nowinsituation

During the past few weeks I have taken to heart the advice so freely and often repeated here -- of working the steps and getting individual counseling. Helping, yes; hurting, oh yes!

I am really having to take a look at my relationship with STBXAH. I shared a few seeming inocuous incidents and BOTH my sponsor and counselor can see the emotional abuse. I still have trouble seeing it. My A played the vicitm role so well that half of me still believes it. I still feel guilty for leaving and responsible for making his live as easy as possible . . . AAAGH.

Our daughter doesn't want to spend alternate weekends with Dad anymore. She is bored to death there. He is not able to drive; and lives in a rural area. He does not plan any activities for when she is there; and she is at an age where socializing with her friends is important to her. She is not comfortable asking to do anything when she is there because he "can't" take her. The real issue isn't that he "can't"; it is that he "won't" try to think of any alternatives. I've had this discussion with him countless times; he'll never get it. My daughter says she doesn't even like to ask him anymore because he gets mad. And these are her exact words . . . "It's not that he gets mad and yells at me; he just gets 'that voice' and I can tell he's mad." That is not a healthy place for her to be!!

We have a settlement conference next week -- and the divorce may finally be moving forward. We do not have a written visitation agreement; I proposed the current arrangement when I left (wanted to be fair . . . wanted to make things easy for him. . . ) Daughter is old enough that a judge will award visitation based on what she wants. Letting her choose feels like putting her in the middle. My STBX will never express an opinion (couldn't be the victim that way). I don't want to be the one to decide, so that the X can blame me for things always having to be done my way (wouldn't be that way if he ever let anyone know what he wanted)!

My sponsor said -- alcoholics drive people away, that's what they do. If he is driving his daughter away that is a consequence he has to face. She told me to definately NOT step in and make things better for him. My counselor says it's his job to "parent" when she is there, not mine. Social activities are part of parenting. They are right, why do I feel like the bad guy?

Thanks for letting me vent -- any thoughts?

HopeandPrayer

I was where you are when I divorced my X. Also you need to add in there, if he is still actively using, your daughter might be in danger. I worried all the time that he would drink, pass out and leave my 5 yr old to take care of his little 2 yr old brother.

Depending on the age of your daughter, I don't believe it's a bad idea to let her talk to your lawyer and the judge, let her tell them, without, you in there what she honestly feels about the situation. Mine were too young to do that so the courts decided, but you might have a different choice to exercise.

Also, if she isn't in counseling, I would start taking her to someone that she can talk to about anything. My kids talked to me, but since I had an emotional connection to the whole mess, I don't feel like they were as honest with me because they didn't want to see mommy cry anymore.

Talk to your lawyer and see what he suggests, I am sure he has more experience with this situation and could offer some really good advice on how to proceed.

Hugs and Prayers, that things will get easier for you and your daughter.
Barb

Stubborn1

What if you asked your daughter to write down a few things that she would like to do with her dad that doesn't cost a lot of money. Maybe they could build something, some sort of art project, bicycling, video games, tennis, paint ball, batting cages........maybe some sort of competition sport that could get them laughing and enjoying each other?
I wouldn't look at this particular situation as making HIS life better. This is for her future as well because no matter how much you like or dislike it her future husband is going to be somewhat like him because that's what she is used to.
Maybe tell him that you asked her to write these things down because they were special to her and you are really hoping they could have a better relationship.
When it comes to men they really don't think on the same level as we do. We are maternal so we look at our children's emotions. Guys are just happy with someone in the room.
I don't know how your husband was raised but he may honestly NOT know what he's supposed to do. How did his father treat him? Did his dad do anything with him? It's not really his fault if this is all he knows.
Without being critisizing maybe you could buy him a book on teens so he can catch up.
On the other hand your daughter needs to be open to "guy" things like fishing, camping or things she thinks she may not like. Maybe if they both have open hearts and open minds they could both have a nice future and lasting memories.
I hope so.
Seems like everyone is hurting so bad. I'm so sorry.

Pajarito

This thread was down on the list, but I picked it right away, because I have similar concerns. What I am trying to remember is that I have no control over my STBXAH's relationship with dd. He makes his choices- and they aren't what I would make, but I have to let that go. Lately we have struggled over his trying to include his new girlfriend in his time with dd. It is very distressing to dd. So, I had to stand up and say no- it is too soon in this process- we just told dd about the divorce in April- and we are not divorced yet. When we are divorced- yes, I have to accept that he will try to incorporate his girlfriend into time with dd- but for now- no way. And he does throw the control word around, but I don't care- this is one area where I have to stand firm and make sure dd isn't in emotional turmoil over his insensitivity.

She is 10. I don't know how old your dd is, but where we live- in MN, the court will listen to the child when it comes to visitation. If dd is distressed- and doesn't want to see him as much as you have it set up for now- I think the court would listen to her. I also agree that counseling would do her a lot of good. I will have my dd go too as soon as it seems necessary. Right now she sees STBXAH regularly and I think he got it through his head that she wants to be with him alone when they see each other. He is- however- foregoing time with her to go out of town with his girlfriend in a few weeks. That breaks my heart. I don't know how he's going to spin it, but if dd asks me about it I will have to have an honest talk with her. Can you do that with your dd?

Another thing that comes to mind is a parenting mediator??? I'm not sure what they are called exactly, but I was told that if there are parenting disputes you can go to one who will counsel you both on what is best for dd.

I guess all I can say really is you are not alone. I NEVER thought I would be dealing with this. It is extremely hard. I am also still dealing with emotional and verbal abuse. I'm getting better at realizing it when it's happening, and my contact with him is very limited- on purpose. I wish you well. . .

nowinsituation

Thanks everybody for your thoughts. BTW my dd is 14 yrs old. I guess my biggest issue with it all, is that HE won't say what HE wants. I haven't even proposed a change to him; and if/when I do I seriously doubt he will resist it at all. This may be projecting on my part but -- what he will do is agree without comment; then be PO'd at me for dictating and controlling things. How do you deal with someone like that?

I think the best move is to go through my lawyer. Also to talk to dd again and look into counseling. I have not yet made his alcoholism an issue with custody. Mainly because he can't drive, so I know there is no way ever that he will be driving drunk with dd. I don't know what they do when she is there; but if it's like it was when I was living there dd sleeps in as late as she possibly can (noonish). By then, AH is "working" out in the garage ("working" on a 12-pack) and will be out there until dinner time. DD will entertain herself in the house (TV, computer, video games). They will eat dinner, then watch some more TV. AH will be really "tired" and go to bed by 9:00; DD will stay up and watch some more TV then go to bed. Heaven forbid he would even arrange for someone to pick them up and go to church on Sunday morning (even though dd has told me she wants to go).

So, anyway, it's not really abusive, but I would call it borderline neglectful. And, without asking her what they do I don't know for sure. It seems like pushing the issue much harder would take a toll on dd by putting her in the middle. I know she would not want to hurt her dad's feelings. Also, part of the reason she wants to spend more time with me is that she has more freedom to come and go and see her friends (since we live in town and AH lives in the country). So, her motives are not entirely pure!

Lot's to think about. The more I think through this I will check with my lawyer and see if I can have dd talk directly to him (or a judge or mediator) to tell them what she wants. Then she can speak freely without fear of hurting me or AH's feelings.