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If she is so obsessed with it that it even takes priority in her dreams, can there really be any hope of her leaving it behind permanently?
I am a recovering alcoholic, with AA and one day at a time, I have not had a drink since August 18 1996. I can tell you that drunk dreams are very common in early sobriety, it is not a continuation of the obsession, I had them off and on for over a year I think.
I mentioned that she should consider staying longer since she has such good support there and she confirmed that she had already been thinking the same thing.
Deep down I am the vile monster who keeps her from her booze.
Try to make it to that meeting, the face to face support will help you tremendously.
Beth
(the ever optimistic major depressive recovering alcoholic
)
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You are not a vile monster.
Her recovery is her issue not yours. It is a daily struggle from what I understand. It is not a permanent state as she has to work on it each day. In turn we have to work on our desire/need/predisposition to control or "help" each day. It is very easy to slip back into that role.
Since you have not yet been to al anon, have you read any literature about codependency? Melodie Beattie "Codependent No More" is a good book to address some tendencies that many of us who have lived with an active alcoholic need help with.
Her recovery is her issue not yours. It is a daily struggle from what I understand. It is not a permanent state as she has to work on it each day. In turn we have to work on our desire/need/predisposition to control or "help" each day. It is very easy to slip back into that role.
Since you have not yet been to al anon, have you read any literature about codependency? Melodie Beattie "Codependent No More" is a good book to address some tendencies that many of us who have lived with an active alcoholic need help with.
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Waterford MI
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Her recovery is her issue not yours. It is a daily struggle from what I understand. It is not a permanent state as she has to work on it each day. In turn we have to work on our desire/need/predisposition to control or "help" each day. It is very easy to slip back into that role.
I also recommend Codependent No More. It has been a real eye-opener for me, I wish I had any idea when I was struggling with my own sobriety and my alcohol/crack active ex husband.
You didnt cause it.
You cant change it.
You will not contol it.
Beth
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Posts: 26
I agree with Wicked BUT I "hear" a big warning signal - she's gotta do her recovery and you're not part of that but you have recovery to go through as well. It takes two to tango and whether you like it or not, you spent 6 years making excuses to yourself for her behavior, LETTING it damage you and part of being married is working through the consequences of choices that were not yours, as well - that sucks.
I agree if you're done, you're done. Doesn't make you feel great or like a good guy - I hear a lot of you wanting to feel like a good guy for not wanting to do it anymore, if I'm correct, I'd let that go it will keep you from doing the work you need to do whether she comes back or not. I don't think setting yourself or her up for "the first times she drinks she's outta her" scenario is fair to anyone - relapses happen. You're either willing to go through it with her or not.
Before you focus on all the things she's done to you and how you're not willing to deal with the drama anymore I'd sit down and have a long, serious "talk" with yourself about what you've done to her, I'm talking about completely seperate from the drinking, no one gets to blame their behavior on their disappointments but marriage is tough and no one is perfect so if you made it 26 years without disappointing or hurting her, I'd be shocked.
Lastly, if you can't be a caring, compassionate, supportive partner anymore - for whatever reason, you're too hurt, can't forgive, don't love her as much as you thought, there are a dozen reasons - cut her lose. I think the worst thing in the world a man can do to a woman is give her hope that her knight is still there for her when he's not. I would rather deal with the reality of killing that then hope it's still there to find it's not.
Good luck and welcome to SR, you'll get what you need here and you are doing lots of good things and going in the right direction.
I agree if you're done, you're done. Doesn't make you feel great or like a good guy - I hear a lot of you wanting to feel like a good guy for not wanting to do it anymore, if I'm correct, I'd let that go it will keep you from doing the work you need to do whether she comes back or not. I don't think setting yourself or her up for "the first times she drinks she's outta her" scenario is fair to anyone - relapses happen. You're either willing to go through it with her or not.
Before you focus on all the things she's done to you and how you're not willing to deal with the drama anymore I'd sit down and have a long, serious "talk" with yourself about what you've done to her, I'm talking about completely seperate from the drinking, no one gets to blame their behavior on their disappointments but marriage is tough and no one is perfect so if you made it 26 years without disappointing or hurting her, I'd be shocked.
Lastly, if you can't be a caring, compassionate, supportive partner anymore - for whatever reason, you're too hurt, can't forgive, don't love her as much as you thought, there are a dozen reasons - cut her lose. I think the worst thing in the world a man can do to a woman is give her hope that her knight is still there for her when he's not. I would rather deal with the reality of killing that then hope it's still there to find it's not.
Good luck and welcome to SR, you'll get what you need here and you are doing lots of good things and going in the right direction.
To thine own self be true.
Join Date: May 2009
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 5,924
My opinion? From what limited information is contained in your posts, it seems to me you may want to stop focusing on what to do about HER and start taking a look at yourself. Don't need a Higher Power because you're comfortable in your own skin? That makes no sense to me. I'm quite comfortable in my own skin and I do need a Higher Power. One's got nothing to do with the other.
I think you may want to consider, what was your contribution to the alcohol consumption? Were the two of you partying together but she's the one with the problem? Did you stop drinking and she didn't? You're not giving much information about the last 20 years of your relationship. If you came here for someone else to support you in a decision to dump your spouse, that's not what we are about. You haven't said WHY you feel this way, what you have gone thru, what you are going thru, how you are suffering from the effects of alcoholism, etc. We don't just support people in a decision to dump someone who appears to be trying.
Trust your instincts, follow your heart. And go to Al-Anon. That's my advice.
I think you may want to consider, what was your contribution to the alcohol consumption? Were the two of you partying together but she's the one with the problem? Did you stop drinking and she didn't? You're not giving much information about the last 20 years of your relationship. If you came here for someone else to support you in a decision to dump your spouse, that's not what we are about. You haven't said WHY you feel this way, what you have gone thru, what you are going thru, how you are suffering from the effects of alcoholism, etc. We don't just support people in a decision to dump someone who appears to be trying.
Trust your instincts, follow your heart. And go to Al-Anon. That's my advice.
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 223
Originally Posted by JoeVet 
It tells me that she is honestly trying to get this under control and she has found a network that is helping her. It tells me if she leaves that network and comes back here that she will quickly relapse but if I tell her to stay where she is then she will relapse because she misses the kids and will be devestated by not getting to come home..
6 months away lets her know this is very serious business. It lets her think while sober just how much she has to lose and how much she has hurt others.
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Join Date: Apr 2010
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Posts: 48
TooMuchSunShine - That is a good post and shows me I have a lot of decisions to make.
Learn2live: In the last 20 years I've been a moderate drinker. 1-2 large glasses of wine a night. Alcohol just makes me sick now. RAW seemed to drink less. We moved to a new post and joined a gourmet group where we went to house parties once a month. That lasted 2 years. She continued with the wives club which met to go for drinking lunches. Still It didn't seem bad. Then she continued drinking and it grew bad. She lost her job and wound up in the hospital for acute liver failure. She recovered from that and seemed to stay sober for almost a year but decided to "test" herself and fell off the wagon. Since then she drinks until she passes out. She gets belligerent if it is taken away or if we make it difficult to get. The rare times I see her coherent, she apologizes and says she needs help and says she wants to stop. Then she goes right back to it. Honestly, I wasn't expecting for her to stay sober this long. I sent her back to the states expecting her to fail and making it easier for me to officially return her to the States. If she is returned the military will give her a housing allowance plus she will get an adequate allowance for living expenses from me. The fact that she lasted 3 weeks is a feat. I am overjoyed for her but conflicted now as to what to do. All the post here have brought up many good points and gives me much to ponder. I will get to a Al-anon meeting here soon. I think face to face conversation would be helpful. As far as the higher power. I am an atheist. I know many will see me as a threat because of my lack of faith. I do not deny that avenue for people who have faith. I simply do not. I enjoy the reality of the world as it is. Having been to many AA meetings with RAW, I see that they do not push a particular deity and I hope that Al-anon is the same. Also I am comfortable with the 3c's. I do not feel responsible. I have tried to help but have come to the conclusion that me and my help are despised by the disease. I guess what I need to advice on whether I should let her back and that is my decision. Perhaps a bit of information on how to minimize the effects if I do let her back. How to isolate her from the family when the disease is in charge. Do I lock her up or just throw a large amount of alcohol in a room and let her drink until she dies or learns? I don't know.
Learn2live: In the last 20 years I've been a moderate drinker. 1-2 large glasses of wine a night. Alcohol just makes me sick now. RAW seemed to drink less. We moved to a new post and joined a gourmet group where we went to house parties once a month. That lasted 2 years. She continued with the wives club which met to go for drinking lunches. Still It didn't seem bad. Then she continued drinking and it grew bad. She lost her job and wound up in the hospital for acute liver failure. She recovered from that and seemed to stay sober for almost a year but decided to "test" herself and fell off the wagon. Since then she drinks until she passes out. She gets belligerent if it is taken away or if we make it difficult to get. The rare times I see her coherent, she apologizes and says she needs help and says she wants to stop. Then she goes right back to it. Honestly, I wasn't expecting for her to stay sober this long. I sent her back to the states expecting her to fail and making it easier for me to officially return her to the States. If she is returned the military will give her a housing allowance plus she will get an adequate allowance for living expenses from me. The fact that she lasted 3 weeks is a feat. I am overjoyed for her but conflicted now as to what to do. All the post here have brought up many good points and gives me much to ponder. I will get to a Al-anon meeting here soon. I think face to face conversation would be helpful. As far as the higher power. I am an atheist. I know many will see me as a threat because of my lack of faith. I do not deny that avenue for people who have faith. I simply do not. I enjoy the reality of the world as it is. Having been to many AA meetings with RAW, I see that they do not push a particular deity and I hope that Al-anon is the same. Also I am comfortable with the 3c's. I do not feel responsible. I have tried to help but have come to the conclusion that me and my help are despised by the disease. I guess what I need to advice on whether I should let her back and that is my decision. Perhaps a bit of information on how to minimize the effects if I do let her back. How to isolate her from the family when the disease is in charge. Do I lock her up or just throw a large amount of alcohol in a room and let her drink until she dies or learns? I don't know.
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Originally Posted by Bucyn
I would choose for myself option two: she stays there until she has her 6 month chip. If she relapses there it isn't because she 'misses the children' or you are being mean to her or anything like that. She relapsed because she chose to relapse. It's no one else's fault but her own. You cannot make any choice that will help or prevent her from relapsing. Those choices are all hers.
6 months away lets her know this is very serious business. It lets her think while sober just how much she has to lose and how much she has hurt others.
6 months away lets her know this is very serious business. It lets her think while sober just how much she has to lose and how much she has hurt others.
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Waterford MI
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Hello JoeVet,
The programs, based on my experience are spiritual, not religious. There is no deity to ascribe to, only my reality, and being true to myself. Each individual chooses their own path.
I have questions, only because I was in the military, married to a soldier and the daughter of an Army officer. But, I am not sure they would be helpful, and maybe just muddy the waters.
Understanding that you want to minimize anymore damage to yourself or your children, as a reality based person I think you know that you must wait. If she agrees to stay in the States where there is much more support, then by all means let her stay there, and wait, you will know what to do when the time comes.
I think you know you could not just throw her in a room with alcohol until she dies or learns a lesson, she was close to death with acute liver failure and still chose to drink.
How old are your children? If they went to visit their mother would the support be there for them if she did relapse? That is something you could find out and make arrangements for them.
Beth
The programs, based on my experience are spiritual, not religious. There is no deity to ascribe to, only my reality, and being true to myself. Each individual chooses their own path.
I have questions, only because I was in the military, married to a soldier and the daughter of an Army officer. But, I am not sure they would be helpful, and maybe just muddy the waters.
Understanding that you want to minimize anymore damage to yourself or your children, as a reality based person I think you know that you must wait. If she agrees to stay in the States where there is much more support, then by all means let her stay there, and wait, you will know what to do when the time comes.
I think you know you could not just throw her in a room with alcohol until she dies or learns a lesson, she was close to death with acute liver failure and still chose to drink.
How old are your children? If they went to visit their mother would the support be there for them if she did relapse? That is something you could find out and make arrangements for them.
Beth
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Originally Posted by wicked
Hello JoeVet,
How old are your children? If they went to visit their mother would the support be there for them if she did relapse? That is something you could find out and make arrangements for them.
Beth
How old are your children? If they went to visit their mother would the support be there for them if she did relapse? That is something you could find out and make arrangements for them.
Beth
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Join Date: Nov 2009
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Joe,
I think that is an excellent plan.
And, I must say I am so glad your kids have you in their life.
It is despicable what this disease does to our children, but my children are recovering now, and two are even thriving.
my seventeen year old is a basket case today, boyfriend dumped her by text last night, told her was at a girls (heroin using)house, and this "wasnt gonna work out."
My children, who i felt the most shame about (letting them down and not being available) love me anyway and see my example as a way to live.
It is the only way.
You know, it just occured to me that if the children go visit, they would find more support there too. Alateen or young peoples groups?
Thank you Joe, for your service and answering my questions.
Beth
I think that is an excellent plan.
And, I must say I am so glad your kids have you in their life.
It is despicable what this disease does to our children, but my children are recovering now, and two are even thriving.
my seventeen year old is a basket case today, boyfriend dumped her by text last night, told her was at a girls (heroin using)house, and this "wasnt gonna work out."
My children, who i felt the most shame about (letting them down and not being available) love me anyway and see my example as a way to live.
It is the only way.
You know, it just occured to me that if the children go visit, they would find more support there too. Alateen or young peoples groups?
Thank you Joe, for your service and answering my questions.
Beth
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
Posts: 26
Joe I'm glad to see that you're feeling a little better, I was feeling bad for you - I've been that angry too.
I know this is a guy thing but maybe it might be better if you didn't try to figure everything out right this minute?
I agree, you need to decide if she comes back but honey, it sounds like you have. I hear "I'm not ready, I'm worried, I don't know what to do if A, B, C happens" and lots of other things. You've been through hell, that's undeniable so protecting yourself until you're ready to deal with these things is reasonable. How your RAW takes that is NOT your responsibility or problem. It sounds like that's hard for you.
If you've been in the military for a long time and it sounds like you have, you're used to things following procedures, there's a way to handle everything and if there's not then you brave people figure one out. I was active duty and a reservist. Unfortunately the rest of the world just doesn't function at all like the military does ;-) I know, I know - shocking! Sometimes I wonder how everyone survives ;-) But you don't have to have everything figured out right now, you know how to prioritize and you are in a battle so use those skills and then learn to let the rest go until it's time not to let it go, the program will help you with that.
As far as the athiesm goes, I think you will find those here will leave you to your own choices and try to help you on your terms as much as possible. I would say try not to get hung up on that. HP's are fundamentally for giving things away that we can't control and "someone" to be in charge cause it's not us. I could see how you would REALLY struggle with those two things and that's okay, it's definately not time to tackle those dragons. At some point I would encourage you to have a honest inner battle about control issues and what you do give your authority to and I nor no one else can even guess what you're gonna come up with - I'd LOVE to hear about it though
Lastly, it sound like your a big, strong, tough guy and I say that with all the acceptance, love and affection I have within me, so when you're ready I would ask you to ponder one other thing about HP's, where does your peace come from, your solace? When the big bad world is big and bad, when you're losing men and women you've worked with, laughed with, bled with to evil or watching the world go to hell in a hand basket, where do you put your sorrow?
Those of us that believe in a HP are saddened if we think someone is missing out on the peace we experience and hopefully when you come across one of us and tell us you're an atheist they treat well and don't give you a hard time but offer you the love, hope and peace we experience. That's all it is and you totally have the choice not to investigate if there's anything there for you.
Hugs, love and kiss big guy! ;-)
I know this is a guy thing but maybe it might be better if you didn't try to figure everything out right this minute?
I agree, you need to decide if she comes back but honey, it sounds like you have. I hear "I'm not ready, I'm worried, I don't know what to do if A, B, C happens" and lots of other things. You've been through hell, that's undeniable so protecting yourself until you're ready to deal with these things is reasonable. How your RAW takes that is NOT your responsibility or problem. It sounds like that's hard for you.
If you've been in the military for a long time and it sounds like you have, you're used to things following procedures, there's a way to handle everything and if there's not then you brave people figure one out. I was active duty and a reservist. Unfortunately the rest of the world just doesn't function at all like the military does ;-) I know, I know - shocking! Sometimes I wonder how everyone survives ;-) But you don't have to have everything figured out right now, you know how to prioritize and you are in a battle so use those skills and then learn to let the rest go until it's time not to let it go, the program will help you with that.
As far as the athiesm goes, I think you will find those here will leave you to your own choices and try to help you on your terms as much as possible. I would say try not to get hung up on that. HP's are fundamentally for giving things away that we can't control and "someone" to be in charge cause it's not us. I could see how you would REALLY struggle with those two things and that's okay, it's definately not time to tackle those dragons. At some point I would encourage you to have a honest inner battle about control issues and what you do give your authority to and I nor no one else can even guess what you're gonna come up with - I'd LOVE to hear about it though
Lastly, it sound like your a big, strong, tough guy and I say that with all the acceptance, love and affection I have within me, so when you're ready I would ask you to ponder one other thing about HP's, where does your peace come from, your solace? When the big bad world is big and bad, when you're losing men and women you've worked with, laughed with, bled with to evil or watching the world go to hell in a hand basket, where do you put your sorrow?
Those of us that believe in a HP are saddened if we think someone is missing out on the peace we experience and hopefully when you come across one of us and tell us you're an atheist they treat well and don't give you a hard time but offer you the love, hope and peace we experience. That's all it is and you totally have the choice not to investigate if there's anything there for you.
Hugs, love and kiss big guy! ;-)
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Guess I should let everyone know that I am not this brave trigger puller on the frontlines fighting Al Qaeda. I'm a medical researcher in a lab. If I see bullets flying then I'm in the wrong place. No big strong army man here, just your average lab rat.
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Joe, I don't think it matters that you're not dodging bullets either. Lots of the parts of the military life are the same, those are what I was referring to and we all live in the big bad world ;-) and you still seem like the strong, tough guy type to me which the worlds needs more of.
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Originally Posted by Still Waters
I'm just curious, there is no rehabilitation where you're stationed?
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