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anyone think about this....

Old 11-22-2010, 08:15 AM
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anyone think about this....

i've been thinking... i remember a friend of mine years ago lived with her BF....both were alcoholics. one day she was in a horrible car accident that involved several automobiles and injured a few people. she knew then that she had to get help (well they made her go anyway) and her BF decided maybe it wouldn't hurt if he tried to stop too. so they both did, successfully. but after the drinking stopped, their relationship started to dwindle and falter. they both realized they no longer had anything in common with each other. they broke up.

do you ever get scared that it could happen to you? i wonder, if my AH does stop, will he see me the same way? how different will it be and will it be for the better or for the worst....
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Old 11-22-2010, 08:20 AM
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Actually it did happen to me, only I left him, and not the other way around.

We were both active alcoholics/addicts, and he went through rehab first. He chose to return to drinking/drugging. I went through rehab and embraced recovery.

For my own safety, sanity, and recovery I had to walk away from him.

What are you doing for yourself to heal from the effects of his alcoholism?
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Old 11-22-2010, 08:32 AM
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i don't really know what the heck i'm doing.... i feel so pulled back and forth...one day good, next day not so good. i am trying really hard to keep my mouth shut when he is "that way" but my tongue gets awfully sore from biting it so much. i want to be like you and walk away, but i can't. he's a good person and has a big heart and he KNOWS he has a disease and i just feel guilty leaving him like this.... he's so helpless and dependent.... and i'm the opposite...i'm very independent. i lived on my own most of my adult life and never needed anyone to coddle me through life.... i was so happy the last week that passed....he didnt drink and he really tried... but i just called him and i could tell in his voice that he had a few (already at 11 in the morning).... and i got upset and he knew i was so he got angry AT ME!! i think i hate that part of it the most.... i get in trouble for the things he does wrong... i am at work right now and i want to cry at my desk but there's too many people around me and i try so hard to keep it together here.... i should be happy when i'm here and away from him.... but its even worse.... i sit and dwell and sit dwell some more..... and i'm just festering inside.....
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Old 11-22-2010, 08:38 AM
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I stayed stuck for five long hellish years because I accepted the blame for all his problems.

I kept telling myself he was a good person inside, that if I just loved him enough, said the right things, did the right things, that he would change.

That kind of thinking almost killed me in the end.

Your AH is not helpless and dependent. He's an adult. He wants you to think that because it keeps you stuck where you are.

Are you attending Alanon? Have you read "Codependent No More?"
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Old 11-22-2010, 08:58 AM
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about alanon, i wrote this earlier...

about the alanon thing and religion.... i wanted to go to alanon but not if its like that.... i don't attend church, i don't relate much to folks that do....especially the reborn again christains (no offense). so if they start talking god this and god that i fear i will walk out and not look back. that is why AA didn't work for my husband. we are not without faith, we are just strongly opposed to organized religion and anyone who uses it as a crutch to solve their problems. god didn't put me in this position, i did. i want to be able to help myself through this with maybe the help of others who have been there and know.... and can freely and openly talk about it. now i feel like i am back to square one.

i really wish i could find a group that is not based on any religions.... it just won't work for me, and that goes for the hand holding and hugging. i have a friend like that who is so sappy and always trying to hug and touch and she alone is enough to annoy the pants off of me!! i can't imagine doing that with strangers. i sound like a cold person don't i? but i'm not....

certainly i didn't mean any offense to anyone.... its just how i feel. maybe some day that may change but right now the only escape from this is to leave and i dont think i'm ready for that either.... i feel so stuck.....
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Old 11-22-2010, 09:00 AM
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This is very common, unfortunately. Or in the the case of an addicted couple, it could actually be fortunate.

There are also lots of couples that made it work out, including a few in my home group. This is true regardless if one or both were alcoholics. Bottom line IMHO - for both the A and the codie - is to keep your recovery first and foremost and see what happens.

Good luck.
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Old 11-22-2010, 09:01 AM
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Sorry, forgot about that post earlier in regards to Alanon.

I was raised in a strict Catholic home and haven't been active in any organized religion since I left home at age 18.

I find no conflict in AA or Alanon for me personally.

I practice spirituality, not religion.
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Old 11-22-2010, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by breakingglass View Post
about alanon, i wrote this earlier...

about the alanon thing and religion.... i wanted to go to alanon but not if its like that.... i don't attend church, i don't relate much to folks that do....especially the reborn again christains (no offense). so if they start talking god this and god that i fear i will walk out and not look back. that is why AA didn't work for my husband. we are not without faith, we are just strongly opposed to organized religion and anyone who uses it as a crutch to solve their problems. god didn't put me in this position, i did. i want to be able to help myself through this with maybe the help of others who have been there and know.... and can freely and openly talk about it. now i feel like i am back to square one.

i really wish i could find a group that is not based on any religions.... it just won't work for me, and that goes for the hand holding and hugging. i have a friend like that who is so sappy and always trying to hug and touch and she alone is enough to annoy the pants off of me!! i can't imagine doing that with strangers. i sound like a cold person don't i? but i'm not....

certainly i didn't mean any offense to anyone.... its just how i feel. maybe some day that may change but right now the only escape from this is to leave and i dont think i'm ready for that either.... i feel so stuck.....

I spent pretty much my whole life, 54 years any way, not believing in a god, and being disgusted with organized religion much like you.

Man, when I'd finally been brought to my knees and had hurt enough, I guess I got that "fox hole religion" they talk about guys in combat getting. What did it for me was when CPS took my precious 5yo daughter away for 5 months. ENOUGH ALREADY! I started to pray, before I believed BTW, and things began to change, miracle after miracle. My only explanation for some of the things that happened is divine intervention. I'm blessed.

I couldn't deny the presence of something greater than myself taking care of me and lifting my burdens. What a comfort it's been for me these last few years. Lots of struggles since then, life certainly didn't magically get "peachy" or anything, but I have peace and serenity.

I believe once a person experiences serenity, they are hooked. I know I am, I will NEVER give it up for anyone again.

I believe it's a common misconception that Alanon is God centered, our group certainly is not. We all have our own concepts of our higher powers, some chose God, I chose Nature/The Universe, some others chose the collective wisdom of the group.

It's a shame to me when someone decides to make their life/journey harder because of a misconception, without ever even being open to at least checking out a different way. That's totally up to you.

None of us can cross BACK over that bridge and carry others across against their will, all I can do is try to cheer you on from the other side.

Thanks and God bless us all,
Coyote
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Old 11-22-2010, 09:53 AM
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Breakingglass, please keep in mind that while you may find religious people at Al-Anon meetings it's not a religious organization. They talk about a higher power. But YOU get to determine what that higher power is.

For me, my higher power is the power of the group. The Al-Anon group has taught me so much and I've been able to do so much with their support. More than I could have done on my own. That makes it a power greater than myself.

I couldn't move a refrigerator by myself. But with three or four people it's really easy.

Remember, take what you like and leave the rest.
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Old 11-22-2010, 09:56 AM
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Have you tried Alanon online?
I too am not religious, have my arguments against church, etc. But. I also found that I was using that as an excuse NOT to go to Alanon or group meetings (not to say that you are doing that...this was just MY 'excuse'). I still have a hard time going, and often I read what I feel like I'm ready for, I stop in here, I've had both Codependent No More & Beyond Codependency checked out for months from the library...
Recovery is hard and it's been a VERY long year trying to figure out what I'm comfortable with, how I'm contributing to an Alcoholic Relationship and what I CAN do about it and what I will tolerate.
I do still worry that AH and I will fizzle and not have much in common. But I remind myself that I don't like who I am when I have to deal with AH's alcoholic behavior. This is the only life I have, and I was so tired of all the crap that AH kept pulling. It stopped being acceptable to me. Your partner DOES have the ability to be a responsible adult. We take it one day at a time and honestly, the serenity prayer does a lot for me. Just posting here is a HUGE step for many people. Keep looking for meetings, read what you can get your hands on, and you'll find a group that isn't touchy-feely, preachy, etc. In the meantime, sound off here
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Old 11-22-2010, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by coyote21 View Post
I spent pretty much my whole life, 54 years any way, not believing in a god, and being disgusted with organized religion much like you. i wasn't "disgusted with it nor did i NOT believe. i have my faith. i just don't throw it around like some people and "groups" do. and i don't discuss it in my every day life. i know its therebut then again i'm the only that needs to know that. but its cetainly not the driving force that makes me who i am.

Man, when I'd finally been brought to my knees and had hurt enough, I guess I got that "fox hole religion" they talk about guys in combat getting. What did it for me was when CPS took my precious 5yo daughter away for 5 months. ENOUGH ALREADY! I started to pray, before I believed BTW, and things began to change, miracle after miracle. My only explanation for some of the things that happened is divine intervention. I'm blessed. it sounds like you had a tough time of thing and for that i am sorry. i know some people say they have "found" jesus or they have these devine intervention but i just don't get it i guess.

I couldn't deny the presence of something greater than myself taking care of me and lifting my burdens. What a comfort it's been for me these last few years. Lots of struggles since then, life certainly didn't magically get "peachy" or anything, but I have peace and serenity.

I believe once a person experiences serenity, they are hooked. I know I am, I will NEVER give it up for anyone again.

I believe it's a common misconception that Alanon is God centered, our group certainly is not. We all have our own concepts of our higher powers, some chose God, I chose Nature/The Universe, some others chose the collective wisdom of the group.

It's a shame to me when someone decides to make their life/journey harder because of a misconception, without ever even being open to at least checking out a different way. That's totally up to you. please do not call it a misconception simply because i don't see things the way you do....i gave religion a big try, when i was young and when i was older. i'm now 51 and i doubt any time soon that i will be a church goer. but i can pray inside myself. i just dont understand how its going to make my husband stop drinking! or how its going to make me feel better about myself because of it. i lived alone before i married him (he's my 2nd husband) and i was perfectly serene! i was at peace... then he happened and all hell broke loose. now can i blame god for letting me get married to an alcoholic? If he's the answer to everything then maybe he's also the cause of it too.

None of us can cross BACK over that bridge and carry others across against their will, all I can do is try to cheer you on from the other side. thank you for that....

Thanks and God bless us all,
Coyote
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Old 11-22-2010, 10:23 AM
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All I know is when the pain of living the way I was greater than the discomfort of making changes in my life, I finally decided to try a different way.

Till then I was just spinning my wheels and becoming more miserable and despondent every day.
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Old 11-22-2010, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by SteppingUp View Post
Breakingglass, please keep in mind that while you may find religious people at Al-Anon meetings it's not a religious organization. They talk about a higher power. But YOU get to determine what that higher power is.

For me, my higher power is the power of the group. The Al-Anon group has taught me so much and I've been able to do so much with their support. More than I could have done on my own. That makes it a power greater than myself.

I couldn't move a refrigerator by myself. But with three or four people it's really easy.

Remember, take what you like and leave the rest.
correct me if i'm wrong, but don't they all talk about god and finding "him"? and i have to be honest, that would totally annoy me.
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Old 11-22-2010, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by breakingglass View Post
do you ever get scared that it could happen to you? i wonder, if my AH does stop, will he see me the same way? how different will it be and will it be for the better or for the worst....
I used to worry about it all the time but I looked into it a huge amount and I found that marriages that end when an addict gets sober, usually do so on the instigation of the non-addicted spouse. Seemingly it's very common for the non-addicted partner to have assumed that all marital problems will be solved once their partner is sober. But they commonly find that their problems had less to do with the alcohol/other drugs and more to do with other issues. Once the addiction was removed they realised that their problems were actually about more than that.

Of course it happens both ways, the addict can sober up and realise that the relationship is not working for them sober, but usually it's the other way around.
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Old 11-22-2010, 10:34 AM
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BreakingGlass, No offense meant......but you will continue to feel stuck until you spiral downward to your bottom! Everyone has their own bottom. When and if you reach your bottom you will have no where else to look...... but up!

After reading your posts I have pondered the following:
You don't have a problem. You have a solution you don't like.
Learn to give from your overflow rather that from your reserve. This is self care, learn to let go of burdens you were never meant to carry. Learn to ask, “What is the best thing for me?”
You can only love yourself as much as you believe you are lovable.
An expectation is a premeditated resentment.
Any time you are in resentment, you are not taking care of yourself. You are blaming someone else for something you need to do.
The higher the expectations, the lower the serenity. Try to keep your boundaries high, your expectations low, and your heart open.
Change can only come from a position of acceptance.
What ever your heart clings to, that is your God.
Be in nature and discover how much God loves you, “Pause, so you can hear the rabbits.”
God helps those who don’t try to take over His work.

I cannot give other people the status of my Higher Power. I once knew a down and out recovering alcoholic whose Higher Power was the coffee pot. It won't work......if you don't work the program!

My Higher Power is God. I have found that so many people confuse Christianity with organized religions, but it's NOT! Organized religions is manmade. Christianity
is a personal one-to-one relationship with our Lord God Almighty!

When all about you is black with gloom,
And all you feel is pending doom.
When your bones are racked with grim despair -
When every breath is a gasp for air.
Keep on going, though you need to grope,
For around the bend is a ray of hope.

A ray of hope is perhaps all that's left,
As your will to live has been bereft.
You've lost it all, it's just no use!
You can end it all, you need no excuse.
But throw away that piece of rope,
And give yourself a chance of hope.

Just give yourself another day,
Brushing aside what your thoughts may say.
This is your life and you can make a new start,
By ignoring the brain - just follow the heart.
Taking baby steps in order to cope,
And minute by minute you'll build on your hope.

Build on your hope,. one day at a time,
Though the road be steep and hard to climb.
The hurts of the past - they should be dead.
The fears of the future are all in your head.
Just live in the present and refuse to mope
Your life will sparkle for you're living in hope.

Hope by Brian Quinn
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Old 11-22-2010, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by breakingglass View Post
correct me if i'm wrong, but don't they all talk about god and finding "him"? and i have to be honest, that would totally annoy me.
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance--that principle is contempt prior to investigation." ~ Herbert Spencer
(quote from Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous, 1st edition)

All we can do is share our experience, strength, and hope with you.

Best of luck to you in your future, whatever it may be.
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Old 11-22-2010, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by breakingglass View Post
correct me if i'm wrong, but don't they all talk about god and finding "him"? and i have to be honest, that would totally annoy me.
i have been to many many meetings in my 14 years of recovery.
I have never, ever heard anyone mention finding "him".
The program is spiritual, not religious.
But, it won't work if you don't.
Just like any program. There are also other programs.
SMART.
Rational Recovery.

Beth
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Old 11-22-2010, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by breakingglass View Post
correct me if i'm wrong, but don't they all talk about god and finding "him"? and i have to be honest, that would totally annoy me.
At the meeting I go to from time to time... gracious, no. People may talk about what god is... and isn't... to them; but there is no judgment regardless. There are plenty of agnostics. Some people refer to god as "She" and no one laughs. Half the attendees at my first home meeting were openly gay-- it wasn't a Christian environment or they would never have attended.

Going back to your original post, though: Unfortunately, if it's your BF's choice to toss back a few before noon, it's idiotic, but not illegal. From his point of view, you called and got upset over his hobby-- it would be like him calling you and getting mad because you were knitting again, or watching "Days Of Our Lives." That would be your business, not his.

I'm not saying you're wrong-- you aren't, you're right to be concerned about it. I had to throw out my much loved but alcoholic husband not because of his drinking, but due to my reaction to his drinking-- I hated the person I became in response to his unutterably stupid choices. I could not stop him from making them. At the end, all I could deal with was the fact that he was hurting me and I needed the pain to end.

Your BF can only be helpless and dependent as long as there is someone to be dependent upon. This is coming from my own experience-- I am passive by nature, and did not begin to take care of my life in many ways until my husband was gone and I had to do it myself. There may be a perfectly competent person inside of him too.

Good luck and treat yourself well
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Old 11-22-2010, 11:27 AM
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It's happening to me now. I have been in alanon for years. She won't get help, won't face her problems. No one in the house plays her game anymore. Even the adult children won't enable her.

I wish she would face her demons.

I am tired of the sh*t. I wonder what it would be like to have a normal relationship with someone who doesn't screw with my head.
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Old 11-22-2010, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by KittyP View Post
I used to worry about it all the time but I looked into it a huge amount and I found that marriages that end when an addict gets sober, usually do so on the instigation of the non-addicted spouse. Seemingly it's very common for the non-addicted partner to have assumed that all marital problems will be solved once their partner is sober. But they commonly find that their problems had less to do with the alcohol/other drugs and more to do with other issues. Once the addiction was removed they realised that their problems were actually about more than that.

Of course it happens both ways, the addict can sober up and realise that the relationship is not working for them sober, but usually it's the other way around.
Thank you for this, Kitty. It is very encouraging.

breakingglass, you may not have seen a thread I put on here a couple of weeks ago asking whether my wife would be even madder at me because I am quitting than she was before I quit.
naive and Learn2Live (amongst others) gave me some fabulous advice: get yourself healthy first and then take care of those worries - dont get ahead of yourself.

Also I think it is very important to try and move forward together in recovery rather than try to go back to the way things used to be in the past.

PS I am really feeling for you - I know it must be a huge disappointment after he managed to do 5 days
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