ToughChoices

Hard night.


My AH has been attempting recovery since his return from inpatient treatment in March. He "slips" for one night every 4 weeks or so (way less than before treatment, way more than I'd like).

Life has been good in spite of the alcohol - we're going to counseling (both individually and as a couple) , and I've really been making some strides.
As I focus on his behaviors instead of the amount of liquor that he still occasionally pours into his body, I'm better able to handle my life.

This is an important step for me.

But last night he didn't come home until 3 am after promising to be home by 8pm. He didn't call. He got drunk in his truck (our house is an alcohol-free zone) and sat in a random parking lot for almost 10 hours.

If you remove the alcohol from this situation and focus solely on the behaviors (lying, staying out all night, not calling, possibly driving intoxicated), there is no way in which it is acceptable to me.

I am angry. But what do I DO about it?!

Of course he is sorry - he never meant for this to happen ..... blah, blah, blah.
I know that he didn't MEAN to do it. Big deal. When he drinks, he loses control and makes bad choices.

I'm trying not to be rash - I've been pretty successful at detaching and living a good life with him so far, and I tend to make mistakes when I react suddenly and strongly to a situation.

Still. What do I do?
I can't make him stop drinking.
I can't make him call if he's snookered.
I can't make him do a dang thing except get out of the house.

And I don't want him out of the house.
But I also don't want the sinking, stinking "where is he" feeling.

I need a swift kick in the rear. And advice, if you've got any.

-TC

LaTeeDa

The title of your post is "Boudaries Overstepped." So, what exactly are your boundaries, what did he overstep, and most importantly, what are the actions you are willing to take to keep YOUR boundaries intact?

I don't think any of us can answer these questions for you. Especially when you seem to be unclear on what your boundaries and consequences are.

L

sunflowerintx

I used to say that my boundaries were made of slinkies...I had to keep moving them around because he kept overstepping them.

In all reality, making him face the consequences of his actions usually means consequences for you too.

In my case, not being with H means that I don't get to be with the man that I dearly love. My kids don't have their father around (self-destructing). I struggle to survive because I get no money from him (until CS is set in our divorce). I am not the one who destroyed our family, but we all suffer the consequences.

That said, life on this side is BETTER. Not great, but better than trying to coddle and reassure him that he is valuable. I was so busy wondering what he was going to do and putting my life, and essentially my kids' lives, on hold for a man who I believe is a lost cause. I had to decide that saving the 3 of us was better than trying to help someone who doesn't want to change.

I hope you can find a workable solution. My H never made it to rehab but I've heard repeatedly that 1 go in rehab doesn't usually do the trick for an alcoholic. I hung in there for 19 years - over half of my life!!!!! :wtf2 I don't regret being with my H. My only regret is not having left sooner.

Good luck, and keep coming back!

ToughChoices

We have previously discussed the "not calling" problem.

A while back, when he came home an hour late without calling we sat down and discussed why it bothered me, what could be done, etc...
We talked about trust and dependability, about my need for order and his need for freedom.
I felt like we had a good talk - walked away thinking, "We figured that out - now it won't happen again."

But that's not true.

As far as boundaries go, so far:
If he chooses to drink, then I will choose not to be around him.
has been working really well.

If he chooses to stay out all night without calling, then I will ....
I don't know.
I hadn't thought enough about it.
I didn't want him to crawl into bed with me, so he slept on the floor.
I spoke to him about why I was angry.

Maybe I need some time away from his this evening.

-TC

cmc

I've learned both in Al-Anon and here on SR that if I continue to have expectations from others I will continue to be disappointed and resentful.
My resentments are not caused by other people; they are caused by how I choose to react to them and by what I continue to allow.
I don't know what your boundaries are...you say he's 'attempting' recovery and has monthly slips. It's good to make the boundary about action. There are several things you mention:
drinking
drinking in a vehicle
not calling
not coming home at a decent hour
It's up to me to decide what the consequences are, but it's better to have no boundary at all than to have one and not stick with it.
If that consequence (kicking him out) you choose is not what you really want, then maybe you can think of another way to maintain serenity and sanity in your life and home.
This is about you and your life, what works for you in your unique situation.
My best and only advice is to get to as many Al-Anon meetings as you can.

Silverberry1331

I know that this is really difficult for you.

I agree with La...boundaries need to be established. After that you must follow through, otherwise it is likely that not only will you end up frustrated and upset but it sends a message that he can do as he pleases with no consequences.

My AH and I are separating now. I always tried to lay down boundaries, but not stuck to them. I think I didn't stick to them for two reasons: 1) I didn't want to be without him 2) I didn't want to face the facts that what I wanted didn't matter as much to him than the drink. Ultimately, those worries and fears about where, what, and when he was doing it were beyond my tolerance.

True you may have to make some hard decisions once you establish firm boundaries, but believe me you can sleep alot better at night when you do. For me, my AH has NEVER said "maybe I should stop this behavior"...it is always "you should just accept me for the way I am." I ended discovering my boundaries weren't about him...but about me.

:praying

bookwyrm

This is the one single fact that I finally had to face and boy was it hard!

LaTeeDa

I'm not so sure I was saying boundaries need to be established *for this particular behavior.* Boundaries are necessary, yes. But, sometimes it's worth taking a look at the situation and deciding whether or not a boundary is appropriate.

For instance, if you say you cannot tolerate the staying out late, not calling, but the only option you see is kicking him out. Yet, you are not willing to do that. Then, you are in a bit of a pickle. So, maybe a boundary isn't what's called for in this situation. Maybe acceptance is. Maybe it requires looking at why the behavior upsets you and dealing with that. I know every single one of the spouses I've ever "met" on SR, who stay with their alcoholic have said acceptance is the key. If you cannot accept them as they are, then you are really just continuing the dance. So, if you really want to stay with him, you will probably have to accept certain aspects of his behavior, while protecting yourself from others.

Personally, I am not strong enough to do it. I had to remove myself from the situation.

L

Silverberry1331

I never looked at it from that dimension before. Acceptance is indeed an option. I guess I see things in such black and white way...Additionally, true acceptance, like you mention here, would be something that you can live with, and have no further expectations regarding it. I think I am still to entrenched in my bad Codie habits to practice it.

Thanks for the insight! I am glad you clarified! 8

ToughChoices

Thank you for this, LTD.
I have a lot to think about.

-TC

lizw

Great thread.

As I understand boundaries are not standards I impose on another person, but rather actions that I take to feel comfortable and safe.
I.e.
I choose not to be in a relationship with an A - drinking/using or sober.
I choose to leave a room if anyone becomes abusive.
I choose to eat a healthy dinners, which means I have to cook it.

Setting a boundary based on another actions, isn't a boundry, I'd call it control. It is impossible to police these too, because we can't control another person.

Your situation reminded me of one of the daily readings in the Al Anon daily reader Courage to Change. The writer of the passage explains his A comes home late and drunk and he reacts so they have a terrible evening BUT if he doesn't react, rave on and argue about where she's been etc..they usually have a nice night.

Al Anon says we shouldn't create a situation that pressures our A to get help (trying to inflict consequences we can't), but that if consequences happen as a result of the A's behaviour we shouldn't stand in the way.
I.e he goes out drinking and has to sit in his truck for 10 hours, before driving home, which probably wouldn't have been too pleasant then he gets home and your not too happy with him and let him know it, when it suits you - not in the middle of the night when he has got home. Neither would it be wise to sit up and wait for him, as this will harm you.

When family members of the A try to inflict consequences on the A, it becomes a battle of wills and it also becomes about the family members being mean to the A, in the A's mind anyway. When we stand aside and let our A's live and expereince their own lives, we give them back their dignity.

ToughChoices

Arggh. My controlling tendencies creep in even when I'm really trying to reign them in and take care of myself!

I had a lot of emotional turmoil yesterday, most of it self-inflicted.

His behavior really touched a nerve in me - some abandonment, "what will people think", "decent people don't behave this way" nerve.

Given that I disliked the emotion his behavior stirred up, I felt like it was up to me to come up with some consequence for my husband to help prevent similar behavior in the future.

It is helpful for me to think about surrendering MY responsibility for creating consequences for HIM. Reminds me that I don't run the universe.

Thanks.
-TC

Mair

I couldn't set bounderies by the end, like LTD wisely says It's Acceptance. I could not ACCEPT his behaviours, but accepted that it was time for me to leave.

Mair

lizw

The last relationship I had with an A, we lived together for 3 years and were together for 4. The entire time he was sober and an AA member, had a sponsor etc.. I think he was like 4 months sober when we got together.

One thing that never changed though was he had a terrible temper so from time to time, he'd lose the plot and be violent. He never actually hit me but would smash stuff during rages.

To begin with I use to get upset then over time I just got to a point when I didn't even react, except to maybe raise my eye brow. When I was able to do this, it kept the attention were it belonged: On him throwing a tatrum.

It then become glaring obvious to me that this was how his father use to behave towards his mother (before she divorced him). So to him it was acceptable behaviour. I.e. all men act like this.

But because I'd been in Al Anon I'd learnt (and I could not even say the date/time etc..) that I didn't have to have a relationship with a man, who was like my own father. My dad use to have tatrums when he didn't get his way too. It was like I my level of what was acceptable behavior for me to be around had changed. I had come to believe I was worth more despite the fact I'd live with him all this time.

So our relationship ended. Rather abusively of course from, his end, and my own occasion but all that did was confirm I was making the right choice.

These days, nearly 2 years later, if I got into a relationship with someone who acted violently, they'd only have to do it once and I'd be out of there. It use to be I'd see 'red flags' in men but rather than run the other way, like sane woman do, I'd run towards them. Lol.

londonvanpelt

I can understand how you feel about your H coming home late, not calling, etc. Been there many times. I didn't realize it at the time, but I was trying to control what another human being does or doesn't do. Your trying to blame your husband for your feelings of anger. If you would have detached with love, then you would have taken care of yourself and went to bed and left him in HP's hands. You're trying to control a disease and it will never work. You are placing all your happiness into what he does or doesn't do. He is not your HP. I can guarantee that if he gets sober, your disease will get worse. Our disease wants to control another human being and we have no right to do that. Our boundaries need to be set to take care of us, not to control someone else. I was so miserable with my alcoholic that I left, but it would be soon that I would find something else to be angry about. It was ME that was causing my misery, not someone else. The martyr role worked really well. It was extremely manipulative and I got attention for it. Look at what he is doing to me worked well until I started saying "look at what I am doing to me". I chose to feel anger, self-pity, manipulation, controlling behavior. I was there to play victim and he was the bad guy. I was the biggest whiner and sobbing basketcase you've ever seen. I had no right to force MY will on someone else's life. I had to finally face myself as I truly was before I could get better or I would do the same dance again with someone else. It wasn't until I got out of the way that HP could take over.