aboutdone

It seems to me, that lately RXAH and I have good weeks, then bad.

It takes one wrong comment, or thing to happen to send us in a downward spiral, and then it takes numerous meetings, counseling, or talks to get us back to where we were.

I may very well get hung to dry for this, but if there is one complaint or disagreement I have with AA/Alanon is they don't have a program for relationships.

He goes to AA, and brings home his idea of taking care of his side of the street. He then dives deep into his AA stuff, and that is great, but then I go to Al Anon, focus more on me, and then we get tangled up in trying to decide what is right/wrong.

I recently walked out on a 2 hr marriage counseling session we scheduled, as for 90 min the counselor just kept lecturing me on the fact that if I wanted the relationship to work, sometimes you have to give 100% and carry the weight while the other one isn't able. Well, I feel that I have done that for 4 years. RXAH claims he is working on some of his resentments and can't focus on much else. REALLY? When does it end? I have resentments too, yet I still have kids, bills, and life to live.

I guess after I walked out, the counselor and RXAH decided I wasn't on board to saving this relationship, and they would give me 6 months to come around. LOL! Seriously?

I asked RXAH to go to different counselor and he said no, just because I didn't like the truth. Oh, ok. So I said, you go to him, and I will find my own. And once again starts the merry go round or individual therapy, but nothing for the relationship.

praiseHim

Man, I've had my fill of crappy counselors that have no clue about addiction!

Yes, I agree, I think it would be helpful to have an inbetween program for marriages/relationships witn aa/alanon.

Bolina

How long have you both been working the program? And have you both done a Step 4 yet?

I just wonder if you are trying to put the cart before the horse a little by doing joint counselling before you both have a firm enough foundation on a personal level.

Just a thought.

praiseHim

I'm sure I am trying to do that, lol

LaTeeDa

This actually sounds like a pretty good idea to me. It seems like an awful lot for two people to try and sort themselves out AND try to sort out a relationship at the same time. Maybe put the relationship work on back burner for a while and each work on your own individual issues. Once you both have some solid recovery going on, then work on the relationship.

My two cents.

L

aboutdone

Yes, we have both worked our 4 step.

Mostly what it is in regards to, is after our divorce was filed, I went NC with him, until he went to rehab. I started seeing someone from out of town. After rehab, I went through with divorce, and he started seeing someone in town, and I was still seeing guy from out of town. We started trying to work on us, agreed to end both relationships we were in. Yes, I know, big sordid mess.

Anyways, there is a conflict about the day everything was ended with the other 2 people. Its really not a big deal to me. He claims not a big deal to him. I run into the girl he was seeing at least once a week, and he never sees the guy I was dating. Anyways, I made a comment about where she is working now, and everything snowballed from there, back to his resentments about how I stepped out of our marriage, when I say, even though it may not have been politically correct, or the smartest move on my part, divorce was filed, so it really isn't as if I cheated with malice. At that point, I was done. He had been gone from our home for 2 months or so, not contributing financially, barely seeing his daughter, being a raging alcoholic when I filed for divorce.

Yet anytime we have an argument or disagreement it comes up, about how I committed adultery, and of course now, since he has issues with it, I'm supposed to turn my head to his inability to contribute anything to the relationship at the moment, because he is entitled to his feelings. Geesh.

Its not like I don't think it is a big deal, but get over it and get on with it. I don't have time to go through this every couple of months, you know?

I am mad, hurt, upset about all the crap he did while drinking, yet I am willing to let it go, for myself, our relationship, our daughter. But everytime I turn around this keeps coming up. Grrr.

Bolina

It's two separate issues, though isn't it? Your adultery (technically, and in his eyes, true) and his behavior whilst drinking. Making it a tit for tat won't resolve anything. Treat each on its own merits (or otherwise) and tackle them appropriately and at different times.

Telling him to get over something he is clearly struggling with is no different from him telling you to get over his behavior. Maybe it's time for some more Step 4 resentment work?

I'm not at all unsympathetic to your plight as I remember being in a similar situation (different scenario but same result).

alanonicnov2008

You are entitled to your feelings too. I've been in your situation, having to deal with another person's resentments while still having my own. In many ways being with an alcoholic is like being with a child, unfortunately. A child who tantrums.

I have found that it's pointless to talk about anything when there are still resentments. One partner has to be the party who stands up and forgives and accepts the other partner. In my "recovery" relationship this was never me, by the way...my abf was usually the first to wave the white flag, if he hadn't, it wouldn't have lasted as long as it did.

So it kind of makes sense that this was the advice...to wait. That's very "program". Not saying everyone can do it, it's just very program. We have to remember that relationships in an alcoholic family are extreme, not normal, and so normal measures don't work...I found in my alcoholic relationship that I had to put up with a lot more distance, separation, and really sit in my feelings a lot, especially when they were hurt. I had to hold my tongue a lot too, and just kind of accept the crazies.

Once I kind of accepted the craziness of it I could take appropriate actions.

There is nothing wrong with letting a little time pass...

Freedom1990

A few things jumped out at me:

And your point of that statement is what? Do you feel it's difficult emotionally to run into this OW at least once a week, whereas he doesn't ever have to see the guy you were dating? There's some emotion underlying that statement. What is it?

Why would you bring her up in a conversation at all, even to mention where she is working now if you are trying to salvage your relationship with him?

What I hear here is justification for what you did because somewhere deep down inside you do feel guilty.

I suspect he also feels guilty over his seeing another woman, and he deals with that guilt by throwing it right back at you. He points the finger at you for what you did after you bring her up in conversation. It starts the ugly cycle of the two of you flinging guilt and resentment back and forth at each other.

This isn't about who's right and who's wrong. This is about each of you cleaning up your own side of the street, working towards a healthier and whole person. You each learn to own your own feelings and actions.

Then it's time to work on issues as a couple.

Just my measly 2 cents worth!

aboutdone

To address a few things...thanks for the questions Freedom. This will be bad on my part but here goes....

I have NO GUILT what so ever about the other relationship I had. I filed for divorce. I was done. DONE, otherwise I wouldn't have filed. I am not remorseful, and quite frankly I am tired of being told what an adulterer I am. I have understanding of his feelings to some degree. This isn't a blame game. I did what I did. However I did what I did, because I was moving on with my life. I wasn't going to sit at home waiting for AH to return whenever it was convenient. In my defense of this mess, had he not left our marital home, and continued on a 2 month drinking binge, I seriously doubt I would have ever filed, or went through with the divorce. Had I never filed, I would never had went out, and wouldn't have met the other guy. It seems to be a blame game, but it all starts somewhere. I am responsible for my actions, but I refuse to have someone tell me I committed a crime in our marriage, when what I considered a marriage, was basically null and void. I finalized that by filing for divorce. I didn't step outside of my marriage at any point prior to filing. I never even considered it. Now the understanding I have of it is this....to him, there was a paper that said we were married, and so regardless of the fact that he wasn't home, didn't plan on coming home, didn't pay anything toward household finances, wasn't there the week I was at the hospital with complications with pregnancy and the delivery of our daughter, he still liked the idea that we were married. Trust me here, I am really not bitter about it, and I don't hold any true resentments towards it, or I wouldn't be able to try to work on things now. I just get a little irritated with feeling I have to defend myself constantly for my actions, as if I was some strumpet, and really I was living life as a single mom of 4 kids as it was. I simply solidified it with a divorce. Hope that makes some sense.


Its not tit for tat. My point is, I see this young lady every week. Its not a big deal. It happened. Whatever. He on the other hand, never ever sees this guy, nor will he. I'm not trying to even the score. I am saying, if I can see her, and really have no feelings about it, I don't understand why he can't just let it go on his part. There is no constant reminder of the guy I was dating. None. No conversation about him. No running into him. It is like he fell off the face of the earth. So anything about him, is simply what RXAH is holding on to, and uses constantly as a little dagger.

Why I brought it up. We live in a very small town. My daughter now drives the car, that the RXAH was previously driving while he had this relationship with this young lady. The OW works at a local gas station again, where she worked previously while they were seeing each other. It simply came up, because daughter went there to get gas, and I guess the young lady was giving her a bit of a hard time. I didn't even bring that up. I merely mentioned she was back at that gas station.

I am the type of person, that doesn't believe you just sweep all the crap under the rug and that it will just dissolve or get absorbed somewhere. I think the past is the past, and that is that. I am not going to avoid talking about it. It was part of my life.

To me, that is like saying I shouldn't ever bring up the day our daughter was born, because it is a sore subject to him, and to me. The more that I have talked about it and the positives of that day, the better I am with it.

I want to move forward, I forgive him for his mistakes, as I would ask him to forgive me, but I am not sure how acting like basically a year of our lives, didn't take place?

bookwyrm

Aboutdone, I don't mean this as an attack, OK? You seem to think that because you've deal with your issues over the end of your marriage and then dating you seem to think that your XRAH ought to be too. He very clearly isn't. He is allowed to process this on his own timescale.

Maybe, knowing this is a trigger topic for him, you should avoid it for now? He obviously needs to work through this on his own. You cannot 'make' him just get over it already. Why would you deilberately hurt him by bringing it up? His therapist/counsellor is a more appropriate person for him to discuss this with rather than you. Don't defend yourself if the subject comes up. Detach. This is his problem to work through. You have no control over his feelings. Make it a boundary. Leave the room. Go do something else. Don't join in the dance. This is something I did when living with XAH. He would start ranting about my 'faults' and instead of participating in an argument I would just let him get on with it. There again, maybe this isn't such a good example. XAH finally escalated the rants to throwing things!

I would think the same thing would go with discussing your daughter's birth. You should talk to your counsellor about it to 'get comfortable' with it rather than the source of your anger and frustration. From my perspective, this what I'd mean by talking about keeping your own side of the street clean.

It is taking a long time for me to get over my resentment of XAH and I've been divorced for 7 months and no contact since Sept 09. I imagine that it would be so much harder if he were still in my life. How are you dealing with your resentments? I'm trying to let go but every so often, wham! They're back in full force for no apparent reason.

Bolina

I do understand how frustrating this situation is, about done. I couldn't resolve my own because there were just too many sticking points. As time has passed, I look back at how they were handled by me and ponder the different ways I might have approached them.

What do you need from your husband so that you can move on from the hurt that stems from his behavior at that time?

And have you asked him what he needs from you so that he can move on from your (as he sees it) adultery?

Can you both treat these two scenarios as separate problems without bringing one into the other, iyswim? If you can't, then you will probably just go round in circles and frustration may well lead to contempt and when that rears its ugly head, then it's game over, imho.

Summerpeach

Some AA/ Al Anon organizations do have groups for couples. You need to ask around.

As for the therapist, it's useless, You need to be counseled by someone who has a lot of experience with addictions.

In my opinion, you didn't cheat, you were well within your rights to go out and "date" whomever you wanted since the marriage was clearly over.
The thing is, men have a much harder time dealing with knowing the women they love was with with another. It's a subconscious double standard.

In this case, I would not bring up the other girl at all and when he brings up his issues with the other man, you can say that you won't in any WAY tolerate being called an adulterer and if he has valid questions about the pain from it, you will answer them, but won't respond to hurtful comments. PERIOD!

My relationship with my RABF sounds similar to yours as well. Really, you are just two people who are hurt and are trying to be heard.
Change therapists and ask around at your local aa /al anon meetings if there are couples meetings. They usually don't advertise them but they exist.

aboutdone

Very good points ladies. Thanks.

I feel I have mostly handled my resentments, and because I initially felt I was the one wronged, and so cheated out of things, and misled due to the alcoholism, then I should be the one with the most resentments. LOL.

I don't really feel that way anymore.

Thanks for pointing out that even though I don't have the bad feelings so much attached to the past, he in all probability does, and that I need to respect that, and try to avoid those conversations.

Today has been a great day with RAXH and I am thankful and blessed for that. Looking forward to him coming home from work in the next hour.

You know, sometimes, keeping my side of the street gets a little tough at times. Some days I need a street sweeper, and then days like today, I just need a little broom and dustpan. Sometimes just a dust mop.

My sister, recently dealing with her dry drunk husbands porn addiction that has come to light, asked me when things would finally be back to normal. I said that was a good question, as I don't ever remember my life being normal. Since I met RXAH he was always an alcoholic, then dry drunk, then raging, then binging, then dry drunk, then raging, then recovering. In the last 4 years, I have been right there with him, with all the insanity that went along with it. Now recovering as well.

In all fairness when we finally land on some degree of normal in our recovering lives, we might actually feel that we are as abnormal as they come, since we have no idea at times what normal looks like. LOL!

You ladies are great. Thanks for the kind words, and encouragement!