Update: He is back, starts work on Tuesday..suddenly able to do that?
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,175
Update: He is back, starts work on Tuesday..suddenly able to do that?
After he left when I asked for some time, and his mother flagrantly flamed me on facebook, then scolded me for 1/2 hour via text/IM, he stayed away for a few days.
He came back saying his sobriety is being compromised, and could we figure out what is best, and what can work for everyone.
We argued. I laid out four options:
-He takes his dysfunctions to the basement
-He gets his own place, we are no longer working on us, he taes son for 2 days/week.
-He gets his own place for 6months, he works on his self authority, we still see each other, coparenting.
-He goes back to work, we see if the problems are solved if he is active everyday.
In his initial anger, he stated that he could move out, by borrowing money, start work, take son a few days a week, get him to school, etc...
I stated, "how is it that as soon as I am fed up with you NOT being able to do those things, that you SUDDENLY are able to go somewhere else and do them...?"
Why could he not just start doing them here?
He initially claimed, that he felt that I was freaking out because he WAS just about to be able to do those things, and I am a sabotager...(quack!)
I quietly laughed that off.
It was within a few hours that he checked his account and discovered that his Unemployment Commpensation was up. No extension. It just ran out.
Within an hour after that, he got a call from his cousin who asked when/if he would be ready to start the job again, that he needed him.
NOw, this is testament to HP at work, and that I could trust that ,and know that I was not the ONLY force pushing him toward getting off the pot.
He got off the phone, and said he guessed we would have to try the fourth option, since he now has no income, and the job is ready for him.
SO, he starts Tuesday.
in the words of Alanis Morisette, "Thank you consequence!!!"
The universe is working with me.
No word at all from the MIL, who chastised me for wantng a break, and who left town the day after the conflict to visit her nephew in North Carolina to 'get away for a few days'....
He came back saying his sobriety is being compromised, and could we figure out what is best, and what can work for everyone.
We argued. I laid out four options:
-He takes his dysfunctions to the basement
-He gets his own place, we are no longer working on us, he taes son for 2 days/week.
-He gets his own place for 6months, he works on his self authority, we still see each other, coparenting.
-He goes back to work, we see if the problems are solved if he is active everyday.
In his initial anger, he stated that he could move out, by borrowing money, start work, take son a few days a week, get him to school, etc...
I stated, "how is it that as soon as I am fed up with you NOT being able to do those things, that you SUDDENLY are able to go somewhere else and do them...?"
Why could he not just start doing them here?
He initially claimed, that he felt that I was freaking out because he WAS just about to be able to do those things, and I am a sabotager...(quack!)
I quietly laughed that off.
It was within a few hours that he checked his account and discovered that his Unemployment Commpensation was up. No extension. It just ran out.
Within an hour after that, he got a call from his cousin who asked when/if he would be ready to start the job again, that he needed him.
NOw, this is testament to HP at work, and that I could trust that ,and know that I was not the ONLY force pushing him toward getting off the pot.
He got off the phone, and said he guessed we would have to try the fourth option, since he now has no income, and the job is ready for him.
SO, he starts Tuesday.
in the words of Alanis Morisette, "Thank you consequence!!!"
The universe is working with me.
No word at all from the MIL, who chastised me for wantng a break, and who left town the day after the conflict to visit her nephew in North Carolina to 'get away for a few days'....
Belgian Sheepdog Adictee
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: In Today
Posts: 6,101
(((((Buffalo66)))))
Please don't take this wrong ................... I have been reading your threads (updates) and the ongoing 'drama' is exhausting me, so I have no idea how you are handling it, to be honest.
Just a thought, but maybe it would be better, if he did get his own place for however long it takes for his ACTIONS to show he is changing and the only time you two have contact is about your child and visitation dates.
That would give you a chance to 'step back' from the 'drama', take care of just you and your child, and just 'watch' his actions.
It just seems to me that you need some definite 'drama' relief. I don't remember if you are going to therapy or Al-Anon but now would be a great time to start or 'beef up' your attendance FOR YOU.
Yes, I have been where you are, although no child was involved, and I finally had no choice, for my own sanity and well being but to say ENOUGH, and get some serious help to learn how NOT to be sucked back in.
In the meantime please know that healing thoughts and prayers are going out for your whole family from NM.
Love and hugs,
Please don't take this wrong ................... I have been reading your threads (updates) and the ongoing 'drama' is exhausting me, so I have no idea how you are handling it, to be honest.
Just a thought, but maybe it would be better, if he did get his own place for however long it takes for his ACTIONS to show he is changing and the only time you two have contact is about your child and visitation dates.
That would give you a chance to 'step back' from the 'drama', take care of just you and your child, and just 'watch' his actions.
It just seems to me that you need some definite 'drama' relief. I don't remember if you are going to therapy or Al-Anon but now would be a great time to start or 'beef up' your attendance FOR YOU.
Yes, I have been where you are, although no child was involved, and I finally had no choice, for my own sanity and well being but to say ENOUGH, and get some serious help to learn how NOT to be sucked back in.
In the meantime please know that healing thoughts and prayers are going out for your whole family from NM.
Love and hugs,
Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: SERENITY
Posts: 58
Sounds like you have boundaries....very good! Just remember to say what you mean, and mean what you say. To be honest, its none of your MIL business. Let me guess....she may be an enabler? If so, I have a great one, too. She is paying the mortgage on my house, while he lives there. He hasnt worked in over 10 years. She was never to be found everytime he would binge. Take care of yourself and go to alanon!!!
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,175
One of the four options was for him to go back to work, and see if the pressure and anxiety and resentment calmed down for me a bit while he was being active and dealing with HIS life more actively everyday.
I came up with those options. I presented them.
His life made the choice for him, for us. I keep on keeping on, and my maxim is, if I feel trodden on, and cannot reel it back in, then I have lost my independence. I do not feel trodden on in a way that I am not reeling it in, making my day mine, and still expressing my needs, my frustrations.
I am operating day to day, staying detached as much as I can, owning what is mine, checking in with my sponsor, and attending regular meetings, as well as SR.
I am making boundaries, not walls, here, because he is working on himself. AND because I tend to buck, and cave entirely when I make a wall. Know thyself.
I have been at this for a long time.
This is progress for me, making lists, offering options that work for me.
This option DOES work for me. Until it doesnt, then I will reassess and reapproach.
I could let him go, run away, fast and hard, I could forgive and forget, completely surpass all this mayhem, I could go on with my life, meet someone new, co parent my son with him, from a distance, but...guess what---?
I would be pretending to be at that point, at that level of acceptance, of forgiveness for myself, for him. I would be pretending that I am above and over it all.
I am not.
Know Thyself.
In all these years I have tried all that. I was not ready, and my emotional matrix responded to that by jumping deeper in, all abandon, no rules, boundaries, or self check. Because I was still in fear, and self judgement and I was Not Ready.
I cannot fake this. I am sorry if some of you have had enough of me and my drama. But I am working my way through, and I am in a better place with myself than I have ever been in regard to him, his projections, his chaos.
I am here with my eyes open, unafraid to make a line in the sand.
Forgiveness and processing through painful dysfunction is hard,
If you fake it you will fail, because it cannot be faked. It will resurface, IF NOT WITH HIM, WITH THE NEXT PERSON I INVOLVE MYSELF WITH.
So..I am just going to keep on in my work. I am pleased with my progress, and my sponsor agrees that I am really hitting a balanced stride in terms of detaching, with my issues, weaknesses, and the REALISTIC self knowledge that making an extreme break with my sons father will plunge me back in deeper with him without any boundaries in a matter of short time.
I am not under any self delusions. I have some other issues that require my self honesty, about what I am willing to take on alone, and what I can tolerate to get the partnership I need at whatever level is available from him.
We have a son who has a sickness, it takes a lot out of me emotionally. I deal with most of the doctors, I deal with a lot of the other stuff, too. But, having the other person who is responsible for this life there to talk to about it, to help make decisions about it. Having him here, sober, of mostly clear mind, able to be playful with a 5 year old when I am wracked with anxiety over health issues is invaluable to me.
I respect your right to respectfully disagree.
I came up with those options. I presented them.
His life made the choice for him, for us. I keep on keeping on, and my maxim is, if I feel trodden on, and cannot reel it back in, then I have lost my independence. I do not feel trodden on in a way that I am not reeling it in, making my day mine, and still expressing my needs, my frustrations.
I am operating day to day, staying detached as much as I can, owning what is mine, checking in with my sponsor, and attending regular meetings, as well as SR.
I am making boundaries, not walls, here, because he is working on himself. AND because I tend to buck, and cave entirely when I make a wall. Know thyself.
I have been at this for a long time.
This is progress for me, making lists, offering options that work for me.
This option DOES work for me. Until it doesnt, then I will reassess and reapproach.
I could let him go, run away, fast and hard, I could forgive and forget, completely surpass all this mayhem, I could go on with my life, meet someone new, co parent my son with him, from a distance, but...guess what---?
I would be pretending to be at that point, at that level of acceptance, of forgiveness for myself, for him. I would be pretending that I am above and over it all.
I am not.
Know Thyself.
In all these years I have tried all that. I was not ready, and my emotional matrix responded to that by jumping deeper in, all abandon, no rules, boundaries, or self check. Because I was still in fear, and self judgement and I was Not Ready.
I cannot fake this. I am sorry if some of you have had enough of me and my drama. But I am working my way through, and I am in a better place with myself than I have ever been in regard to him, his projections, his chaos.
I am here with my eyes open, unafraid to make a line in the sand.
Forgiveness and processing through painful dysfunction is hard,
If you fake it you will fail, because it cannot be faked. It will resurface, IF NOT WITH HIM, WITH THE NEXT PERSON I INVOLVE MYSELF WITH.
So..I am just going to keep on in my work. I am pleased with my progress, and my sponsor agrees that I am really hitting a balanced stride in terms of detaching, with my issues, weaknesses, and the REALISTIC self knowledge that making an extreme break with my sons father will plunge me back in deeper with him without any boundaries in a matter of short time.
I am not under any self delusions. I have some other issues that require my self honesty, about what I am willing to take on alone, and what I can tolerate to get the partnership I need at whatever level is available from him.
We have a son who has a sickness, it takes a lot out of me emotionally. I deal with most of the doctors, I deal with a lot of the other stuff, too. But, having the other person who is responsible for this life there to talk to about it, to help make decisions about it. Having him here, sober, of mostly clear mind, able to be playful with a 5 year old when I am wracked with anxiety over health issues is invaluable to me.
I respect your right to respectfully disagree.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,175
I hope that the previous post does not come off as overly defensive.
I appreciate all kind of love, tough and otherwise.
call 'em as you see 'em. I do the same for you all.
I appreciate all feedback, even if I defend myself.
Thank you all. I have a great deal of gratitude for your input, and your patience .
I appreciate all kind of love, tough and otherwise.
call 'em as you see 'em. I do the same for you all.
I appreciate all feedback, even if I defend myself.
Thank you all. I have a great deal of gratitude for your input, and your patience .
Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: right here, right now
Posts: 6,516
Buffalo,
Whenever I read anything here, or anyone IRL gives me advice, I think of it in the context of where they are coming from. We can only give advice based on our own knowledge and experience. I can't lie -- when I read your posts, my gut reaction is "RUN! And RUN FAST!!!"
When I left my X, a lot of people told me to give it time, see how his recovery went, and withhold judgment on whether I really wanted to divorce him. All of the people that gave me that advice were people who were themselves in tenuous marriages, who were holding on teeth and nail and needed, for their own sake, to tell me that just because you're married to an alcoholic doesn't mean you can't stay married.
I have been in a situation similar to where you are, and I don't pretend to know what it feels like for you. But I know that when I was fighting to make my life work in a marriage with an active A, I completely and utterly resented being told that "the only way you can live your own life is leaving this [insert expletive here] in the dust."
Now, it turned out they were right. But even so, I am very grateful that I didn't take their advice and leave then. Because if I had left when it seemed like everyone around me told me I should, then I would just have replaced one authority (the As) with another (that of my friends and counselor).
I needed to take the time necessary to come to my own conclusion. On a parallel track, a friend with a similar situation (AH in high-profile job, couldn't even go to Al-Anon meetings in her small town because Then Everyone Would know) chose to wait her AH's recovery out. I respect her choice, and it appears that they are successfully working on their marriage. It's not an easy path she's chosen, but it's her choice, just as my choice to leave is mine.
It's taken a long time for me to accept that most of the advice I get comes from a place of love and caring. It's taken even longer to graciously thank people for their advice whether I take it or not. You're doing great in being able to listen and disagree. And I encourage you to make your choices in your own time, because that is the way you will know that they were yours and you don't have to second-guess them.
Lots of love to you.
Whenever I read anything here, or anyone IRL gives me advice, I think of it in the context of where they are coming from. We can only give advice based on our own knowledge and experience. I can't lie -- when I read your posts, my gut reaction is "RUN! And RUN FAST!!!"
When I left my X, a lot of people told me to give it time, see how his recovery went, and withhold judgment on whether I really wanted to divorce him. All of the people that gave me that advice were people who were themselves in tenuous marriages, who were holding on teeth and nail and needed, for their own sake, to tell me that just because you're married to an alcoholic doesn't mean you can't stay married.
I have been in a situation similar to where you are, and I don't pretend to know what it feels like for you. But I know that when I was fighting to make my life work in a marriage with an active A, I completely and utterly resented being told that "the only way you can live your own life is leaving this [insert expletive here] in the dust."
Now, it turned out they were right. But even so, I am very grateful that I didn't take their advice and leave then. Because if I had left when it seemed like everyone around me told me I should, then I would just have replaced one authority (the As) with another (that of my friends and counselor).
I needed to take the time necessary to come to my own conclusion. On a parallel track, a friend with a similar situation (AH in high-profile job, couldn't even go to Al-Anon meetings in her small town because Then Everyone Would know) chose to wait her AH's recovery out. I respect her choice, and it appears that they are successfully working on their marriage. It's not an easy path she's chosen, but it's her choice, just as my choice to leave is mine.
It's taken a long time for me to accept that most of the advice I get comes from a place of love and caring. It's taken even longer to graciously thank people for their advice whether I take it or not. You're doing great in being able to listen and disagree. And I encourage you to make your choices in your own time, because that is the way you will know that they were yours and you don't have to second-guess them.
Lots of love to you.
Rising from the Ashes
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Republic of Texas
Posts: 451
Buffalo, Your relationship with your active alcoholic husband sounds so similiar to my situation with my dry drunk husband. Are you sure you are not a younger version of me?
You wrote "I stated, 'how is it that as soon as I am fed up with you NOT being able to do those things, that you SUDDENLY are able to go somewhere else and do them...?' "Why could he not just start doing them here?'"It sounds like your AH doesn't listen to you. My DDH doesn't listen to me, either. My DDH will take other people's advice, which just reinforces what I was talking him to about.
Check out the threads on validation.
"He initially claimed, that he felt that I was freaking out because he WAS just about to be able to do those things, and I am a sabotager...(quack!) I quietly laughed that off." Your AH, just like my DDH, is invalidating our feelings.
"I came up with those options. I presented them. His life made the choice for him, for us."I felt my relationship with my DDH is a day late......and a dollar short, so I gave him only two things that I wanted from him: to get a physical; and to start individual counseling. Well, he ended up breaking vertebrates in his neck, so he's now under the care of a physician. I'm still waiting for him to start his counseling.
"Because I was still in fear, and self judgement and I was Not Ready. I cannot fake this."I understand the feeling of not being READY to move forward with my live.
My current attempt during this last week was to try to get some help from the Texas Department of Family and Protective Services. Everything that I have tried in the past seems to have backfired on me, I'm scared of doing anything! I had made a self-referral a couple of months ago to the TDPS, and S----- M------- T------- made a home study. The last thing I heard her say was that she was going to keep my case open, and she would talk to my husband. This never happened. Her only recommendation was for me to move out either to live independently or in assisted living arrangements. I just wasn't READY to move out upon her recommendations. Physically detaching from our alcoholics JUST is NOT an easy decision.
Another thread I recommend you read is "Psychological/emotional/ verbal Abuse".
With the help of my friends here on SR, through my own therapist, and through the help of my Heavenly Father, I do believe I will be READY in January to move out!
Love and Peace,
Phoenix
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: behind the viewfinder...
Posts: 6,278
FWIW Buffalo, I think you're doing just fine. 
You are having a difficult time, and that is to be expected. Trying to work out a relationship while both people are working out their own recovery is a massive undertaking.
I hear a lot of acceptance in this post. Ultimately, I believe that is the best possible place to be. Leaving or staying is not the issue, acceptance is. He is who he is, and you are accepting that for now. At some point, it may turn out that who he is is not who you want to spend your life with, and that's also fine. As long as you stay in acceptance and avoid trying to change him into something else, you will be fine.
Keep looking out for you and your son. Keep honoring your needs. He will do what he will do, but your side of the street will be clean.
L
You are having a difficult time, and that is to be expected. Trying to work out a relationship while both people are working out their own recovery is a massive undertaking.
I hear a lot of acceptance in this post. Ultimately, I believe that is the best possible place to be. Leaving or staying is not the issue, acceptance is. He is who he is, and you are accepting that for now. At some point, it may turn out that who he is is not who you want to spend your life with, and that's also fine. As long as you stay in acceptance and avoid trying to change him into something else, you will be fine.
Keep looking out for you and your son. Keep honoring your needs. He will do what he will do, but your side of the street will be clean.
L
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,175
Thanks, everyone!
LaTEe Da---I have to say you really seem to get where I am at with this.
Yes. I am working on my side of the street. Him being here or not is not the issue at moment. I am learning something that has been lacking my whole life, and would continue to lack if I do not address it here, and now.
I am just me doing my work. I am not being abused right now. I know that, and when I am I dont just lie down. Its been years. This is a new plateau for me.Trust me, I wont stay here forever. I will keep moving up the spiral.
LaTEe Da---I have to say you really seem to get where I am at with this.
Yes. I am working on my side of the street. Him being here or not is not the issue at moment. I am learning something that has been lacking my whole life, and would continue to lack if I do not address it here, and now.
I am just me doing my work. I am not being abused right now. I know that, and when I am I dont just lie down. Its been years. This is a new plateau for me.Trust me, I wont stay here forever. I will keep moving up the spiral.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: the moon, milky way
Posts: 1,250
You seem to have a good grasp on the reality of your situation. And having a sick child in itself and under the best circumstances strains couples. It tore up my marriage (my son was medically fragile, has delays etc) and his dad was NOT an alcoholic.
If I was to give any feedback it would be to not always view his behaviors or dysfunction as just a reflection of the alcoholic/recovered alcoholic behavior. Meaning, he could never have touched a drop in his life and still be putting you through this.
From one mom/caregiver to another. Don't stop taking care of yourself. It is that oxygen mask analogy; You need to put it on yourself first. I see you doing lots of the interior/spiritual work but at some point, actions may become the oxygen mask for yourself and your child.
I know how tough it is to be a mom with a child that may need more than other kids right now and I could not have had an alcoholic partner on top of it. As it was I had a nervous breakdown. Just take care of yourself ALWAYS FIRST.
If I was to give any feedback it would be to not always view his behaviors or dysfunction as just a reflection of the alcoholic/recovered alcoholic behavior. Meaning, he could never have touched a drop in his life and still be putting you through this.
From one mom/caregiver to another. Don't stop taking care of yourself. It is that oxygen mask analogy; You need to put it on yourself first. I see you doing lots of the interior/spiritual work but at some point, actions may become the oxygen mask for yourself and your child.
I know how tough it is to be a mom with a child that may need more than other kids right now and I could not have had an alcoholic partner on top of it. As it was I had a nervous breakdown. Just take care of yourself ALWAYS FIRST.
Skipper
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: South Texas, USA
Posts: 827
It's excellent that you know yourself this well. I'm concerned about one factor of the set-up that you have, and my concern is based upon my own experience...so, please use your grain of salt right now.
The choices you gave him may work for you, for now. And I see that you really need the support when you have a sick child (my stepson had Stage 4 cancer when he was 5, I remember needing support, too).
Thing is, you're really counting on that emotional support from the father of your child, as you should in a regular situation. The other parent should always be the parent, too. However, I'm not sure that it's a good idea to depend upon that support from an alcoholic. In knowing yourself, you know you need the support. GOOD! In not knowing or being able to predict or control your AH, I think you could be setting yourself up for disappointment. It could be a good idea to seek out some support outside of your AH so that you may manage parenting on your own, if needed.
If you have a good group of friends, other parents in the same situation, a church group, a parenting group, other family members....those are my thoughts here.
I hope this helps you. I believe all of us parents can use as much support as possible, and when you have a sick child, it's even more true.
The choices you gave him may work for you, for now. And I see that you really need the support when you have a sick child (my stepson had Stage 4 cancer when he was 5, I remember needing support, too).
Thing is, you're really counting on that emotional support from the father of your child, as you should in a regular situation. The other parent should always be the parent, too. However, I'm not sure that it's a good idea to depend upon that support from an alcoholic. In knowing yourself, you know you need the support. GOOD! In not knowing or being able to predict or control your AH, I think you could be setting yourself up for disappointment. It could be a good idea to seek out some support outside of your AH so that you may manage parenting on your own, if needed.
If you have a good group of friends, other parents in the same situation, a church group, a parenting group, other family members....those are my thoughts here.
I hope this helps you. I believe all of us parents can use as much support as possible, and when you have a sick child, it's even more true.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Alaska
Posts: 2,913
Originally Posted by Buffalo66 
I stated, "how is it that as soon as I am fed up with you NOT being able to do those things, that you SUDDENLY are able to go somewhere else and do them...?"
Why could he not just start doing them here?
Why could he not just start doing them here?
I love LaTeeDa's paragraph about acceptance.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,443
I'm glad you are making so much progress and that you feel it. That you have self awareness and are making boundaries within your framework for success. That is a lot of insight! That momentum will carry you.
Because he can. Because he will take what he can and only give what he must. In all your threads it is this theme that stands out to me as being the one giant flag that says keep your eyes open to watch his actions and not his words or to believe what you actually see and not what you hope to see.
I stated, "how is it that as soon as I am fed up with you NOT being able to do those things, that you SUDDENLY are able to go somewhere else and do them...?"
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