A Couple of Questions....
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welcome to the boards 
no help with the best approaches/medications/rehabs etc, I have no experience to share.
re the practical help, Lateeda's list seemed a great start, nothing much to add. re the enabling, I agree its a contradiction to the "you didn't cause it, can't cure it and can't control it" philosophy, and in fact whilst I am not sure what the original definition was sometimes (to me) it can appear to be applied in a way that does hang responsibility for the continued alcohol abuse on those the alcoholic has surrounded him/herself with.
It's not that I don't see that some behaviours of those surrounding alcoholics enable them to carry on, it's more that I think focussing on the minutiae of what is/isn't an enabling behaviour is still focussing on their needs and actions rather than focussing on what will work to improve the lives of your children and you. A determined alcoholic can switch "enablers" at the drop of a hat when a particular one stops playing or can no longer need the things they had ( a job, a home, a family) in order to maintain drinking.
I haven't seen any published evidence that an approach where loved ones stopped "enabling" behaviours led to more long-term sobriety choices by alcoholics, than those who didn't, I'd be interested in seeing any there was (academically: it doesn't really matter to my situation anymore).
In my case, nothing I did made any difference, enabling or otherwise. Other's may have different experiences, and perhaps it would be worth asking in the alcoholics/addictions forum for those with long-term sobriety, if any of them were prompted to choose and stick with sobriety based on the actions of their spouse? get it from the horses mouth so to speak.
no help with the best approaches/medications/rehabs etc, I have no experience to share.
re the practical help, Lateeda's list seemed a great start, nothing much to add. re the enabling, I agree its a contradiction to the "you didn't cause it, can't cure it and can't control it" philosophy, and in fact whilst I am not sure what the original definition was sometimes (to me) it can appear to be applied in a way that does hang responsibility for the continued alcohol abuse on those the alcoholic has surrounded him/herself with.
It's not that I don't see that some behaviours of those surrounding alcoholics enable them to carry on, it's more that I think focussing on the minutiae of what is/isn't an enabling behaviour is still focussing on their needs and actions rather than focussing on what will work to improve the lives of your children and you. A determined alcoholic can switch "enablers" at the drop of a hat when a particular one stops playing or can no longer need the things they had ( a job, a home, a family) in order to maintain drinking.
I haven't seen any published evidence that an approach where loved ones stopped "enabling" behaviours led to more long-term sobriety choices by alcoholics, than those who didn't, I'd be interested in seeing any there was (academically: it doesn't really matter to my situation anymore).
In my case, nothing I did made any difference, enabling or otherwise. Other's may have different experiences, and perhaps it would be worth asking in the alcoholics/addictions forum for those with long-term sobriety, if any of them were prompted to choose and stick with sobriety based on the actions of their spouse? get it from the horses mouth so to speak.
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Originally Posted by spinner 
Hi
When I realized the extend of my ABF's drinking I tried to learn all I could about alcoholism including going to Al Anon and learning how I was enabling him. When he decided he was ready to stop drinking I did all I could to help him to find his own recovery. After he had a bad experience at a local detox place I researched treatment in our area and was able to find a wonderful program at our local mental health centre that was for addicts with a coexisting mental health problem. In Canada, the treatment was free because it is a hospital.
He was willing to go and worked hard at the program. He was about 21 days in the detox part and another 28 days in rehab. Since then he is a regular at AA.
I would like to say that everything worked out between us but unfortunately he still has other problems (anxiety, unemployment, being a jerk) and I left him. Still, he has been sober for 3 years. If he hadn't stopped drinking I think he would be dead by now.
So I see nothing wrong with finding out information for you to have handy just in case she decides to stop. But don't be surprised if this takes WAY longer than you would expect. I'm sure she has a lot of denial going on inside her like my BF. It took some pretty serious events to make him realize the dangers of his drinking.
Spinner
When I realized the extend of my ABF's drinking I tried to learn all I could about alcoholism including going to Al Anon and learning how I was enabling him. When he decided he was ready to stop drinking I did all I could to help him to find his own recovery. After he had a bad experience at a local detox place I researched treatment in our area and was able to find a wonderful program at our local mental health centre that was for addicts with a coexisting mental health problem. In Canada, the treatment was free because it is a hospital.
He was willing to go and worked hard at the program. He was about 21 days in the detox part and another 28 days in rehab. Since then he is a regular at AA.
I would like to say that everything worked out between us but unfortunately he still has other problems (anxiety, unemployment, being a jerk) and I left him. Still, he has been sober for 3 years. If he hadn't stopped drinking I think he would be dead by now.
So I see nothing wrong with finding out information for you to have handy just in case she decides to stop. But don't be surprised if this takes WAY longer than you would expect. I'm sure she has a lot of denial going on inside her like my BF. It took some pretty serious events to make him realize the dangers of his drinking.
Spinner
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Originally Posted by Cowgirl1265
Another way of looking at this is if the alcoholic in question turns to you and says "I do want help" there's nothing wrong in not having all the answers. Codependents do all the work for the alcoholic. If YOU find the center, if YOU pick the doctor, if YOU do all the research, then you have not allowed your wife to walk her own path. And I can guarantee you one thing: if you do all the work on choosing a center, deciding the best one for her, etc, then if her recovery does not work, she can now blame you for it instead of focusing on her own actions or inactions.
My STXH has never in his life dug through something on his own. When it gets tough, he either looks for someone else to do it for him or he quits. While we were together I was his easy way out. When his son's mother was too much for him to deal with I became the mediator between them. I was rewarded by being treated like absolute CRAP by both of them. When he lost his job I helped get him a job where I work. I was rewarded by him hating everyone and everything, messing up continually on the job and me almost losing MY very good job for it. Every time I have "helped" him I have hurt myself and enabled him to not have to take responsibility.
Now he is one his own, and he is finally making some progress in his life. He is getting therapy and taking medication and going to 12-step group regularly. He has done this on his own. I did not find a group for him, he found his own. He now only has one person to point a finger at if something goes wrong: Himself.
My STXH has never in his life dug through something on his own. When it gets tough, he either looks for someone else to do it for him or he quits. While we were together I was his easy way out. When his son's mother was too much for him to deal with I became the mediator between them. I was rewarded by being treated like absolute CRAP by both of them. When he lost his job I helped get him a job where I work. I was rewarded by him hating everyone and everything, messing up continually on the job and me almost losing MY very good job for it. Every time I have "helped" him I have hurt myself and enabled him to not have to take responsibility.
Now he is one his own, and he is finally making some progress in his life. He is getting therapy and taking medication and going to 12-step group regularly. He has done this on his own. I did not find a group for him, he found his own. He now only has one person to point a finger at if something goes wrong: Himself.
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Originally Posted by ANEWAUGUST
This alcoholic wife never turned to my spouse and asked for advice/help on how to get sober.
I knew there were options out there, rehab, detox, AA. I also knew when he was getting sick and tired of me being sick and tired.
I don't know how long this sitution has existed in your life, nor, how old your children are. The reason others suggest that you educate yourself is because relationships with alcoholics are not healthy, not fair, not balanced. By learning all that you can, you will be in the best position to help yourself and your children, and yes, maybe your wife if she asks for your help. Rarely does the alcoholic/addict roll over, admit defeat, and ask for help. Usually, there are all of the other stages, denial, arguing, bargaining, etc. that will occur before we accept or ask for help.
Alcoholics can recover, we can get well, so can our loved ones. The programs of AA and Al-Anon helped my loved ones and I on the journey of recovery.
Peace
I knew there were options out there, rehab, detox, AA. I also knew when he was getting sick and tired of me being sick and tired.
I don't know how long this sitution has existed in your life, nor, how old your children are. The reason others suggest that you educate yourself is because relationships with alcoholics are not healthy, not fair, not balanced. By learning all that you can, you will be in the best position to help yourself and your children, and yes, maybe your wife if she asks for your help. Rarely does the alcoholic/addict roll over, admit defeat, and ask for help. Usually, there are all of the other stages, denial, arguing, bargaining, etc. that will occur before we accept or ask for help.
Alcoholics can recover, we can get well, so can our loved ones. The programs of AA and Al-Anon helped my loved ones and I on the journey of recovery.
Peace
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Originally Posted by LaTeeDa
My understanding is that enabling is anything that helps (enables) the alcoholic to be an alcoholic. It goes far beyond the obvious, like buying their booze, or calling in sick for them, or cleaning up after them. It can be "holding the family together" without their participation, failure to set boundaries around unacceptable behavior, minimizing the problem, failure to be honest with others and children about the problem, or just about anything that gives them a "comfort zone" in which to practice alcoholism.
Having said that, I do understand where you are coming from, but you are assuming the old adage "you're either part of the problem, or part of the solution" applies to the family sickness of alcoholism. It doesn't. In this case, you are either part of the problem, or not part of the problem, but the solution is out of your control. You can contribute to the problem, yes. But, not knowing what constitutes a "rock bottom" for any particular alcoholic, you cannot produce it. Some alcoholics continue to drink despite having lost all their enablers, and drink themselves to death. Thus, you can stop enabling and still not "cure" the problem. Does that clarify it a bit?
L
Having said that, I do understand where you are coming from, but you are assuming the old adage "you're either part of the problem, or part of the solution" applies to the family sickness of alcoholism. It doesn't. In this case, you are either part of the problem, or not part of the problem, but the solution is out of your control. You can contribute to the problem, yes. But, not knowing what constitutes a "rock bottom" for any particular alcoholic, you cannot produce it. Some alcoholics continue to drink despite having lost all their enablers, and drink themselves to death. Thus, you can stop enabling and still not "cure" the problem. Does that clarify it a bit?
L
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Originally Posted by GiveLove
Lots of different opinions and personal experiences - now you've found what we're good at
Perhaps. Not in the majority of cases, from my experience. But perhaps.
The question still remains - and I invite you into this difficult mental territory: Does she want to be helped?
WHY should your wife try to stop drinking? It's obvious she has nothing to lose by continuing to be an active alcoholic. She'll still have you, still have a roof over her head, still have the children, still have the status quo and the ability to numb anything she doesn't want to deal with, with alcohol.
Sounds like a perfect situation...what is the compelling reason for her to trade all of that in for the inconvenience and drama of 28 days in rehab?
Worth pondering. It's not a rhetorical question.
Perhaps. Not in the majority of cases, from my experience. But perhaps.
The question still remains - and I invite you into this difficult mental territory: Does she want to be helped?
WHY should your wife try to stop drinking? It's obvious she has nothing to lose by continuing to be an active alcoholic. She'll still have you, still have a roof over her head, still have the children, still have the status quo and the ability to numb anything she doesn't want to deal with, with alcohol.
Sounds like a perfect situation...what is the compelling reason for her to trade all of that in for the inconvenience and drama of 28 days in rehab?
Worth pondering. It's not a rhetorical question.
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Originally Posted by freya
Please be assured that, if I had meant to say "being open to the possibility of helping," that is exactly what I would have written. Due to my educational background, it is very, very rare that I choose to write words that do not accurately convey my actual intended meaning.
And, BTW, I am open to the possibility of trying to help anyone who:
1. asks for my help, and
2. demonstrates through their own behavior that he/she wants my help by doing everything he/she can to help him/herself, and
3. I have in my power to help without compromising my own well-being and/or recovery.
An active A who has "made some vague moves in the past toward getting help" but for whom even "that hasn't happened for awhile," does not meet that criteria. The actions of such an individual tell me that he/she chooses to continue drinking, and, thus, my "helping" that person to do otherwise would be an attempt on my part to manipulate and/or coerce that person to act according to my will rather than to his/her own.....and, yeah, I'd say that that, to me, meets the definition of "controlling." It also doesn't sound particularly respectful...At least, I sure as h*ll wouldn't feel very respected if someone was attempting to force his/her will on me in that way!
freya
And, BTW, I am open to the possibility of trying to help anyone who:
1. asks for my help, and
2. demonstrates through their own behavior that he/she wants my help by doing everything he/she can to help him/herself, and
3. I have in my power to help without compromising my own well-being and/or recovery.
An active A who has "made some vague moves in the past toward getting help" but for whom even "that hasn't happened for awhile," does not meet that criteria. The actions of such an individual tell me that he/she chooses to continue drinking, and, thus, my "helping" that person to do otherwise would be an attempt on my part to manipulate and/or coerce that person to act according to my will rather than to his/her own.....and, yeah, I'd say that that, to me, meets the definition of "controlling." It also doesn't sound particularly respectful...At least, I sure as h*ll wouldn't feel very respected if someone was attempting to force his/her will on me in that way!
freya
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Originally Posted by JenT1968
welcome to the boards
no help with the best approaches/medications/rehabs etc, I have no experience to share.
re the practical help, Lateeda's list seemed a great start, nothing much to add. re the enabling, I agree its a contradiction to the "you didn't cause it, can't cure it and can't control it" philosophy, and in fact whilst I am not sure what the original definition was sometimes (to me) it can appear to be applied in a way that does hang responsibility for the continued alcohol abuse on those the alcoholic has surrounded him/herself with.
It's not that I don't see that some behaviours of those surrounding alcoholics enable them to carry on, it's more that I think focussing on the minutiae of what is/isn't an enabling behaviour is still focussing on their needs and actions rather than focussing on what will work to improve the lives of your children and you. A determined alcoholic can switch "enablers" at the drop of a hat when a particular one stops playing or can no longer need the things they had ( a job, a home, a family) in order to maintain drinking.
I haven't seen any published evidence that an approach where loved ones stopped "enabling" behaviours led to more long-term sobriety choices by alcoholics, than those who didn't, I'd be interested in seeing any there was (academically: it doesn't really matter to my situation anymore).
In my case, nothing I did made any difference, enabling or otherwise. Other's may have different experiences, and perhaps it would be worth asking in the alcoholics/addictions forum for those with long-term sobriety, if any of them were prompted to choose and stick with sobriety based on the actions of their spouse? get it from the horses mouth so to speak.
no help with the best approaches/medications/rehabs etc, I have no experience to share.
re the practical help, Lateeda's list seemed a great start, nothing much to add. re the enabling, I agree its a contradiction to the "you didn't cause it, can't cure it and can't control it" philosophy, and in fact whilst I am not sure what the original definition was sometimes (to me) it can appear to be applied in a way that does hang responsibility for the continued alcohol abuse on those the alcoholic has surrounded him/herself with.
It's not that I don't see that some behaviours of those surrounding alcoholics enable them to carry on, it's more that I think focussing on the minutiae of what is/isn't an enabling behaviour is still focussing on their needs and actions rather than focussing on what will work to improve the lives of your children and you. A determined alcoholic can switch "enablers" at the drop of a hat when a particular one stops playing or can no longer need the things they had ( a job, a home, a family) in order to maintain drinking.
I haven't seen any published evidence that an approach where loved ones stopped "enabling" behaviours led to more long-term sobriety choices by alcoholics, than those who didn't, I'd be interested in seeing any there was (academically: it doesn't really matter to my situation anymore).
In my case, nothing I did made any difference, enabling or otherwise. Other's may have different experiences, and perhaps it would be worth asking in the alcoholics/addictions forum for those with long-term sobriety, if any of them were prompted to choose and stick with sobriety based on the actions of their spouse? get it from the horses mouth so to speak.
Curled up in a good book...
Join Date: Mar 2008
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I'd just like to recommend the book 'Under the Influence' if you want to learn about alcoholism and the 'Getting them Sober' books to you.
Most of us on this forum have tried and tried to get the alcoholics in our lives to stop drinking. We have all been where you are to one extent or another. When I had tried just about everything I could think of to get STBXAH to stop drinking (and we were together 18 years) with no success, I found myself here. I 'got' the first step of Al Anon very quickly because of personal experience. I knew I had no control over my alcoholic, I knew I was powerless even though it was painful to realise. I still had lapses of wishful thinking that ended up hurting both of us.
If I hadn't tried everything first I think I would have your reaction to Al Anon/12 steps/codependency - and would have ended up at the same point through a longer, more circuitous route.
You can listen to the warnings posted here. You can disregard them. It is entirely up to you. You're a grown up, responsible for making your own decisions, just like everyone else here and just like your wife. Everyone here is a recovering codependent - we're all just trying to help!
Most of us on this forum have tried and tried to get the alcoholics in our lives to stop drinking. We have all been where you are to one extent or another. When I had tried just about everything I could think of to get STBXAH to stop drinking (and we were together 18 years) with no success, I found myself here. I 'got' the first step of Al Anon very quickly because of personal experience. I knew I had no control over my alcoholic, I knew I was powerless even though it was painful to realise. I still had lapses of wishful thinking that ended up hurting both of us.
If I hadn't tried everything first I think I would have your reaction to Al Anon/12 steps/codependency - and would have ended up at the same point through a longer, more circuitous route.
You can listen to the warnings posted here. You can disregard them. It is entirely up to you. You're a grown up, responsible for making your own decisions, just like everyone else here and just like your wife. Everyone here is a recovering codependent - we're all just trying to help!
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WoW I have so appreciated reading this thread! I'm fairly new here, haven't posted alot...and REALLY struggle with what the best response to my alcoholic Hubby is.
I have a good friend who constantly tells me I'm enabling him, simply because I don't confront him on issues.
I, on the other hand and trying to subscribe to the " I didn't cause it, I can't control it, can't cure it" theory."
I'm doing MUCH better at taking care of myself, but REALLY struggle not knowing the best course of action to help him. It's easy to say, nothing I do effects the alcoholic...BUT....and it's the But that gets me.
Welcome Kmarko....thanks for the thread!
I have a good friend who constantly tells me I'm enabling him, simply because I don't confront him on issues.
I, on the other hand and trying to subscribe to the " I didn't cause it, I can't control it, can't cure it" theory."
I'm doing MUCH better at taking care of myself, but REALLY struggle not knowing the best course of action to help him. It's easy to say, nothing I do effects the alcoholic...BUT....and it's the But that gets me.
Welcome Kmarko....thanks for the thread!
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Originally Posted by bookwyrm
I'd just like to recommend the book 'Under the Influence' if you want to learn about alcoholism and the 'Getting them Sober' books to you.
Most of us on this forum have tried and tried to get the alcoholics in our lives to stop drinking. We have all been where you are to one extent or another. When I had tried just about everything I could think of to get STBXAH to stop drinking (and we were together 18 years) with no success, I found myself here. I 'got' the first step of Al Anon very quickly because of personal experience. I knew I had no control over my alcoholic, I knew I was powerless even though it was painful to realise. I still had lapses of wishful thinking that ended up hurting both of us.
If I hadn't tried everything first I think I would have your reaction to Al Anon/12 steps/codependency - and would have ended up at the same point through a longer, more circuitous route.
You can listen to the warnings posted here. You can disregard them. It is entirely up to you. You're a grown up, responsible for making your own decisions, just like everyone else here and just like your wife. Everyone here is a recovering codependent - we're all just trying to help!
Most of us on this forum have tried and tried to get the alcoholics in our lives to stop drinking. We have all been where you are to one extent or another. When I had tried just about everything I could think of to get STBXAH to stop drinking (and we were together 18 years) with no success, I found myself here. I 'got' the first step of Al Anon very quickly because of personal experience. I knew I had no control over my alcoholic, I knew I was powerless even though it was painful to realise. I still had lapses of wishful thinking that ended up hurting both of us.
If I hadn't tried everything first I think I would have your reaction to Al Anon/12 steps/codependency - and would have ended up at the same point through a longer, more circuitous route.
You can listen to the warnings posted here. You can disregard them. It is entirely up to you. You're a grown up, responsible for making your own decisions, just like everyone else here and just like your wife. Everyone here is a recovering codependent - we're all just trying to help!
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don't have any problem at all with the 12 steps.....I've read them, and don't see much there to disagree with, to be honest. - kmarko
The magic, in my humble opinion (IMHO) in the 12 steps is doing them. But to do them, from the codependent's perspective, one must accept "I am powerless over others and my life has become unmanageable." That's where that "we can't change the alcoholic" stuff is coming from.
Here's the codependent's 12 steps: Twelve Steps
I am getting alot out of doing them.
The magic, in my humble opinion (IMHO) in the 12 steps is doing them. But to do them, from the codependent's perspective, one must accept "I am powerless over others and my life has become unmanageable." That's where that "we can't change the alcoholic" stuff is coming from.
Here's the codependent's 12 steps: Twelve Steps
I am getting alot out of doing them.
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Originally Posted by wifeofadrinker
don't have any problem at all with the 12 steps.....I've read them, and don't see much there to disagree with, to be honest. - kmarko
The magic, in my humble opinion (IMHO) in the 12 steps is doing them. But to do them, from the codependent's perspective, one must accept "I am powerless over others and my life has become unmanageable." That's where that "we can't change the alcoholic" stuff is coming from.
Here's the codependent's 12 steps: Twelve Steps
I am getting alot out of doing them.
The magic, in my humble opinion (IMHO) in the 12 steps is doing them. But to do them, from the codependent's perspective, one must accept "I am powerless over others and my life has become unmanageable." That's where that "we can't change the alcoholic" stuff is coming from.
Here's the codependent's 12 steps: Twelve Steps
I am getting alot out of doing them.
Which is all a long way of saying I have the utmost respect and am very happy for anyone who is gaining strength/hope/wisdom etc. from the 12 steps, or anything else. For the record, as I said, I have no problem with them--but find that they have no value for me.
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Originally Posted by Adragonfly
WoW I have so appreciated reading this thread! I'm fairly new here, haven't posted alot...and REALLY struggle with what the best response to my alcoholic Hubby is.
I have a good friend who constantly tells me I'm enabling him, simply because I don't confront him on issues.
I, on the other hand and trying to subscribe to the " I didn't cause it, I can't control it, can't cure it" theory."
I'm doing MUCH better at taking care of myself, but REALLY struggle not knowing the best course of action to help him. It's easy to say, nothing I do effects the alcoholic...BUT....and it's the But that gets me.
Welcome Kmarko....thanks for the thread!
I have a good friend who constantly tells me I'm enabling him, simply because I don't confront him on issues.
I, on the other hand and trying to subscribe to the " I didn't cause it, I can't control it, can't cure it" theory."
I'm doing MUCH better at taking care of myself, but REALLY struggle not knowing the best course of action to help him. It's easy to say, nothing I do effects the alcoholic...BUT....and it's the But that gets me.
Welcome Kmarko....thanks for the thread!
It's not you, it's the alcoholic, they only change if they want vs. the entire concept of enabling and the issues that go with it.
I think, upon reflection, the one action that it seems to come down to is leaving or not--that seems to be the one thing people acknowledge can affect a change. Whether that's really the only thing is unclear to me, at this point.
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[QUOTE=Kmarko;2480561]I'm leery about getting into this too much--it's sort of like if someone loves a movie that I go and see and it doesn't do much for me.....I'm not interested in trying to persuade someone why they SHOULDN'T like something. After all, what's the point? If someone is deriving value from something, why should I change their mind?
This is a great discussion. I am learning a lot from it.
So now, if you're willing to do this exercise, take your analogy from above about the movie. Now replace "movie" with "drinking" and "someone" with "wife's name"...and if your wife is deriving value from drinking, why should you change (or try to change) her mind?
This is a great discussion. I am learning a lot from it.
So now, if you're willing to do this exercise, take your analogy from above about the movie. Now replace "movie" with "drinking" and "someone" with "wife's name"...and if your wife is deriving value from drinking, why should you change (or try to change) her mind?
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Originally Posted by Kmarko
I think, upon reflection, the one action that it seems to come down to is leaving or not--that seems to be the one thing people acknowledge can affect a change. Whether that's really the only thing is unclear to me, at this point.
I cannot count how many times I have typed "focus on yourself" and someone has read "leave."
L
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[QUOTE=stella27;2480572] Well, I think there's a pretty clear distinction there. If the movie was actually KILLING that person, I might try to warn them off of it. (Granted, some movies seem to hurt your brain, but that's a different story.) Thanks for the post--glad you're benefiting from reading.
Originally Posted by Kmarko
I'm leery about getting into this too much--it's sort of like if someone loves a movie that I go and see and it doesn't do much for me.....I'm not interested in trying to persuade someone why they SHOULDN'T like something. After all, what's the point? If someone is deriving value from something, why should I change their mind?
This is a great discussion. I am learning a lot from it.
So now, if you're willing to do this exercise, take your analogy from above about the movie. Now replace "movie" with "drinking" and "someone" with "wife's name"...and if your wife is deriving value from drinking, why should you change (or try to change) her mind?
This is a great discussion. I am learning a lot from it.
So now, if you're willing to do this exercise, take your analogy from above about the movie. Now replace "movie" with "drinking" and "someone" with "wife's name"...and if your wife is deriving value from drinking, why should you change (or try to change) her mind?
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Location: Southwest
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[QUOTE=Kmarko;2480577]
Well, I think there's a pretty clear distinction there. If the movie was actually KILLING that person, I might try to warn them off of it. (Granted, some movies seem to hurt your brain, but that's a different story.) Thanks for the post--glad you're benefiting from reading. I actually said that to my Husband last spring, when he asked why I was always on his back about drinking. I said "Well, I would like to think that if you saw me on a collision course, that you would take steps to stop me."
My motives were good, but my mistake was in thinking that he WANTED the warning. It actually just turned him off to me that much more. He likes the collision course. It fulfills something in him that I cannot understand.
Originally Posted by stella27
Well, I think there's a pretty clear distinction there. If the movie was actually KILLING that person, I might try to warn them off of it. (Granted, some movies seem to hurt your brain, but that's a different story.) Thanks for the post--glad you're benefiting from reading.
My motives were good, but my mistake was in thinking that he WANTED the warning. It actually just turned him off to me that much more. He likes the collision course. It fulfills something in him that I cannot understand.
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Join Date: Jan 2010
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Originally Posted by LaTeeDa
Not at all. This is what most people don't get. What it comes down to is taking the focus off the alcoholic, and putting it on yourself. Taking care of you and your children, regardless of what the alcoholic does. Living your life the way you want to live it--again, regardless of what the alcoholic does.
I cannot count how many times I have typed "focus on yourself" and someone has read "leave."
L
I cannot count how many times I have typed "focus on yourself" and someone has read "leave."
L
I would say, though, that "focus on yourself" is one of those terms that can be elastic to the point of meaninglessness, and that's where you may have run into people mixing the term with "leaving." After all, what does "live your life the way you want to live it" actually mean, if you're talking about unpleasantness with an alcoholic spouse and NOT talking about leaving.
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I agree in theory, LTD. But when children are involved and when their lives are being jeopardized by living with (and perhaps spending a good deal of time alone with) an active alcoholic, then "focus on yourself" isn't enough. Detachment isn't going to stop a house fire or a drunken traffic accident from killing them. I believe strongly in detachment - but I would never leave my children in the care of an active alcoholic, which sounds like the case in Kmarko's situation.
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