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How dumb is this?

Old 12-19-2010, 07:39 PM
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How dumb is this?

My ex Alcoholic defacto cannot stop drinking. We have met on a few occasions recently and he says he wants to stop and still loves me and wants to be there for me and our daughter. He went away for a couple of weeks, stayed with his A father and non-A brother and he remained sober in that time. He came back home and has been making up for lost time, being drunk 24/7 for the last 3.5 weeks.

Anyway, because he is 'a great guy when he doesn't drink', and because I STILL have feelings for him, I prayed my heart out to God and asked for a miracle. Then I typed miracle cure for alcoholism into the computer and found something that seemed to me, a miracle. It is called The Sinclair Method...where you take medication one hour before drinking and then drink to your hearts content. Basically over time, it works on the receptors in your brain and fixes the neural pathways until the A abstains from alcohol or becomes a 'normal' drinker again. If the A wants to remain 'sober' they take the medication for life, only on the days they drink. So, I think "Wow, I've found the miracle cure! , (for the physical part of the addiction anyway). My ex will love this because he doesn't want to face a life of never drinking again and drinking to sobriety seems to me, an alcoholics dream!"

So, I tell the ex. I tell him it if he chose to take the medication, it may help him with the physical part of the dis-ease over time, which would leave the emotional/spiritual side. At the time, he seemed mildly enthusiastic. He said he "might try it" and I, in all my codie-ness decided to show him information on the computer about this method, to which he displayed no interest saying he was "tired".

Then last week, I copped the worst abusive phone call from him whilst he was drunk! It was horrendous...It made Mel Gibson's drunken outbursts seem tame. Normally, I hang up on him when I recognise he's been drinking. This time though, I chose to stay on the phone and listen. I really needed to take in what this man is like when he drinks because I tend minimise and rationalise his drunken behaviour, preferring to focus on and believe in the 'Dr Jeckyll' side of his personality instead of the vicious and hideous "Mr Hyde".

So, my exercise in finding the 'cure' for the ex has resulted in me questioning how far I've really come in my recovery. I suppose it's okay that I would share some new information with him, especially apparent "ground breaking", so called "cures" (yeah, right...the alcohol is but a mere symptom of a greater emotional and spiritual malady), but it still shows me I was focussing on him instead of me. It's also helped me realise AGAIN, this man WANTS to be drunk. He LOVES it. He tells me he loves drinking and going "out there" and "searching" and listening to music while he drinks. It's helped me realise, AGAIN, that there is no miracle. He and any alcoholic will only get sober IF they have their own light bulb moment and choose to get sober and I also realise that some people will never get well.

Right now, I feel like I'm done with him...I'm also disappointed in myself. I know it can be like three steps forward, two back, but I'm wondering how many more years is it going to take for me to 'get it'?
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Old 12-20-2010, 01:18 AM
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JUST FOR TODAY I will try to live through this day only, and not tackle all my problems at once. I can do something for twelve hours that would appall me if I felt that I had to keep it up for a lifetime.
JUST FOR TODAY I will be happy. This assumes to be true what Abraham Lincoln said, that "Most folks are as happy as they make up their minds to be."
JUST FOR TODAY I will adjust myself to what is, and not try to adjust everything to my own desires. I will take my "luck" as it comes, and fit myself to it.
JUST FOR TODAY I will try to strengthen my mind. I will study. I will lean something useful. I will not be a mental loafer. I will read something that requires effort, thought and concentration.
JUST FOR TODAY I will exercise my soul in three ways: I will do somebody a good turn, and not get found out; if anybody knows of it, it will not count. I will do at least two things I don't want to do - just for exercise. I will not show anyone that my feelings are hurt; they may be hurt, but today I will not show it.
JUST FOR TODAY I will be agreeable. I will look as well as I can, dress becomingly, keep my voice low, be courteous, criticize not one bit. I won't find fault with anything, nor try to improve or regulate anybody but myself.
JUST FOR TODAY I will have a program. I may not follow it exactly but I will have it. I will save myself from two pests: hurry and indecision.
JUST FOR TODAY I will have a quiet half hour all by myself and relax. During this half hour, sometime, I will try to get a better perspective on my life.
JUST FOR TODAY I will be unafraid. Especially I will not be afraid to enjoy what is beautiful, and to believe that as I give to the world, so the world will give to me.

reprinted with permission of Al-Anon Family Group Headquarters, Inc., Virginia Beach, VA


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Old 12-20-2010, 01:41 AM
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It's hard, isn't it? Just when I think I've let go completely (the divorce is final and everything) I find myself back in the How can I 'help' him mode. This time I caught myself thinking that if I forward a copy of information to his codie GF maybe she'll work on getting XAH to do the right thing.

Ummm, yeah. She can nag him about his responsibilities all she wants, it's not going to make him hear her any better than he heard me or the court. Bleahhhh.

At least we each caught our trains of thought, right? Don't be so hard on yourself. We're working on our own recovery and it takes time to change the way we deal with this too.
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Old 12-20-2010, 04:50 AM
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dear floss, there is a miracle cure to alcoholism and that is god's Grace. when the alcoholic finally cries out "dear god, what have i done! what am i doing! to myself, to You, to those that love me, with my precious life." when in their repentence, they look outside of themselves to how they can help others, then the miracle occurs and the obsession removed.

other than that, i think it is possible to abstain from alcohol but not really be fully healed, emotionally, physically and spirtually.

i relate very much to seeking a cure for someone else and have their response be apathy, disinterest and boredom. it's disheartening when there is a solution but they simply are not interested at this time. i know that disconnect and hopelessness that i used to feel, because it all seemed so unnecessary.

however, in recovery, i have learned to step aside and let people live their own lives, without having to live it how i think they should live it. people are in different stages of spiritual evolution and i accept that.

for myself, i find peace in sharing my experiences to help those who want assistance, like the people gathered here. with those who don't want help, oftentimes, silence is the best choice and to physically remove myself from witnessing their downward spiral, with compassion and acceptance, for both the addict and also, myself.

if you wish to be of service, there are people who are requesting help. i don't think that being a codependent in recovery means to never help anyone anymore. for me, it means to help those who ask for my assistance rather than beating a dead horse.

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Old 12-20-2010, 07:18 AM
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Then I typed miracle cure for codependency into the computer and found something that seemed to me, a miracle. It is called The Coyote Method...where you take medication one hour before helping and then help to your hearts content. Basically over time, it works on the receptors in your brain and fixes the neural pathways until the codependent abstains from helping or becomes a 'normal' helper again. If the codependent wants to remain 'healthy' they take the medication for life, only on the days they interfere. So, I think "Wow, I've found the miracle cure! , (for the physical part of the addiction anyway). I will love this because I don't want to face a life of never interfering again and helping to normalcy seems to me, an codependents dream!"

I'm actually writing this book right now, it comes with a month's supply of sugar pills. Once it hits the best seller list, I plan to use the proceeds to throw a big all expenses paid week long codie reunion and fly all of us out to some tropical island for a little R&R, and a work shop on codependency.

I hope you don't let my post upset you, I was where you are with my axw for a long while, so I do understand. It helped me see the irony, when I read a post on here where someone exchanged the word alcoholic with codependent. It's kind of two sides of the same coin.

I think you're getting it. Each time you "go to the well", you get it a little more.

Thanks and God bless us all,
Coyote
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Old 12-20-2010, 08:29 AM
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I am 99% sure that my As much worse off 50 year old uncle did this method(and about 10 tries at rehab) and he came out and went to the bar in a week and drank. The family had put up the money, and they were deveastated.

They also tried a different method, it was some type of brain reprogramming, no program, no AA, no Higher power. He went to the bar next day after that one.

The truth is,if he does not want to stop, he will not. If he does not come to it on hs own, he wont have REALLY come to it.

just my information...
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Old 12-20-2010, 03:33 PM
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If I answered this question...

...I would be banned from this board forever, everybody here would hate me, and Desert Eyes would hunt me down and cut off my fingers.

Having said that, Floss, for the love of God if you have not done so already please, please, please start going to Al-Anon no matter what it takes to do so. How to find a meeting in the US/Canada/Puerto Rico

Take care,

Cyranoak
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Old 12-20-2010, 06:24 PM
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Thankyou to everyone for your replies. Phoenix, I love the Just For Today list. Thank you for sharing that. Thanks Uncertainty for your response. Naive, I totally agree with what you're saying and I get a little cranky with myself when I step out of reality and go into fantasy mode. Staying grounded and looking at things without rose coloured glasses is something I've struggled with all my life and just when I thought I'd well and truly thrown the glasses away, I found myself looking through them again. I am continually helping people in different ways, and yes, learning to guard myself from those who don't wish to help themselves (a hard thing to do at times, but I'm slowly getting there). I gave up volunteer telephone counselling after a particularly difficult suicide call and then finding a suicide 4 days later, the result of alcoholism and separation for the poor fellow. In my life now, apart from raising my five children on my own, I'm a good friend. I do, however, have to watch my tendency to take on too much. So taking time out for me, when I'm able, and not 'helping' when I'm physically, emotionally and mentally exhausted is something I'm starting to do.

Coyote, I laughed at your response. Too true! Hey, I need a tropical island holiday, all expenses paid! Buffalo, yes, you're right, they will only stop if they want to. This is what I'm so cranky about! I know this, and yet, for a moment, it looked like a little ray of hope to me! Can't even believe I went there in my head!

Ha ha, Cyranoek, I know it was dumb! Really dumb! But, oh well, we live and we learn again... As for Al-Anon, I've been going on and off for years. The problem is, I find myself dragging my feet to the meeting in my area and find AA a better fit for me (maybe because I'm an ACoA and have the disease without necessarily picking up the drink?). Anyway, after reading your reply, I asked myself why I drag my feet to Al-Anon. This is what I've come up with....
1) I don't live with any A's and so, don't need to learn how to detach from them whilst they're drunk under the same roof (although I know I need to detach from the ones that are in my life and not living with me regardless).
2) I am so sick of putting any focus on the A's (I know it doesn't sound like it from my post). I don't want to sit in a meeting and hear about all the ways I can live in spite of the A's in my life. I want a meeting where the focus is on me and not revolving around 'them'. I want to heal my spiritual malady and I know for me, that's going to take heavy duty work. I need an ACoA meeting where they use the 'red book' and it's a meaty, intense, in your face kind of support group. Sometimes I find Al-Anon too wishy washy and soft (sorry if I'm offending anyone!).
3. Everyone in the Al-Anon group I go to is between 60 to 80+ years of age. None of them have active A partners in their lives. All their partners are either dead, in AA and sober for years and years and one is around 80 and has dementia. A couple of them have A children. There was one younger member for a while (about 40 years of age), with an active A partner. She's also in the AA fellowship. We related well to each other but she left after a time because she felt it wasn't a good fit for her and she didn't relate that well to the rest of the group.
4. There are not many groups to pick from in my area...so, finding a better fit is a hard thing to do.
5. That's probably why I like AA better. They work the steps in a more 'in your face' kind of way and I can relate to it better.
So, I'm thinking about starting my own ACoA meeting next year. I've heard some of them are very similar to Al-Anon and some of them focus on the Red Book. I'd like to get into the nitty gritty and go through the Red Book, one step at a time. Even if it's a meeting for one to begin with, I'm going to do it...Plus, I'm going back to start counselling again after Christmas. Come hell or high water, I'm going to recover! lol...
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Old 12-21-2010, 01:58 AM
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Old 12-21-2010, 03:16 PM
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That's awesome!

And understood on Al-Anon as you have experienced it. Where I live in the United States Al-Anon isn't so soft as you can probably tell from my posts, focuses entirely on me rather than my AW, and you would find the average age of a group in my area is much, much, much lower than yours (I'd say around 40). I guess what works here may not work everywhere.

I also hear you on AA. My rotation, even though I don't consider myself an alcholic, includes two Al-Anon meetings and one open AA group where I'm their token "normie." I find it helps my recovery to be more rounded, and helps me to not hate alcoholics (which is my gut reaction to them).

That said, I think your idea to start an ACOA group, expecially if you live in or around a bigger city like Sydney or Melbourne, will probably be a blessing to many, many people. I wish there were a good ACOA or Alateen meeting in my area for my daughter (and there is not).

Good luck!

Cyranoak

P.s. What the heck is the red book? Maybe I don't know because my folks didn't drink.


Originally Posted by Floss View Post
Thankyou to everyone for your replies. Phoenix, I love the Just For Today list. Thank you for sharing that. Thanks Uncertainty for your response. Naive, I totally agree with what you're saying and I get a little cranky with myself when I step out of reality and go into fantasy mode. Staying grounded and looking at things without rose coloured glasses is something I've struggled with all my life and just when I thought I'd well and truly thrown the glasses away, I found myself looking through them again. I am continually helping people in different ways, and yes, learning to guard myself from those who don't wish to help themselves (a hard thing to do at times, but I'm slowly getting there). I gave up volunteer telephone counselling after a particularly difficult suicide call and then finding a suicide 4 days later, the result of alcoholism and separation for the poor fellow. In my life now, apart from raising my five children on my own, I'm a good friend. I do, however, have to watch my tendency to take on too much. So taking time out for me, when I'm able, and not 'helping' when I'm physically, emotionally and mentally exhausted is something I'm starting to do.

Coyote, I laughed at your response. Too true! Hey, I need a tropical island holiday, all expenses paid! Buffalo, yes, you're right, they will only stop if they want to. This is what I'm so cranky about! I know this, and yet, for a moment, it looked like a little ray of hope to me! Can't even believe I went there in my head!

Ha ha, Cyranoek, I know it was dumb! Really dumb! But, oh well, we live and we learn again... As for Al-Anon, I've been going on and off for years. The problem is, I find myself dragging my feet to the meeting in my area and find AA a better fit for me (maybe because I'm an ACoA and have the disease without necessarily picking up the drink?). Anyway, after reading your reply, I asked myself why I drag my feet to Al-Anon. This is what I've come up with....
1) I don't live with any A's and so, don't need to learn how to detach from them whilst they're drunk under the same roof (although I know I need to detach from the ones that are in my life and not living with me regardless).
2) I am so sick of putting any focus on the A's (I know it doesn't sound like it from my post). I don't want to sit in a meeting and hear about all the ways I can live in spite of the A's in my life. I want a meeting where the focus is on me and not revolving around 'them'. I want to heal my spiritual malady and I know for me, that's going to take heavy duty work. I need an ACoA meeting where they use the 'red book' and it's a meaty, intense, in your face kind of support group. Sometimes I find Al-Anon too wishy washy and soft (sorry if I'm offending anyone!).
3. Everyone in the Al-Anon group I go to is between 60 to 80+ years of age. None of them have active A partners in their lives. All their partners are either dead, in AA and sober for years and years and one is around 80 and has dementia. A couple of them have A children. There was one younger member for a while (about 40 years of age), with an active A partner. She's also in the AA fellowship. We related well to each other but she left after a time because she felt it wasn't a good fit for her and she didn't relate that well to the rest of the group.
4. There are not many groups to pick from in my area...so, finding a better fit is a hard thing to do.
5. That's probably why I like AA better. They work the steps in a more 'in your face' kind of way and I can relate to it better.
So, I'm thinking about starting my own ACoA meeting next year. I've heard some of them are very similar to Al-Anon and some of them focus on the Red Book. I'd like to get into the nitty gritty and go through the Red Book, one step at a time. Even if it's a meeting for one to begin with, I'm going to do it...Plus, I'm going back to start counselling again after Christmas. Come hell or high water, I'm going to recover! lol...
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Old 12-21-2010, 03:54 PM
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Cyranoek, I'd give anything to go to an Al-Anon meeting like yours! It's sounds like exactly what I need! That's probably why I turned to AA! It has people of all ages from young to old. It's way more in-your face and I need that. Seriously, at the Al-Anon meeting I go to, I find it difficult hearing over and over again how said partner with dementia is being moved from room to room in the nursing home and how another member started to experience hot flushes again at the age of 70 something, and which books need recovering with plastic. And they don't work the steps. They just read out of Courage to Change, Hope for Today etc. Don't get me wrong, they're lovely people, but I am in such a different place!

Okay, the Big Red Book and Workbook that goes along with it, can be sourced from the World Service Organisation. It only came out in 2007 I believe...From what I've researched, it sounds pretty intense! I come from Sydney but I moved 3 hours South almost 11 years ago. It's a little hicksville where I live now, compared to Sydney and I think people who don't drink or drug are in the minority here, but I'm going to start a meeting. I've found someone else who'd like to attend. So, it'll be a meeting for two to begin with and we'll see after that. With regard to your daughter, the WSO website has starter packs for people who want to start up their own ACoA meetings. Maybe you could start one yourself too? I'm going to order a pack and see what's in it.... Thanks for your reply C...
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