jehnifer

Good morning friends! I have done a whole lot of reflecting over the weekend and would like to tell you the story of my issue as I see it. I appreciate you guys so much and will be interested in hearing your perspectives. Thank you in advance!

I worked on my alanon 4th step with weekend which helps to see my part in the issues I am having with my husband. He doesnt drink (has 7 years) but has a lot of struggles. And I have struggles too.

My greatest defect of character is that I am overly concerned with other's happiness. For people closest to me (husband and two teenagers) I will bend over backwards to grant them what they want, and it's really hard for me to say No. I don't want them to ever feel disappointed and mad at me, so I take the easy way out a lot of the time and do what they want. This is what I need to work on in my recovery. I have actually made some progress already.

The probelm: There is this ONE THING I will NOT go along with that my husband wants. He wants me to limit how much time my daughter spends at our house and her having friends over. This may sound trivial but there is something deeper driving it. When she comes to our house, has friends over, it is a reminder to my husband that his own daugters are not with us. They live at their moms. It causes him pain and guilt. He does see his daughters every week and talks to them frequently, but they aren't at our house day to day, and this hurts him. He continues to ask me to limit my daughter being there and havign her friends over. And I wont do it. And he's not used to me saying No and it makes him very angry. My daughter and her friends are not disruptive...(if they make any noise I quickly quiet them - I am way overly anxious about my husband getting irritated. They know he doesnt like them being there so they scamper upstairs to her bedroom and shut the door. I don't really like this, I would prefer they hang out in the family room at least some, and watch tv but they get the vibe from my husband and stay clear away.

When my husband blows up at me about this issue he has said things like:
I am too weak to put limits on my daughter
I am stubborn
I am rubbing his nose in it
I tricked him into marrying me
I dragged him to live over on my side of town

The "tricking" he is referring to is that when we dated I had my kids every other week. He says he married me thinking that I would have my kids every other week and that suited him, but now that they're teenagers and more independent, its more fluid and my daughter feels more comfortable at our house and pops in, hangs out, and I am fine with it! But he's not.

I cant help the fact that it causes him pain. But the fights and his anger, anguish, etc is really getting to me.

Thank you so much for reading this long post. I wanted to explain to you all whats going on. What are your thoughts?

naive

jehnifer-

what kind of man would separate a mother and a daughter?

perhaps time that he moves back to his side of the town. if he does the "tricked" into marriage manipulation, tell him that you'd like to straighten that out and divorce him.

MissFixit

Have you talked with a family therapist about your husband and your daughter?

suki44883

How awful for your children to feel so unwanted in their mother's home. They have to "scamper upstairs" to avoid your husband. That would be absolutely and totally unacceptable to me. My thoughts? Kick the jerk to the curb and allow your children to feel at ease in their home.

LaTeeDa

These are not the kind of things a life partner/best friend says. When I realized I was putting up with behavior from my husband that I wouldn't tolerate from the checkout girl at the grocery store, I knew I was settling for a lot less that I deserved. Since I have learned to value myself, I no longer have room in my life for people who disrespect and belittle me.

L

smacked

How long are you going to allow your child pay for his past mistakes?

I honestly don't understand how you could make a home with these things going on. What he ****** up in the past, has nothing to do with making your kid pay for it now.. what a *(%&@#*.

I feel so bad for her.

Awful, in my opinion.

I hope you're done with sitting in this situation soon, if not for your own sake but maybe your kids.

Bernadette

I am way overly anxious about my husband getting irritated.

Great to hear that you are working on the steps.

I found that having a little plan to behave differently really helped (for example you say No to things when you want to instead of rolling over and saying Yes to everyone's demands) But the anxiety I still felt when I started to change my behavior was a big sign that I still had a lot of digging and self-examination left to do. Therapy helped me a lot with that.

A lot of my anxiety was because I was in the "wrong place with the wrong people!!" A huge portion of my anxiety left when I stopped allowing myself to be in relationships that were toxic, and I stopped engaging out of some sense of obligation, or "niceness" with toxic people.

Sticking to my plan, regardless of my anxiety level was key in making major changes in myself and my environment, so I hope you keep at it - baby steps will still take you places!

I, like everyone else here it seems, really cringe when you describe your H's behavior towards your Dear Daughter. These precious teenage years will go by, these will be her memories and yours as well...

peace-
b

Learn2Live

I am so glad you are doing your Step 4 work! I am so excited for you. I know it is VERY hard and can be very painful but it is so important for your health! My Step 4 work put me on a path of self-awareness that has not stopped yet (12 years). It is truly life-changing!!! Once you get thicker skin from doing it, don't forget to ask friends and family who you trust to give you their observations too.

You don't have to answer on the website, but here are some questions you can ask yourself for your Step 4 work:

Are you certain this is why he wants her to spend less time in your house? Did these words come from his mouth or did you figure this out on your own? Are you really listening for what he is saying or are you discounting him and his feelings?

I didn't see a list of practical reasons why he wants your daughter to spend less time there, like "she eats too much food," or "she's too loud" or something like that. The list you provide seems to me to be saying that he feels like you are not holding up some end of some bargain and that he feels he has been manipulated by you. Could any of those things be true?

Ask yourself the following questions. Just answer Yes or No. Then think more on each one and examine how you do these things. Write them down. Don't answer for HIS behavior or HIS feelings or HIS thoughts, answer for YOUR ownr. Make no excuses. Don't justify any of your answers by pointing your finger at him or anyone else for that matter:

1. Are any of these statements even remotely true?
2. Could there be a reason why this is how he interprets your behavior and your decisions, no matter if his interpretations are accurate?
3. Are you seeking some small revenge from everything he has put you thru in the past?
4. Is this a power play?
5. Are you trying to manipulate him?
6. Did you try to manipulate him in the past?
7. Are you just trying to get your way?
8. What do YOU want your home life to be like as relates to your daughter's in and out of the house?

It sounds to me like he's trying to communicate something to you and you are not hearing it.

You sound pretty confident that you are an enabler. If this is true, that is unhealthy behavior (regardless of what he says or does) but perhaps he is picking up on your enabling and reacting to it. When a person enables others, they do not have healthy boundaries, and they encourage unhealthy boundaries in others. Perhaps he is very frustrated and feels you are not listening to him. You may be discounting his feelings and you don't even know you are doing it.

So here's something to think about:

What do HIS FEELINGS (pain and guilt) have to do with YOUR BEHAVIOR (not setting boundaries requested by your husband)? Nothing. It doesn't matter WHY he is asking you to put parameters or boundaries around your daughter's visitation. You are pointing your finger at him, saying HE and HIS feelings are the problem (which is VERY easy to do because he has ALWAYS been the alcoholic and, therefore, the one with the problem, right?) Hmmm...

It sounds to me like what you are saying is that your daughter comes and goes from your house as she pleases. Is this appropriate for her age? You don't know when she will arrive, who she will be bringing, or when she will leave. I know that is typical of teenagers but have you ever thought that maybe he would like to KNOW when someone is coming into his home? It sounds disruptive to me personally (meaning that would be very disrupting to my life if that was the situation in my home, no matter whose daughter she is). I know it is your home and your daughter, but it is also his home, right?

Think about it this way, just a hypothetical alternative reason: Maybe an older man who is in recovery from active alcoholism cannot handle not knowing when two young girls are going to come prancing thru the house, wearing their skimpy clothes, giggling and plopping down on the sofa to watch teen shows on the television. Perhaps it would make this hypothetical man uncomfortable in some way???? Perhaps this man feels threatened by a lack of personal boundaries and space in his home.

We are all so prone to pointing our fingers at one another that we often can't see how we really feel, or why we really feel that way, or what we really want or why want it.

I too explode. I become so angry at times I cannot come out of it and I don't know what else to do but smoke cigarettes. I am not proud of my anger and outbursts. I have an anger problem that I cannot seem to shake. When I get scared, I yell and scream. And someone is always on the receiving end of it. I think it's the anxiety and panic and fear that do it but I don't really know why I react that way. Any time you see anger, it is usually either fear, or unmet needs or unmet expectations, or a combination of those. I hope he does apologize when he yells.

If one is available to you, it might help to see a marriage counselor together.

GiveLove

Jehnifer, glad you're working the steps too.

Have you ever read this:
Patterns of Codependency or Am I Codependent?

Many of the things you have written could have been directly lifted from the Compliance Patterns section of that list. I forget whether you have read "Codependent No More" or are in counseling of any kind?

Learn2Live

Oh! One more thing. When doing Step 4 work, don't forget to inventory the GOOD, positive stuff about you!!!

jehnifer

All your insights are extremely valuable.

I am not setting a good example for my kids
The extreme anxiety I feel (even after the prescription) is indicative that something's not right
"yes" I have part
"no" perhaps Im not listening to him
"yes" his anger is probably being driven by fear
"yes" on the compliance patterns of co-dependency

What now?
suggest we talk? but only if he doesnt yell
listen and aknowledge his feelings
state my feelings/my boundaries
"yes" I am weak about firmly settign boundaries with my daughter (but not letting her be at my house is going too far)
suggest marriage therapy?

I really despise myself for being the way I am.

Thanks everyone. I'm gonna try to lighten up and get through this one (with your words of encouragement and God by my side)

jehnifer

PS
I didnt trick him into marrying me nor coerce him to live on my side of town. It hurts to hear those words from him. But if that's his perception then... not much I can do about it. Maybe he has some regrets. I feel horrible about it.

Bernadette

I really despise myself for being the way I am.

But you can now choose to grow and change!
You can now create a peaceful joyful new future.
You can now choose to love yourself and treat yourself lovingly.

peace,
b

GiveLove

Hey, now, it's not good to let yourself go there.

We are all works in progress, jehnifer. If we were all born perfect and strong and decisive and with perfect judgment, then none of us would be here. We are working on ourselves and how we operate in relationships -- and you are brave enough to come here and ask for help, so give yourself some credit.

Maybe suggest counseling to work through all of these resentments and try hard to find common ground? If you can work through all of these issues in a neutral, safe setting, and he STILL will not respect your needs & wishes, then at least you'd know you tried. For me, it was the key to a better future.

Learn2Live

(Unless your life or your physical health is in danger from this man) Try to focus on your recovery more, and less on your decision about what you are going to do regarding your marriage. Thinking about having to make these decisions could be causing a lot of your anxiety. When I first got into recovery, ANY decision related to my relationship made me sick, depressed and anxious, couldn't sleep, etc. Focusing on yourself and your recovery will give you immediate results, whereas too much focus on "What am I gonna' do?" probably is not helpful.

More questions to ask yourself in response to your list:

1. How are you setting a bad example? What kind of example exactly do you want to set for your kids?
2. Your anxiety is WITHIN yourself. Where is it coming from? Look beyond HIM into yourself, look for your OWN fears.
3. Can you "get out of yourself," your wants, your feelings, your anxiety, etc enough to really listen to him? Without pointing your finger, without discounting, without ignoring the actual problem?
4. Can you acknowledge that he has some difficulty (regarding your daughter being in the house) and that the only solution he can think of is for her to not be there. When there is actually a BETTER solution to his difficulty that neither of you have thought of but that you both could work together to find and can agree to? (It sounds like you are both in your own corners, holding your own ground, both trying to be "right" and "get your way").
5. Do you think it could be a problem that you're discounting his feelings, wants, needs in your marriage?
6. It sounds like your daughter's behavior is disrupting your husband's life. Can you acknowledge that and see his viewpoint? Do you think that setting boundaries for your daughter's behavior (a compromise that you and your husband agree to) might be helpful or at least a step in the right direction?

There is a kind of marriage communication skills called Imago which is based on the book “Getting The Love You Want” by Harville Hendrix, PhD. Maybe reading this book would help. There are also marriage counselors who teach these skills.

I doubt he can control his anger at this point. Does his anger include physical abuse? If so, you should take immediate action by reaching out for help for your physical safety.

Having a marriage counselor could help because the person can help him while helping you at the same time.

jehnifer

Thank you everyone! Great things to consider. I esp like the suggestion to look inside myself to understand the anxiety...and the part about setting the best example I can for the kids.

Thanks to your alls help...Last night I did listen and acknowledge. He's a real talker/sales guy. Persuasive is the word I would use! And I am not real good verbally so didnt have much to say back to him. I did agree to some modifications. But did not wholly buy into his viewpoint nor agree to everything he wants to have happen. The issue will rear its ugly head again I am certian. But on the bright side...this is the only real disagreement we have in our relationship. Perhaps I am a pushover on most other things and accomodate him.

One thing I am definitlye gogin to work on is being more willing to search inside myself about how I feel about something and express what I want or need as opposed to going along just to have peace. I think that is partly what has gotten me in this trap. He is not accustomed to me not agreeing with him and doing as he wishes!

sandrawg

Please please don't say that.

Self-hatred or low self-esteem is part of the reason so many of us get into these types of relationships.

You're human, just plodding along as best you can, and you bring your issues, unique experiences, socialization, fears, and many other factors that are completely subconscious into your communication with others. We all do it.

You can just move forward and learn from it. But please don't beat yourself up! **{hugs}}

sandrawg

This sounds to me like one of those things said hastily, in anger. Maybe you can ask him, do you honestly feel that way? Cuz if so, maybe we need to reconsider this marriage. Or, was it something you said in anger that maybe you regret.

sandrawg

Did you read the section on the forum on boundaries? People tend to respect you more when you have boundaries and enforce them

Glad everything worked out well.