Heart attacks, pronouns and yoga
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Starting over all over again
Posts: 4,426
Heart attacks, pronouns and yoga
This month I celebrate four years since my first heart attack. For me that's a pretty big deal. I've had a total of eleven heart attacks, counting that first one. Been locked up in ICU seven times, not a fun place to visit.
You know the _worst_ part of being disabled? People who have no clue what they're talking about but give me advice anyway. I had this one doc who is _hugely_ overweight, stinks of cigarette smoke, and has high blood pressure so out of control he turns beet red just from standing up. He would tell me all about how I need to exercise more, eat less fat and not smoke. I almost wanted to pick up a burger just to show him.
I hooked up with this group from the American Heart Association, bunch of people with bad hearts just like mine. They have _never_ given me a single word of advice. They just listen quietly and then tell me how _they_ have overcome the same challenges in their life. When I hear somebody who's had _seven_ open heart surgeries tell me they exercise more, eat les fat and don't smoke I _listen_.
The 12 step programs call it a "policy of attraction, rather than promotion". I don't know about you guys, but when somebody gets in my face and tells me what I should do I get my codie shields up. Even more so when I am in emotional pain.
Every now and then I have a nightmare that I am dead. That hurts, scares the **** outta me. Last thing I need is some well intentioned know-it-all telling me what I should do about it. What does me the most good is a couple friends I have in that heart group who are also terminal like me, and who tell me how _they_ get over those nightmares.
They do yoga. I _hate_ yoga. I don't have the patience for it. But they do it, and they are happy, productive and joyful people. So I've been doing yoga. I still hate it, but I do it anyway. And it works.
When I first came to SoberRecovery I was in the middle of a real-life nightmare with my pill-addicted wife. I don't need to tell you guys what that feels like. You guys already know. I wanted to know how you people _survived_ this kind of nightmare. Some folks got in my face and told me what I should do. They sounded just like my wife, in my face, blaming me, making me feel unworthy. Most of you just quietly shared your own experience, strength and hope, so that I could pick and choose what I wanted to do in my own life.
I did what those good people did. And now my life is all fixed. I have a happy little condo, a good job, and a wonderful girlfriend with whom I am building a new relationship. Ok, so my health sucks, but otherwise my life is fabulous.
Whenever I read posts here on SR I count the pronouns. Every time somebody says "I did..." or "I learned ..." I pay attention. These are the people that are the strongest, and who have the happiest lives. Browse around the posts, you'll see what I mean. They stand out by their serenity and wisdom.
There's a whole lot of other people who are still in a lot of pain and anger. Those are the ones that are practically yelling in the way they write. They're telling the newbies what to do, how to do it and when to do it. I almost wonder if they're trying to verbally force the newbies into recovery from codpendency the way I used to try and verbally force my ex-wife into sobriety. I don't pay attention to the angry, hurt ones. They don't have in their lives what I want in mine. When I was new here at SR I would just skip right over their posts.
Whenever I write a post I count my pronouns. As long as I am sharing _my_ experience I know I'm not having a "codie-relapse". Whenver I see "you should.... " or "you ought to .... " I just delete what I wrote and move on to the next thread. That way I avoid sliding back into that place where all I ever did was tell other people how I would run their lives.
Mike
Moderator, SoberRecovery
You know the _worst_ part of being disabled? People who have no clue what they're talking about but give me advice anyway. I had this one doc who is _hugely_ overweight, stinks of cigarette smoke, and has high blood pressure so out of control he turns beet red just from standing up. He would tell me all about how I need to exercise more, eat less fat and not smoke. I almost wanted to pick up a burger just to show him.
I hooked up with this group from the American Heart Association, bunch of people with bad hearts just like mine. They have _never_ given me a single word of advice. They just listen quietly and then tell me how _they_ have overcome the same challenges in their life. When I hear somebody who's had _seven_ open heart surgeries tell me they exercise more, eat les fat and don't smoke I _listen_.
The 12 step programs call it a "policy of attraction, rather than promotion". I don't know about you guys, but when somebody gets in my face and tells me what I should do I get my codie shields up. Even more so when I am in emotional pain.
Every now and then I have a nightmare that I am dead. That hurts, scares the **** outta me. Last thing I need is some well intentioned know-it-all telling me what I should do about it. What does me the most good is a couple friends I have in that heart group who are also terminal like me, and who tell me how _they_ get over those nightmares.
They do yoga. I _hate_ yoga. I don't have the patience for it. But they do it, and they are happy, productive and joyful people. So I've been doing yoga. I still hate it, but I do it anyway. And it works.
When I first came to SoberRecovery I was in the middle of a real-life nightmare with my pill-addicted wife. I don't need to tell you guys what that feels like. You guys already know. I wanted to know how you people _survived_ this kind of nightmare. Some folks got in my face and told me what I should do. They sounded just like my wife, in my face, blaming me, making me feel unworthy. Most of you just quietly shared your own experience, strength and hope, so that I could pick and choose what I wanted to do in my own life.
I did what those good people did. And now my life is all fixed. I have a happy little condo, a good job, and a wonderful girlfriend with whom I am building a new relationship. Ok, so my health sucks, but otherwise my life is fabulous.
Whenever I read posts here on SR I count the pronouns. Every time somebody says "I did..." or "I learned ..." I pay attention. These are the people that are the strongest, and who have the happiest lives. Browse around the posts, you'll see what I mean. They stand out by their serenity and wisdom.
There's a whole lot of other people who are still in a lot of pain and anger. Those are the ones that are practically yelling in the way they write. They're telling the newbies what to do, how to do it and when to do it. I almost wonder if they're trying to verbally force the newbies into recovery from codpendency the way I used to try and verbally force my ex-wife into sobriety. I don't pay attention to the angry, hurt ones. They don't have in their lives what I want in mine. When I was new here at SR I would just skip right over their posts.
Whenever I write a post I count my pronouns. As long as I am sharing _my_ experience I know I'm not having a "codie-relapse". Whenver I see "you should.... " or "you ought to .... " I just delete what I wrote and move on to the next thread. That way I avoid sliding back into that place where all I ever did was tell other people how I would run their lives.
Mike
Moderator, SoberRecovery
Last edited by DesertEyes; 10-12-2008 at 08:00 PM. Reason: typo
Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: FL
Posts: 14,246
Hi Mike...
Thank you so much for sharing. I just got back from a meeting and a newcomer chaired. She did great up to the end and then started in the with the "you shoulds" and "they always-es" uh-oh. Did I 'correct' her after the meeting? Nope. I let it go and thanked her for sharing and chairing the meeting. She will 'get it' when she is ready and when she wants it. What a load off of me. I'm not in charge of what others do anymore..it was a thankless job and the pay stinks too.
I'm still learning to keep my nose where it belongs but I'm getting better at recognizing when someone crosses that line with me. I don't need to hear the 'you shoulds' because I have had a tendency to be very cruel and insensitive to the person I am closest to in this world....ME. I'm learning to respect myself more and it feels good!
Thanks for sharing about 'our sharing' here on the forums.
Thank you so much for sharing. I just got back from a meeting and a newcomer chaired. She did great up to the end and then started in the with the "you shoulds" and "they always-es" uh-oh. Did I 'correct' her after the meeting? Nope. I let it go and thanked her for sharing and chairing the meeting. She will 'get it' when she is ready and when she wants it. What a load off of me. I'm not in charge of what others do anymore..it was a thankless job and the pay stinks too.
I'm still learning to keep my nose where it belongs but I'm getting better at recognizing when someone crosses that line with me. I don't need to hear the 'you shoulds' because I have had a tendency to be very cruel and insensitive to the person I am closest to in this world....ME. I'm learning to respect myself more and it feels good!
Thanks for sharing about 'our sharing' here on the forums.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Keepin' my side of the litterbox clean
Posts: 2,136
Extremely valuable perspective on how to approach people who come to this board. Being it's the weekend, the responses may be few. I hope more people have the opportunity to read this and post their comments during the upcoming week.
The "you should's" always send up a major red flag for me. You are right that each of us needs to be mindful of sharing our own ES&H without directing others in how to work their own recovery. Thanks for this post.
The "you should's" always send up a major red flag for me. You are right that each of us needs to be mindful of sharing our own ES&H without directing others in how to work their own recovery. Thanks for this post.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 163
Great post. I think I did a lot of that in the beginning with the "you shoulds and I thinks". I still do but I am getting to the point where if I feel that coming on I just don't respond. I need to learn how to live my life right now so telling someone else what they should do just seems stupid to me.
Administrator
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: a better place
Posts: 4,047
I know of people who believe using the word "I" is selfish. I remember buying into that theory myself before working a recovery program. Now I am able to distinguish between selfish and self care. I am learning that sharing about my experiences is not selfish, it is actually the opposite. I am so grateful for the people here like you, Mike who have helped me along this journey by sharing your ESH. Thanks!! 
Forum Leader
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: In my little piece of heaven
Posts: 2,870
((( mike )))
I'm so very glad that you're still with us. I am constantly awestruck and amazed by your wisdom and your candor as you share your story.
Thanks for being here, thanks for all you do here on SR, and thanks for sharing your journey with us.
Big hugs
Cats
I'm so very glad that you're still with us. I am constantly awestruck and amazed by your wisdom and your candor as you share your story.
Thanks for being here, thanks for all you do here on SR, and thanks for sharing your journey with us.
Big hugs
Cats
Belgian Sheepdog Adictee
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: In Today
Posts: 6,101
Mike, I whole heartedly agree.
I too have some life threatening health issues and have found the same kind of support on several diabetes boards I belong to. Never 'shoulds' just how they resolved a problem, how they worked to overcome the neuropathy to keep walking, etc.
I too try and do the same thing in my recovery from being an alcoholic/addict and a codie. It's all I have, what worked for me.
Thank you for this thread, I hope more respond as the weekend goes on.
Love and hugs,
I too have some life threatening health issues and have found the same kind of support on several diabetes boards I belong to. Never 'shoulds' just how they resolved a problem, how they worked to overcome the neuropathy to keep walking, etc.
I too try and do the same thing in my recovery from being an alcoholic/addict and a codie. It's all I have, what worked for me.
Thank you for this thread, I hope more respond as the weekend goes on.
Love and hugs,
Member
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,075
I'm bumping this back up.
I work hard to respond from the "I." Most times I succeed.
I also try to never come along and explain someone else's response. I have no idea what they were thinking when they wrote it, what their experience is, etc. I believe those posts belong in PM's.
My two cents.
Thanks.
I work hard to respond from the "I." Most times I succeed.
I also try to never come along and explain someone else's response. I have no idea what they were thinking when they wrote it, what their experience is, etc. I believe those posts belong in PM's.
My two cents.
Thanks.
Looking for the silver lining
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: South Florida
Posts: 243
Thanks Mike!
You have given me some perspective here! I am bumping this back up. I was raised to believe that we shouldn't talk about "I". My mother would say, that is a "ME ME I I" person...I was told that it should always be about the other person. Whenever, I am sharing my experience on this board, sometimes, I thought that the "I" part of my posts was a problem----like I was hijacking the thread! Little did I know that is the recovery in me!
WAIT>>>did you just hear that? I think I just heard a new wrinkle form in my brain! Thanks for the insight! How valuable!
You have given me some perspective here! I am bumping this back up. I was raised to believe that we shouldn't talk about "I". My mother would say, that is a "ME ME I I" person...I was told that it should always be about the other person. Whenever, I am sharing my experience on this board, sometimes, I thought that the "I" part of my posts was a problem----like I was hijacking the thread! Little did I know that is the recovery in me!
WAIT>>>did you just hear that? I think I just heard a new wrinkle form in my brain! Thanks for the insight! How valuable!
CindeRella is proof that a new pair of shoes can change your life!
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Spreading my wings
Posts: 7,163
Originally Posted by CatsPajamas 
((( mike )))
I'm so very glad that you're still with us. I am constantly awestruck and amazed by your wisdom and your candor as you share your story.
Thanks for being here, thanks for all you do here on SR, and thanks for sharing your journey with us.
Big hugs
Cats
I'm so very glad that you're still with us. I am constantly awestruck and amazed by your wisdom and your candor as you share your story.
Thanks for being here, thanks for all you do here on SR, and thanks for sharing your journey with us.
Big hugs
Cats
I have learned so much from your posts over the years-and still do today! 
Thank you for YOU! And all you do here for SR!
Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: OHIO
Posts: 959
Hey Mikie !!!! You are so awesome.....and your words are filled with wisdom as usual....I think your posts are wonderful. Not to mention an example of "recovery".
Take some more care of that ticker okay.
Janitw
Take some more care of that ticker okay.
Janitw
Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 31,179
(((Mike)))
Thanks for an awesome post. When I first came to SR, there were certain people with whom I "clicked". What they said really had an impact. Thinking back, I realize that I learned the most from these people because they told their story and what worked for them.
When I hear "you should" I usually get defensive, even if the person saying it is correct.
I thought using "I" so much was selfish, but thanks to you, I now realize that I'm doing what so many others did for me...they gave me options and ideas by sharing their story.
Hugs and prayers!
Amy
Thanks for an awesome post. When I first came to SR, there were certain people with whom I "clicked". What they said really had an impact. Thinking back, I realize that I learned the most from these people because they told their story and what worked for them.
When I hear "you should" I usually get defensive, even if the person saying it is correct.
I thought using "I" so much was selfish, but thanks to you, I now realize that I'm doing what so many others did for me...they gave me options and ideas by sharing their story.
Hugs and prayers!
Amy
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