the codie blues.................
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Raleigh, NC (Jersey Girl transplant)
Posts: 676
the codie blues.................
Good Morning. I have been feeling a bit down and drained this week. I am PMS. I am also tired. Last night I went to bed at 8:30pm. There are definate cycles to my moods. When my money gets really low, I feel like a failure, then I take more money out of savings and I feel guilty, then I feel relief. Then we start over again and the money runs low again. I can't make things work on just my income without making some serious changes to my spending and our household expenses. The problem is that I don't want to make the changes to the spending and neither does my family, including the alcoholic. I was thinking yesterday that maybe instead of taking money out of savings I would just say, there is no money for food this week. I am out of money. Otherwise the alcoholic doesn't feel the consequences of his not working. And soon the college money will be gone and I have one kid in college this year and another one starting next year. This is such a big issue for me and the problem is my codependency. I want to "fix" this problem for my family without them having to make adjustments because I want to keep the peace. As a result I feel guilty and stressed and resentful. It is so hard to do things differently, and I really want to. I pray for assistance to make a change in my handling of the finances.
I am working on my commitment to not criticize my husband or to try to control anything he does. He had called me on Tuesday and asked for a check or some money to "pick up some things at the store". This means beer. I said no. He said that he would borrow money from our son and I could give it back to him. I said no. He borrowed money from our son anyway, $6. Yesterday he said please bring home the money for our son because he has been asking for it. So last night I was thinking on the way home, how do I handle this? If I give our son the money, then hubby will continue to borrow money from him as a way to get money for beer. So even though I said no, he gets what he wants anyway. But then I thought I should treat him with some respect and $6 is not a lot of money, I am not going to start an argument over $6. So I am all confused, I feel that whatever I do will not be the "right" thing. One one hand I am enabling him and on the other I am not respecting him. Oh help. So anyway I gave my son the $6 and I gave hubby an additional $4 for beer for last night. It just goes on and on. Any suggestions?
I am working on my commitment to not criticize my husband or to try to control anything he does. He had called me on Tuesday and asked for a check or some money to "pick up some things at the store". This means beer. I said no. He said that he would borrow money from our son and I could give it back to him. I said no. He borrowed money from our son anyway, $6. Yesterday he said please bring home the money for our son because he has been asking for it. So last night I was thinking on the way home, how do I handle this? If I give our son the money, then hubby will continue to borrow money from him as a way to get money for beer. So even though I said no, he gets what he wants anyway. But then I thought I should treat him with some respect and $6 is not a lot of money, I am not going to start an argument over $6. So I am all confused, I feel that whatever I do will not be the "right" thing. One one hand I am enabling him and on the other I am not respecting him. Oh help. So anyway I gave my son the $6 and I gave hubby an additional $4 for beer for last night. It just goes on and on. Any suggestions?
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Cleaverville
Posts: 2,898
Rose,
Tell your son that if he lends him money he won't be getting paid back by you. Problem solved...now it is between father and son and no longer your issue.
Your husband is not going to change if all things stay the same. Read my signature. I pulled it off a post of Jon's yesterday. It hit me between the eyes....maybe it will you too.
Hugs,
JT
Tell your son that if he lends him money he won't be getting paid back by you. Problem solved...now it is between father and son and no longer your issue.
Your husband is not going to change if all things stay the same. Read my signature. I pulled it off a post of Jon's yesterday. It hit me between the eyes....maybe it will you too.
Hugs,
JT
Nature Girl
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: By The Lake
Posts: 60,328
Rose
This will continue until you say "enough". I know it is hard to say no, but I think you were on the right track about not repaying your son for your husband's loan. I thinkwhen you did you knew where that would lead. And I sympathize because I am codependent too and hate confrontations.
But until you put on the brakes, the car will keep spinning out of control. It's hard, but so is staying where you are.
Since you are the one responsible for the bills, I suggest making up a budget and sticking to it. And maybe your kids will have to get part-time jobs to help themselves through college. They wouldn't be the first kids to do that and it won't hurt them.
You just can't be all things to all people, Rose. You are not the Bank of America. Neither am I. So we make do with what we have and just try to manage. And if the rest of the family has to make do with us, all the better.
Sending huge hugs.
Ann
This will continue until you say "enough". I know it is hard to say no, but I think you were on the right track about not repaying your son for your husband's loan. I thinkwhen you did you knew where that would lead. And I sympathize because I am codependent too and hate confrontations.
But until you put on the brakes, the car will keep spinning out of control. It's hard, but so is staying where you are.
Since you are the one responsible for the bills, I suggest making up a budget and sticking to it. And maybe your kids will have to get part-time jobs to help themselves through college. They wouldn't be the first kids to do that and it won't hurt them.
You just can't be all things to all people, Rose. You are not the Bank of America. Neither am I. So we make do with what we have and just try to manage. And if the rest of the family has to make do with us, all the better.
Sending huge hugs.
Ann
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Raleigh, NC (Jersey Girl transplant)
Posts: 676
Yes, you are right. I was trying to protect my son from being pressured by his father to give him money. I can just see this confrontation really blowing up. But I guess I really can't protect my son, he will have to learn to handle the pressure just like I will have to learn. I hate this, hate this, hate this. But life marches on and God is with me. I can do it!!!
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: That's what I'd like to know.
Posts: 2,416
Dangit Rose... LET it blow up. Or rather... let HIM blow up. Take JT's suggestion and tell your son you're not the Federal Government ready to rescue his small savings and loan after he makes a bad loan. Just because he blows doesn't mean you have to blow back. Let him stew. If he wants beer money he needs to get off his ass and get a job.
I don't know about you, but I have just HAD IT with your husband. Bozo works.... Bozo buys beer. Simple.
:soapbox
I don't know about you, but I have just HAD IT with your husband. Bozo works.... Bozo buys beer. Simple.
:soapbox
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Join Date: Jun 2003
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Rose,
So goes the life of us who are learning how to set boundaries - it sucks some days more than others.
I notice that the post is all focused on money - not having enough, where to get more, not wanting to make the changes that need to be made. My thoughts are to get real with all the family members on the financial facts.
1. X dollars are coming (or not coming) into the house right now.
2. List out what things cost - including the stuff for your teenagers. They need to contribute to their own expenses - if you don't show them this now the will forever be looking for a handout - from YOU most likely.
3. Identify those things that MUST be paid each month.
4. Subtract the MUST be paids from the COMING IN - this is what is left.
5. There is a Chinese proverb which says, "TELL ME AND I WILL FORGET. SHOW ME AND I MAY REMEMBER. INVOLVE ME AND I WILL UNDERSTAND." Your kids need to understand and need to learn to set boundaries for themselves.
I finally have gotten to the point to letting go and letting God regarding freaking out about money. Amazingly there has been enough and I haven't gone hungry. Likely I won't go hungry either b/c there are folks out there to help - provided I help myself first.
Keep the faith - GET THRU TODAY ONLY. Remember one day at a time is all you need to do.
I wish for you some peace today. PM me if you want, I'm in Raleigh too and would be a willing ear to listen - and share what I have learned so far.
So goes the life of us who are learning how to set boundaries - it sucks some days more than others.
I notice that the post is all focused on money - not having enough, where to get more, not wanting to make the changes that need to be made. My thoughts are to get real with all the family members on the financial facts.
1. X dollars are coming (or not coming) into the house right now.
2. List out what things cost - including the stuff for your teenagers. They need to contribute to their own expenses - if you don't show them this now the will forever be looking for a handout - from YOU most likely.
3. Identify those things that MUST be paid each month.
4. Subtract the MUST be paids from the COMING IN - this is what is left.
5. There is a Chinese proverb which says, "TELL ME AND I WILL FORGET. SHOW ME AND I MAY REMEMBER. INVOLVE ME AND I WILL UNDERSTAND." Your kids need to understand and need to learn to set boundaries for themselves.
I finally have gotten to the point to letting go and letting God regarding freaking out about money. Amazingly there has been enough and I haven't gone hungry. Likely I won't go hungry either b/c there are folks out there to help - provided I help myself first.
Keep the faith - GET THRU TODAY ONLY. Remember one day at a time is all you need to do.
I wish for you some peace today. PM me if you want, I'm in Raleigh too and would be a willing ear to listen - and share what I have learned so far.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Florham Park, nj
Posts: 85
Well I am a newbie and don't understand completely the steps of a co-dependent...but as an outsider have to say I do not think it right for Rose or anyone to allow their CHILDREN to have to take on the responsiblity of their Father's addiction.
They know he is an alchoholic but to expect a child (even if he is a teen) to own up like Mom has to is forgetting that he is the child. They respect and love thier parents and are accountable to them regardless how nuts they are.
I think it is right Rose confront the Father but expecting her son to bare the Father's burden and her burden (for that matter) by leaving it between her son and father is not right either? JMO. IOW, as an adult she understands the need to allow her husband to fall...but knowing he is now taking advantage of her son..who has a different role..he is the SON..looks up to his dad, may not be mature enough to handle this co-dependent conduct role...his Dad asks to borrow some money and he says yes? But then again..for beer, your right that is not right. How sad a child has to be the parent in this situation.
If I am out of line so be it. It is just my opinion. I see too many children take on the parent's burdens.
They know he is an alchoholic but to expect a child (even if he is a teen) to own up like Mom has to is forgetting that he is the child. They respect and love thier parents and are accountable to them regardless how nuts they are.
I think it is right Rose confront the Father but expecting her son to bare the Father's burden and her burden (for that matter) by leaving it between her son and father is not right either? JMO. IOW, as an adult she understands the need to allow her husband to fall...but knowing he is now taking advantage of her son..who has a different role..he is the SON..looks up to his dad, may not be mature enough to handle this co-dependent conduct role...his Dad asks to borrow some money and he says yes? But then again..for beer, your right that is not right. How sad a child has to be the parent in this situation.
If I am out of line so be it. It is just my opinion. I see too many children take on the parent's burdens.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Florham Park, nj
Posts: 85
I just want to add I am not ridiculing Rose as I understand she does not want her son involved. What I ment was that to leave it her son's deal with her Father...doesn't seem right as a Mom either. If you know the father is taking advantage to allow this with the son is like ignoring it. Why is it the son's responsiblity..he still has to resepct his father. Oh well, I don't know the answer..I see your side too. Just venting.
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Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Getting There
Posts: 276
Bradley,
Good to get all perspectives. Kids are much smarter than most pf is give them credit for and they repeat the behavior they see - manipulation being a big part of the A household.
Respecting his father doesn't mean saying yes when you want to say no. Parenthood is difficult but I see this as a situation where son realizes that noone is perfect - not even Dad. It is a lesson that is based in truth.
I hope you will keep coming back to share. It is important to know that we all have opinions that carry value.
Have a good weekend.
Petunia
Good to get all perspectives. Kids are much smarter than most pf is give them credit for and they repeat the behavior they see - manipulation being a big part of the A household.
Respecting his father doesn't mean saying yes when you want to say no. Parenthood is difficult but I see this as a situation where son realizes that noone is perfect - not even Dad. It is a lesson that is based in truth.
I hope you will keep coming back to share. It is important to know that we all have opinions that carry value.
Have a good weekend.
Petunia
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Cleaverville
Posts: 2,898
Brad,
These are not young children. If they were I would agree with you.
Being a codie myself I stood between my husband and my son too many times to count. It is not a good place to be. In the end I had to conclude that my husband and my son had a right to whatever relationship they chose to have. My getting in the middle was only prolonging the manipulation. They didn't want me there.
This is a case of an alcoholic manipulating a situation and ultimately being enabled. That is also a lesson the son is learning from living in the situation he is in. He might be quicker to say "No" to Dad if he did not know Mom would make it good in the end.
Sad? Absolutely.
Hugs and welcome!
JT
These are not young children. If they were I would agree with you.
Being a codie myself I stood between my husband and my son too many times to count. It is not a good place to be. In the end I had to conclude that my husband and my son had a right to whatever relationship they chose to have. My getting in the middle was only prolonging the manipulation. They didn't want me there.
This is a case of an alcoholic manipulating a situation and ultimately being enabled. That is also a lesson the son is learning from living in the situation he is in. He might be quicker to say "No" to Dad if he did not know Mom would make it good in the end.
Sad? Absolutely.
Hugs and welcome!
JT
Member
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: oregon
Posts: 21
The money thing is so hard to figure out. My husband used to make a lot more than me. Enough to pay bills and have plenty left over to pay for his drinking.
Now he's not working partly because of physical problems and partly because his drinking. For a long time I tried to keep up the same level of spending. I finally had to face reality. I couldn't afford to pay bills and for his drinking and the same level of spending we had been doing we were buried in credit card debt.
He wanted money to drink on and didn't care about what it was doing to us financially. He just took what he wanted. I mean from our bank accounts, from my purse and he would borrow money from his mom and friends and say that I would pay it back.
It was so difficult to handle. I had to make a budget. Pay the bills plus a little extra on the cards put aside enough to live on and for emergencies like car repairs first. After that was done I would take what little was left and split it with him telling him this is our spending money if you blow it all on drinking in the first few days that is not my problem.
I also had to protect myself by opening my own checking account, not keeping money in our joint accounts, confiscating and hiding the credit cards that were in both our names, buying gasoline gift cards so he can fill up, not carrying cash in my purse and telling his mom and our friends that if I was not there when he borrowed money I would not be paying the loan back.
This is still an issue. He has a million ways to try to get past me on this but I have to protect myself from his addiction. Tell your son you won't pay back dads loans. I think if he learns not to give his father money now it will save him from years of problems later. This is just my take on this. I hope things improve for you.
Now he's not working partly because of physical problems and partly because his drinking. For a long time I tried to keep up the same level of spending. I finally had to face reality. I couldn't afford to pay bills and for his drinking and the same level of spending we had been doing we were buried in credit card debt.
He wanted money to drink on and didn't care about what it was doing to us financially. He just took what he wanted. I mean from our bank accounts, from my purse and he would borrow money from his mom and friends and say that I would pay it back.
It was so difficult to handle. I had to make a budget. Pay the bills plus a little extra on the cards put aside enough to live on and for emergencies like car repairs first. After that was done I would take what little was left and split it with him telling him this is our spending money if you blow it all on drinking in the first few days that is not my problem.
I also had to protect myself by opening my own checking account, not keeping money in our joint accounts, confiscating and hiding the credit cards that were in both our names, buying gasoline gift cards so he can fill up, not carrying cash in my purse and telling his mom and our friends that if I was not there when he borrowed money I would not be paying the loan back.
This is still an issue. He has a million ways to try to get past me on this but I have to protect myself from his addiction. Tell your son you won't pay back dads loans. I think if he learns not to give his father money now it will save him from years of problems later. This is just my take on this. I hope things improve for you.
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