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Was my ex An Alcoholic?

Old 04-06-2010, 07:44 PM
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DMKK,

Few things....

First off: WELCOME. this is a super-duper terrific site.

Second:

"It's just hard when you get cheated on to know they are happy and thriving and you are suffering and lonely and all that."

umm.....not.

believe me, she is absolutely not thriving, nor is she truly happy. happy people are grounded. grounded people know what they want, they have integrity because they know they have to look in the mirror every night.

Third: as some have said, they can't say whether or not she is alcoholic, but......
well...she is.

Now you know the truth. I think the purpose to ask all these questions, and analyze the relationship, is to learn and grow. And not go into your next relationship repeating.

Peace,
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Old 04-06-2010, 07:56 PM
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DMKK - I am glad to know you are ok and did not slip away or give in. Our situations are so close. Would you be my buddy on here? Meaning, a person to talk to? I hope that is ok. I know there are so many others that are there for me. Just a thought.

I'm glad CoffeeDrinker posted that statement as I too wonder if they are happier with the other guy. Add two kids and the hurts - I have tears thinking about it. Oops, need to detach!

DMKK, I am praying for you.
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Old 04-06-2010, 08:27 PM
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I know it is important to (and seems impossible not to) think and overthink our partners and why they do what they do, but don't forget to settle back down into yourself.
Continue to revist you and how you ended up where you did.
Read Codependent No More by Melody Beattie.
Do the 12 steps thru Alanon or CoDA.
Vist some Alanon meetings.
Journal.
Try therapy.
Don't let her distract you from learning about you so you won't play this out again.
Hugs and peace.
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Old 04-06-2010, 10:42 PM
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Yes what FindingPeace said.

How are you doing DMKK?
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Old 04-07-2010, 05:08 AM
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I'm doing ok all things considered. Today SHOULD be the last day of contact as she is scheduled to come pick up the rest of her things out of my garage.

I got another e-mail this morning to confirm we are still "on" for tonight with a bunch of questions (do you have my xxxxx, and xxxxx, etc) and an attempt at more friendly banter. Says "my roommate" will be by with the truck and I might be a little earlier (so I assume OM might be her "roommate" what a laugh, but I don't care to see him or know, I am going to just be out back on my deck ignoring the situation). She is starting to ask questions like a friend would ask. I don't want to be friends with her. I hope she gets that. I just have this feeling that after this is all over, if she runs into a problem or something she'll feel like she can just write me with a "can you help me with..." type friendly question or something. My plan will be just to totally ignore it. I mean come on. At least once she gets her stuff out of the house, I have no obligation to answer her calls or mails anymore. I just hope she has EVERYTHING out of here. There were indeed a few things we forgot this morning that I had to go add to her stuff pile. I hope there's not any more discovered down the road.

Hurry up and get this over with, please! Need to have no contact!!!
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Old 04-10-2010, 07:37 AM
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Thanks for all the support so far. I have been in a full-blown NO CONTACT mode since Wednesday night, when she came by (I think with the guy she cheated on me with, and is likely now already living with) to get all the rest of her things out of the garage.

We had no goodbye, her arrival was very formal, I saw her for a split second when she got there before her "roommate" did (as she said, my "roommate" is coming with a truck), and that was that.

It's still tough on me because we are not talking an out-and-out "drinking all the time" person here...Sure she had some issues with overdoing it quite often when she drank, and she did drink more than your average person, though it wasn't like she was a wake up and drink type of person ever, so now I just have to sit here, as I am in no contact, alone, and envision her happy having a blast with the new guy, and her new life.

So it's a bitter pill to swallow -- I don't regret standing up to her for her drinking which I still felt was too much, especially all the times she turned into an angry monster when she overdid it, but now I sit here thinking, maybe it was just me, and this won't happen in the new relationship and they will live happily ever after.

It's hard not to miss her for the good times together, but I guess this is part of the whole codependency aspect. I have no idea where she is, what she is doing, who she is with, anymore, totally removed contact from all social media, no emails, no texts, phone calls, etc.

We'll see how it goes. Very sad and lonely so far...Even though I am keeping VERY busy it is still hard to not think of her.
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Old 04-10-2010, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by DMKK View Post
It's still tough on me because we are not talking an out-and-out "drinking all the time" person here...Sure she had some issues with overdoing it quite often when she drank, and she did drink more than your average person, though it wasn't like she was a wake up and drink type of person ever, so now I just have to sit here, as I am in no contact, alone, and envision her happy having a blast with the new guy, and her new life.
I'm wondering about this. I think you are having a hard time with the whole "alcoholic" concept. Why do you think that is? Have you thought about that?

About you being alone, and her having a blast, realize that your alone time is yielding you some good stuff. Reflection and self-examination, time to develop some new friends or interests, and think forward to what you would have your life be if you could just choose one. She is missing out on many, many things. If she is indeed having a blast, it is superficial (given what kind of person I think she likely is). Who wants that?



"the unexamined life is not worth living" socrates
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Old 04-10-2010, 08:18 AM
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I guess because I am wondering if I over-reacted and thusly pushed her away. The word "alcoholic" is a bad term to use because I realize a person needs to decide that for themselves. It is not a label. So I guess I can say "did she drink too much" or "did she have a drinking problem". I suppose I am being hard on myself because the last few months of our relationship, when the cheating really started (when the window opened, per se) was due to my escalating pressure on her about her drinking. We co-existed for 4 years, during that time she DID drink, just as regularly as she had been, sometimes more, but for the most part I just looked the other way. When she had her episodes where she went overboard, the fights, the blackouts, she would always apologize very lightly the next day but then in her eyes it was time to move on. Often she'd drink a little less for a little while after that happened, but gradually get back up to the same levels.

All that said, I read other posts/stories here and it seems like she is not nearly the drinker that many of the other folks here have had to suffer with. And I wonder if she was just a "heavy drinker" and that was just something I was being too hard on her for. I realize at this point it doesn't matter, but looking back I worry it was me that pushed her away and that maybe I was being, as she said, too "controlling" in suggesting she cut back on the drinking levels.

As for being alone, I agree it's a good introspective time and I will ultimately benefit personally. By nature humans fear change, so for me having to go through this after 4 years with the same girl is a major one for me. So it's a struggle right now.

I do like what you have to say about her fun being superficial. She can be enjoying all the attention, the money, the non-judgmental drinking, sex with the new guy, etc, but in the end of the day she still does have to live with herself, and maybe that doesn't register right now but hopefully eventually will.

I read something today that those who do have a drinking problem sometimes do not have the capacity to even realize/understand they are hurting someone, and in their selfishness will rationalize that they did the right thing, and for some reason that bugs me, that she would think that her decisions were right.
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Old 04-10-2010, 08:57 AM
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DMKK,

It was the hardest thing for me to learn when I came here, and I didn't like it one bit:
--I can't control what s/he thinks about me, or about our situation
--I can't control whether s/he "gets the message" later or not
--I can't control whether s/he turns out to be a good person or a bad person

The only thing in my power was looking at our situation, without labels, without excuses, and asking myself: Is this how I want to live for the rest of my life?

And then acting accordingly. It was the people here who taught me that it just didn't matter what he did, what he was, or what he learned.

I had to move on with my life and learn to wipe these useless thoughts out of my mind. Can't control that stuff. At. All. And funny thing: life go so much better when I practiced that.

Wishing you peace of mind and a much better future!
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Old 04-10-2010, 10:58 AM
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Thanks for the re-assuring words. Those are some fantastic realizations. And they of course are 100% correct. The next thing is to train my brain to get away from those type of thoughts...Stop with all the "what if" scenarios. Stop being hopeful she will do a 180 and come around. Between the lying, cheating, and the drinking, it's an impossible fix in the short term anyway, so I am trying to train myself to focus on ME and not her anymore.

I did read, even before we split up, that I couldn't make her change her drinking habits at all, and even told her that when I realized it. Her response was to agree and then just keep on drinking, maybe even more regularly than before. But I still tried to tell her when her drinking was bothering me even after that conversation, which that turned into attacks on me being "controlling" and that she "wasn't doing anything wrong" which then pushed her even closer into her new relationship with the new guy (he was her safety net away from my disapproval of her drinking episodes).

The funny thing is, when it started falling apart, I asked her, did you have fights like this about your drinking in previous relationships, and she said they she did...But that it never changed anything. So I guess I just have to wonder if it will happen again in her new one, or if this guy is just the one who won't care or the one she'll change for.
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Old 04-10-2010, 01:50 PM
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DMKK - Our stories are exactly the same. Wow! Hoping we could talk some more when you get back online. I am moving on, but struggle with alot of the same thoughts you do. Stay strong, keep posting and I will talk to you if you need to vent. I'm not experienced like others on here though with A.
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Old 04-10-2010, 03:17 PM
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That's cool man. Most definitely. I mean honestly it may not be an "alcoholic" we are dealing with, but simply a girl who likes the party, likes the attention, likes the freedom, and so on. Alcohol is an escape, but so is a new relationship, a new guy, new friends, new places, etc.

Overall, these girls are not ready to settle down and they are going to run and escape any way they know how. I am trying to look at it that way. My case was rough because we lived together for 4 years and have been engaged for a year and a half. If she wanted out of this life she had plenty of time to do it in. But still like people say, better for them to leave NOW then later, even if it wasn't as soon as you thought, anyone capable of doing the lying/cheating thing, it's in their blood, in their brain, if they didn't do it now it would have come later...These people don't face problems, they run from them, they use alcohol as a way to numb the poor decisions, they rationalize it however they can.

I am all cool with a girl who says she doesn't want to be together anymore, that is a mature, normal decision to make. I am not cool with a girl who cheats and lies and sneaks around and doesn't tell me what's going on. Regardless of the booze the lying and deception is what made the break something that had to happen.
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Old 04-10-2010, 07:32 PM
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We both feel like we over-reacted, but the flip the coin over. What if a person broke up with you over this type of situation, and you really thought about it and felt it wasn't worth losing. The key word is "thought". I don't think they think like we do. Or, in an A's case, they simply find another victim and feel no different because they love the bottle more anyways.
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Old 04-10-2010, 07:46 PM
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Hi DMKK,

My story is the same as yours in many ways. You might want to go back and read my posts but in a nutshell I was with my exA (who said alcohol "is a problem" and who does NOT believe that "alcoholic" is an appropriate label) for almost a year. I use the abbreviation "exA" because it's easier when I post, but it's true that it's not up to me to place the label on someone else.

Like you, what I came to understand for myself is that whether or not "alcoholic" is an accurate term I couldn't live with the combination of behaviors in the relationship, one of the behaviors being the importance of alcohol in day-to-day life. For me, a glass of wine when I'm at dinner with friends is a pleasant experience, a complement to the meal, etc. However, beyond that, it's just not important. My exA (who became my "ex" just this week) acknowledges that alcohol is "enjoyed" or "thought about" EVERY DAY. When it wasn't around it wasn't talked about and it was easy for me to "forget" how important it might be to someone who has a significant relationship with the stuff. It was my way of pretending that this relationship could/might be "enough" for me.

Then there were the lies. "No, that's not alcohol you smell on my breath, it's mouthwash, maybe your sense of smell is off"; "No, I haven't had contact with the married person I had an affair with just before we began dating" (then it would come to light that there had been contact); "No one else has ever questioned my drinking before" (when in the past it had been acknowledged that others had brought it up), etc. There were many, many manipulations, but I could never seem to grasp them in the moment but after contact would feel like I'd been slugged up side the head with a blunt instrument...with no idea how that happened. I totally gave away my personal "power", which was, and is, my illness to address.

As I'm recounting all of this I can't type fast enough to keep up with all of the inconsistencies that come to mind in a rush...this is the most clarity I've had around this, and the good folks here have had a great deal to do with that, along with Alanon, my sponsor, my healthy friends who have watched me run myself emotionally ragged in this relationship but have given me the encouragement to move through my process with it all.

I completely understand what you're saying here, "I am all cool with a girl who says she doesn't want to be together anymore, that is a mature, normal decision to make. I am not cool with a girl who cheats and lies and sneaks around and doesn't tell me what's going on." You're not alone in expecting accountability. I'm on my own now too, and despite the pain have a growing part of myself that is plenty grateful for the reprieve.

posie
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Old 04-10-2010, 07:58 PM
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Inconsistencies - oh yes. Here is one. XAGF says "I like who you are, you are into my kids and are a good family man. Inbetween I dated men that were into the Harleys, cars, etc." She was married 15 years and I met her one year after separation. I ask her inbetween who? She says "before my marriage and the last relationship before that." It was so oddly stated to me it was obvious she meant after her marriage and before me!! When I met her she said I was the first man she was with. It just felt odd right then and there!
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Old 04-11-2010, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by tpen View Post
We both feel like we over-reacted, but the flip the coin over. What if a person broke up with you over this type of situation, and you really thought about it and felt it wasn't worth losing. The key word is "thought". I don't think they think like we do. Or, in an A's case, they simply find another victim and feel no different because they love the bottle more anyways.
Yeah I mean I was definitely looking the other way or even at times covering for her and not telling friends or family about the episodes she had when drinking. The problems were the times that it happened in front of other people, then there wasn't much that could be done.

No, I don't think they think like us. I mean anyone who could lie and cheat is just a different type of human being, in my opinion. I understand that in some cases the alcohol is an affliction and they can't control it, or choose not to...

I think it's a great point though that if they have the means, leaving for a new guy is great for them because it is a total fresh start, without guilt of drinking, all the past fights/episodes can get wiped clean, etc. Unless they change though I have to assume the problems will come back in the new relationship too. And maybe she will straighten up but I have my doubts. I just wish she would have been willing to try for me, but she chose the fresh start and the drinking.
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Old 04-11-2010, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by posiesperson View Post
Hi DMKK,

My story is the same as yours in many ways. You might want to go back and read my posts but in a nutshell I was with my exA (who said alcohol "is a problem" and who does NOT believe that "alcoholic" is an appropriate label) for almost a year. I use the abbreviation "exA" because it's easier when I post, but it's true that it's not up to me to place the label on someone else.

Like you, what I came to understand for myself is that whether or not "alcoholic" is an accurate term I couldn't live with the combination of behaviors in the relationship, one of the behaviors being the importance of alcohol in day-to-day life. For me, a glass of wine when I'm at dinner with friends is a pleasant experience, a complement to the meal, etc. However, beyond that, it's just not important. My exA (who became my "ex" just this week) acknowledges that alcohol is "enjoyed" or "thought about" EVERY DAY. When it wasn't around it wasn't talked about and it was easy for me to "forget" how important it might be to someone who has a significant relationship with the stuff. It was my way of pretending that this relationship could/might be "enough" for me.

Then there were the lies. "No, that's not alcohol you smell on my breath, it's mouthwash, maybe your sense of smell is off"; "No, I haven't had contact with the married person I had an affair with just before we began dating" (then it would come to light that there had been contact); "No one else has ever questioned my drinking before" (when in the past it had been acknowledged that others had brought it up), etc. There were many, many manipulations, but I could never seem to grasp them in the moment but after contact would feel like I'd been slugged up side the head with a blunt instrument...with no idea how that happened. I totally gave away my personal "power", which was, and is, my illness to address.

As I'm recounting all of this I can't type fast enough to keep up with all of the inconsistencies that come to mind in a rush...this is the most clarity I've had around this, and the good folks here have had a great deal to do with that, along with Alanon, my sponsor, my healthy friends who have watched me run myself emotionally ragged in this relationship but have given me the encouragement to move through my process with it all.

I completely understand what you're saying here, "I am all cool with a girl who says she doesn't want to be together anymore, that is a mature, normal decision to make. I am not cool with a girl who cheats and lies and sneaks around and doesn't tell me what's going on." You're not alone in expecting accountability. I'm on my own now too, and despite the pain have a growing part of myself that is plenty grateful for the reprieve.

posie
Thanks for your post and I am sorry to hear what you are going through, too. I do not miss the alcohol related parts of our relationship and it is nice to be free of all that burden and stress. However I can't help but still miss her for the good times, the company, the love, etc. I think that's what makes this all so hard. It's not like we were miserable 24/7. There are good things to look back on as well and that is what is troubling me so much lately, that and the fact she has replaced me so easily with someone else. It's a tough one.

Like you though after a while the alcohol just became a part of my day to day life with her. Like I said she wasn't drinking in the morning, just by herself most nights, and more on the weekends. It was weird, because it was just beer, but after she drank only 1 or 2, her entire body started smelling like an alcohol distillery. It was like a smell coming from her pores or something like that. Very strange, like nothing I ever saw before.

Also, she never "got drunk" according to her, she just "had a little buzz" all the time.

But anyway like I said, I am happy to be free of that but I still miss her a ton for whatever reason.
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Old 04-11-2010, 05:44 PM
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DMKK

Nothing wrong with missing the good times. Please try to understand it this way. She has a problem, one she doesn't want to deal with. The bottle like it or not came before you and everyone else. It 100% sucks but it is HER issue and nothing personal, as it is something she hasn't/doesn't want to deal with yet. She has some really crappy times on the way. Remember the good times and pray for her wellness every night as she needs it. I know you hurt but TRUST me this will help mend you and might help her.

AG
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Old 04-11-2010, 08:03 PM
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Yes, remembering the good times makes it tough in some ways, there were some really wonderful times with my exA.

Just tonight I was talking with my sponsor and when she acknowledged that I really love my ex I had a realization that I've had before but with less clarity until now: I don't know who my ex is...I don't know WHO I fell in love with. Quite honestly, I feel like I fell in love with someone who doesn't exist--a creation of my own mind that I defended with all kinds of denial when any questionable behavior came up in the relationship.

That's sad, but not devastating by any means. When I think and feel that realization I know that I can find what I want in someone else, right after I find it in ME.

I know it's not easy, DMKK, but I have to say that from where I'm sitting right now, even with the breakup only 4 days old, it's worth it.

Wishing you peacefulness,
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Old 04-11-2010, 08:23 PM
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Thanks. I had a rough day today again for some reason, very unmotivated and didn't leave the house (bad I know). It had been 4 days without any contact at all, and now out of the blue, late here on Sunday night, I just got a text from her saying she is "truly sorry for everything" and that she will miss me. First I have ever heard that from her.

Not sure what to do with this. Just not sure.
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