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Haddock 11-24-2008 01:13 PM

Looking for advice - my wife is an alcoholic
 
Looking for advice, although I know there is no magic solution.

My wife has a drinking problem. I really want her to recogise the problem and I really want to help, but she is in complete denial about it. She drinks most evenings but every so often, usually at the weekend, it becomes a binge. She seems to reach a certain point of no return, at which point she just starts glugging bottle after bottle.

At these times, she undergoes complete personality changes.
Person 1 is the beautiful, intellegent, fantastic mother to our 2 children - the person I love. After a few drinks she turns into Person 2 - slurred speech, euphoric, loud, life and soul of the party. After more drinks and at the end of the night, she becomes person 3 - very depressed, sobbing, very (verbally) abusive to me. Recently, its taken a turn for the worse and she has started self abusing when in this state, by cutting her arms with a razor. Its nothing serious - only small scratches, but its very scary.

Eventually, I manage to get her to go to sleep.
In the morning she will wake up, no hangover and act as if absolutely nothing has happened. She's back to the person I know and love. If I try to raise the subject with her, or suggest that she doesn't start drinking the following day, I just get the silent treatment - she will not accept there's any sort of problem. Consequently, I just don't mention it and carry on as normal.

Our 2 beautiful daughters dont really know there's anything wrong - most of the 'bad stuff' happens late at night when they're in bed.

The trouble is, I know that its only going to get worse and sooner or later, one way or another, I'm worried that we'll end up with a trip to the hospital.

Some evenings (maybe 1 a week) she doesn't drink at all. Maybe this reinforces her belief that everythings under control. How do I get her to recognise her problem and allow me to help?

Any advice appreciated.

loner1968 11-24-2008 01:23 PM

Your right, there is no magic solution. I bet she does know she has a problem and keeps drinking to push it away. I am sorry to tell you that It will only get worse.
As far as the kids not knowing...kids know more than we give them credit for. I know this because I was one of those kids who was supposedly oblivious to my parent's constant battles which kept me up all night, every night for my entire childhood and teenage years.
And her cutting herself....it IS a big deal. There are some serious issues here and I am not skilled in the area of being married or having kids around so you will have to wait til some more members come on with better advice.
Hang in there, there are many people here who have great advice. It may not be what you want to hear but I promise you it will be what you NEED to hear.
Sending you strength.

ToughChoices 11-24-2008 01:24 PM


Originally Posted by Haddock (Post 1997473)
My wife has a drinking problem. I really want her to recogise the problem and I really want to help, but she is in complete denial about it. ....

How do I get her to recognise her problem and allow me to help?

My husband and I had a similar dynamic (he is an alcoholic - I am a recovering codependent).

It seemed incredible to me that he didn't recognize his drinking as unhealthy.
I spent a lot of energy trying to convince him how harmful that amount of alcohol was to his body - his psyche - our family.

I gave him literature on alcoholism and medical options for treatment.
I wrote him poetry about how much I loved him and how willing I was to support him during his struggle.
I cried and pleaded and begged him not to follow his father's path into addiction - for the sake of our son.

Nothing worked.
All of my reasons for him to quit fell on deaf ears. Not because he's a bad and heartless man, but because he is a man who is compelled to drink alcoholically. His brain demands the drug and twists its reasoning around to accommodate that demand. Trying to explain reality to someone in that state is definitely a losing proposition.

It's heartbreaking to experience the alcoholic's denial.
But I found that I was in denial, as well.
I told myself that he wanted to get better. I believed that he wanted to get better, even though there was ample evidence to the contrary.

My husband would occasionally, after a particularly hard night of drinking, tell me that he wanted to quit. He'd say it - he even went to treatment - but he wouldn't actually stop drinking. He wasn't ready.

I had to get out the way. Step out of his business and take over my own. I had enmeshed myself in his struggle to the point that I felt physically ill when he drank. It crushed me.

But I came here. I realized and began to fully accept that it is not my fault that he drinks. I started trying to live my life without relying on his ability to stay sober. That meant rearranging our financial and housing situations, our childcare arrangements, and my general ideas about the emotional support I could expect from my partner.

He still drinks. Today I can honestly say that I have peace and happiness. I will always pray for his recovery, but I no longer depend on it.

Alcoholism is a hard pill to swallow.
I'm glad that you're here, Haddock.

I wish I had a magic answer for you.
Keep posting.
-TC

Barbara52 11-24-2008 02:07 PM

Welcome. I suggest educating yourself on alcoholism, perhaps going to AlAnon or getting individual therapy. The more you learn, the better you will be able to figure out what you need and want to do for yourself and your children.

TTOSBT 11-24-2008 02:19 PM

Welcome Haddock!

I am the recovering alcoholic wife in our family dynamic.
All I can offer is my experience, strength and hope.
I knew I had a problem and I lived in fear that my husband would bring it up.
In fact, I WAY overcompensated in every other area to make it harder for anyone to complain about me.

But if I admitted I had a problem, that would mean that I had to do something about it, which was even more terrifying than what I was doing to myself.

I have now been sober for over six months and I am finally free. I can not tell you what a relief it has been to finally admit my problem and today, the thought of a life without "numbing out" does not scare me.

I had to bottom out and it was not pretty. Thank goodness no one was hurt. All I can suggest is that you take care of yourself. Being a watchdog will not help her to stop and it will make you crazy. But if you make the decision to take care of YOU, then maybe, just maybe, your wife will see that her drinking does not just affect her. This is what I thought. I was super wife, super employee and super Mom and then I started drinking at about 6 pm. I wasn't hurting anyone, or so I thought. But looking back now, if my husband had gone to Alanon to take care of himself, maybe I would have woken up a little sooner? I don't know this for sure but I DO know that my husband would not have suffered as much if he had taken care of himself instead of trying to take care of me, worry about me or developing resentments toward me.

I wish you all the VERY best. If there is anything I can help with, please do not hesitate to ask.
Best.

Still Waters 11-24-2008 02:19 PM


Recently, its taken a turn for the worse and she has started self abusing when in this state, by cutting her arms with a razor. Its nothing serious - only small scratches, but its very scary.
I'm no expert, but this is not good at all. You, as her husband, do have some options such as having her held for observation in a hospital for a period of time. The laws differ between states I believe.

Haddock 11-24-2008 02:33 PM

Thanks for advice so far.

ChangingMyself 11-25-2008 12:37 AM

The cutting could indicate the existence of an additional problem; self-mutilation (such as cutting) is one of the criteria for Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD) and substance abuse is common in those suffering from BPD.

My abf exhibits many traits of BPD though not self-mutilation (in the form of cutting though his alcoholism is of course very self-destructive). Namely extreme emotional/verbal abuse and "splitting" (tendency to see things/people in black/white i.e. all good or all bad); he also has deep abandonment issues which he acknowledges.

To cope with the outfall of the abuse, the books Tears and Healing and Meaning from Madness have helped me greatly (both of these specifically address the so-called abusive personality disorders (including Borderline)). Also the Stop Walking on Eggshells book and workbook which were developed from the online support group (Welcome to Oz) for those with BPDs in their lives (these resources can be found through BPD Central - a dot-com). Tears and Healing and the author's other titles are available online from the Tears and Healing web site - also a dot-com (I am unable to post links). Tears and Healing also specifically deals with the issues involving decisions whether to leave or stay when marriage and children are involved (the author is a male who was married to a dually diagnosed BPD/alcoholic).

Though educating myself about BPD has been helpful for me in coping with my bf's behaviors, most professionals would probably agree that substance abuse must be addressed before any co-existing mental issues can be dealt with. And raising the possibility of BPD to a loved one who may be suffering from the disorder is not advised (this is explained in Stop Walking on Eggshells). The Tears and Healing series are useful for anyone suffering from the abusive behaviors caused by personality disorders and/or substance abuse/alcoholism alone (though not all alcoholics are abusive, many are); many of these behaviors (whether caused by a personality disorder or substance abuse) are similar and often impossible to distinguish.

GiveLove 11-25-2008 03:07 AM


Originally Posted by Haddock (Post 1997473)
Our 2 beautiful daughters dont really know there's anything wrong - most of the 'bad stuff' happens late at night when they're in bed.

I would not bet the store on this, haddock. I was one of those daughters who supposedly never knew and never suffered because "it all happened late at night". It took me many years to recover from my parents' alcoholic-enabler dynamic.

I would second Barbara's suggestion that you embark on a program of education for yourself. This forum is a great source of information to start - there are lots of great Sticky posts at the top of the forum that I found really useful. Al-Anon meetings helped me too, as well as a bit of counseling. I learned about enabling, and how I was not only decreasing the chances that my alcoholic X would choose to seek help, but also damaging myself.

That your wife is now into self-mutilation is a huge sign that something is at work here that's much greater than just a compulsion to drink. She sounds similar to my eldest sister, who was funny and kind when sober, but when drinking it escalated into being a loud, attention-seeking drunk, then a sobbing, tortured drunk after that.

With alcoholism, love just isn't enough. Your wife needs professional help, and I hope she gets it. Mostly, though, I'm glad you found us. This forum is a great source of support and inspiration.

Hugs,
GL

kaye 11-25-2008 03:45 AM

Haddock:

I'm new here so I don't know how to do the quote thing but I really want to echo what others are saying.

I, too, was the 'child in bed and too young to realize what was going on." I knew something was wrong, I could feel the stress in the house and eventually I realized dad was always drunk at night and mom was sad.

I'm 46 years old and when I think about those days I can still feel now how I felt inside then.

I'm so sorry you are going through this with your wife. I don't want to come across as cruel but I also don't want you to kid yourself that your kids don't know and therefore aren't being effected. They know.

Kaye

maisie 11-25-2008 05:05 AM

big hugs, i am the wife of an alcoholic and do not pledge to have any answers, but to echo the words of other it does get worse, so much worse before you get yourself better, your wife may or may not choose to do the same, and it is so so so so hard to accept the fact that you can and will have very little effect on your wife's choice to recognise and deal with her problems, as for the children i truely truely believed my babies (3 & 1) were far to young to know anything bad was happening (we didn't even fight) but the difference in the children since we've left speaks volumes, as others have said keep coming back, try not to be too hard on yourself (or your wife it'll only make you feel worse) when your ready you'll know the answers, just try to take care of yourself and your babies, there's some wonderful advice around here, and some great literature on codependancy (if you feel that may apply!
good luck xxx

Kallista 11-25-2008 08:12 AM

Your children are being harmed by her drinking. You need to protect them. You should not stay in a situation where they're being harmed.

Here's what works: take the children and leave. Before you go, consult an attorney. I would also document her alcohol problem by taking her to the hospital ER when she is drunk and self-injuring. If you tell the ER doctors that she is a danger to herself, they may admit her on a 24 hour psych hold. You can use that evidence in court to get custody and limit her visitation.

If you're not ready to leave, you can give her the treatment option. Find out what treatment you have available for her and make arrangements for her admission. Take her to the ER during one of her drinking and self-mutilating bouts. When she sobers up, tell her that she can go to treatment or you're taking the kids and leaving. Before you do all this consult a divorce attorney, so that you are ready to leave when you need to leave.

Loving her isn't enough to make her better.

Haddock 05-03-2009 01:29 PM

I'm back! 6 months later.

We've had many bad days, but thought we had a breakthrough about a month ago. After a particularly bad and embarrassing night (passing out at the local bar and being carried home) and after waking up on the floor the next morning, she admitted she had a problem and resolved then and there to do something about it. She went a full week without drinking, but then had 'just one'. She explained that this was ok, she would have 'just one' every now and then, as she didn't want to be 'the sort of person who can't have a drink'. You can guess the rest... One became two and about 2 weeks later, she had another major blowout and now, a few weeks later basically we are back to where we started.

The self-harming does seem to have stopped completely since I completely ignored it -it was very minor anyway and was just attention seeking I think.

I have taken much of the advice given above and learned more about the condition. I try to avoid 'enabling' and avoid reacting when being verbally abused. I live in hope that she will one of these days recognise that the only way to beat this will be to give up completely.

Questions:

When she has that first drink in the evening, is she thinking about how the evening will almost certainly end, or does she believe that she will have just a few and stop? Should I say anything at this point or try to intervene while she is still sober -or is it pointless?

Is it possible to beat alcoholism and still have one or two drinks, or is recovery only possible by stopping completely?

Thanks.

isurvived 05-03-2009 02:48 PM

Is it possible to beat alcoholism and still have one or two drinks,

NO

or is recovery only possible by stopping completely? YES.

She's doing something quite typical... self denial and controlled drinking. I'd consider it only a pause in the spiral of alcoholism.

Sugah 05-03-2009 03:08 PM

Haddock,

I can't add much to what's already been said, except to say that in describing your wife, you could have been describing me in active addiction. I was a PTA mom, very involved with my kids, kept a nice house, cooked three meals a day -- and every evening, after I picked up my first drink, I changed. Quickly to Person 2, and eventually, went straight to being Person 3. When you hear that alcoholism is chronic, progressive, and fatal, I can assure you from my own experience, I believe it to be true.

But the one thing I really wanted to add -- don't think your daughter's have been spared. Once I got sober, I found that my kids were not asleep like I thought they were and that they knew much, much more about the condition I was in than I believed. I thought that so long as I postponed drinking until they were in bed, I could go on being their hero mommy. It's years later now, and we've repaired much of the damage, but it's taken a lot of work.

Peace & Love,
Sugah

DESIGNER 05-03-2009 04:06 PM


At these times, she undergoes complete personality changes.
Person 1 is the beautiful, intellegent, fantastic mother to our 2 children - the person I love. After a few drinks she turns into Person 2 - slurred speech, euphoric, loud, life and soul of the party. After more drinks and at the end of the night, she becomes person 3 - very depressed, sobbing, very (verbally) abusive to me.
I am so sorry to hear that you are going through all of this. My exabf of 5 yrs was the exact same way...like most alcoholics. I used to call mine boyfriend 1 and boyfriend 2. Boyfriend 1 was an amazing person. I used to always say that he was everything i wanted in a man when he was in this state. Boyfriend 2 was a horrible thing to be around...he became a person that I did not even recognize.

I hate to hear that a family is going through this!!! You unfortunately can not convince her that she is an alcoholic. I tried for soo many yrs to convince and it never helped....it ended up making me very sick in the end. All you can do is try and take care of yourself and your little ones. Alanon and this website have been a great tool for myself in keeping me somewhat sane while going through the rollercoaster ride. The only good advice to give you is to follow through with what you say. If you set your bounderies then don't go back on them. I would always set bounderies and always let him cross over those bounderies b/c i wanted to try and keep the peace with us but in the end it only hurt the situation more.

I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers.:praying

DESIGNER 05-03-2009 04:19 PM


Is it possible to beat alcoholism and still have one or two drinks, or is recovery only possible by stopping completely?
No and I honestly believe that now. I had to learn the hard way with this one. My exabf also many of times convinced me that he could have one or two drinks or just drink on the weekends. He was great at first and I actually convinced myself that he must have just been going through a bad spell in his life. Well as you can guess that only lasted for so long.

He also did not want to be that guy that was not able to drink. It is a hard thing for an alcoholic being that alcohol is so accepted in this society and made to look like sooo much fun but unfortunately there is no other solution then to say no to even one

I believe that with any kind of hard core addiction the only way to stay sober is to never touch it again. My dad who was not an alcoholic but a smoker who has not touched one in 20 yrs says to this day that at times he still wants one but knows that if he smokes one that he would be at a pack a day again before the week is over.

This disease is horrible and very very confusing and frustrating. Just know that you are not alone.

prodigal 05-03-2009 04:24 PM


Originally Posted by Haddock (Post 2216112)
She explained that this was ok, she would have 'just one' every now and then, as she didn't want to be 'the sort of person who can't have a drink'. You can guess the rest... One became two and about 2 weeks later, she had another major blowout and now, a few weeks later basically we are back to where we started.

This happens because she is an alcoholic. She cannot pick up like normies. She metabolizes alcohol different. I can have a drink and walk away. It doesn't spiral out of control. It will continue to happen this way. It will not stop until she hits her bottom and is able to admit she has no control over alcohol; that HER LIFE has become unmanageable.


Originally Posted by Haddock (Post 2216112)
Questions:

When she has that first drink in the evening, is she thinking about how the evening will almost certainly end, or does she believe that she will have just a few and stop? Should I say anything at this point or try to intervene while she is still sober -or is it pointless?

Is it possible to beat alcoholism and still have one or two drinks, or is recovery only possible by stopping completely?

Question #1 - I don't know how an addict thinks. I am not an addict.

Question #2 - It is pointless for you to intervene. Just as that held true six months ago, it holds true today.

Question #3 - An alcoholic cannot drink. At least, I've never seen a single A I've known - and I've known many - who could pick up normally.

QUESTIONS FOR YOU HADDOCK: When are you going to get off her side of the street and respect her right to drink herself into a stupor? When are you going to try out a program for yourself that could help you? Because whether or not you realize it, YOUR LIFE has become unmanageable due to focusing all your efforts on someone else's addiction. You have zero control over what your wife chooses to do. Zero.

You do have an opportunity to manage your own life and affairs and get the focus on you. Again, as has been suggested previously, give Al-Anon a try. You will find support in those rooms and people who understand how you feel and what you're going through.

I wish you the best.

hope2bhappy 05-03-2009 06:00 PM


Originally Posted by Haddock (Post 2216112)
I live in hope that she will one of these days recognise that the only way to beat this will be to give up completely.

Replace "she" with "I" in your above comment. That is what you will eventually recognize. I'm really sorry for your struggles. We've ALL been there. Take care of yourself and your children. Do what you have to do to protect them. They already have one sick parent. Save yourself, for their sake.

TTOSBT 05-03-2009 09:20 PM

Haddock,
I am sorry that you are still living with an active alcoholic. I feel very sorry for her as well.
I replied to your thread six months ago and in 5 days I will have a year sober.
Not a day goes by that I don't remember where I came from and am so grateful to be a sober wife and mother today.
This last week I made my amends to my husband and my son (17). It was hard to really face what I had done to them when I was drinking and thought I was hurting no one but myself. But not only do I have their forgiveness today, I have earned their respect. I wish that for your wife.
But for you and the kids, I wish peace. As you have been told all over this thread, it is up to you to bring that into your and your kids life. Keep reading, keep posting and get to Alanon!
Best of luck!!!


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