courtney1111

Have you ever noticed on the forums that there is over 5,000 threads on the Alcoholics board but on the "Friends and Family of alcoholics there are over 16,000. Isn't that amazing how many people are affected by the alcoholic however it doesn't seem that many alcoholics are getting help. It really is sad!!

It makes realize even more that the chances are slim for my husband to stop drinking. Not positive thinking I know but I guess I 'm trying to live in the "real world" now. My mind gets clearer and clearer everyday he's gone.

Courtney

Barbara52

That is a rather large disparity ain't it?

I suspect that one of the reasons for it is that the majority of us in the F&F board are women and women in general tend to be more verbal and more willing to talk out their problems.

LaTeeDa

Not only have I noticed the disparity in volume, I have noticed a marked difference in content. If you read some posts on the A forum, you will find that the vast majority of them are about their recovery. Hardly any about SO's or family members. Yet, the vast majority on this forum are about them. And I think that is the saddest part of all.

L

GiveLove

That was my experience too....

TryingSoHard

As a recovering A, I feel compelled to offer my input here. I hope no one minds.

The recovery boards are separated by major topic area, so I post in SEVERAL different places. I pretty much stuck to the Newcomers to Recovery forum for the first month or two, then I started looking at the Alcoholism forum. The Newcomers forum definitely gets the most traffic (as evidenced by the over 15,000 threads), and when you're looking for the most responses in the shortest amount of time, that's the place to go.

I try to stay *generally* on topic so if I want to ask a question or discuss an issue related to my spouse, I go to the Relationships and Parenting in Recovery forum. I also frequent the Newcomer's Daily Support forum and the Secular forum. There are also the 12-Step Forums, which I haven't mentioned because I don't go there, but I think they are quite popular as well.

So, in my opinion, the Alcoholism forum by itself does not accurately reflect the activity of the alcoholics looking for help on this site. So, F&F is all lumped into this one forum but the A's have several different areas to utilize.

And also, just for the record, in no way am I implying that F&F members can't or shouldn't utilize those other areas!! When I posted a major thread in the Relationships forum I was secretly hoping some F&F would read it and give their opinions. I even considered posting it here as well but didn't want to intrude.

Best,
TSH

Bernadette

It goes to show you that ONE alcoholic can have a severely negative impact on MANY lives.

For example - in my family my father's alcoholism impacted all 3 of us normie women (my mom and my sister and I) and set a great example for my 3 A brothers to follow in Dad's footsteps!! So right there 1:6 ratio. My mom's raging codependence also damaged all 5 of us kids.

It's really really HARD and SUCKS to grow up in an alcoholic family. I am grateful for every minute I've spent working on my own recovery from alcoholism's devestating family effects...but when I was LIVING it as a kid with no tools, no one talking about the very real elephant in the living room, and all the shame, secrecy, lies, passive aggression, and rage that co-exist within 5 feet of an alcoholic and a codependent.....YUK!!!

It's no wonder so many more people need recovery from codependency!
peace,
b

LaTeeDa

Just to clarify--I was not suggesting that it is in any way bad that the A' forum is all about the A's recovery. Quite the opposite. I was suggesting that F&F would be better served concentrating on our own recovery, not flogging the A's behaviors/actions.

L

Freedom1990

I'm glad you clarified that! You really threw me for a loop!

ICant

I'm new to the steps and the recovery process (3 months) but I have already seen great improvement in my attitude, relationships with everyone and life in general. I agree with LaTeeDa about the importance of our own recovery. We can be so scathing of the alcoholic who thinks the problems will magically disappear when the bottle is put down. But our own codependent problems will not magically disappear either, when we get rid of the alcoholic in our lives.

Ago

Thank You for the observation, there definitely seems to be an ebb and flow, one day there is incredible recovery here along with helpful posts with insightful observations that seem to "grow" and "morph" as we peel layers of the onion off together, I mean true recovery, and the next day just pages and pages of he said, she said bandwagon bashing threads about "that stupid SOB look at what he did now!!! along with 20 replies all pointing new and exciting ways the guy is a moron and no one talking recovery, just finger pointing and bashing.

I'm not saying it's not deserved, but it doesn't have anything to do with recovery either.

I have to say the A's forum has it's idiosyncrasies however, about 50% of the threads there are arguing about what Bill W meant by placing "But" instead of "and" in the third paragraph on page 132. This gets tedious as well.

I'd say though that as many AA threads (proportionally) are about making amends to SO's and family members and learning to be respectable, responsible husbands/wives/members of Society as F&F threads are about the OP or the respondents taking personal responsibility for their selves, their own choices, and their own happiness and destiny and taking responsibility for their own recovery.

It is an interesting dichotomy.

MissFixit

Hi,

Not to beat a dead horse, but I think the nature of being an A is focusing on yourself whereas the nature of being co-dependant is focsuing on another person. Using that premise it seems logical that FandF would talk about others, while A's would talk about themselves.

I don't think that is a criticism at all. When "we" slip, we dwell on what "they" did. When A's slip, they drink again. Both sections write here, which IMHO is seeking recovery. Just to put your thoughts out there no matter what side of the fence you are on.

I am new and until I came here NO ONE around me could share my experience. I vented and continue to vent here. I also gain a LOT of knowledge from others' situations and advice. I feel less alone in this type of messy life experience, but that is probably becasue I am newer. I don't talk with many others who have never gone through such things. I find it helpful to bounce ideas and situations off others' who have experienced the rollercoaster.

sb0804

It sure is amazing isnt it? The truly sad part of it is that I dont think they chose to see it or cant see it themselves.

guiab

It might be worth pointing out that there are about 2 million AA members worldwide and about 600,000 alanon members. The disparity in threads may reflect a preference for face-to-face meeting for alcoholics/addicts. I don't think it means there is a difference in internet access, but I could be wrong.
There are definitely more AA meetings on any given night, at least in my area, than alanon meetings.
And damn few ACOA meetings!

LaTeeDa

It could also reflect the preference of law enforcement and courts to mandate AA for DUI and other alcohol offenses...................

L

Ago

I don't know.....it seems there are roughly less then 1% of the people I see in meetings are there for a "court card", that number varies, there was a meeting I attended in a tiny isolated town that was 50%, but over the years I'd say that number is well under 1% in the meetings I have been attending. I have had a few years of commitments as the "court card signer" and as secretary in smaller meetings where I have had to sign court cards, so I feel pretty comfortable stating this as fact.

I did speak recently at an NA meeting and out of 75 people there, perhaps 50 were court ordered, the secretary and I were signing cards like madmen....I actually had to sign the secretary's "court card"

In that isolated area there were roughly 20 AA meetings in a one hour radius, and three Alanon meetings.

I counted 70 Alanon meetings in San Francisco and Marin in the schedule

There is just simply more meetings and resources for AA, that may have something to do with it as well, I read here frequently that people have one meeting they can attend once a week, and that's just not the case with AA (in my experience, borne out by the numbers/ratio)

LaTeeDa

Well, obviously, my opinion reflects my situation. I live in a rural area, and I work for the county courts. Every day of every week, in this county, at least a dozen people are mandated AA, so like I said, that's just my experience. (And, I've never seen one Alanon court-mandated. )

L

guiab

In a geeky urge to do something numeric I put all the numbers for posts and threads into a spreadsheet and made some charts.
Disclaimer: This information, based on all posts as of today, as of 1pm-ish, reflects only registered members posting, and does not reflect how many non-members and members who are reading the posts and getting very useful help without responding, or who may be reluctant to register.



The total numbers are 81,328 threads and 1,256,461 posts.
I'd venture an opinion that TSH had it right in suggesting F&F posters may tend to stick around F&F, but FWIW that is just an anecdotal observation. And there are a few individuals who seem to be everywhere at once! (When do you, like, eat?!)

freya

Personally, I attribute this discrepancy to the fact that it is in many ways much easier for those affected by the addictions of others to deny that they themselves have a problem (and/or that we all have issues of woundedness that need to be addressed)....and, therefore, not to realize how much a 12 Step program really has to offer them.

An Al Anon friend of mine who has been in program for over 25 years told me once when we were discussing this very issue: "It is the gift of the alcoholic that his disease puts it right in his face that he must rely on God or die." For us, it's a lot easier to ignore our recovery/healing issues because, in most cases, they are not as obviously and as literally life threatening -- at least not literally physically life threatening.....emotionally and spiritually, of course, is another matter.....but, just in general, our culture does pretty much everything in its power to discourage people from recognizing and addressing their emotional and spiritual needs.

I usually attend at least 2 AA and 2 Al Anon meeting per week, and one of things that draws me to the AA meetings is the explicit sense of "urgency" (as in "vital importance," not "hurried-ness") I find there. I mean, I love the "How It Works" reading because of the way it reiterates over and over again that recovery is a "do or die," "all or nothing" proposition...and that's the way I experience my own recovery and work my own program....But, in all honesty, I don't find that attitude a lot in Al Anon people. In fact, over the last year or so, I have realized very consciously that, for me, the people that I want to and am choosing to be around in recovery and that I am willing to sponsor are the people who understand and feel that sense of urgency -- without that nothing's happening and people don't really work and stick with the program because they never really "get" the fact that the 12 Step life has just as much to offer them as it has to offer anyone else.

freya

ARealLady

If you read some posts on the A forum, you will find that the vast majority of them are about their recovery. Hardly any about SO's or family members.

I noticed this too when I first began reading these boards. My conclusion was that the focus for the recovering A has to be on the A in the early stages and is, if I recall, thinking of the 12 steps of the program.

If the A has to hit bottom before deciding on his/her own to cease drinking then the A is doing it initially for self and only for self.

That might also explain why M. Beattie tells us not to attempt to get into a relationship with an A who hasn't been sober and working the program for at least a year.

JMO

ARL