I told him. Please help me stay strong.
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I told him. Please help me stay strong.
I told AH this evening that we need a clear and defined separation. This probably means a physical separation. We are currently living as roommates w/ fuzzy boundaries. It has not been working.
I'm not feeling so great.
There was lots of finger pointing. He says:
"You have erected a wall"
"You have never supported me"
"I saw this coming a long time ago"
"I can't believe you wanted to bring kids into this relationship"
I didn't say much. What can I say to statements like these?
I tried to explain that I don't see how we stand a chance if we don't do our own work/recovery.
He just kept saying that I will not "let him in".
I tried to stay grounded, and voice my reality. I didn't react, or blame, or finger point.
I simply stated that, right now, I can only work on my own recovery.
I got lots of scowls.
We agreed on one thing, neither one of us is happy.
This hurts so bad
I'm not feeling so great.
There was lots of finger pointing. He says:
"You have erected a wall"
"You have never supported me"
"I saw this coming a long time ago"
"I can't believe you wanted to bring kids into this relationship"
I didn't say much. What can I say to statements like these?
I tried to explain that I don't see how we stand a chance if we don't do our own work/recovery.
He just kept saying that I will not "let him in".
I tried to stay grounded, and voice my reality. I didn't react, or blame, or finger point.
I simply stated that, right now, I can only work on my own recovery.
I got lots of scowls.
We agreed on one thing, neither one of us is happy.
This hurts so bad
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I'm so sorry, Robinsfly. You'll get more responses here tomorrow.
Be prepared for his addict behaviors to ramp into high gear. When we draw a line, the addiction is threatened and it increases its hold on the addict, to try to take back control of US. When we say no, all hell breaks loose. That is because to progress, the addiction needs everyone to cooperate and to NOT change the status quo.
Your behavior threatens your partner's denial that he is not falling apart. If things remain status quo, he can convince himself that he is succeeding and it is YOU that is the problem. This can really mess up your mind. And rob you of all resolve because you doubt everything you think and do.
It is quite simple: drinking and drugging is a deal breaker in a relationship. All the other "issues" are moot.
Stay strong. Stay safe. If you cave, you step back on the roller coaster.
Be prepared for his addict behaviors to ramp into high gear. When we draw a line, the addiction is threatened and it increases its hold on the addict, to try to take back control of US. When we say no, all hell breaks loose. That is because to progress, the addiction needs everyone to cooperate and to NOT change the status quo.
Your behavior threatens your partner's denial that he is not falling apart. If things remain status quo, he can convince himself that he is succeeding and it is YOU that is the problem. This can really mess up your mind. And rob you of all resolve because you doubt everything you think and do.
It is quite simple: drinking and drugging is a deal breaker in a relationship. All the other "issues" are moot.
Stay strong. Stay safe. If you cave, you step back on the roller coaster.
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Originally Posted by bluejay6 
Be prepared for his addict behaviors to ramp into high gear. When we draw a line, the addiction is threatened and it increases its hold on the addict, to try to take back control of US. When we say no, all hell breaks loose. That is because to progress, the addiction needs everyone to cooperate and to NOT change the status quo.
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At this point I don't think it is as much about what is "going on" today as much as it is what has already happened in the past
That may very well be true from his point of view, can you be OK with that?
It sounded like from what you wrote on TC's thread I think it was, by the time he had his last drunk you were already "done", and when he went on that drunk the switch flipped, the "I have had enough and I can't do this anymore" switch. That's OK, you are allowed to have that switch. You are allowed to care for yourself.
Then he decided to quit drinking to "save" the relationship and you stayed to see if anything had or would change. Like your feelings for him.
Apparently it was too little, too late.
You gave it a chance, you tried. It seems to me you waited to see if your feelings for him had changed.
You are not a failure, the marriage isn't a "failed" one if it produced beautiful children for you two.
"Hurt people hurt people" and he is going to be hurt right now, so is going to try to hurt you.
Can you be OK with that? Can you take care of yourself around that? knowing he is going to lash out and try and blame you and hurt you? That that's what hurt people do when relationships end?
It's OK to take care of yourself, to follow your own heart.
Anyhow, I'm trying to ask if you can take care of yourself but doing a poor job. Hang in there, it will all work out.
He just kept saying that I will not "let him in".
It sounded like from what you wrote on TC's thread I think it was, by the time he had his last drunk you were already "done", and when he went on that drunk the switch flipped, the "I have had enough and I can't do this anymore" switch. That's OK, you are allowed to have that switch. You are allowed to care for yourself.
Then he decided to quit drinking to "save" the relationship and you stayed to see if anything had or would change. Like your feelings for him.
Apparently it was too little, too late.
You gave it a chance, you tried. It seems to me you waited to see if your feelings for him had changed.
You are not a failure, the marriage isn't a "failed" one if it produced beautiful children for you two.
"Hurt people hurt people" and he is going to be hurt right now, so is going to try to hurt you.
Can you be OK with that? Can you take care of yourself around that? knowing he is going to lash out and try and blame you and hurt you? That that's what hurt people do when relationships end?
It's OK to take care of yourself, to follow your own heart.
Anyhow, I'm trying to ask if you can take care of yourself but doing a poor job. Hang in there, it will all work out.
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Originally Posted by RobinsFly
I tried to stay grounded, and voice my reality. I didn't react, or blame, or finger point.
I simply stated that, right now, I can only work on my own recovery.
I got lots of scowls.
We agreed on one thing, neither one of us is happy.
When it became clear that my marriage wasn't going to make it, I moved almost immediately from the dream of a loving, mutually beneficial marriage to the dream of a loving, mutually beneficial separation/divorce. I had this vision of us being open and communicative - of him appreciating my candor and rigorous self-examination. I was hurt and disappointed (over and over again) when he responded to my practical, recovery-minded responses with accusations and anger.
Today I think the truth is: it sucks to hear that your spouse wants out. Pretty much period. That news takes some getting used to. ANY big change will require a period of acclimation, and it's not surprising that his defense mechanism of choice is finger-pointing. I use that one sometimes, too when I'm really hurting and desperate.
My advice is to breathe deep, resting in the confidence that you are doing what is in your best interest. Tune him out as best you can (I've had to limit "conversations" to email exchanges, walk out of rooms, say "I will not discuss this with you right now", etc...), and give him some time to process the changes that are occurring. Keep walking in the direction that you want to go, and let go of the dream that he will follow your lead or adhere to your time frame. He has his own time frame, and that's OK.
It is 100% OK to do what is best for you. Anyone who says otherwise only wants you to do what is best for them.
Big hugs and lots of courage headed out to you!
-TC
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I am going to change my name to Broken Record. Two books, Emotional Blackmail and The Verbally Abusive Relationship, How to Recognize it and How to Respond.
The first book talks about the FOG they throw out there when they don't get their way. FOG is blinding, but it stands for Fear Obligation and Guilt....also blinding. His statements hit the F the O and the G, all three. The second book says there are two kinds of people the "Power Over" people and the "Power from Within People" Unfortunately, they usually hook up. He will try to get Power Over for the rest of his life unless he truly embraces the steps....but it doesn't sound like he has.
I echo what others have said, but I add that you better get strong because it's going to get worse. When you have the house and the majority of the time with the kids, and they are alone to use or dry drunk, you MAY just actually become the Enemy....I have. And I don't even argue or disagree with him, usually communicate in one line emails void of emotion, and my estranged R?AH is still launching missiles. Hiding or taking money, messing up prearranged schedules, maligning me to the extended family.....anything to try to get back his power. Guess he still hasn't accepted that he is powerless. And you could ask the same thing about your recovering husband.
But, and WHILE I am not one to play games, you may want to calm the waters a bit. Consider saying "Right now I know what I feel, and I feel that for X number of years I have been married to you, and I need a break. I don't know how I will feel in 90 days, 6 months, or a year (that is usually true, even psychics don't usually receive info on self). But I know if you force me to decide now, I would choose divorce. Let's see how our relationship gets on separated, and we can revisit it every so often."
Then, put everything in LEGAL form. Don't assume like me that he will meet his agreements. Don't assume that he will follow the rules. Don't assume that he won't try to change child time, monetary agreements, etc. So if it is all in legal form, you stand a better chance. Do it now when things are calmer than they will be once his pity party ramps up.
Hugs
The first book talks about the FOG they throw out there when they don't get their way. FOG is blinding, but it stands for Fear Obligation and Guilt....also blinding. His statements hit the F the O and the G, all three. The second book says there are two kinds of people the "Power Over" people and the "Power from Within People" Unfortunately, they usually hook up. He will try to get Power Over for the rest of his life unless he truly embraces the steps....but it doesn't sound like he has.
I echo what others have said, but I add that you better get strong because it's going to get worse. When you have the house and the majority of the time with the kids, and they are alone to use or dry drunk, you MAY just actually become the Enemy....I have. And I don't even argue or disagree with him, usually communicate in one line emails void of emotion, and my estranged R?AH is still launching missiles. Hiding or taking money, messing up prearranged schedules, maligning me to the extended family.....anything to try to get back his power. Guess he still hasn't accepted that he is powerless. And you could ask the same thing about your recovering husband.
But, and WHILE I am not one to play games, you may want to calm the waters a bit. Consider saying "Right now I know what I feel, and I feel that for X number of years I have been married to you, and I need a break. I don't know how I will feel in 90 days, 6 months, or a year (that is usually true, even psychics don't usually receive info on self). But I know if you force me to decide now, I would choose divorce. Let's see how our relationship gets on separated, and we can revisit it every so often."
Then, put everything in LEGAL form. Don't assume like me that he will meet his agreements. Don't assume that he will follow the rules. Don't assume that he won't try to change child time, monetary agreements, etc. So if it is all in legal form, you stand a better chance. Do it now when things are calmer than they will be once his pity party ramps up.
Hugs
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Originally Posted by bluejay6
That is because to progress, the addiction needs everyone to cooperate and to NOT change the status quo.
Your behavior threatens your partner's denial that he is not falling apart. If things remain status quo, he can convince himself that he is succeeding and it is YOU that is the problem. If you cave, you step back on the roller coaster.
Your behavior threatens your partner's denial that he is not falling apart. If things remain status quo, he can convince himself that he is succeeding and it is YOU that is the problem. If you cave, you step back on the roller coaster.
Denial. Bingo.
I actually had to point out how miserable we BOTH are. Then, of course, he went on a rampage about how much he has supported me, blah blah...
He has convinced himself. Hey, look, he's sober!
I did cave, last July. As Ago said, I thought my feelings would change. Or, I hoped they would. They didn't.
Unless he can recognize and stop the enmeshment, we will not last.
Originally Posted by ToughChoices
I had this vision of us being open and communicative - of him appreciating my candor and rigorous self-examination. I was hurt and disappointed (over and over again) when he responded to my practical, recovery-minded responses with accusations and anger.
He has his own time frame, and that's OK.
He has his own time frame, and that's OK.
I have been avoiding the blame game. I grew up with this -- a father who blamed me for everything under the sun. gag.
He tried to hook me in so many times last night. And so many times I started to talk, and then shut up.
I am the enemy in his eyes.
Originally Posted by FunnyOne
I am going to change my name to Broken Record. Two books, Emotional Blackmail and The Verbally Abusive Relationship, How to Recognize it and How to Respond.
The first book talks about the FOG they throw out there when they don't get their way. FOG is blinding, but it stands for Fear Obligation and Guilt....also blinding. His statements hit the F the O and the G, all three. The second book says there are two kinds of people the "Power Over" people and the "Power from Within People" Unfortunately, they usually hook up. He will try to get Power Over for the rest of his life unless he truly embraces the steps....but it doesn't sound like he has.
The first book talks about the FOG they throw out there when they don't get their way. FOG is blinding, but it stands for Fear Obligation and Guilt....also blinding. His statements hit the F the O and the G, all three. The second book says there are two kinds of people the "Power Over" people and the "Power from Within People" Unfortunately, they usually hook up. He will try to get Power Over for the rest of his life unless he truly embraces the steps....but it doesn't sound like he has.
I'll see if the library has it today. Broken record. funny...
Oh, I'm totally a covering Power Over type person. And, I'd like to get beyond this. I wish AH would recognize and get beyond this....but, like TC said, he has his own time frame.
Think I need to look into legal options, again. So much to do...
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Originally Posted by Ago
It sounded like from what you wrote on TC's thread I think it was, by the time he had his last drunk you were already "done", and when he went on that drunk the switch flipped, the "I have had enough and I can't do this anymore" switch. That's OK, you are allowed to have that switch. You are allowed to care for yourself.
Then he decided to quit drinking to "save" the relationship and you stayed to see if anything had or would change. Like your feelings for him.
Funny thing is, AH knew it. But our unhealthy ways continued. I was miserable w/ his addiction and dependency, and he was miserable because I pulled away...
Yes, yes, and yes. I stayed to see if my feelings would change. I thought, 'let's see what this whole thing looks like w/ him sober'. But, after learning more about addictive behaviors, I realized that all the underlying stuff is still there. Addiction is addiction, and it can take many forms.
Andrew, sounds like you really know where I'm coming from. Thanks for your thoughts.
I'm not sure where I'm going to pull this strength from. There's a lot of grieving involved.
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Originally Posted by FunnyOne
But, and WHILE I am not one to play games, you may want to calm the waters a bit. Consider saying "Right now I know what I feel, and I feel that for X number of years I have been married to you, and I need a break. I don't know how I will feel in 90 days, 6 months, or a year (that is usually true, even psychics don't usually receive info on self). But I know if you force me to decide now, I would choose divorce. Let's see how our relationship gets on separated, and we can revisit it every so often."
My counselor keeps telling me that I still don't know what's going to happen. Suppose I have to let go of trying to predict and control the future.
Damn, and that was my MO!
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Originally Posted by anvilhead
were ya very good at it? that future predicting thing? the next Sylvia Brown? LOL try as we might, we can't breathe TOMORROW'S air, or walk in next week's sunshine.....all we got is today kiddo.......
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Hello RobinsFly,
I wish I had wise words, but I don't. Anyway I wanted to tell you I wish you well: good for you for recognizing when something is not good for you, and acting. Most people stay because of religious ideas, because of fear, hopes "he" will change, and lose their lives that way.
I am certain better things are to come for you, not because I am wishing for them but because you are determined in choosing the very best and are taking actions towards your own healing and happiness.
Good vibes~~!!
I wish I had wise words, but I don't. Anyway I wanted to tell you I wish you well: good for you for recognizing when something is not good for you, and acting. Most people stay because of religious ideas, because of fear, hopes "he" will change, and lose their lives that way.
I am certain better things are to come for you, not because I am wishing for them but because you are determined in choosing the very best and are taking actions towards your own healing and happiness.
Good vibes~~!!
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Originally Posted by anvilhead
any chance that skill works with WINNING LOTTO NUMBERS? cuz THAT would be cool!!!
Originally Posted by TakingCharge999
Hello RobinsFly,
I am certain better things are to come for you, not because I am wishing for them but because you are determined in choosing the very best and are taking actions towards your own healing and happiness.
I am certain better things are to come for you, not because I am wishing for them but because you are determined in choosing the very best and are taking actions towards your own healing and happiness.
Thank you
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The best thing I think I heard when I was heading for/going through a break up was:
"she would be perfect if she was just...........someone else"
The thing is, I have never seen a break up where both partners weren't saying that. It sounds as if you were saying "if only he would just....." and he was saying "If only she would just....."
The best thing I could do was stop trying to be someone I wasn't, and stop trying to make "them" into who I wanted them to be, and blaming her because she wasn't able to be what I wanted.
When I turned it around to be "I am leaving for me" rather then "I am leaving because of you" mental health, peace and tranquility returned a bit faster for me.
"To Thine Own Self Be True" then it follows like night follows day etc etc
Hang in there, it gets better
"she would be perfect if she was just...........someone else"
The thing is, I have never seen a break up where both partners weren't saying that. It sounds as if you were saying "if only he would just....." and he was saying "If only she would just....."
The best thing I could do was stop trying to be someone I wasn't, and stop trying to make "them" into who I wanted them to be, and blaming her because she wasn't able to be what I wanted.
When I turned it around to be "I am leaving for me" rather then "I am leaving because of you" mental health, peace and tranquility returned a bit faster for me.
"To Thine Own Self Be True" then it follows like night follows day etc etc
Hang in there, it gets better
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Originally Posted by Ago
When I turned it around to be "I am leaving for me" rather then "I am leaving because of you" mental health, peace and tranquility returned a bit faster for me.
"To Thine Own Self Be True" then it follows like night follows day etc etc
"To Thine Own Self Be True" then it follows like night follows day etc etc
PEACE!!!
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