LaTeeDa

And you're accusing US of being cold and heartless? Nobody needs to be hit. Some people, however, do need to be allowed to hit bottom.

Will you feel the same way when your BF decides you need to be hit?

L

TTOSBT

Hi needhelp,
I am not a family or friend, I am actually a recovering alcoholic.
All I can offer is my experience, strength and hope.
When I hit bottom and decided it was time to quit, I was willing to do ANYTHING to stay sober. For the first couple of weeks when I was not at work I was either sweating it out at the gym or sitting in an AA meeting. Because I had to learn how to not drink. That was not natural for me those first 30-60 days. But I found the meetings, I scheduled to get there, I drove myself there. My husband has been supportive of my recovery but he has not done a single thing for me. It has to be MY recovery and I have to do the work.

I was blessed in that, physically I was able to do it without medical intervention. If you bf is shaking and have dt's, he might want to look into medical detox. Detoxing can be very dangerous.

Oh, BTW, I do not think two grown men hitting eachother is normal at all. I have two brothers, they have never hit eachother. My husband has two brothers, they have never hit eachother as adults.

I just want to say that I think everyone here just wants the best for you.
I know I do!
I think you should support him in his recovery and HIS working on getting well. But there is nothing you can do FOR him, he has to take the steps. :ghug2

blessed4x

NeedHelp,
Part of recovery, OUR recovery, is seeing that we are as sick as the addict we are trying to save. I hope that you are here to grow and learn. I hope that you are able to come back to this thread when you have had a chance to breath and reread the advice without becoming angry and defensive.

I know that on a public forum there is always the chance that people will join to get everyone stirred up and create drama. I hope that's not the case. There is so much wisdom here free for the taking.

TTOSBT

Yup, I am a meth addict and an alcoholic.
I have to take care of me if I want to stay sober.
That means I do not hang out in bars.
That means I do not associate with ANYONE that uses drugs (even if I am related to them).
That means I am ready to walk away if someone did try to "wave it in my face"

You are seriously angry and I can sympathize. But I am sorry that you are so angry at the folks here trying to help and the mil who seems to have learned how to detach. Get angry at the disease and refuse to participate in his addiction!

Frontier

also no need to say some one is more of an addict then another. Not your place to say. That is taking someone's inventory.

Stubborn1

He has no place to live??? Wah for him. There is a reason his mother doesn't help. She's smart. He created his own debt. Are you going to "help" with those too?
So let me get this straight.....you are going to give him shelter? Attention? Show him the way to pay off his debts? You can not be his savior.
If anything you are giving a very sick person a glimmer of hope that YOU will take care of everything for him. You claim to love him? Then let him learn what it's like to take full responsibility of himself.
I had to let go and let my husband sleep in a truck being bitten by red ants, no shower, I would not accept phone calls. Was that his rock bottom? Nope.
He was admitted to the hospital for bleeding internally, was that his bottom? Nope. What you do not understand is they do not come out and say "hey, I've hit rock bottom" and then expect you to help them.
What has he done? Nothing. You said he is still drinking. :wtf2 Does that sound like rock bottom?
If you want to help him you need to let him find his way like a big boy. Hand him a list. Let him find bus money to get there or arrange his own rides.
If your way works then come back in one month and let us know your success.
Don't be embarassed if you come back and say it didn't work. We will still be here. You will learn for yourself.

Frontier

Making excusesfor him. I have 16 friends who have takin "their" own lives. Nothing can be done unless that person Is willing and wanting help.

Frontier

You are here for help so listen the advise. What we all mean is what are you doing for ;your self to recover. I work full time and raise my daughter on my own. If you do not want help get off this site.

Barbara52

There is no reason to get nasty. A great many of us have struggled with this sort of denial and understand.

LaTeeDa

IMHO, there is no need to tell anyone to get off this site.

When I first started coming here:

I got offended and angry when people pointed out my delusions.
I thought my A was unique and different from all the others.
I just knew that I could make him see the light.
I denied that I had any part in the mess.

And on and on..........

Just like the alcoholic, the enabler/codependent has to hit bottom. Everyone gets there when they get there, and not a minute sooner. And, I'm starting to learn that some never get there..............sad, but true.

L

Stubborn1

Frontier, these are normal emotions and steps to new comers to the addiction. It's not like she's familiar with this. I've been around it for ten years and I don't have a hold on it yet. She needs to hear all of this and I know she's hearing it. She will now look out for it. She'll find her way.
This is HER board, she needs to be here. I would hate for her to leave and be alone through this. She doesn't realize there is a ton more he is about to throw her way.
She'll realize soon enough she has no control and her plans didn't work.:codiepolice

tormented22267

After posting this:

You asked those of us here on SR for help. After reading the above, we were concerned. For you. For your safety. Not because we are cold and heartless, but because we have been there and do not want to see someone have to go through the same things.

Then you write the following:

I find it even more scary that when you are NOT with him, he writes on your walls, breaks your things and scares you, so your reaction is to GET BACK TOGETHER WITH HIM??

You have since done nothing but stick up for T.

I honestly feel for you NeedHelp. I’ve been there. I’ve gone through the denial. I’ve stuck up for my XABF to no end. We are trying to give you advice from experience, we are not trying to hurt you or upset you. And, we are certainly not trying to gang up on you.

I truly hope that you take a break, breathe, then come back and re-read these posts. Maybe you can get more out of them at a later time.

I’m sorry you are in this situation and I truly hope everything works out for the best for you.

I also hope that it doesn’t take you the years it took me to realize what was really happening. Most importantly, I hope that you don’t end up with stitches, or in the hospital, or worse, before you become open to honest, heat-felt, advice.

sunflowerintx

NeedHelp81,

I've wondered about you often over the last several weeks...I'm sorry to see things are not looking up for you.

Oy. I can certainly understand your anger. Addictions bite.

I am no longer with my AH, the love of my life, because of his addiction and his abuse. I KNOW what it's like to want someone to get better. He is also the father of my two children, ages 12 and 8.

Please know that everyone here has your best interests at heart. Tyler has to help Tyler. I read an interesting story here once about supporting the recovering alcoholic. It's Tyler's race to run....not yours. You can be supportive and caring but you don't win the race...there is no "best clapper" award.

IOW, this is Tyler's problem, not yours. Al-Anon practices detaching with love and it is a very difficult skill to master. I don't think I ever did it properly, but I had to save myself and my children.

My H hasn't had a drop of alcohol since June 28th but he's still not any fun to be around. He's a miserable human being and I refuse to wallow in his misery. My H told me he was going to get help with or without me. Instead, he sits around doing nothing and mooching off his baby sister. Like Tyler's mother, I wish my H's family would make him be responsible for himself. Tyler's mom is not cold...she is doing exactly what she needs to do to take care of herself. She is most likely tapped out where the addicts in her life are concerned.

I completely understand where you are coming from....the anger, the defensiveness... You are so used to being in drama and chaos where Tyler is concerned that the calm that would come from detaching would leave a big hole in your life. You have to want, and work for, serenity in your life....just like Tyler has to want his own recovery. I highly recommend you give him the number to the Salvation Army and take care of you while he takes care of himself.

Hugs,
Sunny

Bernadette

It's a more peaceful place when I am in a crappy "relationship" with him then when I see him and he makes my life hell.

That's one of the truly saddest things I've ever read on here.

(((((((((((((((((NeedsHelp81))))))))))))))))))))

Take care of yourself.
B.

cmc

Please be reminded that in this forum we limit our sharing to our own experience, strength and hope, offered with respect to one another.

NeedHelp,
I'm just coming onboard to this thread but have been following all the posts here. You have received some of the best, most carefully thought out replies that I have ever seen on this site.

The above quoted statement is never acceptable. I can't beat the truth into a person to teach them how to live. That kind of violence is the ultimate form of attempting to control a person...and that kind of thinking and resulting action will only make things worse. In legal terms it's called assault & battery, attempted murder and at it's worse-murder.

When my son was actively using drugs for about 10 YEARS.... I _never_ got angry...not when he stole, lied, manipulated or did any other harmful thing to himself and our family.

That's a very long time to be in denial, it's a very long time to keep things going as they were. I love my son- I was desparate just like everyone else who comes here. And btw...In my view- my son's case was 'special' and that's why it was worse and why he needed my help so badly. He has a life threatening condition and continued to use despite that fact.

My breaking point....my bottom....came when I realized just how sick _I_ was. I doubt there are any of us here on this forum who would not become angry at a stranger who burglarized our homes, assaulted others---much less defend that person and support their actions. Yet no matter what my son did, it all bounced off of me and I made excuses and kept trying to help him stop.

While rescuing my son from 'one more' incident, I found myself in a situation where my safety and my very life became threatened. I won't get into the details but there were drug dealers involved in an area where organized crime has a stronghold.

On my way driving back home it finally dawned on me that these dangerous people now had seen my face, my car, my license plate etc. etc. I become enraged at my son....for about 30 seconds. At that point all I had learned in counseling, Al-Anon, open AA and NA meetings and here on SR began to come together.

I became angry at myself! I had put myself in that place- nobody dragged me there. It surely was not my son's doing that I was in that situation. He was completely unable to comprehend any of that reality anyway due to his using. Today I thank God that I am not another statistic written about in the paper and shown on the 10 o'clock news.

I also became aware that for just one more time I gave my son a soft landing.... I stepped in between him and his consequences. I stepped in between him and his HP. At that point I acquired a new resolve that if he was going to live like that...I could not live with myself for my part in it. In my mind and heart I knew that my actions were actually helping him to use...helping him to kill himself and perhaps someone else who was present or otherwise in his path.

The anger was in me but it was misdirected. Once I learned that I could change, things got better. Everything did not improve overnight but I am happy to say that when his dad and I detached- he was forced to face the music.

He is clean now and happily married, not because: I beat him into submission, nor because I helped him to see the light or helped him recover. I did step out of the way and he did have to face things on his own. I believe that at that time, it was his response that saved his life and continues to keep him focused on his new life in recovery. He doesn't want to live like that ever again.

He did that on his own and he owns his own success. That's the gift I give to myself and to my son- to let him be a man and stop mothering an adult child.

The best thing I ever did for myself....was to get professional help, go to meetings, come here and take the cotton out of my ears so I could listen to those who had gone before and were willing to show me a better way.

Berry1976

I don't know how long you have been on here or how long you have been dealing with this.
But I use to feel the same way, like these people where heartless and how could I just sit back and worry about myself at a time like this.
But after being hurt over and over and over again after promises and god knows what I started to realize that there is NOTHING I can do for him, HE has to do it. This deciese (sp)is not like a normal one. Cause normally if you are sick you get help.
But I learned that until they do something by them self they will spin you up in their web of lies and manipulation and do what ever it takes to have you do things for them no matter what it takes.
My ExAH told me he would get help and he did go see a mental health doctor, however he did it "for me" so he would go there and tell him what ever sounded good, and then he would come home do freaking drunk and high and didn't think I would notice cause he had in his mind done his part on seeing the shrink...

So my advice to you.
Read up on addiction and what it does and read lots of posts here and maybe you'll see where everyone here is coming from.

Take care!

splendra

(((NeedHelp)))

I have 4 active addicts in my life and many times I have thought that they could not possibly get any lower and that they must have reached their bottom only to find that they could go lower and drag me down with them if I let them.

I know how hard it is to hear what we are saying about are you at your bottom. It takes what it takes. I have learned the very hard way that there is nothing I can do to make the As in my life choose to be sober. I imagine his family is tired of putting up with his "stuff" and I commend them fr not putting up with it. I hope you will reach a bottom very soon.

Be gentle with yourself ok.

Berry1976

Well, that is his problem, not yours.
Or did you force him to do drugs and alcohol and mess up his credit to get a bank account and an apartment?
Hate to say it... But you are enabling him... And he knows it that's why he's coming to you to keep doing what he's doing.
He has not hit rock bottom yet... He's telling you that he has so you will believe him and "help" him so he doesn't have to.
You are making excuses for him and defending him.
Please take care of yourself and step back and see what actions he is really taking.
:codiepolice

AmpHusky

It sounds like we are saying we have a rock bottom too. It is when we are fed up enough to take care of ourselves first. Whether that be getting the A's out of our lives or just changing our enabling behaviors. We need to get out of our addition to them before they can get ut of their's.

hello-kitty

Pretend that there is duct tape over his mouth. What is he telling you by his actions?