A "Hand Up",,,,,
 

With all the crap I've gone through with my A this week regarding the new job and him asking me for "help" until he gets on his feet I wondered about a term he used,,,

"I'm not asking for a hand out, instead, a hand up"

I'm curious, is this a term used in AA?

What's the difference?!?!?

My past expereince with him is that he uses the "slogans" when they suit his purpose at the time. But this one confuses me.

Peace

A "hand up" is absolutely an AA slogan. The idea is that the A is not looking for an enabler, but for genuine help in moving forward with life and recovery. The problem is, I agree with you that A's often use those slogans in a manipulative way. There is nothing wrong with looking for a "hand up". Everyone can use a helping hand at times. However, IMHO your alcoholic is approaching the wrong person for this help. I am assuming that at some point in your history together, you inadvertently enabled him in some way. By coming to you, who has (from what I can see) taken steps to detach from him, he is most likely expecting you to once again provide for him in some way, and get him out of a difficult situation. It is an unfair position to put you in, and my feeling is that if he was as far along in his recovery as he says, he would know that and would never put you in such a difficult place. The whole thing smacks of manipulation to me, even if only on a subconcsious level. Remember, A's are masterful liars, especially to themselves.

Wow! I had to *shake* my head a few times! Caity is correct! My XA never used this because he was not in AA and with me.

However-my brother was KING of using this quote refering to my mother when speaking to me! "All I want is a "hand up" from Mom" and all she does is just complain! Well..........................paid for an attorney to get him out of his mess more than 3 times! Paid for a roof over his head-paid for a car for him, put gas into it....oh and wait when he was out on his ass again after she enabled him...she put him under her roof-gave him food, shelter, support in every shape and form.

When my Mom decided not to enable him (except for the roof over his head) he began AA again-started doing things for himself-really started making a life for himself-("cough") it was a grand show of manipulation! "HANDS UP"

As Caity said "A's are masterful liars, especially to themselves."

(((HUGS CE)))) Careful on that one!

oh, i so needed to hear this today. thank you! k

Never heard the term. I've worked the steps, and been in the rooms for 8 months.

Most recovering alcoholics I know are just the opposite. Although we are taught to be less self-reliant, we are the last ones in the world to ever ask for help.

I've never heard that used either and I've been making at least a meeting every night for 2+ years, but I can see how we'd use it, even to manipulate.

Can't disagee with being a masterful liar.

Astro and Glass maybe it is an assumption on my part then I apologize for sure.

My brother has been in and out of AA mostly in now for close to 4 years-maybe he is just king of the masterful liars and with that being said that it is the chosen words of one!?

Could be a geographic thing, Rella. Even though we follow much the same format and use the same slogans, there are some differences across the country.

Hey, I thought I was King Of The Liars, and there can only be one King! Bwaaaaaahahahahaha!!!!!!!

;) haha

bowing down to the king..

i like "hands up". i don't care where it came from. makes sense to me.

k

And could be a geographic thing possible? He is in Florida...so who knows!

I now crown Astro and Pick-A-Name the two kings of SR!

LOL...my GF had 8 years clean and sober and when the monster
came after she relasped...it started throwing the program at me..
or use the program against me...it messed me up bad...

yes.. i heard of it before..becuase I lot of AA newbies has a hard
time asking for help becuase of pride...getting a hand out
so oldtimes came up with ..it's a hand up

okay...let the AA people give him the hand up...
you're a codi..when you do that it's call enabling..lol

a little bit of contact messes with ya..dosn't it ?

here's the kicker that clears it up "check your motive"

I've heard that one a few times.
Seems congruent with him asking you to be his sponsor. Has he asked that lately? The words are program words but thats about all I hear that sounds related to aa. Im pretty sure the 12 steps and traditions are not fundamentally sucessful when abused and manipulated to serve ones selfish motivations.

My ex was super fond of this game. He would bust them out like there was no tomorrow. "Babe, its progress not perfection" and "this isnt about you". Then pop into the bathroom for a quick pint. Barf.

I once told my ex that since he was so comfortable throwing out program lingo, he was surely comfortable enough to ask another member or sponsor for a hand up. Because, afterall, this 'isnt about me' babe.

Can you say UNDERSTATEMENT SaTIT,,,

But I'm coming around,,,,lol,,,that l'il native hippie chick is peeking her head out again,,funny how she resembles a TURTLE for days after there's contact.

No worrys', I saw the statement for what it was. just another attempt to manipulate and wake up the sleeping giant GUILT.

As Rella perfectly illustrated with her brother. My A would do what your brother did to your Mom. If I didn't give him the "hand up" the next act of the drama would of been him doing it hiself and then telling me how everyone ELSE was there for him, giving him the "hand up"

Course, he would never ask anyone else for a "hand up" so i KNEW it was an attempt to smooze my codie self

And frankly, it pissed me the hell off! It definately was an indication of no regard for ME. I may be simple, but I ain't STUPID

I can see where it would be used in the rooms of AA (geographical or not) Because as SaTIT says, it is used by other A's to encourage the newbies to ask for help.

But yup, typical of my A, use it where ever it fits HIS scenerio.

So, would you say the "true" meaning of a "hand up" in AA would be answering the phone if your number was the one he called on the phone list, giving him a ride to a meeting cause he doesn't have a vehicle, spending time after a meeting talking on the curb till late in the night, or even buyin the coffee when the small group gets together after the meeting?

Peace

Nah, that's just service work. Do it all the time.

I was short on rent the other day. Another A said he had the money if I needed it, which I declined (Of course). The next day, I DID call him, and made the rent. I paid him back 3 days later. That would probably be a good example.