He chose the bottle...
 

"He chose the bottle over me (us)." I have seen these words on this forum over and over and it concerns me. It implies that the bottle was more important than the people involved with the alcoholic. It implies that those very special and wonderful people involved with the alcoholic are unimportant or are being discarded. It makes me sad.

Unfortunately, I don't really believe that the alcoholic chooses the bottle over his/her loved ones. This disease is so awful. They don't choose to be alcoholic, and they have no control (choice) over it. Recovery for the alcoholic is like the insulin to the diabetic. Insulin doesn't cure the disease. And if the diabetic refuses to believe they are a diabetic and if they refuse to take their insulin or eat right, you can't force them to do it. They don't choose to be diabetic. They can't "will" themselves to get better any more than the diabetic can will themselves not to have diabetes.

I guess what I am trying to say is that we (loved ones of the A) are not unimportant. We are not "second" to the bottle. We are dealing with people with an insidious disease that literally damages their internal organs and their brain. They are very very sick people. Ultimately, it is not that they are choosing the bottle over you. They are in denial that they have a disease and they are refusing to "take their insulin" (recovery).

Since we can't force them to recognize their disease and we can't force them to recover, we have to do what we have to do for US (and our children or family).

I apologize if this sounds preachy. It just makes me sad to see so many of you putting yourselves in second place behind the bottle. Placing ourselves FIRST and recognizing that we ARE more important than the bottle is a tiny little baby step toward our own recovery.

Take care of yourselves!

gentle hugs

Kindeyes-:hug: not preaching at all...it is just that sometimes when those who are involved with an A...be it a friend, husband, wife, child, sibling, grandparent, Parent or whatever may have you-it takes them hitting their own bottom to allow themselves to know what you have said.

I know that when I was involved with an A it took me 3 years with him but 18 years in a whole to realize that no matter what I do that bottle is going to come before me and I have choices as an adult-so I finally reached a point where I had to make myself FIRST and I did! It helped me to cope better with my brother and others in my life that are unhealthy and choose the life they want-which I no longer have to be a part of anyone's life but my own! I did not know this as a child-I knew as an adult things were not right but it took me to hit my bottom to realize what I needed to do to change it! All the "preaching" words, suggestions had to sink into me until I actually GOT IT! It takes time.....just as it takes time to recover

Recovery is a wonderful thing if we work it!

Great words KindEyes! :hug:

In AA meetings we say that people "chose the bottle" because they have the disease of alcoholism which causes a dis-ease of life with out alcohol. Alcoholics are doing the best that they can which unfortunately isn't very good for loved ones and those closest too them. It is easier if we understand the disease and can apply what so many before us have applied to their loved ones. It is very hard to acknowledge a disease that turns people the the way alcohol does. It is so sad to see such strong, smart, funny, loving, talented flip in to mean, hateful, hurtful, destructive, disheveled soup sandwiches in a matter of hours.

I mourn the dreams that I thought I were coming true. It is ok to mourn something lost than to continue to dream something that would never really be.

I also don't see it as preaching. I see it as a reality check. Without even realizing it I was placing myself second- or third- last behind everyone else. My AH was always first. It did take me hitting bottom with his leaving for me to realize this. I am learning new things everyday about myself- and trying very hard not to be hurt by his words and actions. I have to tell myself to think about myself- it's not second nature. It's much easier (?) or maybe I'm so used to thinking about him that thinking about my needs and actions, words etc. is not as easy. Slowly I am getting the hang of it. Instead of focusing on him and what he left or why, I am trying to place myself first. Your post is just more of what I need to get me to where I'm going- on my own path. Thank you!

I think for many saying "they choose the bottle over me" is just another way of saying "they chose not to get into recovery." Its not the same in my view as thinking I am not as important as that bottle. Yes, alcoholism is a disease but it does involve choice in that no one pours that alcohol down their throats.

Barbara
This is so very true. I guess the sneaky way that this disease works is what is so puzzling. Why can one person drink occasionally and know when to stop and another needs more and more and more and more to just feel "normal". How does one know that they are headed toward dependency?

I'm doing fairly well at understanding my role as a co-dependent but I still don't think I understand the how's and why's of this disease very well. My son attended Lakeside Milam Recovery Center (yes...that Milam) and they did a fabulous job of explaining the metabolic differences between an alcoholic and person who can imbibe responsibly without heading down that slippery slope. But it is still a bit baffling....I don't want to get into the thought process that everyone who drinks around me is headed toward doom.

Slightly off topic but I'm just thinking this morning.....and boy....that can be dangerous!
hugs
ke

Alcoholics will tell you that the disease, alcohol, the bottle ect. were more important than the loved ones around them. I heard that myself multiple times when I went to A.A. meetings with my mother.

"It just makes me sad to see so many of you putting yourselves in second place behind the bottle."

The disease does that.

I mean, IMHO, we don't put ourselves second, the disease forces us to be second in the alcoholics life.

I guess I wonder though......did I allow myself to be in that "second" position? If I would have done something differently, would it still have happened? I know that I can't change the past but I am trying to reflect on my own behaviors and wonder if my son would have turned to alcohol anyway. I guess it's really a waste of my time to wonder that. What is just is. I guess I would like to talk to people who are in AA to better understand the disease from their perspective. Other than my son (who understandably) doesn't really want to talk to me about it, I haven't really talked to an alcoholic in recovery.

I attended open AA meetings; only once in a while now. There are many double winners in my Al-Anon groups, several of whom are my friends. I take their word for it: quit coddling the alcoholic and they chose to get sober on their own terms. One explained it to me this way: if you say to me I will leave you if you don't get sober, I don't give a damn. If you actually leave me, I might be forced to see the choices I am making.

I'm not saying everyone should leave; this is just an example. I think it sums up "actions, not words," which, in my opinion works for both the addict and non-addict.

Visiting the alcoholics forum here also is interesting and informative. One thing I really notice is the talk tends to be about their own recovery, not what is going on in the lives of those around them.

You may have a point...as individuals our perceptions and actions differ...but the one constant in the equation is alcohol or drugs (this applies to all addictions)...the addicted person puts him/herself second to the addiction so those in the near vicinity like family and friends are most certainly second or further down the list...we must always keep in mind that the addiction is all powerful until help is requested or pursued.

Sometimes in our borderline codependent love we allow treatment that we would otherwise find unacceptable...this too will end when we are no longer comfortable in that situation. JMHO (alcoholic in recovery)

My therapist asked me if I would stay with someone who was cheating on me. I said no. He then told me that staying with an alcoholic is essentially the same as staying with someone who is having an affair. It is their obsession, it is their passion, and it takes them outside of the relationship. It hurts the relationship, and they do it anyway. In fact, on those terms, it is a little worse. It's staying with someone who is having an affair right in front of you.

This made sense to me. I don't know if it's coming second or not, but it sucks.

I agree, Denny. I found the fast track to recovery the minute I realized that my alcoholic was focused on his recovery and I was focused on my alcoholic's recovery, too. Therefore nobody's attention was focused on me, so it's not surprising that I was stuck for so long. Then I realized it was a self-imposed immobilization and I could free myself.

The key is that WE don't put ourselves 2nd. The drugs/alcohol will do that to our qualifier. We are the only ones who can put ourselves second in our own lives if we dwell on them. Long ago I gave up the inquiry process about what caused it and taking blame. No need to beat myself up as AS's addiction already had me on the ropes. Though this is natural process for Mom's when we first learn that our sons + daughters are addicts.Something we have to work through in our own recovery to heal ourselves.
I do believe at this time that my AS is headed for doom. I think he is relapsing in a big way which is getting bigger. I will need to make some hard choices real soon if he will be allowed to cont. to live w/ me since he has been back for 3 1/2 mos. There is NO quick road to recovey for him.

To my X, I very much WAS in second position, after acquiring whatever substance he craved. There was nothing I could to about it.

To myself, I was never in second position. When I could no longer reconcile the two, and it became clear that it would never change, I was forced to leave.

If I am going to go to the work of being in a partnership, we have to be one another's number one (after self-nurturing of course) Healthy relationships are tricky enough without a Stoli bottle in bed between us.

In my case, he DID choose. I made him. Asked him to pick, either me or the beer. He picked the beer..........and even that wasn't enough to get me to leave. It took another year after that. :abcp: Duh!

L

Is that what that was? And all this time, I thought it meant that my boyfriend was happy to see me. :skillet

FD, Would you kindly give us a 'spew alert' before you make comments like that? I now have coffee all over my keyboard! :rof

O-tay.

Thank U! :)