Is an active addict capable of being in love?
Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Booneyville USA
Posts: 246
Many people seem to believe the answer is no because the addict doesn't love themself so how could they love you? I'm not sure I agree with that (or I think its too painful to agree with that!). I guess it depends on how you define LOVE. I would certainly like to believe they can be in love but unfortunately addiction is stronger than love so I'm not sure it really matters anyway. It would probably be easier to believe they AREN'T capable of loving because then we could certainly let go of them a lot easier. But when you are with an active addict its hard to tell what is real and what is manipulation. You see glimpses of what you would like to believe is love (and what may very well be love at that particular moment). But is it real enough and shown often enough to sustain a relationship with that person? That's all an individual thing I guess. My own personal thought is that if the relationship hurts more than it helps then it isn't love. If it isn't nurturing and giving then it isn't love. Just my opinion. I'm sure some wiser people will answer you shortly 
Member
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: oh
Posts: 757
they may love you, but hold up a can of beer or a bottle to them and ask them to choose between it and you, or ask them not to take that drink for you- see what happens 
i can no longer accept coming in second to alcohol, or sharing my partner with it, or being with someone who would choose it over me.
addiction is much the same as an affair. the Alcoholic's love affair is with the bottle.
i can no longer accept coming in second to alcohol, or sharing my partner with it, or being with someone who would choose it over me.
addiction is much the same as an affair. the Alcoholic's love affair is with the bottle.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: ft. bend texas
Posts: 179
Originally Posted by hopeangel 
they may love you, but hold up a can of beer or a bottle to them and ask them to choose between it and you, or ask them not to take that drink for you- see what happens
i can no longer accept coming in second to alcohol, or sharing my partner with it, or being with someone who would choose it over me.
addiction is much the same as an affair. the Alcoholic's love affair is with the bottle.
i can no longer accept coming in second to alcohol, or sharing my partner with it, or being with someone who would choose it over me.
addiction is much the same as an affair. the Alcoholic's love affair is with the bottle.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: southern indiana
Posts: 2,145
in my personal experience with my xah, and with other addicts that i have known.....the desire for the addiction to survive overshadowed all other aspects of humanity.
imho, all i have experienced with the alcohoic in my life.......it's certainly not the kind of love i want or need.
think of this.....even child molesters, murderers, or other people that commit heinous crimes, often declare their deep love for their victims, and can often time justify their actions by claiming they were protecting their loved ones or showing love to them in some twisted way.
imo....an altered mind is not capable of healthy relationships. jmho.
imho, all i have experienced with the alcohoic in my life.......it's certainly not the kind of love i want or need.
think of this.....even child molesters, murderers, or other people that commit heinous crimes, often declare their deep love for their victims, and can often time justify their actions by claiming they were protecting their loved ones or showing love to them in some twisted way.
imo....an altered mind is not capable of healthy relationships. jmho.
Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: FREEDOM
Posts: 665
I think A's can love. But like everything else in their lives, its dysfunctional.
All of us have been given the gift of the emotion of love. The spirits (hp) don't differentiate between people. It's up to us how it plays in our lives.
With that simple concept, sometimes we turn our back on it. For whatever reason. Funny, though, it keeps "popping up" in our core. We feel it and express it.
The difference is being able to maintain it. Not let the "mortal" in us take over.
An alcoholic lets the mortal lure of alcohol interfere
Maybe a simplistic view, but I can't reconcile that ANYONE can't love.
But then again, I'm a peace LOVING hippie,,,
Peace
All of us have been given the gift of the emotion of love. The spirits (hp) don't differentiate between people. It's up to us how it plays in our lives.
With that simple concept, sometimes we turn our back on it. For whatever reason. Funny, though, it keeps "popping up" in our core. We feel it and express it.
The difference is being able to maintain it. Not let the "mortal" in us take over.
An alcoholic lets the mortal lure of alcohol interfere
Maybe a simplistic view, but I can't reconcile that ANYONE can't love.
But then again, I'm a peace LOVING hippie,,,
Peace
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Backwoods, PA
Posts: 223
I think that they can love, but not in a healthy way.
I think they NEED others.
My exabf loved his alcohol, he needed me to be his partner/cook/slave, so that he had more time to drink his alcohol.
When my sister was diagnosed with chronic pancreatitis, the doctor told her that she was killing herself with the booze. Shortly after that, she was holding her baby daughter in one arm and a beer bottle in the other. I said to her, "You need to decide which is more important. Your baby or your beer?" She's still drinking.
I think they NEED others.
My exabf loved his alcohol, he needed me to be his partner/cook/slave, so that he had more time to drink his alcohol.
When my sister was diagnosed with chronic pancreatitis, the doctor told her that she was killing herself with the booze. Shortly after that, she was holding her baby daughter in one arm and a beer bottle in the other. I said to her, "You need to decide which is more important. Your baby or your beer?" She's still drinking.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: where the streets have no name
Posts: 1,078
I hate 2 say it. When alcoholism set in my wife love of alcohol and alcohol related activities/people gradually replaced her love for our family, including a little girl.
She said she would stay with me me her entire life but in actuality that meant to keep me as a good enabler. Nice house, nice cars, etc etc. I watched her deteriorate and it broke my heart being powerless to help. There were moments when she had horrendous hangovers, lying in bed and reaching her hand to hold my hand. I asked her why she hurts herself so much. Those moment brought tears to me as does recalling them. Deep inside the love still exists however I believe the addiction does not allow it to express itself normally.
God bless you all...................
She said she would stay with me me her entire life but in actuality that meant to keep me as a good enabler. Nice house, nice cars, etc etc. I watched her deteriorate and it broke my heart being powerless to help. There were moments when she had horrendous hangovers, lying in bed and reaching her hand to hold my hand. I asked her why she hurts herself so much. Those moment brought tears to me as does recalling them. Deep inside the love still exists however I believe the addiction does not allow it to express itself normally.
God bless you all...................
full of hope
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 1,170
I think our idea of love is warped sometimes. My husband loves me even though he is an alcoholic just like I love him even though I'm codependent.
Does someone who loves and isn't an addict love better than the rest of us?
I hate the idea that he loves alcohol more than me. And even though that may seem to be the case most days, I try to remember that he isn't well. He is an addict.
I have been sitting here staring this thread for 10 minutes trying to figure out if he loves me.
He loves me and I love him.
You know what, I just noticed the original question wasn't are they capable of loving but are they capable of being IN love.
Is there a difference? Can they love us and be in love with alcohol?
Does someone who loves and isn't an addict love better than the rest of us?
I hate the idea that he loves alcohol more than me. And even though that may seem to be the case most days, I try to remember that he isn't well. He is an addict.
I have been sitting here staring this thread for 10 minutes trying to figure out if he loves me.
He loves me and I love him.
You know what, I just noticed the original question wasn't are they capable of loving but are they capable of being IN love.
Is there a difference? Can they love us and be in love with alcohol?
A work in progress....
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: FREE!!!! Somewhere in the Tennessee Mountains
Posts: 1,018
I have come to the conclusion that, for me, when my exah said that he loved me, he meant it. The problem was that he described the powerful emotions he felt toward me as 'love' when in fact they were really a need to possess and contol me (my marriage involved abuse and addiction).
He felt a powerful desire to RECEIVE my love and caretaking, but he only wanted to GIVE love when it was convenient for him. He desired for me to devote my entire life to making him happy, and every time he wasn't happy he blamed me. (In a lot of ways, I did the same things to him which was a hard truth to swallow.....)
Genuine love means respecting the humanity of the other person, wanting what is best for him or her, supporting the other person's self-esteem and independence.
This kind of healthy love is simply not compatible with addiction and abuse. Just my opinion.
He felt a powerful desire to RECEIVE my love and caretaking, but he only wanted to GIVE love when it was convenient for him. He desired for me to devote my entire life to making him happy, and every time he wasn't happy he blamed me. (In a lot of ways, I did the same things to him which was a hard truth to swallow.....)
Genuine love means respecting the humanity of the other person, wanting what is best for him or her, supporting the other person's self-esteem and independence.
This kind of healthy love is simply not compatible with addiction and abuse. Just my opinion.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Keepin' my side of the litterbox clean
Posts: 2,136
That's a tough question for me, and one to which I've given a lot of thought over time. I can only speak from my own experience as the one on the receiving end of what AH once called "love." He hasn't actually said he loves me in a very long time. He used to show it, sometimes in ways I would consider pretty normal. However, as this alcoholism has worsened it seems that he's reverted to the sort of needy, clinging love a two-year-old would exhibit while hanging onto mommy's knees and whining for a candy bar. I don't know if that makes much sense.
Anyway, it's almost as if I'm a body he can have around to sit with in the evening watching t.v. He'll meander on about nothing in particular, not particularly coherent. It's sad. I guess I've been relegated to an audience-of-one.
Did he ever love me in the conventional sense of the word? I don't think so. He was too busy buying me by doing things for me. However, the things he did, in hindsight, fit his agenda of what would make me happy, not mine. I don't recall him suggesting we do things together that would interest me, or actually initiating such undertakings. I made plans that I thought would interest both of us, and he gladly went along with my plans. Of course, that was when he actually showed an interest in doing anything with me. Those days are long gone too. So sad ....
Anyway, it's almost as if I'm a body he can have around to sit with in the evening watching t.v. He'll meander on about nothing in particular, not particularly coherent. It's sad. I guess I've been relegated to an audience-of-one.
Did he ever love me in the conventional sense of the word? I don't think so. He was too busy buying me by doing things for me. However, the things he did, in hindsight, fit his agenda of what would make me happy, not mine. I don't recall him suggesting we do things together that would interest me, or actually initiating such undertakings. I made plans that I thought would interest both of us, and he gladly went along with my plans. Of course, that was when he actually showed an interest in doing anything with me. Those days are long gone too. So sad ....
Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: England
Posts: 3,410
There are as many definitions of love as there are people in the world.
I always come back to this post when this questions comes up:
I always come back to this post when this questions comes up:
What Addicts Do
My name's Jon. I'm an addict. And this is what addicts do. You cannot nor will not change my behavior. You cannot make me treat you better, let alone with any respect. All I care about, all I think about, is my needs and how to go about fufilling them. You are a tool to me, something to use. When I say I love you I am lying through my teeth, because love is impossible for someone in active addiction. I wouldn't be using if I loved myself, and since I don't, I cannot love you.
My feelings are so pushed down and numbed by my drugs that I could be considered sociopathic. I have no empathy for you or anyone else. It doesn't faze me that I hurt you, leave you hungry, lie to you, cheat on you and steal from you.
My behavior cannot and will not change until i make a decison to stop using/drinking and then follow it up with a plan of action.
And until I make that decsion, I will hurt you again and again and again.
Stop being surprised.
I am an addict. And that's what addicts do.
My name's Jon. I'm an addict. And this is what addicts do. You cannot nor will not change my behavior. You cannot make me treat you better, let alone with any respect. All I care about, all I think about, is my needs and how to go about fufilling them. You are a tool to me, something to use. When I say I love you I am lying through my teeth, because love is impossible for someone in active addiction. I wouldn't be using if I loved myself, and since I don't, I cannot love you.
My feelings are so pushed down and numbed by my drugs that I could be considered sociopathic. I have no empathy for you or anyone else. It doesn't faze me that I hurt you, leave you hungry, lie to you, cheat on you and steal from you.
My behavior cannot and will not change until i make a decison to stop using/drinking and then follow it up with a plan of action.
And until I make that decsion, I will hurt you again and again and again.
Stop being surprised.
I am an addict. And that's what addicts do.
Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: England
Posts: 3,410
Chero, that was written by the founder of this site, Jon. It is the most honest depiction of the thinking of an active drinker I have ever read and I am forever grateful that he was able to share that with us.
I get slated sometimes on here for not so subtly implying that the drinkers do not give a fig about their partners and families, but I am afraid that their actions say it all. Drinking may be a reason, but it is a lame excuse.
I get slated sometimes on here for not so subtly implying that the drinkers do not give a fig about their partners and families, but I am afraid that their actions say it all. Drinking may be a reason, but it is a lame excuse.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 240
Minnie, thank you for sharing that powerful passage. It is very hard to read, but when I really think about what my AH says and does both when he's drinking and "dry" (NOT recovered, just taking a short break), it's the absolute cold truth. If he loves me at all anymore, it is buried far beneath his disease and all that's come along with it in the past few years. When I asked him to leave, his Mother took him in and picked up where I left off. I heard from him less and less as he no longer needed me to "fuel" his disease. He had a new enabler. Nope, I don't think an active alcoholic can truly love or be in love. Sad, but true.
Becoming a Butterfly
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 904
I honestly don't feel my exAH was like John's quote. He never stole or cheated, wokred hard and brought home good money, and he only lied about drinking. He was honest about everything else. I feel quite confident that he loved me and still does.
By the end of our marriage I saw him passed out on the couch more than I saw him sober. He drove drunk no matter how much I tried to stop him. It wasn't lack of love - it was too much beer that ended it.
I do believe that, back when he was active, if he had to choose between me and beer he would have self-destructed like a computer that's been set to solve pi.
By the end of our marriage I saw him passed out on the couch more than I saw him sober. He drove drunk no matter how much I tried to stop him. It wasn't lack of love - it was too much beer that ended it.
I do believe that, back when he was active, if he had to choose between me and beer he would have self-destructed like a computer that's been set to solve pi.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Seattle, wa
Posts: 118
I so wanted to belive my xabf loved me. And maybe he did in some way. But was it healthy love? no I do not believe it was....ever. And it took me way too long to realize it and he still doesnt. He still has his denile, deception, and he still wants his alcohol over our relationship.
...healthy love is what we strive for from here......and I begin with loving me first
...healthy love is what we strive for from here......and I begin with loving me first
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