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Join Date: Feb 2010
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Originally Posted by Bolina 
Your body is your own. You control the access to it. You decide the conditions that allow access (and I am using access in the broadest sense). Those conditions can be as sane or as stupid as you wish. I know that some State laws take a while to catch up with the modern age, but conjugal rights really are from a bygone era. The grown up thing to do is to talk about, seek help and leave if the marriage is irretrievable. I hate with a passion this entitlement nonsense, particulary when it comes to some men in relation to women's bodies. We are NOT in a permanent state of consent which we then withdraw to be "mean".
Get tested. And figure out why you are so wound up over a man-child.
Get tested. And figure out why you are so wound up over a man-child.
I don't think calling her husband names or telling her what to do is helpful at all.
She is "Wound up' because he deceived her. This is pain. She is wound up because these are normal feelings.
ease up a little, This woman is in pain
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Location: UK
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but men are sexual beings,
Porn is not all about men's "needs" or greater desire or need for sex, it is a complex industry with a long history based in patriachal control, the visual medium and the denial of women's personal sexual desire and autonomy. Is it wrong or dirty? not in my opinion, but it isn't simple, and it isn't evidence of men's greater need for sex.
Men (in general) no more "need" sex than women (in general). What happens if they don't have sex? do they explode? or go crazy? or wither and die in a corner?
If you believe men equate sex with love do men purchasing sex from prostitutes love the prostitutes?
The #1 reason why married men cheat: lack of sex (to them love) at home.
don't give them sex.
By the way, I know 2 couples in "healthy, non addict" relationships where one of the partners is cheating and the reason, No sex! It's not just about addicts, it's about broken spirit and deflated ego.
leaving work to have drug and alcohol fueled sex with sex-workers in hotels has nowt to do with a lack of committed partnership, relationship context, intimacy enhancing sex. it is fulfilling an entirely different want.
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Join Date: Nov 2009
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I am massively sympathetic to anyone in this situation. I have been there. My point about being wound up by a man-child was because I see plenty of people around me who would just go "Huh? Grow up" and move on. I was (and am) interested in why I didn't do that. And am always surprised that other people might not be.
I am also massively frustrated that sexist notions (especially in relation to sex) are still being peddled in this day and age. And I find it even more frustrating that women buy into this crap. Generalizing also gets my goat, however I do see that it serves its purpose on occasion.
I apologise for being shorter than usual - I was watching 22 man-children kicking around a bag of air at the time. I should have waited until it was over.
ETA - what Jen said.
I am also massively frustrated that sexist notions (especially in relation to sex) are still being peddled in this day and age. And I find it even more frustrating that women buy into this crap. Generalizing also gets my goat, however I do see that it serves its purpose on occasion.
I apologise for being shorter than usual - I was watching 22 man-children kicking around a bag of air at the time. I should have waited until it was over.
ETA - what Jen said.
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Originally Posted by Summerpeach
Men feel a huge rejection when the women they love doesn't give them sex. They equate sex to love, like women equate emotionalsharing with love.
As far as associating it with love, I think mature people (of both sexes) know that love is about actions. Not feelings, not sex, not emotional sharing. Loving actions. That can mean sex if both people are into it, it can also mean respectfully taking no for an answer if one person is not in the mood. It can mean cooking dinner for the other, or rubbing their back. It can mean a thoughtful gift, or an attentive ear. A supportive smile, or a shoulder to cry on.
Blaming cheating on lack of sex seems to me a lot like blaming drinking on depression. There are many ways to deal with troubles in life, cheaters choose to cheat, just like alcoholics choose to drink. There are plenty of other choices.
L
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Location: UK
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Originally Posted by Summerpeach
Normally, your posts are great, but for some reason, you're really agressive today.
I don't think calling her husband names or telling her what to do is helpful at all.
She is "Wound up' because he deceived her. This is pain. She is wound up because these are normal feelings.
ease up a little, This woman is in pain
I don't think calling her husband names or telling her what to do is helpful at all.
She is "Wound up' because he deceived her. This is pain. She is wound up because these are normal feelings.
ease up a little, This woman is in pain
I don't see bolina's post as an attack, I would view this as supportive post if it was directed to me, validating my autonomy over my own body.
vive la difference!
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Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Ohio
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GMC-Can you step back for a second, reach deep down and answer why you feel sorry for him? What exactly happened to him for you to feel that way? Why, after realizing what he did would you want to hug him?
I am not judging you at all and dont want to come across harsh. I think it might be good for you to reach deep and try to honestly answer those questions.
IMHO, cheating is the ultimate betrayal. No matter what excuse he gives, there is NO excuse for it.
Please go get yourself checked for STD. U dont know how long he has been involved in this behavior and your health and well being is priority #1!
I am not judging you at all and dont want to come across harsh. I think it might be good for you to reach deep and try to honestly answer those questions.
IMHO, cheating is the ultimate betrayal. No matter what excuse he gives, there is NO excuse for it.
Please go get yourself checked for STD. U dont know how long he has been involved in this behavior and your health and well being is priority #1!
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 44
Originally Posted by coffeedrinker
here here, bolina.
my therapist at the time told me he would approach me, knowing what the answer was going to be, to set himself up. he was setting himself up a lot. then he could wallow in self-pity and self-loathing, and go drink or smoke to feel better.
my therapist at the time told me he would approach me, knowing what the answer was going to be, to set himself up. he was setting himself up a lot. then he could wallow in self-pity and self-loathing, and go drink or smoke to feel better.
That is so interesting. I completely see that. Thank you for pointing this out. Very eye-opening for me.
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Originally Posted by JenT1968
okay then, even if we accept that you have a part in him feeling that his sexual needs were unfulfilled (and whilst I am certainly not underestimating the effect sexual abuse has had on you nor seeking to undermine your obvious authority over what is normal for you, human beings exhibit a very wide and diverse range of normal levels of libido, sexual therapists accept ALL levels as within the normal human spectrum, including no desire whatsoever, and most people experience extended periods at some point in their lives where desire is severely limited, my point being, you yourself are not necessarily "broken", you two may be merely mismatched sexually).
so back to the first sentence, even if we pretend for a minute that we accept that you had some responsibility towards his behavior re seeking sexual fulfillment outside of the marriage, what did you do to ensure he combined it with a drugs and drinks fest, bunking off work to indulge in an aging rock-god hotel fantasy? and why high-end hookers? and why only when he traveled? what about your behavior forced him to do that?
and yes: being addicted to a substance indeed seems to create misery to the addict eventually, and I am not going to downplay anyone's personal experience. BUT lets not forget that the reason *most* people start to, and want to, take drugs and drink alcohol and have sex is because these things fire up our pleasure centres and can be enormously enjoyable, it is not to "mask their pain".
All three together, sounds to me like he was going all out to have fun.
so back to the first sentence, even if we pretend for a minute that we accept that you had some responsibility towards his behavior re seeking sexual fulfillment outside of the marriage, what did you do to ensure he combined it with a drugs and drinks fest, bunking off work to indulge in an aging rock-god hotel fantasy? and why high-end hookers? and why only when he traveled? what about your behavior forced him to do that?
and yes: being addicted to a substance indeed seems to create misery to the addict eventually, and I am not going to downplay anyone's personal experience. BUT lets not forget that the reason *most* people start to, and want to, take drugs and drink alcohol and have sex is because these things fire up our pleasure centres and can be enormously enjoyable, it is not to "mask their pain".
All three together, sounds to me like he was going all out to have fun.
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Originally Posted by Summerpeach
I'm going to go against the grain here and many will disagree, but men are sexual beings, whether us women want to accept that or not. The porn industry is one of the most profitable. And it's not women buying it!
Men need sex and when they don't get it from their wives, they go elswhere. Is it right? NO, but to them, it is!
The #1 reason why married men cheat: lack of sex (to them love) at home.
Men feel a huge rejection when the women they love doesn't give them sex. They equate sex to love, like women equate emotionalsharing with love.
Not saying his disgusting cheating was in ANY way you're fault, but like you said, there were many issues in the relationship and well, he was not mature or well equipped to handle them.
By the way, I know 2 couples in "healthy, non addict" relationships where one of the partners is cheating and the reason, No sex! It's not just about addicts, it's about broken spirit and deflated ego.
Men need sex and when they don't get it from their wives, they go elswhere. Is it right? NO, but to them, it is!
The #1 reason why married men cheat: lack of sex (to them love) at home.
Men feel a huge rejection when the women they love doesn't give them sex. They equate sex to love, like women equate emotionalsharing with love.
Not saying his disgusting cheating was in ANY way you're fault, but like you said, there were many issues in the relationship and well, he was not mature or well equipped to handle them.
By the way, I know 2 couples in "healthy, non addict" relationships where one of the partners is cheating and the reason, No sex! It's not just about addicts, it's about broken spirit and deflated ego.
I agree with this too. My feelings are all over the board on this issue. I dont think there was any excuse - it's just, you hear about it all the time whether or not men are alcoholics.
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Posts: 44
Originally Posted by spinwc
GMC-Can you step back for a second, reach deep down and answer why you feel sorry for him? What exactly happened to him for you to feel that way? Why, after realizing what he did would you want to hug him?
I am not judging you at all and dont want to come across harsh. I think it might be good for you to reach deep and try to honestly answer those questions.
IMHO, cheating is the ultimate betrayal. No matter what excuse he gives, there is NO excuse for it.
Please go get yourself checked for STD. U dont know how long he has been involved in this behavior and your health and well being is priority #1!
I am not judging you at all and dont want to come across harsh. I think it might be good for you to reach deep and try to honestly answer those questions.
IMHO, cheating is the ultimate betrayal. No matter what excuse he gives, there is NO excuse for it.
Please go get yourself checked for STD. U dont know how long he has been involved in this behavior and your health and well being is priority #1!
See, the thing is, I LOVE everyone's responses on here. They have all been full of wisdom. My looking at my 'blame' or 'my part in the scenario' is just me going through the motions. I spent all of yesterday wrestling with this and reading the responses and talking to family who know us both, and have seen both sides of this relationship. Its not as black and white an issue as we make out.
Now, that being said, just because I am going through the motions and examining all my feelings about the situation, does not change the fact that I hired a lawyer yesterday and am planning my future.
But yes, I will be at counseling and they will look at me too. Let's be honest about that.
Thanks for all the responses guys. Theyve given me LOTS of food for thought and lots to continue thinking about. I really appreciate it!
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Join Date: Jun 2010
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Biologists have known for a long time that of the 5,000 or so mammal species, only about 3%-5% were monogamous for life.
And in my opinion, almost all of that % are better at it than most humans.
I belive that there are men and women that do not cheat. It's a choice they make. At the same time it's a chioce you make to stay or leave.
And in my opinion, almost all of that % are better at it than most humans.
I belive that there are men and women that do not cheat. It's a choice they make. At the same time it's a chioce you make to stay or leave.
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Join Date: Feb 2010
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Breaking; I agree.
We are not monogamous by nature.
I knew my point of view would not be popular and many would disagree, but that doesn't mean it's not the reailty of it all.
It's real. Men are wired totally different than women. Men are wired for sex.
It's human nature and not just my belief
After the whole Tiger/Jessie James scandal, CNN did a poll involving 5000 men and the question they asked was "if you knew you could cheat on your partner and never get caught, would you do it"
A staggering 97% said they would.
We are not monogamous by nature.
I knew my point of view would not be popular and many would disagree, but that doesn't mean it's not the reailty of it all.
It's real. Men are wired totally different than women. Men are wired for sex.
It's human nature and not just my belief
After the whole Tiger/Jessie James scandal, CNN did a poll involving 5000 men and the question they asked was "if you knew you could cheat on your partner and never get caught, would you do it"
A staggering 97% said they would.
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Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,292
Originally Posted by anvilhead
and i'm gonna have to take exception to that just a bit because NOT ALL MEN are like that, at all. men don't cheat because of the Y chromosone....PEOPLE cheat due to a lack of personal ethics.
nor do i think for most men love and sex are ever in the brain at the same time!!!
and finally, i know at least ONE woman who has bought her share of her porn. and other stuff at the adult store. of course the intent was as a shared experience, i never, i mean SHE never bought it for solo viewing.
bottom line, bad behavior is just that BAD behavior.
nor do i think for most men love and sex are ever in the brain at the same time!!!
and finally, i know at least ONE woman who has bought her share of her porn. and other stuff at the adult store. of course the intent was as a shared experience, i never, i mean SHE never bought it for solo viewing.
bottom line, bad behavior is just that BAD behavior.
Sure women buy porn, but it's probably about 2% of sales.
Bad behavior is relative. In some nations, a man taking many wives is not uncommon and it's not considered cheating.
I'm not condoning cheating, but unless we understand the biology of the "brain", then we are only buying our heads in the sand
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Originally Posted by Bolina
Blaming cheating on lack of sex is like blaming a rape victim for wearing a short skirt.
The finger is pointing in the wrong frigging direction.
The finger is pointing in the wrong frigging direction.
You are comparing a VIOLENT and criminal act (rape is not about sex) to a person cheating because their ego is unfulfilled and their needs are not being met
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Originally Posted by LaTeeDa
I, too, must disagree with this overreaching generalization. Different people have different levels of libido, regardless of their gender. I have been with a couple of men who wanted less sex than I did, and a couple who wanted more.
As far as associating it with love, I think mature people (of both sexes) know that love is about actions. Not feelings, not sex, not emotional sharing. Loving actions. That can mean sex if both people are into it, it can also mean respectfully taking no for an answer if one person is not in the mood. It can mean cooking dinner for the other, or rubbing their back. It can mean a thoughtful gift, or an attentive ear. A supportive smile, or a shoulder to cry on.
Blaming cheating on lack of sex seems to me a lot like blaming drinking on depression. There are many ways to deal with troubles in life, cheaters choose to cheat, just like alcoholics choose to drink. There are plenty of other choices.
L
As far as associating it with love, I think mature people (of both sexes) know that love is about actions. Not feelings, not sex, not emotional sharing. Loving actions. That can mean sex if both people are into it, it can also mean respectfully taking no for an answer if one person is not in the mood. It can mean cooking dinner for the other, or rubbing their back. It can mean a thoughtful gift, or an attentive ear. A supportive smile, or a shoulder to cry on.
Blaming cheating on lack of sex seems to me a lot like blaming drinking on depression. There are many ways to deal with troubles in life, cheaters choose to cheat, just like alcoholics choose to drink. There are plenty of other choices.
L
If you believe addiction is a disease, then drinking is not a choice right?
And yes, people drink because they are depressed?! People do all sorts of things that are not rational when they are depressed.
Your point is not clear to me
I also don't think one needs to me mature to understand love and to not cheat. I think one needs to me spiritually grown to understand that cheating is wrong.
Mature people with broken spirits and egos cheat all the time.
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Originally Posted by Summerpeach
agreed and disagree.
If you believe addiction is a disease, then drinking is not a choice right?
If you believe addiction is a disease, then drinking is not a choice right?
Originally Posted by Summerpeach
And yes, people drink because they are depressed?! People do all sorts of things that are not rational when they are depressed.
Your point is not clear to me
Your point is not clear to me
Originally Posted by Summerpeach
I also don't think one needs to me mature to understand love and to not cheat. I think one needs to me spiritually grown to understand that cheating is wrong.
Mature people with broken spirits and egos cheat all the time.
Mature people with broken spirits and egos cheat all the time.
So, out of all this, what is the point you are trying to make? That men cheat, so we shouldn't expect them not to? That since men "need" sex, women should perform on demand? That the OP's husband was justified in locking himself in a hotel room and hiring hookers because she wasn't having sex with him?
L
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