For the ones hurt because they show no remorse
A jug fills drop by drop
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 6,784
For the ones hurt because they show no remorse
I had a lightbulb moment, when I was wondering how the hell ex had NO REMORSE while I had a hellish year of pain.... I realized he is not at all remorseful because....
HE THINKS ITS NORMAL TO TREAT WOMEN THAT WAY !
Well probably you are rolling your eyes saying "she just got that?" lol but it was huge for me. It makes sense to me and helps me stay away...
:ghug2
PS I am writing to you dressed up as the Greek Goddess Metis, Goddess of Wisdom. LOL.
HE THINKS ITS NORMAL TO TREAT WOMEN THAT WAY !
Well probably you are rolling your eyes saying "she just got that?" lol but it was huge for me. It makes sense to me and helps me stay away...
:ghug2
PS I am writing to you dressed up as the Greek Goddess Metis, Goddess of Wisdom. LOL.
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: east siiiide
Posts: 254
It's funny how they couldn't care less about anyone else's pain but when it comes to them it's like, WHY ME?? How COULD they!!! Pity me, I'm a victim quack quack. I don't think my husband has ever or maybe will ever show ENOUGH remorse to make me happy right now, something I have to deal with and sort out for myself. For those of us who feel too much remorse for everything, it's hard to imagine a world where you feel no guilt...!@
My AH said to me that I had been very rude the past two days and had hurt him a lot and that I was making things very difficult. I said, I'm sorry you feel that way. His words were "YOU made me feel that way." I didn't respond to that but it brought up this chuckle in me like, wow, I think I used to feel that powerless too.. THANK YOU to SR, Al-Anon, my HP, and all the support I've found out there.
Thanks to everyone for helping me see that I am not a victim, I have a choice in how I feel, and that it's SO POINTLESS to go around shoving my finger in someone's face saying YOU made me feel this way, YOU.
I wanted to share with him that there was a more empowering way to live life but I really didn't think he'd hear through the quacking. He ahs to want a better life.
My AH said to me that I had been very rude the past two days and had hurt him a lot and that I was making things very difficult. I said, I'm sorry you feel that way. His words were "YOU made me feel that way." I didn't respond to that but it brought up this chuckle in me like, wow, I think I used to feel that powerless too.. THANK YOU to SR, Al-Anon, my HP, and all the support I've found out there.
Thanks to everyone for helping me see that I am not a victim, I have a choice in how I feel, and that it's SO POINTLESS to go around shoving my finger in someone's face saying YOU made me feel this way, YOU.
I wanted to share with him that there was a more empowering way to live life but I really didn't think he'd hear through the quacking. He ahs to want a better life.
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: rural west
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HOLY SMOKES that is SO straight up. I mean, I don't even think for my AH he THINKS its normal. He is so overwhelmed by himself/by the unrealistic perfect vision he expects himself to be/by the flawed human being that he is that he can't THINK at all! Just react. Just defend. Just deny. Just avoid. Just bury the gunk. Run away from himself and his pain as fast as he can every moment.
Mine can't apologize or OWN UP because he doesn't want to BE himself. Doesn't want to be the man that did and said those things. Doesn't think any dark side is acceptable.
But he is himself. Stuck with himself.
(Maybe if I avoid owning up it won't be true! It will go away!)
Wah wah wah wah! Sooorrrrryyy, but no. You lose. You're still you, AH.
The rest of us are still deserving your personal responsibility, but also not holding our breath for it.
I am digging boundaries with love. I deserve a relationship of honor, communication and honesty. You get to do what you do with that. I will choose what to do based on my rights and boundaries. What you do is not my burden. I can love you and still have boundaries. I can love you if we stay together or apart. I can love you and be PISSED!
Mine can't apologize or OWN UP because he doesn't want to BE himself. Doesn't want to be the man that did and said those things. Doesn't think any dark side is acceptable.
But he is himself. Stuck with himself.
(Maybe if I avoid owning up it won't be true! It will go away!)
Wah wah wah wah! Sooorrrrryyy, but no. You lose. You're still you, AH.
The rest of us are still deserving your personal responsibility, but also not holding our breath for it.
I am digging boundaries with love. I deserve a relationship of honor, communication and honesty. You get to do what you do with that. I will choose what to do based on my rights and boundaries. What you do is not my burden. I can love you and still have boundaries. I can love you if we stay together or apart. I can love you and be PISSED!
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 149
Originally Posted by wifeofadrinker 
HOLY SMOKES that is SO straight up. I mean, I don't even think for my AH he THINKS its normal. He is so overwhelmed by himself/by the unrealistic perfect vision he expects himself to be/by the flawed human being that he is that he can't THINK at all! Just react. Just defend. Just deny. Just avoid. Just bury the gunk. Run away from himself and his pain as fast as he can every moment.
Mine can't apologize or OWN UP because he doesn't want to BE himself. Doesn't want to be the man that did and said those things. Doesn't think any dark side is acceptable.
But he is himself. Stuck with himself.
(Maybe if I avoid owning up it won't be true! It will go away!)
Wah wah wah wah! Sooorrrrryyy, but no. You lose. You're still you, AH.
Mine can't apologize or OWN UP because he doesn't want to BE himself. Doesn't want to be the man that did and said those things. Doesn't think any dark side is acceptable.
But he is himself. Stuck with himself.
(Maybe if I avoid owning up it won't be true! It will go away!)
Wah wah wah wah! Sooorrrrryyy, but no. You lose. You're still you, AH.
SO TRUE! especially the unrealistic perfect vision part and the running away/burying/denying. where does this come from? is it a defense mechanism from growing up in an alcoholic home, so they construct this perfect vision in their minds of who they are so as to not face the dark past, the personal demons? i'm not sure of your entire story or if your AH comes from an alcoholic home, but my xabf's father was an alcoholic. i don't know details about their relationship, but i just know his home life wasn't good. of COURSE he'd say things to me like "you haven't seen the things i've seen" or "my father wasn't a very good man..." i'd think if you keep on this dangerous path you're on, you might be looking your father in the mirror one day. but he just didn't see it. he couldn't. that wasn't him, AT ALL. he couldn't have a problem!
Only stepping forward
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Alabama, USA
Posts: 330
Wow, thanks to all of you for your posts.
I never thought xabf's having no remorse could hurt so bad. It creates such anger within me and I know I need to just put having no remorse in the "alcoholism is so sad" category and then move on with my day.
Queennie....I've actually heard the "you haven't seen what I've seen" and "what I've been through". But he has said many times that his father drank too much and was mean to his mother and so on and so forth but he's not like that, his mother raised him better than that. The last real, major, walk away fight we ever had was me coming back to him on that saying "if you're so much different then your father, then why did your mother beg you to stop drinking because she was afraid you were turning into your father?"
Yet, he still saw no problem. It's sad. So very, extremely sad.
I never thought xabf's having no remorse could hurt so bad. It creates such anger within me and I know I need to just put having no remorse in the "alcoholism is so sad" category and then move on with my day.
Queennie....I've actually heard the "you haven't seen what I've seen" and "what I've been through". But he has said many times that his father drank too much and was mean to his mother and so on and so forth but he's not like that, his mother raised him better than that. The last real, major, walk away fight we ever had was me coming back to him on that saying "if you're so much different then your father, then why did your mother beg you to stop drinking because she was afraid you were turning into your father?"
Yet, he still saw no problem. It's sad. So very, extremely sad.
A jug fills drop by drop
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 6,784
Hey kv, that is a good one, just throw the trash in a big bag that says "its such a sad disease and never ending madness" that phrase is like a STOP sign.
Today I find myself wanting my ex to see me, how sick is that. I've got so many compliments that MY EGO wants to be fed for him to see me beautiful and happy. How sick of me...
And I say, let's see he sees me, what then? what for? what do I win? what could happen? nothing.
I am not sure where I learned I needed to "demonstrate" things.
I am trying to have a healthier attitude as in "who cares, I already look pretty and happy everyday" and going back to my life, my weekend, my plans, etc.
Wow, ex is such a stranger. I wish I could really believe the wandering body I see, is a twin.
Sometimes it is easier, especially when I am out of work, I can think "so sorry we lost him, he used to be a good person" as if he was dead. That's also a STOP sign that prevents me from re hashing hurtful stuff for the Nth time.
Gosh, the only way to win is NOT TO PLAY, not even go there. If I let this one rent space in my head I am totally doomed. I can't afford a single thought anymore. When I run into him I just try to breathe but my heart beats way faster and I am reminded of so much misery. UGH. At least I got the correct response now, a turned stomach, and I do no longer want to run to his arms !! Its just a huge question mark. Who the hell is he?
Ships in the night...
And no, there is not enough remorse to "pay".. in fact it would be better if there is never any show of remorse or pain, that way I can keep convincing myself he is a selfish jerk. DONE with talking about him.
Thanks for always being here for me even in my most pathetic moments ahhh
Today I find myself wanting my ex to see me, how sick is that. I've got so many compliments that MY EGO wants to be fed for him to see me beautiful and happy. How sick of me...
And I say, let's see he sees me, what then? what for? what do I win? what could happen? nothing.
I am not sure where I learned I needed to "demonstrate" things.
I am trying to have a healthier attitude as in "who cares, I already look pretty and happy everyday"
and going back to my life, my weekend, my plans, etc.Wow, ex is such a stranger. I wish I could really believe the wandering body I see, is a twin.
Sometimes it is easier, especially when I am out of work, I can think "so sorry we lost him, he used to be a good person" as if he was dead. That's also a STOP sign that prevents me from re hashing hurtful stuff for the Nth time.
Gosh, the only way to win is NOT TO PLAY, not even go there. If I let this one rent space in my head I am totally doomed. I can't afford a single thought anymore. When I run into him I just try to breathe but my heart beats way faster and I am reminded of so much misery. UGH. At least I got the correct response now, a turned stomach, and I do no longer want to run to his arms !! Its just a huge question mark. Who the hell is he?
Ships in the night...
And no, there is not enough remorse to "pay".. in fact it would be better if there is never any show of remorse or pain, that way I can keep convincing myself he is a selfish jerk. DONE with talking about him.
Thanks for always being here for me even in my most pathetic moments ahhh
To thine own self be true.
Join Date: May 2009
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 5,924
How can you be remorseful about something you don't even remember doing, and believed you were justified in doing anyway? They are delusional. They have no normal reasoning ability. It is all focused on the drinking. Anything and everything becomes okay to do, as long as it allows you to drink and drug. It has nothing to do with your parents or your upbringing or any of that; those are all excuses. Dad and Mom, and anyone else, are the scapegoats.
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Baghdad
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Originally Posted by TakingCharge999
I had a lightbulb moment, when I was wondering how the hell ex had NO REMORSE while I had a hellish year of pain.... I realized he is not at all remorseful because....
HE THINKS ITS NORMAL TO TREAT WOMEN THAT WAY !
HE THINKS ITS NORMAL TO TREAT WOMEN THAT WAY !
In any event, in my experience, such behavior is equal-opportunity, non-gender specific behavior. Just how alcoholics/addicts behave.
Happy Halloween!
Only stepping forward
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Alabama, USA
Posts: 330
John....she was referring to HER ex (who is a guy); not alcoholics in general. So when she said HE thinks it's okay to treat women that way, she was talking about her ex. It wasn't sexist at all....it was specifically about one man in her life.
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 245
Originally Posted by Learn2Live
How can you be remorseful about something you don't even remember doing, and believed you were justified in doing anyway? They are delusional. They have no normal reasoning ability. It is all focused on the drinking. Anything and everything becomes okay to do, as long as it allows you to drink and drug. It has nothing to do with your parents or your upbringing or any of that; those are all excuses. Dad and Mom, and anyone else, are the scapegoats.
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Join Date: Mar 2008
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Originally Posted by kv816
John....she was referring to HER ex (who is a guy); not alcoholics in general. So when she said HE thinks it's okay to treat women that way, she was talking about her ex. It wasn't sexist at all....it was specifically about one man in her life.
My point, and I think it bears repeating, is that is how alcoholics/addicts treat people in general. Regardless of the gender of either party.
A jug fills drop by drop
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 6,784
Hi sailor, I get your point, as he seemingly keeps a handful of friends I kind of assume its only with certain people. But your perspective helps a great deal
kv thanks for making the clarification, perhaps I should have been more general !
Anyway, it sucks when they do not even remember. I mean. How much lonelier can it get?
I have no idea why some memories come out of the blue. Oh well. "trust your process" is the motto nowadays...
kv thanks for making the clarification, perhaps I should have been more general !
Anyway, it sucks when they do not even remember. I mean. How much lonelier can it get?
I have no idea why some memories come out of the blue. Oh well. "trust your process" is the motto nowadays...
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: London
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Hey TC I was going back through old posts of mine a few weeks ago (I find almost blogging as it were has really helped because reading back on everything I've written since July, and seeing the incredible progress I've made, has been wonderful and a real help to know I am a strong person and I can survive being elbowed by a selfish, self-centred jerk. Do you know all my early posts go on about how wonderful, etc, he was and how we didn't argue very much but he would finish with me out of the blue.
Do you know though a few weeks ago I went through a few emails I'd written to a male friend while still with my ex and that was a real eye opener - so much so I was overwhelmed to tears. Incidents I couldn't remember at first, but there they were in black and white.
There was one about how he'd been dying to see me this one evening so I'd driven to his 30 miles away and when I got there he insisted on cooking for me, told me how much he loved me, told me how beautiful I was, hugged and kissed me in the kitchen while the food was cooking and he told me he loved me when I wore my glasses (which I don't wear very often). Then we had a real laugh, more gushy things were said on both sides. etc. Then when I got home that night, so about half an hour after I left him, he texted me asking me to ring him. Then he finished with me! I was texting him asking why, saying I didn't understand. And if he was going to do that, then why did he say all those things as that had made it ten thousand times worse, and he threatened me in the next text. I didn't write to my friend exactly what he said so I can't really remember, but the text ended, 'You'll pay!' In another text he sent me abuse (again I didn't log what he said!) And I found an old mobile phone the other day from when we first started seeing each other. In one text, about 10 months after we got together, he wrote 'I'm sorry I lied to you!' It's amazing how much we'll block out and lie to ourselves, telling ourselves how wonderful everything was, when in reality it couldn't be further from the truth!
Do you know though a few weeks ago I went through a few emails I'd written to a male friend while still with my ex and that was a real eye opener - so much so I was overwhelmed to tears. Incidents I couldn't remember at first, but there they were in black and white.
There was one about how he'd been dying to see me this one evening so I'd driven to his 30 miles away and when I got there he insisted on cooking for me, told me how much he loved me, told me how beautiful I was, hugged and kissed me in the kitchen while the food was cooking and he told me he loved me when I wore my glasses (which I don't wear very often). Then we had a real laugh, more gushy things were said on both sides. etc. Then when I got home that night, so about half an hour after I left him, he texted me asking me to ring him. Then he finished with me! I was texting him asking why, saying I didn't understand. And if he was going to do that, then why did he say all those things as that had made it ten thousand times worse, and he threatened me in the next text. I didn't write to my friend exactly what he said so I can't really remember, but the text ended, 'You'll pay!' In another text he sent me abuse (again I didn't log what he said!) And I found an old mobile phone the other day from when we first started seeing each other. In one text, about 10 months after we got together, he wrote 'I'm sorry I lied to you!' It's amazing how much we'll block out and lie to ourselves, telling ourselves how wonderful everything was, when in reality it couldn't be further from the truth!
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Join Date: Oct 2009
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Oh my SClarke, do I relate to this post! Right down to the sweet nothings in the kitchen... love... beautiful... then BANG - I'm done with you.
Well SC - it doesn't matter that he's done with you. You didn't "belong" to him to begin with.
However... I realize these are reflections from months ago, and that you have come FAR since then. Congratulations on your progress!
Your post helped me because I could relate. Thanks!
Well SC - it doesn't matter that he's done with you. You didn't "belong" to him to begin with.
However... I realize these are reflections from months ago, and that you have come FAR since then. Congratulations on your progress!
Your post helped me because I could relate. Thanks!
A jug fills drop by drop
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 6,784
sclarke and tigger, I know how it feels like. And it also makes me feel way better knowing there are people out there who get me!
I agree we do not belong to anyone just as no one belongs to us....
When I see my old codie ways creeping in I like to think "my joy is not up to you"
Works for me
I agree we do not belong to anyone just as no one belongs to us....
When I see my old codie ways creeping in I like to think "my joy is not up to you"
Works for me
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 234
My RAH expresses remorse. I guess knowing that he is sorry for what he did helps me a little, as it is somewhat validating, although I know these feelings are painful for him. However, assessing his remorse puts the focus on his thoughts/feelings, not mine. I've spent too much time focusing on what he is thinking/feeling. I personally haven't found rehashing the past to be a big help in my recovery. Maybe this will change as I progress on my journey. At this point I'm much more interested in my feelings about how he is treating me today.
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 902
I found that focusing on his lack of remorse only held me back. I don't think it matters why my ex treated me poorly. He did and that's all I needed to know. I gave him 4 years of my life and don't think he deserves anymore of my time. Trying to figure out how he feels, if or why will keep you from enjoying the new person in your life. Hugs!
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Someplace USA
Posts: 415
Sometimes I get sick of it all. Remorse, no remorse. He's treating me mean; they flip that switch and become prince stinking charming. They shift as quickly as the fluid they drink. If their life isn't an excuse it's a waste or they are wasting the time of those around them; infecting them with parts of this mutating virus that has a 100% infection rate. As partners and children we do or don't do because of them. We walk on eggs because of them. Spend countless hours explaining things to them that a 10 year old understands.
I'm thrilled and happy just when my AH is treating me "nice". Shouldn't people in your home in general treat you nice? When I'm told we are working on our marriage that means I'm mostly treated nicely, respectfully, lovingly and given some time and attention. I think this has been the best he's treated me since we've dated. I still can't talk to him about the drinking or anything important. They've been two of the nicest weeks of my marraige. How sad. He wouldn't even begin to understand why that is sad or not enough if you want something real or that I may want or need more. He would be mad to hear me say that; I'm sure.
Notice your A "feels" everything deeply. Ask them and they are the one hurt by you and everyone else. Life is unfair. We spend too much time on what they think and feel. The truth is they don't want to think or feel anything. They drink it all away along with their lives and everyone who is in relationship with them. Being involved with an alcoholic is like getting up everyday and walking onto the Titanic knowing it's going to sink at some point.
Even if they say sorry; it's just sorry your mad; or sorry I got caught. Unless they are headed to rehab sorry with no change is not sorry at all... I know I sound a bit off today; but my guy is the best he's been and it's creepier then him at his worst, especially because I'm planning on leaving and he's not suppose to know. I'm just sick of it all!!!
I'm thrilled and happy just when my AH is treating me "nice". Shouldn't people in your home in general treat you nice? When I'm told we are working on our marriage that means I'm mostly treated nicely, respectfully, lovingly and given some time and attention. I think this has been the best he's treated me since we've dated. I still can't talk to him about the drinking or anything important. They've been two of the nicest weeks of my marraige. How sad. He wouldn't even begin to understand why that is sad or not enough if you want something real or that I may want or need more. He would be mad to hear me say that; I'm sure.
Notice your A "feels" everything deeply. Ask them and they are the one hurt by you and everyone else. Life is unfair. We spend too much time on what they think and feel. The truth is they don't want to think or feel anything. They drink it all away along with their lives and everyone who is in relationship with them. Being involved with an alcoholic is like getting up everyday and walking onto the Titanic knowing it's going to sink at some point.
Even if they say sorry; it's just sorry your mad; or sorry I got caught. Unless they are headed to rehab sorry with no change is not sorry at all... I know I sound a bit off today; but my guy is the best he's been and it's creepier then him at his worst, especially because I'm planning on leaving and he's not suppose to know. I'm just sick of it all!!!
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