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My First Post - Out of the Blue....

Old 10-20-2010, 10:21 PM
  # 21 (permalink)  
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Rayn - thank you for your comments. I do think her alcoholism is still in its infancy. Regardless, I know it will only get worse with time. Maybe it would take another 10 years before she's falling down drunk at night. This is something I do not want to wait for. There's no way I could knowing what I know now.

I love her so much, but I also do not have patience for denial. I don't think I make a very good codependent. It's painful for both of us, but I feel like my intolerance is to our benefit.
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Old 10-20-2010, 10:25 PM
  # 22 (permalink)  
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Yes, it is..we have to know what we want out of life and act accordingly.
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Old 10-21-2010, 02:46 AM
  # 23 (permalink)  
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hi pacapps-

i'd like to say another thing about the daily journaling. as stated, i wrote down briefly what went on in the day...money spent, drinks consumed, promises, etc...

this was very helpful in getting a real picture of the extent of the drinking and lying...

however, more importantly, i could refer back to these notes when my alcoholic would state things that didn't concur with my memory of events. this had been going on for some time and i really was doubting myself and becoming quite confused.

once i had the journal going...he'd say something which triggered in me doubt...this time, though, i could refer back to the events in my journal.

and you know what, my memory was correct 100% of the time.

i discovered that he had been twisting reality and the result was that i was doubting myself, over and over again.

with the journal, i would simply pull up the file, go back to the day in question and voila! the facts.

it went a long way to re-establish my self-confidence after being worn down with mistruths for so long.

oh, and the seeping away of our finances became quite clear to, once i added up the cost of the alcohol. for such a long time, i was wondering why we were always so broke...where was all the money going?

we have a saying here "one day at a time"...try to let go of your expectations for the future and deal with today. many of us have hung in there way to long, waiting for the future with our alcoholics. deal with today and try to keep your mind in the present and not some future bliss which hasn't occurred yet.

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Old 10-21-2010, 03:30 AM
  # 24 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by PacApps View Post
I do think her alcoholism is still in its infancy.
I wouldn't bet on it. Drinking at 9 am, no way she is not drinking for the rest of the day too.
My RAH was similar type of drunk, highly functioning, but was drinking every day all day long. Hardly anyone noticed anything. I did but only because my dad was A too, so I knew how to recognize the signs much better than the next person. RAH was never stumbling down (only very, very rarely if he was out celebrating something) until over a year ago when his health started detoriating, he lost weight, his stomach was bloated, he turned yellow, and in May he was admitted into hospital with end stage liver cirrhosis. I knew he was drinking but I dind't know that he drunk that much, and I knew it could get bad eventually, but I thought he was not there yet.
Some A's drink until get wasted, some enough to keep them going. The fact your wife is not wasted everyday doesn't have to mean anything in regard to how serious her alcoholism is.
I think you're handling the situation well for now. You're thinking clearly. Please, don't forget what you know now, don't compromise, don't go for denial yourself (which can be quite tempting when the pain gets too much). I agree with others who said her willingness to go for therapy (but no discussion about alcohol) is nothing but bargaining.
But also that baraganing is not to deceive you, it is again about her own denial. Alcoholism is a terrible disease, accompanied with shame, guilt, selfhatred,... that A is trying to heal with more drinking.
The best thing you can do for your wife is what you're doing right now: letting her face the consenquences of her actions. That is all help you can give her. Please, remember that whenever you feel tempted to do something else.
Also, I suggest you stick around here and read as much as you can, especially stickies at the top of the forum, there is so much wisdom there.

Here is a link to the thread you might find useful:
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...l-problem.html

You're doing great
take care
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Old 10-21-2010, 08:51 AM
  # 25 (permalink)  
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(thanks for the compliment, rayn3drop)

pacapp-

i'm going to second what sesh said...i doubt her alcoholism is in its infancy. from what you've shared here, she's a full blown active alcoholic. all of the signs are there...the hiding, the denial, drinking in the morning, refusal to talk about it, the bargaining...

for myself, in order to validate my suspicions, i decided to get to the bottom of exactly how much he was drinking. everyone might not agree with me, but if i was going to split up our home of 6 years, i wanted to know for sure. i wasn't interested in controlling his drinking...i was interested in the facts so i could make my decision...

i started mixing up my routine...popping in at unexpected hours, validating where he said he was, marking bottles (best way to do this is turn the bottle upside-down and make your mark that way), reading receipts from stores, if i went on a trip, i'd come home unexpectedly a day earlier unannounced...well, you get the idea.

this method is not for everyone, but for me, i needed to know for sure. what i uncovered was mind-boggling...the amount of alcohol, lies about his pay, lies about where he was, lies about how much he drank, lies about going to work, lies, lies, lies.

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Old 10-21-2010, 10:26 AM
  # 26 (permalink)  
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in my situation, it was such a tangled mess of lies that I gave up, like I often give up on the ball of yarn my cat has gotten herself into. It's just too complicated. I'd rather remove the tangle, snip it off and start off. Where my XAH was concerned, I just decided that the amount he was drinking (at the time 3 liters of beer a day) was enough for me.

I tried the snooping and checking up on him; I did it for years in fact. Nearly drove me crazy. It's only once I gave up and realized that the amount of booze didn't matter, the "real truth" didn't matter...it was simply that I had lost my faith in the relationship and in my partner. And because there was abuse, there was no way to "work on things".
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Old 10-21-2010, 12:06 PM
  # 27 (permalink)  
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Hi Pac,

I feel your pain as I'm in a similar place.

My W seems to think that drinking a bottle (or more) of wine each night is perfectly normal. Attacking me at the slightest thing is, of course, my fault.

One thing you wrote really resonated with me:

"The tension progressed that evening, and I told her that I was going to go to Al-Anon meeting, which I did and found to be helpful. She asked “why are you doing this to me?”. I told her that I am having a difficult time coming to terms with her drinking problem and that I was going to the Al-Anon meeting for myself. In the end, she packed a bag and left the house (she manages a local inn and got a room there). She says she feels like a stranger in her own house, and that she doesn't know if she can be married to someone who makes her feel this way."

Sounds like she's playing the victim card and putting all the blame on you. I've had my W play the "I'm not sure I can be married to someone who makes me feel this way" card too. It's a perfect weapon for the A because it turns our attention away from their drinking and makes us question ourselves.

What has helped me is the realization that what she thinks is really none of my business. It's hard but I'm learning to not take anything she says while she's drunk personally. Q-TIP = Quit Taking It Personally.

I think the truth is that whether or not she thinks she's got a drinking problem, YOU have a problem with her drinking. That's enough.

Please learn detachment and don't let her denials drive you crazy!

Stick around and keep posting. You'll get the most wonderful support from the folks here!
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Old 10-21-2010, 03:12 PM
  # 28 (permalink)  
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early on in my recovery, catlovermi said to me "if you believe anything that an active alcoholic says, then you'll have to take responsibility for that."

that now makes a lot of sense to me.
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Old 10-22-2010, 06:31 AM
  # 29 (permalink)  
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The one crazy thing for me is that if I never walked in on her drinking I never would have known! Most people (the very limited I've been able to connect with to date) seem to have had significant others that get wasted at home and be openly drunk. This has not been the case for me. Our life has been relative bliss to date. Just another layer of complexity I'm having a hard time rationalizing.

It is a blessing you do not have children with her. The husband of the mother who drove the wrong way wasted on the Taconic Parkway last year and killed 3 innocent small children (one had a cell phone and had been calling her parents terrified!) and killed the people in the oncoming car - he said his wife never drank - and they always brought the same (magically or was someone up to something sneaky hmmmmm?) unfinished bottle of vodka on their camping trips for him to have a drink AT NIGHT.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/05/nyregion/05crash.html

He lost his wife and his two children and his niece in that crash.

As painful as it is to break free of denial it is always better to know, always better to make decisions based on reality and acceptance of what IS.

That tension you feel....I grew up with that tension (again be grateful you aren't trying to raise healthy children w/ this person). That tension was bread and butter in my house. Along with shame, suspicion, resentment, rage, denial, magical thinking, blah blah blah....It sucked.

Glad you're here - glad you found AlAnon!
Stay in the moment - stay in reality - and remember it is not a measure of whether we love them or whether they love us if they cannot give up the lies and the booze - it is a measure of the strong grip of the addiction - don't take it personally - alcoholism is a formidable foe - the book Under the Influence helped me realize that. An addict does not, cannot, change on a dime. No matter how much we love them, beg with them, bargain with them, or wait for them. The addiction has its own agenda and timetable that we are not privy to.

Peace-
B
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Old 10-22-2010, 06:51 AM
  # 30 (permalink)  
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Correction * 4 children she killed in that crash - 3 nieces and her 1 of her own 2 children.
:-(
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Old 10-22-2010, 07:16 AM
  # 31 (permalink)  
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I am glad you are going to therapy and Al-Anon PacApps. It sounds like you have a good handle on your emotions. It's important to also maintain your social life during this time, such as hanging out with the guys, playing basketball once a week, or whatever it is you enjoy.

I know this is difficult, to think it is the end of something, but just try to stay in the Present Moment, don't dwell too much on the past or worry too much about the future. Focus on today and taking the best possible care of yourself as you can. Be kind to yourself and recognize that you are learning new things, like a new language.
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Old 10-22-2010, 11:16 AM
  # 32 (permalink)  
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I just decided that the amount he was drinking (at the time 3 liters of beer a day) was enough for me.
Slightly OT, but I've always been amazed at the volume of beer some people are able to consume. When I was a teenager, there was a middle-aged guy that I worked with, and on his days off, he would drink a whole case of beer in one afternoon.

My AW doesn't drink quite that much, but on the days she's drinking beer instead of Vodka, she'll easily put away six or seven in a row without pausing. I just don't see how a person can drink that much of anything without getting bloated, but they do.
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Old 10-22-2010, 11:53 AM
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I've come to believe that the spouse of a drinker came up with the expression: "Pissing your life away"....because that's what my XAH did. Guzzle, guzzle, guzzle, pee, and away it goes!
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