decisions
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decisions
Hi!
Ok, It's been a week of real serious thinking for me. The thing is, it took me a long time to get to the point where I just accepted that my ex was an alcoholic. I was in denial, and in denial about what that meant about him, and what it meant about me. But I worked through that, and got to a place where I understood that is just the way things are, and it wasn't for me. I was really up in the air about whether contact was a good idea, what that contact should consist of, etc. I negotiated a space that I was comfortable with with the understanding that he would continue to drink.
Then, as these things tend to go, things kind of changed. He decided to stop drinking. All of my negotiated ideas and terms and whatever got disrupted. So I had to think things over with the new terms.
Last night, I came to the conclusion that this just isn't fair. He isn't being fair to me. I am too invested in the idea of his sobriety. I know why he wants to talk to me about it: I am smart, compassionate, funny, helpful, hopeful, resourceful, solid, remarkably un-judgmental, and extremely supportive. And I may be one of the few people in his life that has truly seen what a problem this is. So it makes sense, from his perspective, to lean on me a bit. It's a smart move. But only if you take what this relationship does to me out of it. Basically, it's a smart move for him, and an extremely stupid move for me.
I've been put/put myself in a pretty complicated situation. I mean, it's all well and good to say it isn't my problem, and I bear no responsibly. But when someone you love tells you that they are in trouble, huge trouble, and they don't tell anyone else, it's hard to just ignore. That isn't who I am. Yes, it is manipulation, but it is also serious and real.
At any rate, I have made some decisions about how I can “help” but also not invest myself in an unstable situation. Right now he plans to “go it alone.” He is on tour for a month. He can have this month, without me getting involved, to establish and maintain his sobriety. If this doesn't work, and he continues to drink, then I will present him with some choices to make. I have found some resources that will allow him free treatment, I have a list of AA meetings, I have information on medications that he might take. I will give him this information, and explain that I am here to help him figure out a plan, and more than happy to help him do that. I'm not in charge of the plan, the shape of it is up to him.
If he refuses to make a plan, whether on his own or with help, then this is done. He's going to have to leave me alone. I can't do it. I can't hear how he is scared, thinks he is going to die, hates himself. I can't do it without having my heart break for him. And I can see pretty clearly that is what is going to happen again and again if I allow it. This is terrible for me. I thought it would be different, but I am who I am, and I am much too sweet to not get hurt by this.
Ok- I know this is a bit long. Be thankful I didn't get into my ideas about love, because it would have been even worse.
Ok, It's been a week of real serious thinking for me. The thing is, it took me a long time to get to the point where I just accepted that my ex was an alcoholic. I was in denial, and in denial about what that meant about him, and what it meant about me. But I worked through that, and got to a place where I understood that is just the way things are, and it wasn't for me. I was really up in the air about whether contact was a good idea, what that contact should consist of, etc. I negotiated a space that I was comfortable with with the understanding that he would continue to drink.
Then, as these things tend to go, things kind of changed. He decided to stop drinking. All of my negotiated ideas and terms and whatever got disrupted. So I had to think things over with the new terms.
Last night, I came to the conclusion that this just isn't fair. He isn't being fair to me. I am too invested in the idea of his sobriety. I know why he wants to talk to me about it: I am smart, compassionate, funny, helpful, hopeful, resourceful, solid, remarkably un-judgmental, and extremely supportive. And I may be one of the few people in his life that has truly seen what a problem this is. So it makes sense, from his perspective, to lean on me a bit. It's a smart move. But only if you take what this relationship does to me out of it. Basically, it's a smart move for him, and an extremely stupid move for me.
I've been put/put myself in a pretty complicated situation. I mean, it's all well and good to say it isn't my problem, and I bear no responsibly. But when someone you love tells you that they are in trouble, huge trouble, and they don't tell anyone else, it's hard to just ignore. That isn't who I am. Yes, it is manipulation, but it is also serious and real.
At any rate, I have made some decisions about how I can “help” but also not invest myself in an unstable situation. Right now he plans to “go it alone.” He is on tour for a month. He can have this month, without me getting involved, to establish and maintain his sobriety. If this doesn't work, and he continues to drink, then I will present him with some choices to make. I have found some resources that will allow him free treatment, I have a list of AA meetings, I have information on medications that he might take. I will give him this information, and explain that I am here to help him figure out a plan, and more than happy to help him do that. I'm not in charge of the plan, the shape of it is up to him.
If he refuses to make a plan, whether on his own or with help, then this is done. He's going to have to leave me alone. I can't do it. I can't hear how he is scared, thinks he is going to die, hates himself. I can't do it without having my heart break for him. And I can see pretty clearly that is what is going to happen again and again if I allow it. This is terrible for me. I thought it would be different, but I am who I am, and I am much too sweet to not get hurt by this.
Ok- I know this is a bit long. Be thankful I didn't get into my ideas about love, because it would have been even worse.
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Location: Los Angeles, CA
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Originally Posted by good_luck 
He can have this month, without me getting involved, to establish and maintain his sobriety. If this doesn't work, and he continues to drink, then I will present him with some choices to make. I have found some resources that will allow him free treatment, I have a list of AA meetings, I have information on medications that he might take. I will give him this information, and explain that I am here to help him figure out a plan, and more than happy to help him do that. I'm not in charge of the plan, the shape of it is up to him.
If he refuses to make a plan
If he refuses to make a plan
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 225
Nope. I haven't made a plan. While we were dating and I was secretly freaking out about his drinking, I gathered a bunch of resources. I still have them, and I am going to give them to him. To let him know some of the options available. I'm not especially invested in which route he takes, or thinking that it has to be something from what I have found.
Forgive me, I am a librarian.
Forgive me, I am a librarian.
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Manchester UK
Posts: 1,017
Last night, I came to the conclusion that this just isn't fair. He isn't being fair to me.
You seem to have done everything for him, what have you done for yourself? and what is he doing for himself?
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Los Angeles CA
Posts: 208
I think Denny is bringing up a good point.
Do you have any such detailed plans for yourself in the next 30 to 60 days? Your OWN recovery? Maybe your own career or financial goals, taking a class that interests you, spending time with your friends, being of service to others, working the 12 steps yourself...stuff like that.
I have learned this fact:
I am the LAST person who can help an alcoholic. Why? Because I am not an alcoholic (and even if I were, being so close would cancel it out -- right message, wrong person).
We have this saying in recoery about sharing our experience, strength and hope with others. Well, I have no experience, strength or hope about how do get sober because I am not an alcoholic.
You said him talking toyou about his problems is a smart move. I think I would exchange the word "smart" for the word "cunning." It is a huge manipulation. You've seen through it now. There is hope for you.
Thank you for sharing. Keep posting!
BTW, I heard a little self-depricating humor in there -- that's great!
Do you have any such detailed plans for yourself in the next 30 to 60 days? Your OWN recovery? Maybe your own career or financial goals, taking a class that interests you, spending time with your friends, being of service to others, working the 12 steps yourself...stuff like that.
I have learned this fact:
I am the LAST person who can help an alcoholic. Why? Because I am not an alcoholic (and even if I were, being so close would cancel it out -- right message, wrong person).
We have this saying in recoery about sharing our experience, strength and hope with others. Well, I have no experience, strength or hope about how do get sober because I am not an alcoholic.
You said him talking toyou about his problems is a smart move. I think I would exchange the word "smart" for the word "cunning." It is a huge manipulation. You've seen through it now. There is hope for you.
Thank you for sharing. Keep posting!
BTW, I heard a little self-depricating humor in there -- that's great!
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Ok. I'm tired of getting the same responses. This is what I have done for me. I don't see how it's germane to this topic, but I really need to stand up for myself.
I attended alanon
I have a therapist
I have begun meditating daily
I am taking boxing lessons
I moved back to the city I love
I am volunteering
and I just got my Masters, and am looking for a job in my field.
Most of my life is about me. It really is. I post in the friends and family of alcoholics forum about the alcoholic in my life. I know it presents a weird picture of me. Sorry. But I tend not to ask questions about what I should do about myself because I have a good understanding of that, in general. I don't always do it, but I understand it.
I attended alanon
I have a therapist
I have begun meditating daily
I am taking boxing lessons
I moved back to the city I love
I am volunteering
and I just got my Masters, and am looking for a job in my field.
Most of my life is about me. It really is. I post in the friends and family of alcoholics forum about the alcoholic in my life. I know it presents a weird picture of me. Sorry. But I tend not to ask questions about what I should do about myself because I have a good understanding of that, in general. I don't always do it, but I understand it.
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,075
Originally Posted by good_luck
Right now he plans to “go it alone.”
He can have this month
If this doesn't work, and he continues to drink, then I will present him with some choices to make.
I have found some resources that will allow him free treatment
I have a list of AA meetings,
I have information on medications that he might take.
I will give him this information, and explain that I am here to help him figure out a plan
If this doesn't work, and he continues to drink, then I will present him with some choices to make.
I have found some resources that will allow him free treatment
I have a list of AA meetings,
I have information on medications that he might take.
I will give him this information, and explain that I am here to help him figure out a plan
I'm not sure what being a librarian has to do with it LOL - but I know I lived in denial a long time. Something that worked for me was thinking long and hard before defending my decisions. Many people not connected to my situation were able to see it far more clearly.
Good luck!
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Manchester UK
Posts: 1,017
Originally Posted by good_luck
Ok. I'm tired of getting the same responses. This is what I have done for me. I don't see how it's germane to this topic, but I really need to stand up for myself.
I attended alanon
I have a therapist
I have begun meditating daily
I am taking boxing lessons
I moved back to the city I love
I am volunteering
and I just got my Masters, and am looking for a job in my field.
Most of my life is about me. It really is. I post in the friends and family of alcoholics forum about the alcoholic in my life. I know it presents a weird picture of me. Sorry. But I tend not to ask questions about what I should do about myself because I have a good understanding of that, in general. I don't always do it, but I understand it.
I attended alanon
I have a therapist
I have begun meditating daily
I am taking boxing lessons
I moved back to the city I love
I am volunteering
and I just got my Masters, and am looking for a job in my field.
Most of my life is about me. It really is. I post in the friends and family of alcoholics forum about the alcoholic in my life. I know it presents a weird picture of me. Sorry. But I tend not to ask questions about what I should do about myself because I have a good understanding of that, in general. I don't always do it, but I understand it.
I didn't mean to sound harsh, your original post didn't mention much about you though.
If I get the same responses time after time, I start to think there may be something in them.
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Posts: 225
Of course it's my plan. But the plan isn't about his sobriety really. It's a plan to let me leave this cycle gracefully, and without guilt, with a small allowance for the cycle changing.
The librarian joke was a reference to my gathering of resources. It's how I deal with everything. So it might seem crazy that I have all of these articles and links and books from before, but I have the same deal going for, like, gardening.
I guess I see giving these things to him as a symbolic gesture as well. Like, "here take it, I'm not keeping this around anymore, it's (literally) in your hands now."
The librarian joke was a reference to my gathering of resources. It's how I deal with everything. So it might seem crazy that I have all of these articles and links and books from before, but I have the same deal going for, like, gardening.
I guess I see giving these things to him as a symbolic gesture as well. Like, "here take it, I'm not keeping this around anymore, it's (literally) in your hands now."
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 46
I understand your side
because I am the same way. I have read all of the stickies, and I am attending Al Anon and I am back in church, but all everyone ever says is for me to only be concerned with ME and do things for ME and put the focus back on ME. The thing is, that I do for MYSELF everyday! But when I post in this forum, or when I ask for help and advice about my AB, it's because of my love and my compassion for him that I am asking it, not my love and compassion for myself, which I DO have. I don't necessarily believe that turning my back to him and letting him do all of this on his own is the right thing to do. My AB needs his friends and family MOST now. And to turn everything into "all about me", to me, is extremely selfish. Sure, he has to DO this on his own. But he has MADE the decision to be sober, once again in his life, and I am going to embrace that, and stand by him, and not judge him, and not say "ok buddy you are on your own now".
i'm sorry, that's just the way I think....
i'm sorry, that's just the way I think....
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Location: Manchester UK
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Originally Posted by triciafawn
because I am the same way. I have read all of the stickies, and I am attending Al Anon and I am back in church, but all everyone ever says is for me to only be concerned with ME and do things for ME and put the focus back on ME. The thing is, that I do for MYSELF everyday! But when I post in this forum, or when I ask for help and advice about my AB, it's because of my love and my compassion for him that I am asking it, not my love and compassion for myself, which I DO have. I don't necessarily believe that turning my back to him and letting him do all of this on his own is the right thing to do. My AB needs his friends and family MOST now. And to turn everything into "all about me", to me, is extremely selfish. Sure, he has to DO this on his own. But he has MADE the decision to be sober, once again in his life, and I am going to embrace that, and stand by him, and not judge him, and not say "ok buddy you are on your own now".
i'm sorry, that's just the way I think....
i'm sorry, that's just the way I think....
I'll still be there for him when he decides he wants to do it for himself, but I wont let myself be manipulated or get ill worrying while I wait for him to make the big decision.
I really feel for you both your positions, and I feel for the A's in your lives too. But I've learned that there's nothing I can really do for the A in mine till he does it himself.
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Something I learned that was by "being there," and "helping" so much, I was saying to the A in my life "you are not competent enough to do this on your own." When people continually treat you as though you cannot handle things, you begin to believe that you cannot handle things. The best thing I ever did was step back and say "you are an adult, you are perfectly capable of making your own decisions." When I left his life, his recovery, his choices all up to him, he found out for himself how capable he really was. It was a beautiful thing. I don't think he would have found his own strength and competence had I continued to act as though he couldn't do it on his own.
My two cents,
L
Additional thoughts about this. My need to help him was WAY more about me than him. It was all about my NEED to feel superior, my NEED to be needed, my NEED to see myself as this sweet, caring, selfless person. Yep, it was all about me. And not in a good way, lol.
My two cents,
L
Additional thoughts about this. My need to help him was WAY more about me than him. It was all about my NEED to feel superior, my NEED to be needed, my NEED to see myself as this sweet, caring, selfless person. Yep, it was all about me. And not in a good way, lol.
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That walk wasn't so long.
Ok. I am doing this to myself. All of it. I am making myself upset, I am allowing old horrible patterns to continue. I am letting myself be taken advantage of. Things are not any different. I am not acting any different. I am going to start right now. He isn't my problem, and he isn't my job. If he wants to pay me what he pays his therapist, I might consider it (just kidding.)
Things are at a fine point between us. I haven't done anything "wrong," I've been supportive. Time to leave things up to him, and not spend this outrageous amount of emotional effort trying to help.
Ok. I am doing this to myself. All of it. I am making myself upset, I am allowing old horrible patterns to continue. I am letting myself be taken advantage of. Things are not any different. I am not acting any different. I am going to start right now. He isn't my problem, and he isn't my job. If he wants to pay me what he pays his therapist, I might consider it (just kidding.)
Things are at a fine point between us. I haven't done anything "wrong," I've been supportive. Time to leave things up to him, and not spend this outrageous amount of emotional effort trying to help.
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Ok, I am ready to go. I compromised with myself. The next time he tries to talk to me about his drinking/quitting I have a phone number of a hotline for him. It's 24 hours, friendly, local, and it's...
NOT ME!
NOT ME!
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Originally Posted by good_luck
That walk wasn't so long.
Ok. I am doing this to myself. All of it. I am making myself upset, I am allowing old horrible patterns to continue. I am letting myself be taken advantage of. Things are not any different. I am not acting any different. I am going to start right now. He isn't my problem, and he isn't my job. If he wants to pay me what he pays his therapist, I might consider it (just kidding.)
Things are at a fine point between us. I haven't done anything "wrong," I've been supportive. Time to leave things up to him, and not spend this outrageous amount of emotional effort trying to help.
Ok. I am doing this to myself. All of it. I am making myself upset, I am allowing old horrible patterns to continue. I am letting myself be taken advantage of. Things are not any different. I am not acting any different. I am going to start right now. He isn't my problem, and he isn't my job. If he wants to pay me what he pays his therapist, I might consider it (just kidding.)
Things are at a fine point between us. I haven't done anything "wrong," I've been supportive. Time to leave things up to him, and not spend this outrageous amount of emotional effort trying to help.
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