Abuse versus addiction??

Old 07-12-2007, 01:29 PM
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Abuse versus addiction??

Im being told by an alcohol counseling professional that there is a difference between addiction and abuse...that is the reason for this process with my AH taking so long. There appears to be some confusion here.
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Old 07-12-2007, 01:33 PM
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i'm confused as to what you mean - why is the difference between the two making the process take so long?

to my knowledge, there is a big difference between the two. addiction is physically being incapable, or even unwilling, of stopping, even in the face of devastating circumstances or events. those who aren't addicted to alcohol can stop after having 2 drinks, or would probably even stop if their doctor told them it was slowly killing them.
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Old 07-12-2007, 01:38 PM
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The difference is which treatment plan they will force. They dont want him to go through a treatment plan that is for those who have lost control. His story and mine dont match up basically.
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Old 07-12-2007, 01:47 PM
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This is a copy of a thread I started a few weeks ago:

There seems to be a lot of discussion about abuse here these days, and whether or not addiction causes abuse. This book: 'Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men' by Lundy Bancroft (a therapist who works in an abusers program) opened my eyes and my mind to the fact that my ex is an abuser, period. Drugs or no drugs.
__________________________________

Here is some wisdom from this book:

The role that alcohol and drugs play in abusiveness is greatly misunderstood. A majority of abusers are not addicts, and even those who are mistreat their partners even when they are not using.

Addiction does not cause partner abuse, and recovery from addiction does not cure it, although a man's addictions can contribute in important ways to his cruelty or volatility. Ironically, it is not uncommon for abusers to actually get worse when in addiction recovery. There are many similarities in addicts and abusers, such as:

-Escalation

-Denial, minimization, and blaming

-Choosing approving peers

-Lying and manipulating

-Lack of predictability

-Defining roles for family members

-High rates of relapse

Differences in addiction and abuse include:

-Abusers don't 'hit bottom' unless it is in a legal sense. Abuse is not self-destructive, but it is highly destructive to others. Your life and sanity may slide down the tubes due to the way he treats you, but his won't.

-Addiction has short-term rewards (quick, easy pleasure and relief from emotional pain), but these rewards are usually relatively short-lived as the addicts life spins out of control. Abuse can be rewarding to the abuser for a life time. Abusers gain multiple benefits through their behavior that do no damage to them, only to others.
__________________________________________________ ______

Abuse is a problem that lies entirely within the abuser.....his thinking, his attitudes, his beliefs. Chronic mistreatment gets people to doubt themselves. When someone has invaded your identity in this way enough times, you naturally start to lose your balance. Lundy names these hallmarks of an abuser's mentality:

1) He is controlling. This control comes in many different forms, some more obvious than others.

2) He feels that he is entitled to special rights and priviliges that do not apply to his partner in the areas of physical, emotional, or sexual caretaking, and believes his partner should always defer to his wishes. He considers himself above criticism and accountability for his behavior.

3) He twists things into their opposites. ("I had to do it because she.....insert whatever here...")

4) He disrespects his partner and considers himself superior.

5) He confuses love and abuse. What he calls 'love' is more often a desire to have you devote your life to keeping him happy; the desire to possess and control you.

6) He is manipulative. He changes moods abruptly and frequently. He denies the obvious about what he is doing or feeling. He convinces you that what he wants you to do is best for you. He gets you to feel sorry for him. He gets you to blame yourself or others for what he does. He uses confusion tactives in arguments. He lies and misleads you about his actions, desires, and reasons for doing things. He tries to turn others against you.

7) He strives to have a good public image. Part of how he gets his power is by looking good in public.

8) He feels justified. He is a master at excuse-making. Everything is someone else's fault-usually yours.

9) He denies and minimizes his abuse. A woman can fell that she is losing her mind-or develop real psychiatric symptoms-if the obvious realities of her life are denied repeatedly by her partner.

10) He is possessive. They have a sense of ownership of their partners.

Abuse grows from attitudes and values, not feelings. The roots are ownership, the trunkis entitlement, and the branches are control.

Abuse and respect are opposites; abusers cannot changes unless they overcome their core of disrespect toward their partners.

Abusers are far more conscious of what they are doing than they appear to be. Their behaviors are driven by their core attitudes.

Abusers are UNWILLING to be nonabusive, not unable. They do not want to give up power and control.

You are not crazy. Trust your perceptions of how your abusive partner treats you.
________________________________

Again, the book is 'Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men' by Lundy Bancroft. I got it on Amazon.com. If abusiveness is part of your relationship, I encourage you to get it and read it.
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Old 07-12-2007, 01:55 PM
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What do YOU want for YOUR life, lover?
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Old 07-12-2007, 02:46 PM
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If we abuse our medication , we run the risk of becoming addicts.

I use drugs to abuse myself.
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Old 07-12-2007, 03:08 PM
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They are two separate issues. There are very informative stickies at the top of the Women in Recovery Forum and at the top of each of the family and friends forums regarding abuse. It would likely be helpful for you to read them all.

Thank you Duet for the gift of your time and benevolence to have posted that here.

I think this is a very misunderstood issue.

Also, there are great stickies re:addiction at the tops of the forums also.

Best wishes,
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Old 07-12-2007, 03:16 PM
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the OP was referring to Alcohol Abuse vs. Alcohol Addiction and the different treatments for one or the other.

L
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Old 07-12-2007, 03:17 PM
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I have heard this ,too........not abusuive person; alcohol abuse versus alcoholism. If it goes on for month after month and progresses over the years,wouldn't this be consisdered alcoholism and treated the same way?

We had a counselor say AH's drinking was abusive and that he was physically dependent,but he did not know if he was a "true alcoholic". (AH would not consider stopping,so I guess the point is moot).

I know my actions relate to what I want from life,not the definition given to him,but I found that very confusing information to give AH.

Maybe he was just a counselor who was ignorant about alcoholism....I think that is probably it. AH isn't "down and out" enough for this man's description of a "real alcoholic".

Last edited by Pick-a-name; 07-12-2007 at 03:39 PM.
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Old 07-12-2007, 03:33 PM
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oops, thanks for pointing that out.!
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Old 07-12-2007, 03:33 PM
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Yes, mine also had a counselor supposedly telling him that it was just alcohol abuse, not dependency. I begged to differ, but whatever.
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Old 07-12-2007, 03:46 PM
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to my knowledge, there is a big difference between the two. alcoholism is physically being incapable, or even unwilling, of stopping, even in the face of devastating circumstances or events. those who aren't alcoholic can stop after having 2 drinks, or would probably even stop if their doctor told them it was slowly killing them.
This. With the slight changes I made in italics.

Also, alcohol abusers, AKA "Heavy" or "Problem" drinkers are often just alcoholics in the early stages of the disease/condition.

Lastly, there is alcohol dependance. This is where the alcoholic suffers withdraw with abstinence. And I DO mean suffer.

It's confusing, because they are all closely inter-related.
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Old 07-12-2007, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by GlassPrisoner View Post
This. With the slight changes I made in italics.

Also, alcohol abusers, AKA "Heavy" or "Problem" drinkers are often just alcoholics in the early stages of the disease/condition.

Lastly, there is alcohol dependance. This is where the alcoholic suffers withdraw with abstinence. And I DO mean suffer.

It's confusing, because they are all closely inter-related.

Thanks....now,the big question. Are they treated differently? Wouldn't refraining from drinking be the logical answer to this problem for ALL types?

If you stop right there, I am leaning toward thinking it is abuse when you see there is a problem and decide to stop AND CAN, and can STAY stopped. Like drinking too much for a bit at college and then decided it was time to stop and just going on, dropping the drinking and craziness.

Those that deny there is a problem or can either not stop or stay stopped, seem to be dealing with another problem.....I would think that indicates alcoholism ( the craving or something).

Physical dependence probably would be seen in some alcoholics (daily drinkers or later stage).

Do these sound close?
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Old 07-12-2007, 06:22 PM
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It wasn't until I started dating my ex-ABF, who was definitely 'addicted' to alcohol that I realized that my ex-H wasn't addicted, but rather abused it. He enjoyed drinking as a past time. Always out with his friends drinking and have a grand ole time. Was the first one to wear the proverbial 'lampshade' at every gathering, drank, drank, drank. BUT....... he wasn't addicted to it. He just enjoyed it! Like I said it wasn't until I came face to face with a addict did I realize that there is definitely a difference. My ex-H had absolutely no problem quitting. When we separated, he just didn't have the extra money to go out to bars or even buy it so he stopped cold turkey. Just like that. No cravings or relapses. Just stopped drinking because he wasn't 'fun' anymore. Meanwhile, my ex-abf has been in and out of rehabs, lost his job, his family, his friends, basically his life and yet still craves the sh**. I don't have to be an expert to realize that there is definitely a difference between abuse and addiction! At least from my experience. Jo
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Old 07-12-2007, 07:00 PM
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sorry for the miscue on the abuse thing...I get it now. You are talking about substance ABUSE vs. substance addiction.

This is just my 2 cents and not an expert view or anything, but my exah claims he is not an addict because he is not 'physically' addicted, meaning he doesn't think he has withdrawls when he quits using (which I would beg to differ because he would complain of muscle pain, etc, when he didn't have oxy), but be that as it may......

IMHO, anytime drug or alcohol use is bad enough to cause problems in family relationships, jobs, etc., then a line has been crossed. In my situation, I couldn't care less at this point what name a doctor or counselor pins on what my exah has done. The bottom line is that his use has caused multiple serious problems with myself and my children, and he refuses to see that or accept any responsiblity for it.
So the only thing I could do is set boundaries and seperate us from his use, and thus from him.

I'm not sure a therapist or doctor can really tell the difference anyway; the people who live with the person in question are much more qualified to determine whether or not the use is serious enough to cause problems.
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Old 07-12-2007, 10:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Pick-a-name View Post
Thanks....now,the big question. Are they treated differently? Wouldn't refraining from drinking be the logical answer to this problem for ALL types?

If you stop right there, I am leaning toward thinking it is abuse when you see there is a problem and decide to stop AND CAN, and can STAY stopped. Like drinking too much for a bit at college and then decided it was time to stop and just going on, dropping the drinking and craziness.

Those that deny there is a problem or can either not stop or stay stopped, seem to be dealing with another problem.....I would think that indicates alcoholism ( the craving or something).

Physical dependence probably would be seen in some alcoholics (daily drinkers or later stage).

Do these sound close?
IMO, you nailed it.
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Old 07-13-2007, 12:28 PM
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The American Psychiatric Association has developed strict criteria for the clinical diagnosis of abuse and dependence. The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual�IV (DSM-IV) defines abuse as:

* A maladaptive pattern of substance use leading to clinically significant impairment or distress, as manifested by one (or more) of the following, occurring within a 12-month period:
1. recurrent substance use resulting in a failure to fulfill major role obligations at work, school, home (e.g., repeated absences or poor work performance related to substance use; substance-related absences, suspensions, or expulsions from school; neglect of children or household)
2. recurrent substance use in situations in which it is physically hazardous (e.g., driving an automobile or operating a machine when impaired by substance use)
3. recurrent substance-related legal problems (e.g., arrests for substance-related disorderly conduct)
4. continued substance use despite having persistent or recurrent social or interpersonal problems caused or exacerbated by the effects of the substance (e.g., arguments with spouse about consequences of intoxication, physical fights)
* The symptoms have never met the criteria for Substance Dependence for this class of substances.

[DSM-IV, Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, ed. 4. Washington DC: American Psychiatric Association (AMA). 1994.]

Most often, abuse is diagnosed in individuals who recently began using alcohol. Over time, abuse may progress to dependence. However, some alcohol users abuse alcohol for long periods without developing dependence.

Dependence is suspected when alcohol use is accompanied by signs of the following:

* Abuse
* Compulsive drinking behavior
* Tolerance
* Withdrawal

DSM-IV defines dependence as:

* A maladaptive pattern of substance use, leading to clinically significant impairment or distress, as manifested by three (or more) of the following, occurring at any time in the same 12-month period:
1. tolerance, as defined by either of the following:
o a need for markedly increased amounts of the substance to achieve intoxication or desired effect
o markedly diminished effect with continued use of the same amount of substance
2. withdrawal, as manifested by either of the following:
o the characteristic withdrawal syndrome for the substance
o the same (or a closely related) substance is taken to relieve or avoid withdrawal symptoms
3. the substance is often taken in larger amounts or over a longer period than was intended
4. there is a persistent desire or unsuccessful efforts to cut down or control substance use
5. a great deal of time is spent in activities to obtain the substance, use the substance, or recover from its effects
6. important social, occupational or recreational activities are given up or reduced because of substance use
7. the substance use is continued despite knowledge of having a persistent or recurrent physical or psychological problem that is likely to have been caused or exacerbated by the substance (e.g., continued drinking despite recognition that an ulcer was made worse by alcohol consumption)

[DSM-IV, Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, ed. 4. Washington DC: American Psychiatric Association (AMA). 1994.]
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