I'm so lost...
Member
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Waterford MI
Posts: 4,202
Originally Posted by suki44883 
His sponsor is telling us "we should be living together to work thru this" and that as long as he begins his steps again... everything is going to be ok.
Did you hear his "sponsor" say that, or did he just say his "sponsor" said that? Sorry, but I have a VERY difficult time believing a real AA sponsor would say those words. If he really did, then he either doesn't know the true story or he isn't much of a sponsor. A sponsor's job is to try to keep his sponsee sober, not micromanage his love life. This all just sounds like a huge con job to me.
Did you hear his "sponsor" say that, or did he just say his "sponsor" said that? Sorry, but I have a VERY difficult time believing a real AA sponsor would say those words. If he really did, then he either doesn't know the true story or he isn't much of a sponsor. A sponsor's job is to try to keep his sponsee sober, not micromanage his love life. This all just sounds like a huge con job to me.
"The next call I get, should be from your sponsor."
His reply was a very energetic and happy OK!!
I guess I'll now be getting that call soon.
His reply was a very energetic and happy OK!!
I guess I'll now be getting that call soon.
Alright, I just had a very wicked idea.
Have this "sponsor" call your new found "sponsor" suki!
Oh, I know it is not very recovery like of me, but i would love to be a fly on the wall.
I think suki could hang him out to dry without raising her voice.
:ghug3
lost, you are doing okay. just keep posting and ignore the trouble makers like me.
RIP Sweet Suki
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: In my sanctuary, my home
Posts: 39,908
I don't know where this guy really is, but I'd bet pretty much everything I own that he is not on a "quiet retreat with his sponsor." He's more that likely off with some other woman or some of his friends and they may even be reading these texts and have a grand old time laughing about it. From what you have told us about him, I have absolutely NOTHING good to say about this guy. He is a jerk and a liar and a manipulator and just a pile of dog crap that you have stepped in. Scrape him off your shoe and move on.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: europe
Posts: 624
My opinion: this guy is full of it!!!
You have a son that needs you happy and well. I think that is your priority.
Not likely to have that sticking with a guy who was able to pull this on you. It has nothing to do with alcoholism or recovery, it is just about the kind of person he is and what is he capable of doing.
Remember he has been doing this to you it seems true your whole relationship, thus it has all been a lie, from the begining to the end. You don't know him at all, you only know what he wanted you to believe. He played you each step of the way, what is there to go back to?
Nothing but the idea of him, the person that doesn't really exist.
You met a man, fell in love with him, than you found out you were lied to from the very beggining, and that you don't know him at all.
You have a choice: either cut your loses, admit being played, betrayed, and the rest, learn from it, remove yourself, protect yourself and move on, hurt but wiser, or go back to him and expose yourself to finding more things he's capable of, whenever again he feels like self sabotaging.
If I were you I'd be grateful I found out now and not after moving in with him. You haven't sold your house yet. Your son can easily go back (I hope) to his old school, so in that aspect of it no unreapairable damage done.
You said you don't know what made you look at his cell. I wouldn't let that one slide easily. Maybe you were sensing something was wrong or maybe it is just your HP taking care of you. Either way, that is another thing to be grateful for.
And the way he is acting now, it speaks of everything but a grown up, responsible man. What is he, in high school, not taking no for an answer and getting his buddy (sponsor) to speak to you?
It is your decision, but I just have to say, if I were you, I'd plug off my phone, and go NO CONTACT for good, and run away from him as fast as I could.
I understand your pain, take your time to grieve something that never was what you thought, but protect your self and your child.
take care
You have a son that needs you happy and well. I think that is your priority.
Not likely to have that sticking with a guy who was able to pull this on you. It has nothing to do with alcoholism or recovery, it is just about the kind of person he is and what is he capable of doing.
Remember he has been doing this to you it seems true your whole relationship, thus it has all been a lie, from the begining to the end. You don't know him at all, you only know what he wanted you to believe. He played you each step of the way, what is there to go back to?
Nothing but the idea of him, the person that doesn't really exist.
You met a man, fell in love with him, than you found out you were lied to from the very beggining, and that you don't know him at all.
You have a choice: either cut your loses, admit being played, betrayed, and the rest, learn from it, remove yourself, protect yourself and move on, hurt but wiser, or go back to him and expose yourself to finding more things he's capable of, whenever again he feels like self sabotaging.
If I were you I'd be grateful I found out now and not after moving in with him. You haven't sold your house yet. Your son can easily go back (I hope) to his old school, so in that aspect of it no unreapairable damage done.
You said you don't know what made you look at his cell. I wouldn't let that one slide easily. Maybe you were sensing something was wrong or maybe it is just your HP taking care of you. Either way, that is another thing to be grateful for.
And the way he is acting now, it speaks of everything but a grown up, responsible man. What is he, in high school, not taking no for an answer and getting his buddy (sponsor) to speak to you?
It is your decision, but I just have to say, if I were you, I'd plug off my phone, and go NO CONTACT for good, and run away from him as fast as I could.
I understand your pain, take your time to grieve something that never was what you thought, but protect your self and your child.
take care
Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,431
The more you talk with him and show him yourself...your thoughts, feelings, state of mind etc the more info he has on "how to handle you".
I don't think you want to be handled.
This is your life, health and happiness and your responsibility to your son.
I know you want to make good decisions.
I once used to be so gratified hearing that I was just the best thing that ever happened to this man in my life.
We all overlooked whether he was the best thing that happened to me.
I, too, couldn't believe what I was accepting from him since, like you, prior to that I wouldn't have put up with even the first occurence of wrong....I had bowed out on guys plenty times before.
Something felt so special and different tho'.
I have to tell you it shredded all my dignity, my heart, warped my mind and nearly ruined my life.
It took alot of counseling and reading to get a clue on what had happened to me.
I don't think you want to be handled.
This is your life, health and happiness and your responsibility to your son.
I know you want to make good decisions.
I once used to be so gratified hearing that I was just the best thing that ever happened to this man in my life.
We all overlooked whether he was the best thing that happened to me.
I, too, couldn't believe what I was accepting from him since, like you, prior to that I wouldn't have put up with even the first occurence of wrong....I had bowed out on guys plenty times before.
Something felt so special and different tho'.
I have to tell you it shredded all my dignity, my heart, warped my mind and nearly ruined my life.
It took alot of counseling and reading to get a clue on what had happened to me.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,431
for your consideration also......that other woman didn't know about YOU either.
She was also deceived and he tried to shut her up.
I am SURE he knew she was married.
There is also her HUSBAND deceived.
That tells you very many things.
She was also deceived and he tried to shut her up.
I am SURE he knew she was married.
There is also her HUSBAND deceived.
That tells you very many things.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 29
Originally Posted by Live
for your consideration also......that other woman didn't know about YOU either.
She was also deceived and he tried to shut her up.
I am SURE he knew she was married.
There is also her HUSBAND deceived.
That tells you very many things.
She was also deceived and he tried to shut her up.
I am SURE he knew she was married.
There is also her HUSBAND deceived.
That tells you very many things.
He says that's a lie. He said she is a horrible woman and is lying to me. That she DID know about me but that she really didn't care.
Behind the Red Door
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 181
Originally Posted by lostfrmbetrayal
---
He says that's a lie. He said she is a horrible woman and is lying to me. That she DID know about me but that she really didn't care.
He says that's a lie. He said she is a horrible woman and is lying to me. That she DID know about me but that she really didn't care.
RIP Sweet Suki
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: In my sanctuary, my home
Posts: 39,908
He says that's a lie. He said she is a horrible woman and is lying to me. That she DID know about me but that she really didn't care.
Yeah, because he's such a great catch that any woman would jeopardize her marriage just to have nude pictures taken of herself in his kitchen. LOL!!! This guy is so full of himself.
Yeah, because he's such a great catch that any woman would jeopardize her marriage just to have nude pictures taken of herself in his kitchen. LOL!!! This guy is so full of himself.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Reality, NJ
Posts: 853
Hi Lisa,
I am so sorry that you are going through this. Many of us have been in your shoes. You are at a pivotal point though. I can only speak for myself when I say I wish I was at my pivotal point again. I would have chosen to leave. You have the power right now to make a decision that will affect the rest of your life. Even without the knowledge of what alcoholism does to a person. Which if you stick around here you will learn. In reality this is what you do know:
1) He is a liar who will go to great lengths to protect his lies.
2) He is a cheater.
3) He is a manipulator.
My dear friend, this is all you need to know right know. If your friend did this to you would she still be in your life?
I know he showers you with his love and you cant understand that. He doesnt want to lose you. Why? He likes/loves you to his ability. Is that good enough for you? Youre taking this next step in this relationship which normally would be a beautiful milestone and instead you find out all of this? Seems like a sign to me and just in the knick of time too. But Lisa, if you stay..you will end up leaving him sooner or later. If he works his steps and becomes this magnificent person he claims he is, tell him to look you up then.
Hugs
Lulu
I am so sorry that you are going through this. Many of us have been in your shoes. You are at a pivotal point though. I can only speak for myself when I say I wish I was at my pivotal point again. I would have chosen to leave. You have the power right now to make a decision that will affect the rest of your life. Even without the knowledge of what alcoholism does to a person. Which if you stick around here you will learn. In reality this is what you do know:
1) He is a liar who will go to great lengths to protect his lies.
2) He is a cheater.
3) He is a manipulator.
My dear friend, this is all you need to know right know. If your friend did this to you would she still be in your life?
I know he showers you with his love and you cant understand that. He doesnt want to lose you. Why? He likes/loves you to his ability. Is that good enough for you? Youre taking this next step in this relationship which normally would be a beautiful milestone and instead you find out all of this? Seems like a sign to me and just in the knick of time too. But Lisa, if you stay..you will end up leaving him sooner or later. If he works his steps and becomes this magnificent person he claims he is, tell him to look you up then.
Hugs
Lulu
I'm no angel!
Join Date: May 2005
Location: tampa, fl
Posts: 6,728
If in fact his sponser said what your bf said he said, his sponser must be one brick short of a full load. Did you actually hear the sponser say this? Or is this another lie from Mr. Wrong? Live together to work this out? Surely they jest.
As for your son, he is a child, as an adult you need to make the right decisions for him. Don't confuse religion and common sense, they do not mix.
Please stay where you are, there is no reason to move in together, none. You have your own house, keep it, he wants you to become his prisoner, so that you have no options, no where to go. It is all a game to him, once he gets what he wants, all hell will break loose.
Listen to your therapist, if I were you, I'd go to one on my own, without him.
There is no hurry to do anything with this guy, I would advise no contact, back off for awhile, what's the rush?
As for your son, he is a child, as an adult you need to make the right decisions for him. Don't confuse religion and common sense, they do not mix.
Please stay where you are, there is no reason to move in together, none. You have your own house, keep it, he wants you to become his prisoner, so that you have no options, no where to go. It is all a game to him, once he gets what he wants, all hell will break loose.
Listen to your therapist, if I were you, I'd go to one on my own, without him.
There is no hurry to do anything with this guy, I would advise no contact, back off for awhile, what's the rush?
Member
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: CA desert
Posts: 1,599
It would be interesting to see what he would do if you tell him to back off for awhile.
Although I think it's a lost cause, let's say you did tell him to give you space. Would his home be vacant for long? Would he use the time to work on himself or use it to line up replacements? Scary huh?
Although I think it's a lost cause, let's say you did tell him to give you space. Would his home be vacant for long? Would he use the time to work on himself or use it to line up replacements? Scary huh?
Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,292
Ok, wow, I have a lot to say here. First off, HUGE HUG. I am only 5 weeks out from finding out my recovering ex cheated on me so I am still very raw so I can relate to your pain right now.
I won't tell you to stay or leave or not have contact, because this is a process you need to get through your own way and at your own pace.
The way I see it, contact is important in order for closure and to help make your transition easier.
The extent that he's grovelling, begging and continuing the lies (saying OW is a liar) shows me he has a serious personality flaw. Addict or not. I know many addicts who are not master liars and manipulators. Most lie and manipulate, but not masters! Actually, every lies so....
In my case, I found a woman's pics on my ex's cell and he gave me half/trickled truths before I walked away. Most people, when caught, feel ashamed of their actions. In your case, he has no shame
My ex didn't grovel, he blamed and was not too nice to me once I caught him and asked him to explain, but he never begged for me back and said he would have left me also had I cheated. He never tried to convince me to stay. Though I would have liked to see more caring and remorse for ripping my heart out.
And I agree this pain is worse than any other pain a human can feel. I think I posted something here that talked about how cheating is abuse and how some people say they were raped and the pain of being raped didn't compare to being cheating and lied to.
The one thing that is true, many addict self sabotage. My ex admitted he did this because our relationship was difficult and we didn't really know how to work it out and i said some mean things to him during our relationship, so in my case, since he was not able to express his feelings, he built resentments and cheated. He even admitted it was done a little out of spite.
My ex has been only 2 yrs sober and not worked his steps. He also told me he was going to work his steps and fix this because he just needs to get better and needs to understand why he did this. Blowing smoke up my a^ss? Maybe, but I can't concern myself with this. For his kids sake, I hope he decides to face his HP and become an honest man.
I'm in Al Anon and working on me. Of course I want to believe him, but believing someone who so blatantly lied to my face and had this affair would be stupid of me. Because of these lies, I have been tearing my head apart wondering how many more there were and how deep his cheating was going.
The only way to believe or regain trust in someone who committed such acts of deceptions are to stand back and let them heal. If they heal and are truly remorseful, you'll know.
People can change, people can get well, but people with a serious personality disorder cannot heal or change.
There actions once you leave speak volumes as well.
If they run out to just hook up and continuing lying and act like filth, then all the better that you got out.
My suggestion would be to get to Al Anon ASAP, get to therapy and ask him to stop contacting you until you can sort this out in your head.
Things happen for a reason, you found this out before selling your home and displacing your son, your HP rocks in this case.
Imagine you moved in with this guy?! ugh!!!
I know you're scared, please keep posting and talking and posting and talk some more
I won't tell you to stay or leave or not have contact, because this is a process you need to get through your own way and at your own pace.
The way I see it, contact is important in order for closure and to help make your transition easier.
The extent that he's grovelling, begging and continuing the lies (saying OW is a liar) shows me he has a serious personality flaw. Addict or not. I know many addicts who are not master liars and manipulators. Most lie and manipulate, but not masters! Actually, every lies so....
In my case, I found a woman's pics on my ex's cell and he gave me half/trickled truths before I walked away. Most people, when caught, feel ashamed of their actions. In your case, he has no shame
My ex didn't grovel, he blamed and was not too nice to me once I caught him and asked him to explain, but he never begged for me back and said he would have left me also had I cheated. He never tried to convince me to stay. Though I would have liked to see more caring and remorse for ripping my heart out.
And I agree this pain is worse than any other pain a human can feel. I think I posted something here that talked about how cheating is abuse and how some people say they were raped and the pain of being raped didn't compare to being cheating and lied to.
The one thing that is true, many addict self sabotage. My ex admitted he did this because our relationship was difficult and we didn't really know how to work it out and i said some mean things to him during our relationship, so in my case, since he was not able to express his feelings, he built resentments and cheated. He even admitted it was done a little out of spite.
My ex has been only 2 yrs sober and not worked his steps. He also told me he was going to work his steps and fix this because he just needs to get better and needs to understand why he did this. Blowing smoke up my a^ss? Maybe, but I can't concern myself with this. For his kids sake, I hope he decides to face his HP and become an honest man.
I'm in Al Anon and working on me. Of course I want to believe him, but believing someone who so blatantly lied to my face and had this affair would be stupid of me. Because of these lies, I have been tearing my head apart wondering how many more there were and how deep his cheating was going.
The only way to believe or regain trust in someone who committed such acts of deceptions are to stand back and let them heal. If they heal and are truly remorseful, you'll know.
People can change, people can get well, but people with a serious personality disorder cannot heal or change.
There actions once you leave speak volumes as well.
If they run out to just hook up and continuing lying and act like filth, then all the better that you got out.
My suggestion would be to get to Al Anon ASAP, get to therapy and ask him to stop contacting you until you can sort this out in your head.
Things happen for a reason, you found this out before selling your home and displacing your son, your HP rocks in this case.
Imagine you moved in with this guy?! ugh!!!
I know you're scared, please keep posting and talking and posting and talk some more
Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,292
oh and as for his sponsor saying these things. Keep in mind, sponsors were also lying addicts at one time and some sponsors can be 13 steppers who make their own rules.
I cannot see a healthy person saying you need to live together to work this out.
I mean SERIOUSLY!
I cannot see a healthy person saying you need to live together to work this out.
I mean SERIOUSLY!
Member
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1
Wow, I am so sorry to hear that you are going through this. I am hoping that you listen to my advice, because I wish that I would have gone onto a site like this and asked for advice when I was in this same situation. My ex husband was a complete liar and cheater. I found notes here and there, weird text messages, bizarre phone calls, yet I was in denial because he assured me he would never cheat. He said he was not a cheater and would never do that to me. Well I found out (by walking in on him having sex with our next door neighbor), and was devastated. Seven years later, I still can close my eyes and visualize every inch of what I saw that day. I later found out he had had several different woman throughout our 7 year marriage. He even had a child with one, who was married, although they never took a paternity test to prove it was his. What I am trying to say is, once a cheater, always a cheater. He is now re-married and guess what??? He cheated on her, too.
Only you know what you can live with, but I could not live with what I had seen with my own two eyes. I wish I would have realized what a scum he was earlier in our relationship, as we have a daughter together who now has a split family. However, she is my world and the only good that came of the relationship.
Trust me, cheaters always cheat again. He probably has done this throughout his life and just wont admit to it. Cut all contact and move on with your life. Your son deserves to have a wonderful role model in his life, or none at all- not one like this!
Only you know what you can live with, but I could not live with what I had seen with my own two eyes. I wish I would have realized what a scum he was earlier in our relationship, as we have a daughter together who now has a split family. However, she is my world and the only good that came of the relationship.
Trust me, cheaters always cheat again. He probably has done this throughout his life and just wont admit to it. Cut all contact and move on with your life. Your son deserves to have a wonderful role model in his life, or none at all- not one like this!
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: ashamed ville
Posts: 311
My AH's lying doesn't has to do with cheating. It has to do with doing some other drugs. I confronted him about it and he denies it. I suggested a hair follicle test and 5 minutes later he was out the door with his bag packed.
To me, it wasn't the actual drug doing at that time. It was because he is an active alcoholic and he did these drugs. He is not known for doing this particular drug. If he wasn't drinking, we wouldn't have done those drugs. He lied about it when I asked if he seen the drugs at this place (i didn't ask if he did them only if he seen them). I know they were there at this place. He responded 'who told you I was doing the drugs' I didn't ask him that but with his response I knew he did them. So that's why I asked him to do test.
I think my point is, is that how would you be able to trust him again. If my AH does get sober and goes to treatment it will take me along time to be able to trust him. About anything he says. (I'm really not good at making points as my mind is still jumbled from what I'm going through now. I hope everyone understands. I can think of it put have a hard time typing it out so please forgive me)
To me it all boils down to his alcoholism and his behaviors because of it. Even if he gets sober he will have to earn my trust in order for me to feel comfortable in our relationship. When he tells me he loves the kids, do I believe that? I really don't know.
I'm sorry if I got offtrack. I did have a good response but I think it got lost as I typed. Sorry.
To me, it wasn't the actual drug doing at that time. It was because he is an active alcoholic and he did these drugs. He is not known for doing this particular drug. If he wasn't drinking, we wouldn't have done those drugs. He lied about it when I asked if he seen the drugs at this place (i didn't ask if he did them only if he seen them). I know they were there at this place. He responded 'who told you I was doing the drugs' I didn't ask him that but with his response I knew he did them. So that's why I asked him to do test.
I think my point is, is that how would you be able to trust him again. If my AH does get sober and goes to treatment it will take me along time to be able to trust him. About anything he says. (I'm really not good at making points as my mind is still jumbled from what I'm going through now. I hope everyone understands. I can think of it put have a hard time typing it out so please forgive me)
To me it all boils down to his alcoholism and his behaviors because of it. Even if he gets sober he will have to earn my trust in order for me to feel comfortable in our relationship. When he tells me he loves the kids, do I believe that? I really don't know.
I'm sorry if I got offtrack. I did have a good response but I think it got lost as I typed. Sorry.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 29
Every time I start to feel strong -he then says or texts the next convincing thing:
"My tendencies to my compulsivity and obsessiveness which are traits among all those who have addictions -got the best of me. This I CAN correct and WILL correct!! I'm promising you NOW that nothing like this will ever happen again to you! I am going to show you how wonderful you are... you are going to be treated so special by me that you will have no other choice but to believe in me again - I PROMISE YOU!!!"
---really, why is he trying so hard if he doesn't mean it?
"My tendencies to my compulsivity and obsessiveness which are traits among all those who have addictions -got the best of me. This I CAN correct and WILL correct!! I'm promising you NOW that nothing like this will ever happen again to you! I am going to show you how wonderful you are... you are going to be treated so special by me that you will have no other choice but to believe in me again - I PROMISE YOU!!!"
---really, why is he trying so hard if he doesn't mean it?
Belgian Sheepdog Adictee
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: In Today
Posts: 6,101
---really, why is he trying so hard if he doesn't mean it?
Go NO CONTACT. Wait and WATCH HIS ACTIONS and see. Right now, he is not 'working on himself' he is 'WORKING ON MANIPULATING YOU' so nothing has changed.
Just because he has '10 years' does not necessarily mean that he is well. And his actions certainly show he is not well.
Here is my 'translation' of everything he has been telling you and texting you, and mind you I have over 29 continuous years of sobriety, 'working a program' all those years:
"you are naive and if I can convince you to continue then I can have my cake and eat it too."
Remember the old adage about "a leopard does not change his spots?" Well you have a prime example of someone who is 'playing' with the program and is NOT practicing the Principles of the 12 steps in his life.
Before any more harm is done to either your child or you, please, please think very seriously about going NO CONTACT.
Change his name in your contact list on your phone to "AZZHOLE" so that anytime he calls or texts you don't answer you just delete.
Or, you can continue to take his calls and messages, drive yourself totally insane and wonder 'what went wrong?'
Sweetie, you
didn't CAUSE this.
can't CONTROL this.
can't CURE this.
As I said before I have been continuously sober over 29 years and in the AA program, and this fellow hasn't got a DAMN thing I would want.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
RIP Sweet Suki
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: In my sanctuary, my home
Posts: 39,908
Lost, you will ultimately do whatever you want to do. We have tried our best to dissuade you from continuing in a relationship with this guy, but when it comes right down to it, many people think they know better than a bunch of strangers on a message board. You have every right to chuck it all and give this guy the benefit of the doubt. If it were just you, I would say, go ahead if that's what you want to do. The thing is, it isn't just you, it is your son. I tend to get pretty protective of children who are or might be put in harm's way. I'm backing out of this thread now because I have said all I can to make my point. It's up to you now, whether you will heed the voices of experience here or allow him to manipulate you into a position where you won't have the freedom you have now. Good luck to you.
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