My counseling appointment yesterday
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 215
My counseling appointment yesterday
I went to see the counselor yesterday solo - my husband and I have seen him 4 or 5 times over the past several months. I shared honestly a few things that happened recently that upset me, made me feel uneasy at home with my husband at times. I felt bad that it felt like a complaint session about my husband but it was really for the purpose of getting a greater understanding and seeing where I needed to improve.
The one thing that struck me hard that I can't seem to get out of my head today was the counselor's comment that 'this is a form of abuse.' small subtle things that hurt me, attempt to control me, and that should not be happening between a husband and wife (according to the counselor).
I left there feeling so crappy - it would have been much easier I believe to have been told that I am the cause and I need to make the following changes. He said trust your gut - if something isnt feeling right there is a good reason for it. What I did leave with however was the responsibilty for communicating with my husband, sticking up for myself, sharing what I am feeling, even say Stop It.
I feel horrid that this is not the first time someone has used the word abuse...you all have said that indirectly if not directly. I feel angry - for being in this spot and still doubting myself - not wanting to believe that my husband is at fault for anything. I feel wacked out right now. thanks for listening.
The one thing that struck me hard that I can't seem to get out of my head today was the counselor's comment that 'this is a form of abuse.' small subtle things that hurt me, attempt to control me, and that should not be happening between a husband and wife (according to the counselor).
I left there feeling so crappy - it would have been much easier I believe to have been told that I am the cause and I need to make the following changes. He said trust your gut - if something isnt feeling right there is a good reason for it. What I did leave with however was the responsibilty for communicating with my husband, sticking up for myself, sharing what I am feeling, even say Stop It.
I feel horrid that this is not the first time someone has used the word abuse...you all have said that indirectly if not directly. I feel angry - for being in this spot and still doubting myself - not wanting to believe that my husband is at fault for anything. I feel wacked out right now. thanks for listening.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Stumbling toward happiness
Posts: 4,706
((( jehn )))
Growth starts with some pretty difficult first steps sometimes.
And yes, of course it would be 'easier' if someone said, "It's all your fault and here's what you need to change." But that would only happen if the counselor was your husband - he's the only one on the whole planet who believes that.
Congratulations on making these steps on your own....I know how hard it is.
Growth starts with some pretty difficult first steps sometimes.
And yes, of course it would be 'easier' if someone said, "It's all your fault and here's what you need to change." But that would only happen if the counselor was your husband - he's the only one on the whole planet who believes that.
Congratulations on making these steps on your own....I know how hard it is.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: rural west
Posts: 1,375
[COLOR="Blue"]I know the feeling of envy when I see other couples...how they work together...seem secure... laugh together... have each others' backs. I know the feeling of not expecting I could have that or deserve it...for whatever reason. Primarily due to self imposed thinking that I am not a good enough or strong or confident enough person for that. I have chosen partners and relationships on that basis rather than on the basis that I deserve something very special.
* I want to feel secure and protected - that someone is there to take care of me
* (even though I may not be entierly ready to let them)
* I want someone who will be genuinely interested in how I am doing
* I want someone who will see a need and do things
* and thoughtful gestures that say I was thinking about YOU not me
* I want to be loved unconditionally
* I want some one to share in my joys - to be supportive of the things that make me happy
The above is from you.
Are you getting that in your relationship?
I went back and started reading your old posts and saw such fabulous advice...
I think you KNOW you are unhappy about certain things.
I think it feels scary to set boundaries and say, "NO. You can't control me. NO. You can't follow me around critiquing me. NO. You are not the boss of me. NO. I am not here to serve you, etc."
I think it might be scary to say, "I deserve..." and find out you don't have it.
I think it might be scary to consider you have to make major changes to get your needs met. Isn't it easier to just stuff our needs than change everything?? (That's how I feel sometimes)
Can you share what it would mean if your husband was abusive?
What would it mean about you? About him? About your marriage?
Maybe if you clarify this it will help you understand your feelings of horror and resistance.
* I want to feel secure and protected - that someone is there to take care of me
* (even though I may not be entierly ready to let them)
* I want someone who will be genuinely interested in how I am doing
* I want someone who will see a need and do things
* and thoughtful gestures that say I was thinking about YOU not me
* I want to be loved unconditionally
* I want some one to share in my joys - to be supportive of the things that make me happy
The above is from you.
Are you getting that in your relationship?
I went back and started reading your old posts and saw such fabulous advice...
I think you KNOW you are unhappy about certain things.
I think it feels scary to set boundaries and say, "NO. You can't control me. NO. You can't follow me around critiquing me. NO. You are not the boss of me. NO. I am not here to serve you, etc."
I think it might be scary to say, "I deserve..." and find out you don't have it.
I think it might be scary to consider you have to make major changes to get your needs met. Isn't it easier to just stuff our needs than change everything?? (That's how I feel sometimes)
Can you share what it would mean if your husband was abusive?
What would it mean about you? About him? About your marriage?
Maybe if you clarify this it will help you understand your feelings of horror and resistance.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 215
i wrote that? sounds so foreign, like it came from someone who knew what they wanted. where did I go?
what it would mean if my husband were abusive? it would say that i didnt matter to me. it would say that he felt he was right about most things and should get what he wants. it would say that the marriage is not of equals.
And you make a very good point: it IS scary to open up rather than stuff - because I fear what I will discover.
thanks all of your for the support (and patience). Wow! gives me a lot to think about.
what it would mean if my husband were abusive? it would say that i didnt matter to me. it would say that he felt he was right about most things and should get what he wants. it would say that the marriage is not of equals.
And you make a very good point: it IS scary to open up rather than stuff - because I fear what I will discover.
thanks all of your for the support (and patience). Wow! gives me a lot to think about.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: rural west
Posts: 1,375
If your therapist could give you advice
and whatever s/he told you
you could do/feel/say/think with no bad consequences
and no scary feeling,
what would you have liked him/her to tell you about your relationship or about what to do?
and whatever s/he told you
you could do/feel/say/think with no bad consequences
and no scary feeling,
what would you have liked him/her to tell you about your relationship or about what to do?
Member
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Southwest
Posts: 1,207
Originally Posted by jehnifer 
I think it might be scary to say, "I deserve..." and find out you don't have it.
that statement makes my stomach knot up.
that statement makes my stomach knot up.
Sooo...I want you to know that tolerating abuse has its ramifications on you. It's never just "over" because he has stopped talking to you. It requires a lot of affirmative self-love to heal from it, IMO. More than just the self-love it takes to get out.
But I am so much happier away from the cruelty.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 215
setting aside the fear I guess I would have liked him to say that the relationship is not healthy and is heading down a path that will be fuill of struggles - full of me gettingin this place over and over again.
That my 'fears' are getting in the way of me being who I really am and living a real honest life. (whatever that means
)
I just copied this from someone else's post because it revealed me: "I wanted to protect him but more then that, I felt incredible anxiety when he was upset - anxiety at his uncomfortableness. My boundaries went crashing down to alleviate his emotional distress, which were causing such a physical/emotional reaction in me." See, I often go to great lengths to ensure he doesnt get upset about something or at me.
I would also expect my therapist to say That my husband's characterisitcs of perfectionism, judgement, controlling nature will likley stay with him forever and will be a constant cause for conflict. That I need to look within and value myself enough - just a little bit at least - to beleive I have a right to move away from something that does not feel good to me, even if it was scary and sad and might be deemed as a failure. And then there's the notion that It's not ALL bad! Just sometimes!
BUT here's the thing: I dont know what is on the other side; will it be better? what if its worse? What if I were to look back and realize that I really had it good?
That my 'fears' are getting in the way of me being who I really am and living a real honest life. (whatever that means
) I just copied this from someone else's post because it revealed me: "I wanted to protect him but more then that, I felt incredible anxiety when he was upset - anxiety at his uncomfortableness. My boundaries went crashing down to alleviate his emotional distress, which were causing such a physical/emotional reaction in me." See, I often go to great lengths to ensure he doesnt get upset about something or at me.
I would also expect my therapist to say That my husband's characterisitcs of perfectionism, judgement, controlling nature will likley stay with him forever and will be a constant cause for conflict. That I need to look within and value myself enough - just a little bit at least - to beleive I have a right to move away from something that does not feel good to me, even if it was scary and sad and might be deemed as a failure. And then there's the notion that It's not ALL bad! Just sometimes!
BUT here's the thing: I dont know what is on the other side; will it be better? what if its worse? What if I were to look back and realize that I really had it good?
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 215
OMG Something else just came to me!
My therapist would also dare to say...That i am living a very DISHONEST life. And shame on me. Dishonest because I'm not being 'real' with the one person who is supposed to be closest to me...my husband. (i can tell you its becasue of fear). And if I were being honest in the relationship I would be communicating very clearly to him and hearing myself say - what I want and need FOR MYSELF and that I am not real comfortable with things right now. And by not sharing this with him and taking care of myself and needs I am creating an artificial relationship.
Not sure if that makes sense but it seems to fit.
My therapist would also dare to say...That i am living a very DISHONEST life. And shame on me. Dishonest because I'm not being 'real' with the one person who is supposed to be closest to me...my husband. (i can tell you its becasue of fear). And if I were being honest in the relationship I would be communicating very clearly to him and hearing myself say - what I want and need FOR MYSELF and that I am not real comfortable with things right now. And by not sharing this with him and taking care of myself and needs I am creating an artificial relationship.
Not sure if that makes sense but it seems to fit.
A jug fills drop by drop
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 6,784
Hi!
A relation is 50/50, its never one person's fault.... that was a tough pill to swallow but now its obvious...
I struggle with "I deserve".
But I am finding out its not about going out to obtain it.
Its more like letting go the obstacles and toxins.
Then you get some clarity and silence and realize you already got it within you, you just forgot for a while.
All the best. I think its great you keep going to the counselor to talk about the uneasy stuff. That takes A LOT of guts, its something brave. I often worry about my therapist's APPROVAL for God's sakes
and am ashamed when I lose it and want to cry...
Anvil thanks for that post. Its not about luck or "the world", its all about the tools and wisdom you can use in your favor regardless of the circumstances.
A relation is 50/50, its never one person's fault.... that was a tough pill to swallow but now its obvious...
I struggle with "I deserve".
But I am finding out its not about going out to obtain it.
Its more like letting go the obstacles and toxins.
Then you get some clarity and silence and realize you already got it within you, you just forgot for a while.
All the best. I think its great you keep going to the counselor to talk about the uneasy stuff. That takes A LOT of guts, its something brave. I often worry about my therapist's APPROVAL for God's sakes
and am ashamed when I lose it and want to cry... Anvil thanks for that post. Its not about luck or "the world", its all about the tools and wisdom you can use in your favor regardless of the circumstances.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,443
Originally Posted by jehnifer
OMG Something else just came to me!
My therapist would also dare to say...That i am living a very DISHONEST life. And shame on me. Dishonest because I'm not being 'real' with the one person who is supposed to be closest to me...my husband. (i can tell you its becasue of fear). And if I were being honest in the relationship I would be communicating very clearly to him and hearing myself say - what I want and need FOR MYSELF and that I am not real comfortable with things right now. And by not sharing this with him and taking care of myself and needs I am creating an artificial relationship.
Not sure if that makes sense but it seems to fit.
My therapist would also dare to say...That i am living a very DISHONEST life. And shame on me. Dishonest because I'm not being 'real' with the one person who is supposed to be closest to me...my husband. (i can tell you its becasue of fear). And if I were being honest in the relationship I would be communicating very clearly to him and hearing myself say - what I want and need FOR MYSELF and that I am not real comfortable with things right now. And by not sharing this with him and taking care of myself and needs I am creating an artificial relationship.
Not sure if that makes sense but it seems to fit.
Originally Posted by anvilhead
Personal Bill of Rights
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 215
you mean him calling me a 'lesbo' means i am not being treated with respect?
and him not liking that i sometimes put my hair put in a pony tail causing him reach over and take the rubberband out saying you know I dont like your hair up that way... steps on my right to be be uniqely myself? and worse yet i now re-consider everytime i want to put my hair up oh he won't like that...
and him not liking that i sometimes put my hair put in a pony tail causing him reach over and take the rubberband out saying you know I dont like your hair up that way... steps on my right to be be uniqely myself? and worse yet i now re-consider everytime i want to put my hair up oh he won't like that...
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 545
Originally Posted by jehnifer
you mean him calling me a 'lesbo' means i am not being treated with respect?
and him not liking that i sometimes put my hair put in a pony tail causing him reach over and take the rubberband out saying you know I dont like your hair up that way... steps on my right to be be uniqely myself? and worse yet i now re-consider everytime i want to put my hair up oh he won't like that...
and him not liking that i sometimes put my hair put in a pony tail causing him reach over and take the rubberband out saying you know I dont like your hair up that way... steps on my right to be be uniqely myself? and worse yet i now re-consider everytime i want to put my hair up oh he won't like that...
.... hold on...... looking for........
...... found it......Oooh girl he wouldn't want to .... never-mind.... this is for you :ghug3
Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: rural west
Posts: 1,375
You rock!
You answered my questions right away and honestly - wow!
I TOTALLY understand not wanting to upset your H. Backing down/playing nice/placating if he's upset - I do that, too! Or I avoid bringing up my rights/needs/wants because I know he'll have himself a little freakout!
(But pulling the band out of your hair? Sorry, but F-YOU, husband! That pisses me off FOR you! What gall! You could stomp on his foot and tell him to F-off and take his grimy hands off you, as far as I am concerned! NO ONE has the right to control you but you! GRRRRR!!!! - Okay, my rant is done!)
Jehnifer's Messages to Herself:
* the relationship is not healthy and is heading down a path that will be fuill of struggles - full of me getting in this place over and over again.
*my 'fears' are getting in the way of me being who I really am and living a real honest life.
* my husband's characterisitcs of perfectionism, judgement, controlling nature will likley stay with him forever and will be a constant cause for conflict.
* I need to look within and value myself enough - just a little bit at least - to beleive I have a right to move away from something that does not feel good to me, even if it was scary and sad and might be deemed as a failure.
* i am living a very DISHONEST life. Dishonest because I'm not being 'real' with the one person who is supposed to be closest to me...my husband.
* if I were being honest in the relationship I would be communicating very clearly to him and hearing myself say - what I want and need FOR MYSELF and that I am not real comfortable with things right now.
* by not sharing this with him and taking care of myself and needs I am creating an artificial relationship.
This is huge! Read that one 1000 times. But please, no shame or blame. Don't beat yourself up over what happened. It's done. So what. Every moment is a NEW one and all this information does is help you make choices TODAY that will help you in the future live a life of joy.
What if's pop up, for sure! What if I am wrong! What if I am being selfish!
But you KNOW you feel crummy in the situation the way it is. You KNOW. Stop denying and questioning that. You have a right to admit that. It doesn't make you a bad wife or person or anything.
So, anything new, will undoubtedly be better than a relationship that makes you feel crummy.
HUGE HUGS TO YOU, my friend!
You are doing great work.
Reread your previous posts and replies and keep present to the life you want to create.
Peace.
You answered my questions right away and honestly - wow!
I TOTALLY understand not wanting to upset your H. Backing down/playing nice/placating if he's upset - I do that, too! Or I avoid bringing up my rights/needs/wants because I know he'll have himself a little freakout!
(But pulling the band out of your hair? Sorry, but F-YOU, husband! That pisses me off FOR you! What gall! You could stomp on his foot and tell him to F-off and take his grimy hands off you, as far as I am concerned! NO ONE has the right to control you but you! GRRRRR!!!! - Okay, my rant is done!)
Jehnifer's Messages to Herself:
* the relationship is not healthy and is heading down a path that will be fuill of struggles - full of me getting in this place over and over again.
*my 'fears' are getting in the way of me being who I really am and living a real honest life.
* my husband's characterisitcs of perfectionism, judgement, controlling nature will likley stay with him forever and will be a constant cause for conflict.
* I need to look within and value myself enough - just a little bit at least - to beleive I have a right to move away from something that does not feel good to me, even if it was scary and sad and might be deemed as a failure.
* i am living a very DISHONEST life. Dishonest because I'm not being 'real' with the one person who is supposed to be closest to me...my husband.
* if I were being honest in the relationship I would be communicating very clearly to him and hearing myself say - what I want and need FOR MYSELF and that I am not real comfortable with things right now.
* by not sharing this with him and taking care of myself and needs I am creating an artificial relationship.
This is huge! Read that one 1000 times. But please, no shame or blame. Don't beat yourself up over what happened. It's done. So what. Every moment is a NEW one and all this information does is help you make choices TODAY that will help you in the future live a life of joy.
What if's pop up, for sure! What if I am wrong! What if I am being selfish!
But you KNOW you feel crummy in the situation the way it is. You KNOW. Stop denying and questioning that. You have a right to admit that. It doesn't make you a bad wife or person or anything.
So, anything new, will undoubtedly be better than a relationship that makes you feel crummy.
HUGE HUGS TO YOU, my friend!
You are doing great work.
Reread your previous posts and replies and keep present to the life you want to create.
Peace.
peaceful seabird
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: floating
Posts: 4,822
I remember finally finding my voice. I finally decided to say what I meant and I meant what I said without being mean.
I told my spouse:
Your happiness is not more important than mine.
Your comfort is not more important than mine.
Your life is not more important than mine.
Then I began to learn new tools to find my happiness, establish my personal comfort and live my life. It is a journey of progress, not perfection.
We're here to support you on your journey. You are doing great!
I told my spouse:
Your happiness is not more important than mine.
Your comfort is not more important than mine.
Your life is not more important than mine.
Then I began to learn new tools to find my happiness, establish my personal comfort and live my life. It is a journey of progress, not perfection.
We're here to support you on your journey. You are doing great!
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Kansas
Posts: 10,182
Originally Posted by jehnifer
BUT here's the thing: I dont know what is on the other side; will it be better? what if its worse? What if I were to look back and realize that I really had it good?
This is one of the worst effects of suffering abuse, whether it's physical or emotional. We doubt ourselves, our feelings, our self-worth. We lose ourselves.
I was whittled down, piece by piece, bit by bit, cell by cell when I was with my EXAH.
He could say he was leaving to get a pack of cigarettes, and not come home for three days, leaving me to run the gamut of emotions.
I would be absolutely frantic by the time he made it home.
The end result was he always beat the living hell out of me, and by the time he was done with the hitting and verbal abuse, I was 100% convinced had I just handled it differently, things would have been 'fine.'
I believed I deserved that kind of treatment, and that was as good as it was ever going to get for me.
Every insult hurled at me, every kick in the head, every slap in the face...I was sure I deserved it.
I look back now and it's almost like looking at someone else's life.
There are rare occasions when something triggers old memories/feelings from that hellish period in my life, and I feel like I'm going to vomit.
I am so grateful today that he didn't kill me. I am so grateful that I left him when I still had a shred of myself left.
:ghug3
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 215
LaTee Da said: If you were to look in on your life/marriage from the outside, like sitting in the audience watching a play, what would you be cheering for the heroine (you) to do?
The words "stand up" come to mind. Stand up tall. This heroine should show that she owns herself and her surroundings and has command of her every next step...with conviction. HOw she moves about her home would be with self-assurance and confidence (rather than doubt or fear). She will be happy and SHOW that she is happy by doing what makes her feel good! She will not be moved by the moods iofothers: she will be respoectful yet move along with her own business.
She will say Stop it... or I dont like it when you do that... Or it was unacceptable to me that you.. or it hurt me when... and not feel bad about it.
The words "stand up" come to mind. Stand up tall. This heroine should show that she owns herself and her surroundings and has command of her every next step...with conviction. HOw she moves about her home would be with self-assurance and confidence (rather than doubt or fear). She will be happy and SHOW that she is happy by doing what makes her feel good! She will not be moved by the moods iofothers: she will be respoectful yet move along with her own business.
She will say Stop it... or I dont like it when you do that... Or it was unacceptable to me that you.. or it hurt me when... and not feel bad about it.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Southwest
Posts: 1,207
Right, DeVon.
What I wanted to say is that the literature says that abusiveness - mental, verbal, physical, is not something that you can "work out" by communicating better, having date nights, making each other a priority, etc.
It does not get better with time or more work on the relationship. Someone wise on this board recommended a book called "Why Does he Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft and it was absolutely riveting in the way it described my life.
What I wanted to say is that the literature says that abusiveness - mental, verbal, physical, is not something that you can "work out" by communicating better, having date nights, making each other a priority, etc.
It does not get better with time or more work on the relationship. Someone wise on this board recommended a book called "Why Does he Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft and it was absolutely riveting in the way it described my life.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: minneapolis, mn
Posts: 2,762
Originally Posted by jehnifer
I often go to great lengths to ensure he doesnt get upset about something or at me.
I used to pick up my niece every Friday, so she could spend the weekend with us (til we ended up taking her in that is). She was abandoned by her mother and had some borderline abusive foster parents.
I can't count how many time I would say to her, while driving and hearing about some little minor form of torture this foster mother would impose on my niece:
"honey, whenever someone is abusive to you, it's always about them. and it's never really about you."
I thought that if I told her this statement every time something relevant to it came up, it would get in her head and stay there.
Jehnifer, can you start saying that statement to yourself? And maybe then one day you'll believe it.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
