trying to go no contact
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: england
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trying to go no contact
hi, how do you go no contact, when mother who is 81 is dragging me into the drama's. I just want to escape it all. My brother is causing enormous problems for my mother, and i feel so helpless, i can't cope with him and mother can't. she is phoning me when she gets hysterical, and i don't know how to console her. he is falling around drunk, and she calls emergency, and they take him to hospital , then he comes back, and mother takes him in, he is also overdosing on prescription pain killers, i tried hiding them, but mother said she would be blamed when he couldn't find them. i don't know what to do, but feel i am being emotionally manipulated by both of them
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: england
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sorry if i came across as selfish, i know i feel i should be taking care of my mother, but i don;t know what to do. she is a very strong woman, and has always coped , i think better than me, but she always has a knack of making me feel inadequate, and i can't help feeling useless, after all she is old
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,888
What is selfish about wanting to save yourself from a no-win situation??? If you're not sure of the answer...it's "nothing."
That's right, it's not selfish to want to move out of the way when your brother's behavior become toxic and it causes toxic behavior in your mother who then dumps it at your feet.
Your mother is a strong woman and God bless her at 81, but rather than shut the toxic element out of her life and enjoy the positive energy and love you bring to it, she avoids the discomfort of what going no contact with him might bring by dumping all the angst and horror on you.
It is hard to believe the lengths we as family and friends of addicts will go to in an effort to avoid this "discomfort." It takes many forms; from tantrums by an addict to stealing to get a fix, to abuse physical and emotional, on and on.
I know for years I walked on eggshells around my XABF. There were times I made sure there was beer in the house because I didn't want to face his wrath if he came home to an empty fridge. I made sure he had snacks in the house to go with the beer even if I had to make do to put meals together with less money. I kept the pets quiet and made sure his laundry was done. All of this was extra work and angst on my part to avoid more work and angst brought by him. It seems rediculous in retrospect. But the exhaustion and frustration for me had to go somewhere and that was often right into the lap of my friends and family.
There was nothing they could do to help me or get me out of my cycle of insanity. I know there were times my calls were not returned because they knew it would be more of the same.
What got me out of my cycle was coming hear and learning the root of the problem and changing my behavior instead of seeking out someone else to listen to my woes and say some magic words to fix it all. It's never too late for your mom to learn the 12 steps, some health detachment, and what it means to be codependent.
Try the Codependent No More with her. Encourage her to find a healthy way to cope that does not include driving a wedge between you. You both deserve a relationship that is not comprised solely of discussing your brother's latest addict behavior.
Much love and patience is needed and I know you have that in you.
Wishing peace for you and your mom.
Alice
That's right, it's not selfish to want to move out of the way when your brother's behavior become toxic and it causes toxic behavior in your mother who then dumps it at your feet.
Your mother is a strong woman and God bless her at 81, but rather than shut the toxic element out of her life and enjoy the positive energy and love you bring to it, she avoids the discomfort of what going no contact with him might bring by dumping all the angst and horror on you.
It is hard to believe the lengths we as family and friends of addicts will go to in an effort to avoid this "discomfort." It takes many forms; from tantrums by an addict to stealing to get a fix, to abuse physical and emotional, on and on.
I know for years I walked on eggshells around my XABF. There were times I made sure there was beer in the house because I didn't want to face his wrath if he came home to an empty fridge. I made sure he had snacks in the house to go with the beer even if I had to make do to put meals together with less money. I kept the pets quiet and made sure his laundry was done. All of this was extra work and angst on my part to avoid more work and angst brought by him. It seems rediculous in retrospect. But the exhaustion and frustration for me had to go somewhere and that was often right into the lap of my friends and family.
There was nothing they could do to help me or get me out of my cycle of insanity. I know there were times my calls were not returned because they knew it would be more of the same.
What got me out of my cycle was coming hear and learning the root of the problem and changing my behavior instead of seeking out someone else to listen to my woes and say some magic words to fix it all. It's never too late for your mom to learn the 12 steps, some health detachment, and what it means to be codependent.
Try the Codependent No More with her. Encourage her to find a healthy way to cope that does not include driving a wedge between you. You both deserve a relationship that is not comprised solely of discussing your brother's latest addict behavior.
Much love and patience is needed and I know you have that in you.
Wishing peace for you and your mom.
Alice
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,059
hi thyme-
why not consider your boundaries with respect to your mother and then communicate them to her and stick to it.
for example, explain that while you wish to have a relationship with her, you do not want to hear any further about your brother and his drinking.
and then stick to it.
it might be a bit rough in the beginning, but just keep stating your boundary. when she crosses it, say goodbye and hang up.
i agree that a copy of "co-dependent no more" might help her understand your position and perhaps her own enabling. but there is no guarantee of that.
naive
why not consider your boundaries with respect to your mother and then communicate them to her and stick to it.
for example, explain that while you wish to have a relationship with her, you do not want to hear any further about your brother and his drinking.
and then stick to it.
it might be a bit rough in the beginning, but just keep stating your boundary. when she crosses it, say goodbye and hang up.
i agree that a copy of "co-dependent no more" might help her understand your position and perhaps her own enabling. but there is no guarantee of that.
naive
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 13,497
Thyme,
As a mom who is "helping" my grown son, I can talk about this, and give you some of my feelings, if that is ok.
My girls do not want me letting my son live here, and I understand that. He is not drinking at present, nor drugging. he is hopefully getting a job soon, nearby. He is not actively causing huge problems, tho he has recently. i am giving him a short time to get his self a job, and then to move on. there is a fine line between helping him and enabling him.
but.....
a couple of years ago, I took him in for a while. He was actively drinking, and causing all sorts of grief for me. I had no one to talk to about the terrible situation at that time. If I tried to talk to my girls, they could not deal with it. They rightfully thought I should throw him out. It was my choice to not do that, so since it was my choices that were causing my pain, I had no right to cry "help" or to complain about it to them. it was too painful for them , to see me so upset.
so i had to not share it with them. It was not good to make them worry, since I was "choosing " that life. I did eventually move, leaving him without a place. He went homeless, living in his car. "His" choices got him there, not mine.
I do not want my daughters to feel guilty for their desire to not be part of this unhealthy dance. I don't talk to them much about their brother. Even when good-ish things happen, i dont share them , for we dont want to get hopes up- it has usually not been worth getting excited about. they get angry if i say anything good about him, usually. I leave it up to them , to decide how they feel about their brother. they love him, but they have detached, which is good for them.
They would support me, if I chose to take care of myself, and throw him out. They just cant be expected to listen to the "awfulness of it all", nor is their business. I wont dump the garbage on their day.
There were horrible times , in the past, that i had to not share with them. they knew, they would call me each day, and heard the defeat in my voice. they were so angry at him. It was coming between me and my daughters. When they said that it was going to ruin our relationship, by having the situation in my home, i must say that it hurt me terribly, for it is hard to chose not to help a child, whether adult or not. but, i was enabling him, and they knew it. I am guessing they were trying to tell me that they could not bear this situation any more. I understood.
I never call them and complain, for it is my choice to put myself in the way of this crap-train. I am trying to detach, and to get him out of here, asap. tho it is my problem, it affects my girls. i am sorry for that, too.
detachment is healthy for you. letting your mom know that you love her, and dont wish to see her waste her life, that is fair. she can go to sr, for support, if she needs to. she can go to al-anon, too. she should not expect you to have to suffer over a situation that you have no control over, and neither does she, really.
detach with love.
hugs, chicory
As a mom who is "helping" my grown son, I can talk about this, and give you some of my feelings, if that is ok.
My girls do not want me letting my son live here, and I understand that. He is not drinking at present, nor drugging. he is hopefully getting a job soon, nearby. He is not actively causing huge problems, tho he has recently. i am giving him a short time to get his self a job, and then to move on. there is a fine line between helping him and enabling him.
but.....
a couple of years ago, I took him in for a while. He was actively drinking, and causing all sorts of grief for me. I had no one to talk to about the terrible situation at that time. If I tried to talk to my girls, they could not deal with it. They rightfully thought I should throw him out. It was my choice to not do that, so since it was my choices that were causing my pain, I had no right to cry "help" or to complain about it to them. it was too painful for them , to see me so upset.
so i had to not share it with them. It was not good to make them worry, since I was "choosing " that life. I did eventually move, leaving him without a place. He went homeless, living in his car. "His" choices got him there, not mine.
I do not want my daughters to feel guilty for their desire to not be part of this unhealthy dance. I don't talk to them much about their brother. Even when good-ish things happen, i dont share them , for we dont want to get hopes up- it has usually not been worth getting excited about. they get angry if i say anything good about him, usually. I leave it up to them , to decide how they feel about their brother. they love him, but they have detached, which is good for them.
They would support me, if I chose to take care of myself, and throw him out. They just cant be expected to listen to the "awfulness of it all", nor is their business. I wont dump the garbage on their day.
There were horrible times , in the past, that i had to not share with them. they knew, they would call me each day, and heard the defeat in my voice. they were so angry at him. It was coming between me and my daughters. When they said that it was going to ruin our relationship, by having the situation in my home, i must say that it hurt me terribly, for it is hard to chose not to help a child, whether adult or not. but, i was enabling him, and they knew it. I am guessing they were trying to tell me that they could not bear this situation any more. I understood.
I never call them and complain, for it is my choice to put myself in the way of this crap-train. I am trying to detach, and to get him out of here, asap. tho it is my problem, it affects my girls. i am sorry for that, too.
detachment is healthy for you. letting your mom know that you love her, and dont wish to see her waste her life, that is fair. she can go to sr, for support, if she needs to. she can go to al-anon, too. she should not expect you to have to suffer over a situation that you have no control over, and neither does she, really.
detach with love.
hugs, chicory
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: england
Posts: 24
i would just like to say thanks to alice, naive and chicory for your kind advice. I have actually given my mother the book by Melodie Beatty, co dependant no more, but she said she has glanced at it but can't find the time or more likely can't be bothered to read it. Well the latest drama was about 10 days ago, i just got to know yesterday because i visited my mother because it was her birthday. They went by train to visit my other alcoholic brother, who is quite settled in some kind of hostel, and is doing rather well considering his past behavior. he understands mother can't cope with how he is and doesn't cause any problems now, but still phones mother to ask how she is very regular. Well mother payed for the trip and kept hold of the tickets, then when it was time to go home my brother who was already drunk decided he wanted to buy more booze before catching the train, so off he went even though mother tried her hardest to make him stay as the train was due. she tried to give him his ticket because she was adament she wasn't going to miss the train. he was so drunk he just pulled away from her and she boarded the train alone. So as a result he was left without his ticket to go home, and eventually he was arrested for being drunk in a railway station. Now he is supposed to appear in court this morning in the town miles away from home, and is flapping about it, of course it was mothers fault this happened according to him. i just hope my mother lets him deal with his own mistake, but somehow can't see it. He asked me to drive him there but i refused. I will be keeping away now for a while , only went because it was mothers birthday. Thanks for the advice everyone about boundaries, i know i sure need some. xx
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Join Date: Nov 2008
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Hugs, thyme.
Have you considered going to a therapist?
As a character in a play said: you "have to" NOTHING. Everything is a choice. Taking time away will bring peace to your life and that is totally valid and adequate. If you are distressed, you won't be able to help her, or move forward. If you feel ok, its easier for your mom to pick up. Well at least that is what happens to me and my mom, who i believe has had severe chronic depression. Instead of trying to tell her what to change, i invite her to a concert- to a park -for coffee, bring a present, a flower. Expressing love in this way has improved our relation, no more judgments or regrets or guilt or anger (well that is the goal, of course I am not there yet).
Also have you tried writing her a letter and telling her everything that you feel? of course, burning the paper afterwards? this is a good way to release feelings and thoughts that destroy us and serve no purpose. Write, and write more, and don't censor anything. Burn it and let it go. Repeat. To your mom, your brother, an ex, God, yourself, the classmate that bugged you in high school, anyone that represents an emotional weight to you.
Take care and i hope you treat yourself this weekend. And do the exercises. Just actually sitting there and taking time to acknowledge and feel my feelings is very freeing.
Have you considered going to a therapist?
As a character in a play said: you "have to" NOTHING. Everything is a choice. Taking time away will bring peace to your life and that is totally valid and adequate. If you are distressed, you won't be able to help her, or move forward. If you feel ok, its easier for your mom to pick up. Well at least that is what happens to me and my mom, who i believe has had severe chronic depression. Instead of trying to tell her what to change, i invite her to a concert- to a park -for coffee, bring a present, a flower. Expressing love in this way has improved our relation, no more judgments or regrets or guilt or anger (well that is the goal, of course I am not there yet).
Also have you tried writing her a letter and telling her everything that you feel? of course, burning the paper afterwards? this is a good way to release feelings and thoughts that destroy us and serve no purpose. Write, and write more, and don't censor anything. Burn it and let it go. Repeat. To your mom, your brother, an ex, God, yourself, the classmate that bugged you in high school, anyone that represents an emotional weight to you.
Take care and i hope you treat yourself this weekend. And do the exercises. Just actually sitting there and taking time to acknowledge and feel my feelings is very freeing.
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: england
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hi, mother has phoned, and wants me to go over tomorrow, to help get my brother out. apparently he has been offered a property in a warden controlled appartment, but is not allowed to take his dog. She is willing to keep his dog, but he is refusing to go. what do i do, i am trying to disconnect, but feel i have to go, even though it won't solve anything
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