure out 'normal' or where to draw lines. I see it even more now because my xah isn't actually narcissistic for real, he's just that way when his drinking is spiraling. He's been in rehab for 6 weeks now and skypes the kids and since he is normal on the other end they have really responded. It makes it even more clear how not OK it was before.

I'm sorry I don't have advice. I feel like I dropped the ball on this myself because once again, I have fuzzy lines on what normal parenting is I guess. I grew up with quite a bit of emotional manipulation, even though I think it was completely unintentional. Just poor boundaries. I'm really looking forward to the replies. It is a timely thread for me too.

Mamaplus2kids, if you're not already doing it, document, document, document. You may not be able record phone calls and can't use those recordings in a case, but if you're consistently journalling all of the interactions between him and your children, the journal can be used.

I wish I had more to offer than just shoulder.

Yes, no contact at this point is better than any contact.

He is quite disturbed.
Narcissists are notorious for seeing people (yes, even their own children) as objects to be manipulated to their will.

And do the documenting as the uncertainty suggested.

Beth

mama...this man is dangerous. I know you're not in a position to cut contact off completely (yet) but document EVERYTHING. Heck, place a little tape recorder near the computer desk to record the conversations and transcribe later if needed.

My XAH was a narcissist and ...a bunch of other things I can't put my finger on (delusions about the apocalypse, about him being a superior being, about his son being the new messiah, etc). He put himself in a position of not seeing our child and I didn't do a thing to stop it. Now he doesn't see her at all and I'm glad for it.

It all sounds very familiar.
And since the court order dictates contact, document everything.
My narcissist told our youngest that she is the only thing stopping him from committing suicide. A 9-year-old saying that isn't enough for he courts to take custody away from him. :(

Wow! That's terrible. I'm sorry to read that. Hopefully, you can provide your child with enough support to deal with this. THank you for the advice of documenting everything. I just wonder how a journal can be proof enough.

I wonder if it's legal to tape conversations on skype... especially on speakerphone.

It depends on where you live. Whether or not you can present it as legal evidence, you can however use the tape to document conversations that could be deemed inappropriate and/or dangerous to have with a minor. You build your case and slowly cut him out.

It's sad to have do this, but what's even sadder is that the law protects parents who are mentally ill to the detriment of their children's emotional and psychological well-being all in the name of "respecting parents' rights". Nowhere in the rhetoric is there mention of children's rights to live a sane and healthy childhood.

Ok, /rant off.

Very well said! Children should have rights!