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I have so many questions...

Old 06-24-2009, 12:17 AM
  # 21 (permalink)  
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Hi Scarlet,
I am so sorry for you, that you didn;t get the closure you needed before he passed.
You know, nobody really knows what is in a person's heart & mind......especially an A's.
He may very well have felt more blame & apologetic attitude than you will ever know. Men in general, and moreso A's, have a hard time expressing their feelings. Perhaps he felt it deeply, but also for whatever weird reason felt it would be "unmanly" to admit to you. You know, guys have such strange egos (sorry any guys reading!).
I hope you can find the peace you need to come to grips with this. I'm sure he loved you very much, and sometimes the most powerful words are not actually SPOKEN.

Hugz
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Old 06-24-2009, 07:31 AM
  # 22 (permalink)  
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I can really relate to many of the sentiments expressed in this thread. My AGF is in treatment. I have found myself wondering, "When is she going to stop blaming everyone else and understand the damage she caused?" and "When is she going to say she is sorry?"

I recognize that I need to work on myself and I have my own amends to make, but I can't help but feel like if you were to put the amount of damage caused by me and the amount of damage caused by her on a scale, it would tip to her side very heavily.

On an intellectual level, I understand that this is my own stinkin thinkin. And, based on my religion and spirituality, it is wrong. Matthew 7:3 states, "Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?"

But wow, the feelings are strong.
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Old 06-24-2009, 10:08 AM
  # 23 (permalink)  
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Thank you all for this thread...

I think it is very human to expect an apology. Especially when it is so DAMN OBVIOUS the other person has hurt you greatly. And repeatedly. Somehow it seems like an insult to never hear an apology...

But then only people that have self awareness and love themselves enough to perform a personal inventory, can ask for an apology.

I believe when I ask for an apology it is not for the other person, it is just to close one of my circles and provide peace TO MYSELF.

So, again if someone does not ask me for an apology, it is not because of ME, it is because they are not in an emotional place yet to be able to look back to the past with honesty, acknowledge their role and release it in peace... or maybe they did, and thought I had every reason not to want to hear from them again and preferred not to bother me...?

Thanks to Ago I realized I could make up anything about what xabf really thought about me, what he feels/felt but I will never know. I prefer to think I will just never know his part, and its OK. That comforts me more than thinking he still blames me, etc. etc. all theories are equally possible so please do not torture yourself with these "theories" that he never felt remorse, this just hurts you.

Yesterday I was thinking what I would do if exAbf ever asked forgiveness. I realized the only one who can forgive him is God/HP. I am not God. I cannot "forgive" anyone. I can just forgive myself.

I hope its allowed to put this link
Closure Redux Getting Past Your Past

Hope it helps. All the best!
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Old 06-24-2009, 10:21 AM
  # 24 (permalink)  
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Another good one
Finishing Unfinished Business Getting Past Your Past
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Old 06-24-2009, 11:15 AM
  # 25 (permalink)  
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OR:

to everyone reading this thread, along the lines of "speck in their eye log in yers etc"

Who here has made a complete and total amends to every single person you have ever harmed, inadvertently or on purpose?

For every single spiteful and hurtful thing you have ever said, or do you justify it with, well they deserved it because ________

We all do the best we can with what we have, as we go through life as we learn better we do better.

I have seen a number of people I know in my life get sober, and done the same thing, waited around for amends that never came.

Turns out it was far more important to me then it was to them.

I am DEAD certain I have missed some amends, but I plug away, when people appear if I remember them I will make an amends, and quite often even ask, "Hey, is there anything I owe you an amends about?"

But I'm dead certain, somebody somewhere is angry at me and thinking I am doing my program wrong because I didn't give them an amends to their satisfaction.

/shrug

Like Anvil, a few amends I have made was simply the decision to avoid these people as no matter what I did or said it would just harm both of us.

However, if anyone in the world came to me with unhealed pain and asked for help in removing it, ie, I was really really hurt by XYZ I'd totally give them an amends.

I tell you as a practicing alcoholic that is pretty thorough, the amends I give outnumber the amends I receive by about 99%

It does get frustrating
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Old 06-24-2009, 12:56 PM
  # 26 (permalink)  
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Hi this is just my humble opinion.

This is a very interesting topic as I am working on doing some amends... of course to ppl that I am pretty sure won't be harming with me stating "I acknowledge I hurt you deeply and I was an idiot. Certainly I would do things differently if I came to the same situation now. I know this is too little, too late. I hope the very best for your future and offer you my sincerest apology for hurting your feelings".

Of course there are other situations like anvilhead's where it would harm more than heal and the way to go is to keep out from someone's life. And I am keeping out from ppl's life in that way too and the circle is closed with them.

Recently I apologized to another ex, a few months later he told me "hey I am sorry too, if I made you pass bad times too.. I am not planning to keep being a jerk all my life". When I remember him I remember the good stuff and feel grateful, bad things from him and me are forgotten. (That's refreshing!) And no I was not expecting him at all to do that, I had already reached that acceptance point. It was nice for him to be in the same "wavelength" though

I agree there are errors, mistakes, hurts, and the majority of them are "little" or you forget about them or can easily say "he or she did not know otherwise... no problem".

In the case of an AH my frustration comes because it was so obvious what he did, and it was not like "ok you are out of my life, good luck" and you never see them again and don't know how they are doing but guess they are moving on.

Here he saw me crying as a direct result of his verbal abuse, paraded new enabler, talked about her infront of me, looked my zombie eyes, I mean even the cleaning lady and strangers were worried! IT was all real and no I did not do that for sympathy, I was having a really bad time... so I guess I just cannot put myself in his shoes and see someone feeling that bad and laughing it off and doing nothing.

I guess with other ppl I always have a way of seeing their view, understanding their own hurts, stage in life, whatever but when you are so hurt, angry, sad. etc and the other one is skating... I mean... this other ex that apologized did some stuff but I did not really need an apology.. yet he did.. and then when another person hurts me much much worse he does nothing? Its totally frustrating!! It infuriates me. I think its only natural to be even more hurt when a fairly standard acknowledgment of your feelings is shrugged off..

On the other hand I agree this "closure of open circles" is reachable through inner work as the Getting past your past webpage articles say... I no longer wait for any apology or anything else to happen outside to move on with my life and create beauty, etc... those are also expectations..

My conclusion after these ramblings is that those anger and hurt feelings are OK as long as you are on the mourning process but when years and decades pass and its still something that prevents you from living your life .. its a warning sign there is unfinished inner work.

Thanks for letting me vent, this is the emotional place where I am at now... and I agree its a great feeling when you have no expectations at all! no way to be dissapointed from now on. I had it backwards and trusted everyone, even drug addicts, alcoholics, losers etc etc. after almost 30 years I can tell you it does not work LOL

Let's see how I do the next 30... so far.. it looks MUCH better...

Now can you direct me to the closest punching bag? I am very angry today
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