KeepPedaling

I called my xabf today. I told him not to try contacting me again until he'd been sober for at least a month. I don't know how many weeks it's been, but he's respected my boundary and hasn't tried to contact me.

I was worried. I missed him. So I called.

He told me about the withdrawls. He told me about starting school again and how much he loves his new classes. He apologized for what he had done. He said he learned a lot about himself and is glad he quit when he did. He said it was a scary place to be. He told me that he was not mad at me for not talking to him. He said I did exactly the right thing by leaving and refusing to give him any financial support, admitting that he would have just spent it on alcohol.

So he was sober for almost 2 years. He relapsed for 2 months. He appears to be back in recovery.

He sounds so much better. He sounds like the person I know again. He asked if we were talking again and if he could call me. I told him that I was still processing everything and I would prefer it if he didn't try to contact me.

I don't know what's going to happen between him and me, but I have to say, I feel so much relief knowing that my friend is choosing the path of recovery. Keeping my fingers crossed that he keeps on that path.

barb dwyer

KP-

I've been reading your struggling for a while, you know?

I think if you can make some kind of closure,
some kind of growth ... landmark-er
boundaries.. or 'don't let this happen again' kind of thing...
establishing a distance
from the contact - great.

But be sure, inside yourself -
that you're clear in the understanding
that who you're in love with....
and who you keep trying to see this man as ...
is not who you spoke to today,
and not who he was using
and not who he was when NOT using.

I don't want to come off harsh, hon, I truly don't.

You've come SO FAR in the last couple of weeks.
Learned SO MUCH about yourself ...

please don't leave this book open.

I don't mean 'leave it open' as in blow the guy off or anything...
I mean leave it open as in -
you've worked so hard to gain this perspective.

Re-entangling... would be MORE than easy.

I truly believe it would serve little more than to UN-do
all the good self awareness work
you have just done.

I am an alcoholic.
My spots ... don't change.
I'm never going to be a housecat.

Does that make sense?

I have been so proud to see you
establish a distance
that YOU can grow.

barb dwyer

oh, crap. I can't say it right.

And that is VERY rare for me.

KeepPedaling

Barb, I don't understand what you're saying. Could you elaborate a little? Are you saying that I shouldn't begin talking to him again so soon, or ever?

I KNOW I'm not the only one in here who has thought this, but I can't help but think, "maybe he's the kind of alcoholic who will stay in recovery forever and never drink again." He sounds so sure of himself. It makes me so hopeful because I care about him so much.

When is it ok to feel safe again with a recovering alcoholic? How many chances do you give a person? One? Two?

Thanks for being there Barb.

naive

keep pedaling-

is there a chance he is lying? whenever i was away travelling, mine would call me and say he wasn't drinking, the car was on the road, he was working, when was i coming home?

it was 100% lies. all of it. not one word of truth in it.

he also said he was sorry for everything.

i agree with barb.

there are so many fish in the sea! try giving it some more time.

in AA, they say to the recovery alcoholic to not get involved in a personal relationship for one year. so, let's say he is sober for one month now. dangerous waters! keep swimming!

naive

tjp613

KP - I love the advice that you're getting from Naive. I just want to remind you that the decision to go back or not is a personal one and only you know what is right for you. If you do decide to go back, just play the tape loop all the way to the end and remember that this is a LIFE LONG disease. Know going in that there is something like a 75-90% chance of relapse for the alcoholic and he is especially susceptible at the 6 month-to-1 year mark after treatment.

Is this a crap-shoot you are willing to take?

KeepPedaling

Hi Naive. No, he's not lying. He's one of those night and day drinkers. He can only cover up being drunk for about 5 minutes on the phone. So he's been sober about a week, which is when school started for him. I still haven't seen him since he relapsed.

You know, I think this would be so much easier if he weren't such an old friend. If he were just some guy I was dating, I would have left running and never looked back. As it is though, it's not so easy to go.

KeepPedaling

I guess that's what I'm trying to figure out. I didn't call him today. I spent the whole day up in the mountains, which was great. It's nice that he hasn't been trying to contact me while I've been processing things.

I don't feel like I have to figure everything out today or tomorrow. So I guess for now I just have to keep reading and keep posting.

Thanks for all the support everyone.

coffeedrinker

keep,

i understand the "friend" thing. my s/o has been - off and on cuz of his using periods - my best friend for 15 years. when we became lovers it felt so right, like the connection i had been waiting for all my life. we have endured relapses (his), service to others "still struggling" (both), cancer (mine), and numerous other things that have bonded us. he has been there for me in my dark times and i for him. it's so, so difficult to make the break. missing him, and breaking your "no contact" rule i totally get.

i believe you when you say you "know" he's straight right now.

i am not giving you covert advice here about what to do - just letting you know that i can empathize. and i, too, am confused by exactly what barb was saying - come back and explain more barb!

i think the very best advice in this thread came from you, keep. you do not need to have all the answers today. just relax a little and continue to seek clarity.

peace

FindingPeace1

One way you can judge where you are (emotionally), is if you feel you *need* to call him, you are not balanced.
When you *let go* of your worry and need, then you could call him from a balanced state. But when you get there, you won't need to call him anymore. Does that make sense?
Then if he contacted you (and if he was in recovery, or not), you could move forward in balance.

spinner

Hi KP,

I know just how you feel. I keep breaking my no contact with my ex BF too. In fact, it lasted about 1 day this time!! He called 3 times last night and the 3rd time I answered. I seriously wanted to know how things went at his first day teaching skiing after he tore his ACL last year and got surgery a few months ago. We had a good, civil conversation (and he had a good day on the ski hill). Funny, but the one thing he has been able to do through all this alcoholism thing is teach skiing. The only year he missed since he was in his teens was the winter he was in rehab.

I don't think I want him coming to visit though.

I remember the many times I would talk to him and think "oh, he's finally got it together" and I would feel relief and happiness. Now I realize he doesn't have it together and maybe never will but it's not my responsibility to do anything about it.

It's awfully hard though, when they are also your friend.

Spinner

KeepPedaling

Thanks. I think thats the thing. I don't feel that I need to call him anymore. I just miss my friend and want to talk to him. I don't want to fix anything for him. I do miss "helping" him with some things, like having him bounce his creative ideas off of me for my opinion. I don't miss "helping" him financially or with his big life decisions. I've learned a lot about letting go of the "helping" thinking that is damaging for me, thanks to this forum.

I don't feel a lot of pressure right now to decide anything. I get tired of thinking about what to do though. I just wish I could predict the future.

KeepPedaling

Spinner, how long did your moments of thinking "oh he's finally got it together" last? What was his longest time sober? How long did he drink?

My xabf drank for about 15 years I guess. Long time. I can't really fathom the idea of spending so much of my life intoxicated. I wonder if they've ever done a more specific study of recovery rates, like the recovery rates based on years of drinking (for example: 3 year active alcoholics recovery rate is 50%; 15 years is 20% etc).

Freedom1990

Here's some food for thought, and I speak as a recovering alcoholic/addict right now. Are there alcoholics who stay in recovery long-term? Certainly.

I have been around the rooms of AA since 1986. I initially stayed clean/sober for 4 years, but because I did not address my codependency issues, I relapsed in 1990. Now I have been clean/sober a little over 19 years this time.

Since 1986, I know of one other person with any substantial sobriety, my sponsor, who celebrated 27 years clean/sober last August.

Now I will speak as a recovering codepedent, former wife of an alcoholic, and mother of an active alcoholic/addict.

For me, hope is an emotion based on the outcome of future events (expectations). That has brought me a world of hurt over the years. Time and time again my hopes were dashed on the rocks when I would listen to the BS that my A daughter would feed me. She was/is a master manipulator.

I have replaced any hope with faith, faith that a higher power is at work in her life, and I have no idea what his plans are for her, but I stay out of the way.

I no longer place my happiness and peace of mind on her, or on anyone else. That is an inside job. I work hard at living in the moment, and just doing the next right thing in front of me.

Regardless of what she does in her life, I sleep well at night knowing I have placed her in God's loving hands.

If it weren't for my granddaughter now living with her, I would essentially have no contact with her whatsoever. The last time she wiped her feet on me, I said no more and I meant it.

Today I give her the dignity to make her own choices.

spinner

My moments of thinking he'd gotten things together sometimes lasted a few weeks, until some other crisis happened. The latest was last fall when he filed 10 years of tax returns he had neglected. I made the mistake of taking him back then, until some other crisis erupted.

I remember when we first started going out that he never seemed to be able to relax. He could never sit down at the end of a day and says "Ahhh. What a good day" and enjoy the sunset. There was always some crisis hanging over his head (taxes, work to do, health matters). Now I realize that's just how he is all the time. I can't live with that.

My ex drank from the age of 15 to 50. He's been sober now for almost 3 years. I've only know him for almost 5 years so I don't know how often he tried to get sober before. I know he never seriously tried.

Spinner

Mambo Queen

I know this is a little off topic, but...really? That seems awfully low to me, Freedom. I've only been in AA for about 6 months, but in my women's group alone I can think of at least 5 women who have 10+ years of sobriety, and at least 10 women who have more than 5 years. I suppose it's possible a few of them are lying or exaggerating, but even still, I'd consider all of them to have "substantial sobriety".

JACKRUSSELLGIRL

KP

I think you are doing great. You contacted him as a friend via the phone and that was that. It is not like you went running back to him and the drama. You did not even see him in person. You and only you will decide if he can be a friend and that will probably take some time to figure out.
Just do not forget all the progress you have made and all the wonderful advise you get from the people of SR. Make sure to run that tape all the way through! This is a very tricky disease and it is progressive. Keep yourself armed with all the knowledge and facts about the disease and move forward with caution!!

Take it one day at time and you go girl! There is a wonderful life ahead of you!