OG0801

My therapist has suggested Al-Anon meetings several times, but I'm not sure it's a step I want to take, so here I am. Sorry this is so long!

I am dating someone who has a tendency to abuse alcohol. I don't know if he is an alcoholic, or whether he will become one in the future. We have been dating for nine months, and have been living together for two.

When we first met, he mentioned a past history of drug and alcohol use, but he no longer drank like that. And that was pretty consistent with his actions during the first six seven months of our relationship. He might have a beer at dinner, but usually he'd order an iced tea. There were one or two occasions where he drank too much liquor, but they were few and far between, and as someone who drinks socially (and has had similar such over-indulgences) it didn't strike me as all that unusual or worrisome. I will add here that I do not have an alcohol problem and have never used drugs; my parents didn't drink when I was a kid, so alcohol has never really been a part of my life.

In late summer he suddenly began to experience a lot of stress and anxiety attacks--he's very recently divorced, left the military after 10 years, moved from California, went back to school, etc. That he was stressed wasn't surprising. I expected a transition period, and it's why I was hesitant to date him in the first place. Anyway, he started to drink more regularly. And it was easy, since his mother and stepfather unwind at the end of the day with a few drinks, so they always have lots of liquor and wine and beer at home, and we were there a lot for family functions.

I didn't realize the extent of the drinking until the night before my birthday. We were hanging out at his mom's house, and everyone was drinking. (I think I had one beer.) He got drunk and started to get sort of obnoxious, in a good-natured overly affectionate way, but still grating to me. I expressed some irritation and displeasure, and he became extremely emotional and accused me of judging him and said it wasn't going to work. Yeah, he was trying to break up with me. And because I refused to have him break up with me on my birthday, we basically talked it out that night as he sobered up.

A similar situation happened again four days later. I was beside myself trying to decide whether I was going to end the relationship, and decided to hold off until after his son had gone home for the summer. The next 2.5 weeks were good, with no problems. Then, the night of my company picnic, he got anxious and drank before we left, and continued to drink beers while we were there. He made some obnoxious and borderline inappropriate comments at the picnic, and we got into a huge fight that night. We sort of resolved everything, but I was on edge for the next 24 hours, until I saw my therapist. Had a break down during the visit, went home, and we had a serious talk that nearly resulted in us breaking up. At one point he said, "Maybe you just need a calmer guy," and I told him, "Maybe I do." We talked some more, and he admitted he has a problem, but that he's so stressed and doesn't know any other way to address it...needs my support and patience as he works through many of these issues in his life. I told him fine, but that I don't like who he is when he's drunk and it's not acceptable--I need a healthy partner, esp. since we had been talking about marriage and children before these issues reared their head.

We went on a planned trip the next week and things went well, even though we were in Reno, of all places. But the drive home triggered a massive anxiety attack, he drank when we got home, and we had another argument. I ended up just leaving the house for a few hours to calm down. A few days later I came home from work and realized he'd polished off a bottle of wine and thrown it away. I was absolutely livid - and he was asleep on the couch. I went away that weekend (over Labor Day) to visit friends.

Since then, there has been one other episode, two weeks ago. He had a couple of strong cocktails at his mom's house during a football game, got drunk, decided we needed to go home, and he went to bed and fell asleep. But in the morning he woke up and said he couldn't remember what had happened the night before, and was having trouble concentrating and remembering anything while trying to study. He again said he had a problem and needed to stop drinking liquor and needed my support. He was more introspective and calmer during this talk--and I did not bring it up. I again laid out that I don't like the heavy drinking and it's not healthy.

I have known a few people who go through patches of excessive drinking at various points in their life and are able to be social drinkers, having a beer or two or a glass of wine now and then. So it is hard for me to believe what my therapist is saying--that my boyfriend, whom I love, is an alcoholic. I want to believe that like a lot of people, he will be able to stop abusing alcohol. I don't care whether he decides to abstain totally or has one beer every other night or two if he can truly keep it at that. (So far he has been able to drink a beer and stop without becoming intoxicated. Liquor, on the other hand, seems to go down fast and easy. Still...) I don't want him to slide into dependency and alcoholism. I don't know what support I can offer him now, if any. All I have done so far is tell him that we cannot have a healthy life together if he can't figure out a better way to deal with his anxiety.

He is the first man I've ever loved, and it breaks my heart that this is an issue in our relationship. But like a lot of people, I see the amazing guy he has been for most of the relationship, and I'm not willing to walk away from that--yet. Just needed to get that all off my chest. Thanks for reading.

Jadmack25

Hi OG, it is hard and heartbreakng to see a loved one doing this, and suffering as they do. If hisdrinking istriggered or aggravated by increased anxiety, it may be a benefit to first see his GP, get a check up and see what he advises. He may suggest medication or even therapy, to ease his feelings of anxiety and stress.

For me that would be my first step, and depending on the findings, I would take it from there.

I hope others can give you other ideas and suggestions.

One thing is sure, if he has a problem with drinking, YOU cannot fix it.

Whatever treatment he needs will only have a chance, if he wants it for himself, and is prepared to work his butt off in recovery.

Sure, be there as support if he is really into quitting and doing what he needs, but if you are expected to stay while he makes no effort, then I would do a lot of thinking about that.

God bless

hps

Sounds to me like fairly advanced alcoholism. Drinking before a social event is one red flag here. Also complaining about stress and difficulty concentrating, when caught drinking. If he was like me, I would assume there is a lot more drinking that you are not aware of.

puckettcg

I've been married to an Alcoholic for just over 20 years. In the beginning, I noticed the exact same thing you did. When we were dating, he would seem to get drunk at parties and with other friends who were also getting drunk - we were young, just out of college, so it didn't seem that he was any different than anyone else in our age group - and in between the parties, he would have a beer here and there but nothing that would be alarming. Soon after we married, he got really drunk on liquor, and after a handful of other episodes, we discovered that he couldn't drink liquor at all - he turned very quickly into this obnoxious. He agreed to stay away from liquor. The problem is that the beer quickly grew to take its place, and by about 10 years ago, it had reached a daily 18 pack (or more) level. The drunk happened more gradually, and I dealt with by knowing that he'd reach a certain level and simply pass out. But, even that got worse.

I guess what I'm telling you is that right now, he may only have "a problem" when he drinks liquor. He sounds a lot like my AH in the beginning, and if so, its only going to get worse. He may agree to stick to beer, but when he wants to get drunk - he'll just drink a lot more beer.

Hammer

JMHO, relative newby, myself.

Have done 5 Al-Anon meetings now, and before I made it to #6, was told and am pretty sure that is where I belong -- so there / here I am, at least for a while.

If you do not think so for you -- maybe stay on the path you are on, and look down through the mess of folks with posts on here about what they have been through and how they got there / here, and you may see yourself some years in advance.

Some folks learn from reading. some folks learn from hearing and formal teaching, and some folks have to learn from experience -- and I suppose some folks never learn. Pick your method of learning, but I am thinking your T knows their job and has cause to advise you to check this out.

canuckch

Hi OG. I just wanted to say Welcome to the board!

I am rather new to all of this myself. After months of reading and trying to figure out things for myself I finally realized that I needed to participate as well. I congratulate you for seeing a counselor, writing on this forum and considering an Al-Anon Group. It took me 7 years of marriage to get here.

Sorry I don't have any insightful input in yours and your ABF relationship. But there are many on this forum that do. I am sure you will see yourself in many other posts. Keep on reading.

Pelican

Welcome to the Sober Recovery family!

You will find support and information here. You will also find face to face support at Alanon meetings. Your therapist is an excellent source of information and seems to have experience with addiction, good!

You said:
We talked some more, and he admitted he has a problem, but that he's so stressed and doesn't know any other way to address it...needs my support and patience as he works through many of these issues in his life. I told him fine, but that I don't like who he is when he's drunk and it's not acceptable--I need a healthy partner, esp. since we had been talking about marriage and children before these issues reared their head.

He needs your support as a friend. He does not need you to baby sit him through his problems. As an adult, he needs to find his own way through his stress, issues and addictions. If you try to become his savior (this is what he is wanting), you will be blamed for his failures. ie., you didn't give him enough support, you were too controlling, you don't understand......

The best source of support for problems with alcoholism is a professional and/or another recovering alcoholic. He keeps telling you that he needs to work on his issues, with your support. You keep telling him that you need a healthy partner. Take a look at his actions and your actions.

You are searching for answers. You are speaking with a therapist, and you are reaching out to a support group.

He keeps telling you he needs to change, but nothing changes.

Your posts shows you are thoughtful, intelligent, and caring. Please take care of yourself.

OG0801

Thanks for the welcome, everybody.

Needless to say, this has been a difficult situation, and even knowing what I know and have read, I have a hard time saying he is an alcoholic. At my therapy session yesterday (I see a therapist for depression and general anxiety disorder, preexisting this relationship) we talked about the theory of alcoholism as a progressive disease. She asked me where I thought he was on the scale, I said somewhere between habitual and social drinking. It hasn't crossed over into dependence, though he may be flirting with psychological dependence.

And that's my mental block with this. It doesn't appear to be habitual yet--and I'm living with the guy, so I'd see it--but the episodes where he's self-medicated or has gotten out of control are upsetting. I'm sure my attitude isn't helped by what I've seen of a lot of people--periods where drinking is heavier (whether from stress or being in college and just experimenting) or even abusive to an eventual return to occasional social drinking without a progression into alcoholism.

Since our last serious talk about alcohol two weeks ago, he has had an occasional beer, maybe one a night (not every night) while playing a computer game. He had one late yesterday afternoon, and then drank soda for the rest of the evening. Over the last few nights he has complained of panicky feelings and high anxiety, but hasn't had anything to drink while complaining of these symptoms. And so this is a positive step in the right direction for him. But I'm here because I don't know if or how long it will last. Clearly some people are able to control problem drinking. I just don't know if he will be able to do it without causing serious damage.

catlovermi

Remember that there are different patterns manifested in alcoholism.

One pattern is binging, where the alcoholic can go intervals looking "normal" but, boy, when they do drink, it is in excess.

It isn't what or how much or when.

It's what happens after that first drink.

And it may not happen every time, early on in the disease. It's a progressive disease.

CLMI

OG0801

Forgive me - I'm not trying to be argumentative, but just working through all of this.

I agree that alcoholism is progressive. But not everyone who drinks or even abuses alcohol progresses into alcoholism. What is the difference between the person who abuses alcohol but doesn't become an alcoholic and the one who does? I'm just having a mental block with that question, because I know so many people who have abused alcohol at times, but aren't alcoholics.

I keep thinking that he may be one of those people who won't slide into alcoholism, that what's happened in the last couple of months is worrisome and something for him to address and move beyond, but it's not an irreversible problem worth ending a relationship over. On the other hand, I don't want to spend the rest of my life with someone who will cause me nothing but heartache and misery. Hence the confusion over what to do...

Learn2Live

What to do...focus on today, the here and now. Who are you today? How do you feel today? What do you want from yourself today?

Freedom1990

My AA sponsor's wife of 18 years is a good example of a former alcohol abuser. She didn't drink that often, but it didn't take her long to see it created problems for her. She quit, just like that, several years ago. Both of them have been through a lot over the years, and not once has she felt it necessary to pick up a drink for anxiety or anything else since she quit.

You can get stuck on whether he's an alcoholic or not, but the fact remains it is impacting your life negatively at this time, enough to be posting here on SR.

My father's parents were alcoholics, both dying very young, his mother at 42 from a heart attack/cirrhosis of the liver. His father died in a fire at the bar he owned. They were daily drinkers, and there was violence in the home.

I, on the other hand, was a binge drinker. That doesn't make me any less of an alcoholic than my paternal grandparents were (who were dead long before I was born).

I was also married to an alcoholic, now deceased, and I clung to the illusion for five hellish years believing I could change him, and he really was a good guy deep down inside.

In addition to seconding the suggestion your therapist gave you for attending Alanon, I also encourage you to pick up a copy of the book "Codependent No More" by Melody Beattie.

Welcome to SR!

:ghug2 :ghug2

wanting

You can analyze to death whether he's an alcoholic or not. It doesn't really help.

My question is...he's a recently divorced alcoholic, and is the first person you've ever loved...why? And you are already talking marriage and children...why? (I could tell you why, because I've been there, of course.)

Bernadette

He again said he had a problem and needed to stop drinking liquor and needed my support.

I am not qualified to help people with drinking problems!! In fact I can't "help" them, because i am neither a psychologist nor a recovered alcoholic.

I can however hand them the telephone number to local AA and say - " Y'know this whole issue is so much bigger than me, I've got my own problems to deal with - here's the number to call where there are a whole bunch of people who have been in your shoes and had a problem with alcohol. They will know how to help you."

And then let it go.

He is choosing how to live his life every day. He admits he has a problem with alcohol. Whether you think he is an alcoholic or not - alcohol abuse is causing a problem in your relationship right?

Read around this site - although your story has its unique details it is also a very very familiar one to everyone here. In fact the more I learned about alcoholism and alcoholics the more I began to ask "Geez do they all operate from the script?!"

And the more I learned about how people who love alcoholics and enable alcoholics behave I had to wonder the same thing! I got pretty crazy until I saw and accepted how much damage their drinking was doing to ME and I myself decided to get help for ME.

I hope you don't wait till you're in as much pain as I was when I finally stumbled into AlAnon and just followed directions. Have you considered AlAnon for yourself - it's to help the friends and family of alcoholics get the focus off the alcohol & alcoholic and back on themselves where it belongs so they are making healthy choices for their own life.

peace-
b

OG0801

Today is good. The last two weeks have been good. I feel very conflicted about the therapy visits, though. If she hadn't mentioned his drinking at yesterday's appointment it's not something I would have brought up, because it just wasn't something that has been an issue since we had that last talk about his drinking. He appears to be following through on what he said he was going to do after the last episode, and I was willing to just wait and see whether it lasted...but since my appointment yesterday I'm having a hard time not thinking about everything. So here I am. At least she hasn't said I'm co-dependent! Haha.

I don't think I can change my boyfriend. His decisions are his own. All I can offer is support and encouragement for healthy decisions and boundaries for inappropriate actions.

Wanting, He's not the first person I've ever loved--he's the first man I've been in love with--my first relationship as an adult. I do have healthy and loving relationships with family and friends, none of whom are alcoholics or have other substance abuse problems. I have a non-existent dating history, and I turned 29 this past summer. As for why we were already talking marriage and children, it was more along the lines of a mutual life goal--not an immediate thing we wanted to do. I wasn't ready for marriage before this all became an issue, and since then I'd say I'm even more cautious.

I have looked into Al-Anon but I'm not interested at this time. I'm not sure its approach is something I'd be able to buy into.

Learn2Live

OG, Sweetheart, I need to tell you something..... I am usually rather brutal about this kind of thing (sorry to say) but for some reason I am feeling unusually sweet lately.... go figure ....

OG, You are at the right age for a person to experience a tremendous change in her life; the turn of a decade. I read your posts and am even a bit jealous that life has given you these very gentle and kind proddings to wake you up and ready you for your thirties.

No matter what you want to call your boyfriend's behavior, no matter how you explain what he is doing, no matter what the therapist says, what your parents or friends say, or what anyone on SR says, your boyfriend is exhibiting very unhealthy behaviors and has chosen a very unhealthy life. It is not only unhealthy for him, it is unhealthy for you.

OG, your posts are full to the brim with denial. But the real beauty of that is you have choices here. You can accept this idea of denial and ask others here questions about it and how to get out of it. Or, you can keep your eyes closed and your fingers in your ears and let life bring it to you as painfully and violently as I had to learn it.

It's up to you. If you would like me to point out to you why I think you are in denial, I would be more than happy to. Just say the word.

Free108

I've also suffered from a lot of denial about my xabf's drinking and drugging. I don't think that a day goes by when I don't question whether or not he really has a problem or whether I'm just latching on to this issue to make myself feel better.
I go back to the "what I don't miss thread" regularly! But then I question myself again if I read any symptom of alcoholism that he DIDN'T have. LIke, he doesn't binge drink, he just drinks a lot every day and he never admitted to having a problem and then broke a promise to be sober. He just happily drinks every day and has a lovely time doing it. Actually since we broke up, he's happier than he's been in a long time!
And the emotional insanity that his drinking created, I blame it on my own disfunction half the time. I tell myself that I'm just hopelessly codependent and that I'm the one with the problem. Agh. Not that it's not my problem, but you know what I mean.
SR is a great place to put your head on straight now and again when you start doubting yourself and your very real feelings and concerns.
Denial is a hard thing. I'm so attached to my stories, to my old romantic vision of my life. But now that things are such a mess, I'm having my nose rubbed in my crazy thinking and it's time to change...

NewMe11109

OG - I am sorry that I will also be a bit blunt.

Please read all of the posts of people who are married and/or with children in an active alcoholic household. See the problems that they are experiencing with their active alcoholic spouse. Read about the impacts it is having on their children, their finances, their own self-esteem, their physical safety.

You can walk away from this right now - and yes, it will be painful, but you can do it.

I see all the warning signs of a progressive alcoholic. I am not saying that all alcoholics are bad (as I am one), but you should make him show you that he has coping tools to deal with his anxiety (not just that he can stop drinking for a while).

Go to Al Anon meetings and see what they say. Only you can decide. You owe it to yourself to be with someone who is healthy.