Am I Insane to marry a recovering alcoholic???
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Upper Midwest
Posts: 220
I am going to speak frankly and this is only my opinion... I would not - I repeat not - marry an active alcoholic nor a newly recovered alcoholic. This does not mean I would not love, cherish or spend time with this person, but I would absolutely not marry him.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Los Angeles, C
Posts: 5
To all of you, thank you so much for your thoughts and comments.
We do not have a wedding date, nor do we intend to do any wedding planning for the foreseeable future. So rest assured. . . .we're not jumping into anything.
After he came out to me about this alcoholism he made it clear that it was important to him that we do the following things before re-entertaining the marriage question (though we never formally broke our engagement):
a) he needs to figure out who he is sober, and make sure that I actually still like who he is sober
b) he needs to experience me in sobriety, and make sure that he actually still likes who I am when he's sober
c) he needs to deal with a level of resentment he has towards me for being an enabler by my not realizing or calling him out on his alcoholism (though he knows this is an unfair resentment because he did everything in his power to successfully hide it from me, but he still needs to deal with it)
d) I need to get into alanon and build myself a support structure to help me deal (hence my introduction to you all on here, and my first meeting of alanon tomorrow - gulp!)
e) he needs to continue to devote himself to the program as he has been doing and continue to go to therapy twice a week.
The one thing that gives me hope in all of this is that I don't need to be the one saying "Whoa nelly. . . ." slow down the train. He's saying that and he recognizes the importance of taking time. He tells me that he wants us to take this time to build a strong foundation, both on our own in the ways that we are dealing with his alcoholism, and together through our communication. If we're successful in doing so, then we might have a shot. If not, then it'll break our hearts but it's a very real possibility that we go our separate ways. (though in truth it's hard for me to imagine)
When I read those of you like KerBearz and Brundle telling me that I am 100% insane to marry a recovering alcoholic, it makes me think to myself in that case, why stick around to do the tough work? Just get out now. Self protect. On the other hand it also makes me think, how selfish am I? I love this person and at the first sign of difficulty we've ever had I throw in the towel and run for the hills. Staying feels like a great risk, but it could yield the greatest reward which, after we do the work, could be an amazingly strong marriage. He's an extremely high functioning periodic binge alcoholic. In the scheme of how bad the abuse could have been (and I've read your stories so I can only imagine the reality of what some of you have experienced), I have experienced very little. The main abuse I have sustained up to this point is the emotional trauma of being lied to (which is no small thing in itself).
Who knows if any alcoholic will stay on the wagon. Certainly taking time to examine all these things and strengthen our relationship is only going to help, but waiting a year before planning the wedding isn't going to give me any guarantee that he won't fall off the wagon after 10 years.
I can see both sides. The rational (get the **** out, who would voluntarily sign up for this???) and the emotional (we are soulmates, I want to do my part to see if we can make it). Hello rock. . .meet hard place.
We do not have a wedding date, nor do we intend to do any wedding planning for the foreseeable future. So rest assured. . . .we're not jumping into anything.
After he came out to me about this alcoholism he made it clear that it was important to him that we do the following things before re-entertaining the marriage question (though we never formally broke our engagement):
a) he needs to figure out who he is sober, and make sure that I actually still like who he is sober
b) he needs to experience me in sobriety, and make sure that he actually still likes who I am when he's sober
c) he needs to deal with a level of resentment he has towards me for being an enabler by my not realizing or calling him out on his alcoholism (though he knows this is an unfair resentment because he did everything in his power to successfully hide it from me, but he still needs to deal with it)
d) I need to get into alanon and build myself a support structure to help me deal (hence my introduction to you all on here, and my first meeting of alanon tomorrow - gulp!)
e) he needs to continue to devote himself to the program as he has been doing and continue to go to therapy twice a week.
The one thing that gives me hope in all of this is that I don't need to be the one saying "Whoa nelly. . . ." slow down the train. He's saying that and he recognizes the importance of taking time. He tells me that he wants us to take this time to build a strong foundation, both on our own in the ways that we are dealing with his alcoholism, and together through our communication. If we're successful in doing so, then we might have a shot. If not, then it'll break our hearts but it's a very real possibility that we go our separate ways. (though in truth it's hard for me to imagine)
When I read those of you like KerBearz and Brundle telling me that I am 100% insane to marry a recovering alcoholic, it makes me think to myself in that case, why stick around to do the tough work? Just get out now. Self protect. On the other hand it also makes me think, how selfish am I? I love this person and at the first sign of difficulty we've ever had I throw in the towel and run for the hills. Staying feels like a great risk, but it could yield the greatest reward which, after we do the work, could be an amazingly strong marriage. He's an extremely high functioning periodic binge alcoholic. In the scheme of how bad the abuse could have been (and I've read your stories so I can only imagine the reality of what some of you have experienced), I have experienced very little. The main abuse I have sustained up to this point is the emotional trauma of being lied to (which is no small thing in itself).
Who knows if any alcoholic will stay on the wagon. Certainly taking time to examine all these things and strengthen our relationship is only going to help, but waiting a year before planning the wedding isn't going to give me any guarantee that he won't fall off the wagon after 10 years.
I can see both sides. The rational (get the **** out, who would voluntarily sign up for this???) and the emotional (we are soulmates, I want to do my part to see if we can make it). Hello rock. . .meet hard place.
same planet...different world
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Butte, America
Posts: 10,946
hi and welcome to SR.
You'll find the posters here will be honest with you -
sometimes painfully honest -
but there is (almost) never any harm intended.
We truly want you to know the consequences WE lived through.
I love alcoholics.
And I am an alcoholic.
Now, you'd THINK that meant
I love myself.
Wouldn't you?
Well, apparently not.
I've got three words for you.
Counseling. Private. Couple.
I think you're being shown something here.
Wedding plans bring with them not only great girlish excitement
but it also brings great tension.
You haven't even set a date
and he's binged.
Educate yourself before taking this step.
Try your best to learn from our mistakes.
Again - welcome to the forum.
You'll find the posters here will be honest with you -
sometimes painfully honest -
but there is (almost) never any harm intended.
We truly want you to know the consequences WE lived through.
I love alcoholics.
And I am an alcoholic.
Now, you'd THINK that meant
I love myself.
Wouldn't you?
Well, apparently not.
I've got three words for you.
Counseling. Private. Couple.
I think you're being shown something here.
Wedding plans bring with them not only great girlish excitement
but it also brings great tension.
You haven't even set a date
and he's binged.
Educate yourself before taking this step.
Try your best to learn from our mistakes.
Again - welcome to the forum.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Upper Midwest
Posts: 220
Hi, I would like to clarify my opinion... I said that I would not marry an ACTIVE or NEWLY RECOVERING alcoholic. That does not mean that down the road, I would consider marrying a long-time-sober-working-a-very-strong-recovery-program- recovering alcoholic.
[QUOTE= He's an extremely high functioning periodic binge alcoholic. In the scheme of how bad the abuse could have been (and I've read your stories so I can only imagine the reality of what some of you have experienced), I have experienced very little. The main abuse I have sustained up to this point is the emotional trauma of being lied to (which is no small thing in itself).
[/QUOTE]
Please do some research on the progressive nature of the disease of alcoholism. I speak to you from some experience - I am the daughter, wife, niece, sister-in-law, aunt, cousin & friend of many alcoholics... and I love them all. Some of them are sober now, some are still drinking and some are dead. I would in no way enter into any type of legally binding agreement with any of them (except for the long-time recovered).
I apologize if I sound harsh, but you did ask our opinions!
Welcome to SR.
[QUOTE= He's an extremely high functioning periodic binge alcoholic. In the scheme of how bad the abuse could have been (and I've read your stories so I can only imagine the reality of what some of you have experienced), I have experienced very little. The main abuse I have sustained up to this point is the emotional trauma of being lied to (which is no small thing in itself).
[/QUOTE]
Please do some research on the progressive nature of the disease of alcoholism. I speak to you from some experience - I am the daughter, wife, niece, sister-in-law, aunt, cousin & friend of many alcoholics... and I love them all. Some of them are sober now, some are still drinking and some are dead. I would in no way enter into any type of legally binding agreement with any of them (except for the long-time recovered).
I apologize if I sound harsh, but you did ask our opinions!
Welcome to SR.
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Southwest
Posts: 1,207
On the other hand it also makes me think, how selfish am I? I love this person and at the first sign of difficulty we've ever had I throw in the towel and run for the hills. Staying feels like a great risk, but it could yield the greatest reward which, after we do the work, could be an amazingly strong marriage. He's an extremely high functioning periodic binge alcoholic. In the scheme of how bad the abuse could have been (and I've read your stories so I can only imagine the reality of what some of you have experienced), I have experienced very little. The main abuse I have sustained up to this point is the emotional trauma of being lied to (which is no small thing in itself).
___________________________________________
RedHead, You sound very intelligent and together. I don't know how old you are, but I married at 24, almost 25. At that time, I didn't want to appear selfish and I figured that if you loved someone, you had to accommodate them and who they really are.
So I made some dumb decisions and overlooked a lot of things that have not gone away as he has aged. I did not say "matured." Not only have these habits gotten worse, they have literally ruined our life together and our three children's security.
This may sound cryptic, but I am in a hurry, and I hope that another member can step in and elaborate on why it is not just okay to be "selfish", but it is absolutely necessary if you want a healthy situation for yourself and your future. I used to think it was a derogatory term, but I am learning that it isn't, and if I had put myself and my needs in front in the first place, we would not have married.
And this isn't the first sign of a difficulty. This is a REALLY big deal and a way of living (as is recovery, so kudos to him for seeking it), not a mere difficulty.
Alcoholism carries with it a mindset that will never put you first. Alcohol will always be first with an active alcoholic, just as now his recovery will be first, as it has to be for him to be successful.
Don't be a martyr. And if anyone tells you how good you are for him, run the other way. I didn't know then that it wasn't something to aspire to. I hope that you are smarter than I was. ((hugs))
___________________________________________
RedHead, You sound very intelligent and together. I don't know how old you are, but I married at 24, almost 25. At that time, I didn't want to appear selfish and I figured that if you loved someone, you had to accommodate them and who they really are.
So I made some dumb decisions and overlooked a lot of things that have not gone away as he has aged. I did not say "matured." Not only have these habits gotten worse, they have literally ruined our life together and our three children's security.
This may sound cryptic, but I am in a hurry, and I hope that another member can step in and elaborate on why it is not just okay to be "selfish", but it is absolutely necessary if you want a healthy situation for yourself and your future. I used to think it was a derogatory term, but I am learning that it isn't, and if I had put myself and my needs in front in the first place, we would not have married.
And this isn't the first sign of a difficulty. This is a REALLY big deal and a way of living (as is recovery, so kudos to him for seeking it), not a mere difficulty.
Alcoholism carries with it a mindset that will never put you first. Alcohol will always be first with an active alcoholic, just as now his recovery will be first, as it has to be for him to be successful.
Don't be a martyr. And if anyone tells you how good you are for him, run the other way. I didn't know then that it wasn't something to aspire to. I hope that you are smarter than I was. ((hugs))
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Los Angeles, C
Posts: 5
RedHead, You sound very intelligent and together. I don't know how old you are, but I married at 24, almost 25.
If I were 23 going through this and had 10 years to spend with him to feel secure in his sobriety before we got married and had kids, I'd do that.
But I'm not 23, and I don't feel like I have 10 years to wait and see. I'll be 33 in a few months and as we all know, there's that pesky biological clock that isn't going to stop ticking just cause I need some time to deal with AF's alcoholism.
There's just so much fear of the future going on here and fear of regretting whichever decision I eventually make. I'm trying to just be in the moment and realize that I don't have to make any decisions right now which is really hard for me.
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Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,431
You are clearly a very smart lady!
It seems to me, however, that there has been difficulty---as in he was drinking and lying about it.....he just didn't share that with you....but in time it would have manifested itself any way.
I have trouble getting past the "COULD" have a great relationship in your first post....oh, man, I have so thought that way!....I have learned it had better be really great now because I can't even count on potential in any way, shape or form. I have personally gotten hung up there more than a few times.
It sounds from your later posts as if he is calling all the shots....I sure hope that I am misunderstanding!
I wish you the very best...now and in the future,
you can see how much alcoholism has damaged our lives in our attitude of be careful, very very careful! LOL....there is no laughter while I am still exposed to that mess...it took awhile to get any laughter back!
I am afraid that when it comes to alcoholism...love has nothing to do with it...if it did, none of us would be here!
It seems to me, however, that there has been difficulty---as in he was drinking and lying about it.....he just didn't share that with you....but in time it would have manifested itself any way.
I have trouble getting past the "COULD" have a great relationship in your first post....oh, man, I have so thought that way!....I have learned it had better be really great now because I can't even count on potential in any way, shape or form. I have personally gotten hung up there more than a few times.
It sounds from your later posts as if he is calling all the shots....I sure hope that I am misunderstanding!
I wish you the very best...now and in the future,
you can see how much alcoholism has damaged our lives in our attitude of be careful, very very careful! LOL....there is no laughter while I am still exposed to that mess...it took awhile to get any laughter back!
I am afraid that when it comes to alcoholism...love has nothing to do with it...if it did, none of us would be here!
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,582
Red,
Hi. We are close to the same age. I was in your exact shoes until 15 months ago. Mine secretly drank despite telling me that he was in an outpatient program. This went on for months, until I discovered that he had been cheating and gotten engaged to a drinker...he was never in a program. Just more lies to keep me hooked and available to him.
You cannot put faith in what he says rght now. I guess you can do what you want, but I highly suggest not. Put your focus on you. In hindsight I would not be romantically involved with someone in recovery.
Hi. We are close to the same age. I was in your exact shoes until 15 months ago. Mine secretly drank despite telling me that he was in an outpatient program. This went on for months, until I discovered that he had been cheating and gotten engaged to a drinker...he was never in a program. Just more lies to keep me hooked and available to him.
You cannot put faith in what he says rght now. I guess you can do what you want, but I highly suggest not. Put your focus on you. In hindsight I would not be romantically involved with someone in recovery.
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: ALBUQUERQUE
Posts: 1
fiance thing
Hello.
I thought maybe I could say something about myself. I can identify with you're fiance a lot. I have the same type of binge drinking habit and have been in and out of the rooms for about 5 years also only to fall off the wagon...anyways very similar. You'll be happy to hear that if you're fiance is working the steps he's embarking on a journey toward being a much better partner than one might be who has some other less frightening problem. I mean seriously, alcoholism is debilitating, it calls for immediate attention as opposed to something like say being a sociopath. Sociopath's might appear to be perfect and may have learned to pretend to care about others. A sensitive addict type may go on benders but they are doing it to cover an underlying emotional problem, looking a little deeper you'll probably find an adult survivor of child abuse, that's my guess.
I mostly just said all this because I know I'm a good partner, one of the best despite my flaws, I'm still a loving nurturing person. Try to look past the labels
I thought maybe I could say something about myself. I can identify with you're fiance a lot. I have the same type of binge drinking habit and have been in and out of the rooms for about 5 years also only to fall off the wagon...anyways very similar. You'll be happy to hear that if you're fiance is working the steps he's embarking on a journey toward being a much better partner than one might be who has some other less frightening problem. I mean seriously, alcoholism is debilitating, it calls for immediate attention as opposed to something like say being a sociopath. Sociopath's might appear to be perfect and may have learned to pretend to care about others. A sensitive addict type may go on benders but they are doing it to cover an underlying emotional problem, looking a little deeper you'll probably find an adult survivor of child abuse, that's my guess.
I mostly just said all this because I know I'm a good partner, one of the best despite my flaws, I'm still a loving nurturing person. Try to look past the labels
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 2,126
Hey Red....
Let's remove the alcohol/binge drinking/alcoholism from the equation. By your own admission (your original post), this man lied to you; he manipulated situations to keep the truth from you..........
Is this truly the kind of person you want to marry; to spend the rest of your life with; the kind of person you want for your (as yet unborn) children......a LIAR; a MANIPULATOR..........? Something to think about, anyway.
No matter your decision; here's wishing you the best.
(o:
NoelleR
Let's remove the alcohol/binge drinking/alcoholism from the equation. By your own admission (your original post), this man lied to you; he manipulated situations to keep the truth from you..........
Is this truly the kind of person you want to marry; to spend the rest of your life with; the kind of person you want for your (as yet unborn) children......a LIAR; a MANIPULATOR..........? Something to think about, anyway.
No matter your decision; here's wishing you the best.
(o:
NoelleR
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 6,262
In all the time I've spent reading the posts in this area I've never seen one where someone says, "Gee, I'm glad I married an alcoholic" or "It's not bad being married to an alcoholic" or "my kids have a terrific alcoholic dad".
Noelle nails it ... he hasn't treated you with love and respect. Do you think it will get better when you marry?
Noelle nails it ... he hasn't treated you with love and respect. Do you think it will get better when you marry?
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Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: wichita ks
Posts: 7
definitely join alanon its important that you know its your choice even if your loved one relapsed you would have to choose. my friends say to keep a fyou fund.enough money to hit the road with. personally i prefere to be with people in recovery
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Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: wichita ks
Posts: 7
alcoholics drunk or sober are still alcoholics at our best we are driven by a hundred forms of fear and selfish self seeking motives , he didn't want to loose you so he did the natural alckie thing and lied he may out grow some of this but for your sake learn more because you are obviously attracted to us' alanon
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 6,262
Forgot to mention: alcoholism is a progressive disease and there's nothing anyone can do to stop the progression. He's binge drinking now; that will change and increase.
Also, alcoholism is classified as a mental illness by the American Medical Association. AA's own "Bible", "Alcoholics Anonymous" describes alcoholics as being self-willed, self-involved and self-centered in the extreme; have enormous egos with low self-esteem, grandiosity and immaturity. "His Majesty the child." If they get sober and work hard some of those things can change, but not while he/she is drinking.
Also, alcoholism is classified as a mental illness by the American Medical Association. AA's own "Bible", "Alcoholics Anonymous" describes alcoholics as being self-willed, self-involved and self-centered in the extreme; have enormous egos with low self-esteem, grandiosity and immaturity. "His Majesty the child." If they get sober and work hard some of those things can change, but not while he/she is drinking.
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Chicago area
Posts: 4,269
Originally Posted by RedHeadShopGirl 
After he came out to me about this alcoholism he made it clear that it was important to him that we do the following things before re-entertaining the marriage question (though we never formally broke our engagement):
a) he needs to figure out who he is sober, and make sure that I actually still like who he is sober
b) he needs to experience me in sobriety, and make sure that he actually still likes who I am when he's sober
c) he needs to deal with a level of resentment he has towards me for being an enabler by my not realizing or calling him out on his alcoholism (though he knows this is an unfair resentment because he did everything in his power to successfully hide it from me, but he still needs to deal with it)
d) I need to get into alanon and build myself a support structure to help me deal (hence my introduction to you all on here, and my first meeting of alanon tomorrow - gulp!)
e) he needs to continue to devote himself to the program as he has been doing and continue to go to therapy twice a week.
The one thing that gives me hope in all of this is that I don't need to be the one saying "Whoa nelly. . . ." slow down the train.
Where's the part about his making amends to people he harmed by lying to and deceiving them?
Where are your boundaries?
One of the more meaningful things I have read on SR included the following:
If you cannot say no, you have no business being in any relationship.
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Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,422
Wow. This has made really interesting reading. I think what comes across the most is how very hurt and angry (with good reason) some of the partners of alcoholics are. And they are very much bringing their experiences to your situation.
But the thing is, while there are traits and common characteristics of alcoholism, your fiancée is a person, not just an alcoholic. I completely agree with the idea of taking your time to get to know each other - that's good advice for anyone who takes marriage seriously - but some of these posts are making this guy sound like an abusive monster in the making. WTF? He's a guy. A person. Not just an alcoholic.
And the whole thing about lying - who HASN'T done that with a new partner? I remember agreeing with my angry husband that all teenagers are little shts when we first met I'm a secondary school teacher! I love and am very good at working with teenagers - they are pretty much the only breed of people that make complete sense to me.
Shouldn't it count for something that he's now trying to be open?
I agree that you're signing up to some tricky times. After 8 years, and a very open marriage (ha ha! I mean communication. We don't swing ) I know sometimes my H lies to me about what he's taking. But you know what? Sometimes I lie about how my day's gone. And about how much my new jeans actually cost, and they weren't in a sale like I said either. And sometimes I might lie about much bigger things, and sometimes I'll come clean after, but sometimes I won't.
Any marriage is tricky. See your fiancée for the person he is and decide whether that person is someone you can love, even with his disease.
Good luck
Still xxx
But the thing is, while there are traits and common characteristics of alcoholism, your fiancée is a person, not just an alcoholic. I completely agree with the idea of taking your time to get to know each other - that's good advice for anyone who takes marriage seriously - but some of these posts are making this guy sound like an abusive monster in the making. WTF? He's a guy. A person. Not just an alcoholic.
And the whole thing about lying - who HASN'T done that with a new partner? I remember agreeing with my angry husband that all teenagers are little shts when we first met I'm a secondary school teacher! I love and am very good at working with teenagers - they are pretty much the only breed of people that make complete sense to me.
Shouldn't it count for something that he's now trying to be open?
I agree that you're signing up to some tricky times. After 8 years, and a very open marriage (ha ha! I mean communication. We don't swing
) I know sometimes my H lies to me about what he's taking. But you know what? Sometimes I lie about how my day's gone. And about how much my new jeans actually cost, and they weren't in a sale like I said either. And sometimes I might lie about much bigger things, and sometimes I'll come clean after, but sometimes I won't.Any marriage is tricky. See your fiancée for the person he is and decide whether that person is someone you can love, even with his disease.
Good luck
Still xxx
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 602
Originally Posted by RedHeadShopGirl
After he came out to me about this alcoholism he made it clear that it was important to him that we do the following things before re-entertaining the marriage question...
Lying about it would be more troubling.
But him then going on to provide you with a to-do list with action items for you to fulfill. No way. People who love me don't tell me what to do. That is the creepiest bit out of everything you describe. If he needs to do something--that's fine, and then you can take it or leave it. But he doesn't get to tell you how to respond to this.
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