He wants to keep in touch with female RA's from Rehab
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: where the streets have no name
Posts: 1,078
I recall reading something from medical professionals(rehab) that spoke of how the loved ones still need to detach during recovery citing feelings of jealousy towards people the A may be associating with in recovery. In my humble opinion, it is understandable how a newly recovering alcoholic can relate better to others in recovery than to their non alcoholic SANE RATIONAL loved ones. I have heard how important it is for someone inrecovery to not associate with active addicts.
Personally, having lived through seeing a lovely. bright, person turn into a character from "night of the living dead" I would not expect too much too soon in recovery.
Its funny, over the last year or two I seem to have developed friendships with alanon members and/or recovering alcoholics that might be viewed as bizarre. Some friends in recovery relate to OUR dilemma better than anyone who has never lived with addiction. Some of my friends that never lived with addiction are ticked off at the time i spend with the so called "drunks" albeit drunks in recovery.
For me the best thing is staying busy. I dont even know that if I had a girlfriend she would not be upset with the time i spend on these forums.
Personally, having lived through seeing a lovely. bright, person turn into a character from "night of the living dead" I would not expect too much too soon in recovery.
Its funny, over the last year or two I seem to have developed friendships with alanon members and/or recovering alcoholics that might be viewed as bizarre. Some friends in recovery relate to OUR dilemma better than anyone who has never lived with addiction. Some of my friends that never lived with addiction are ticked off at the time i spend with the so called "drunks" albeit drunks in recovery.
For me the best thing is staying busy. I dont even know that if I had a girlfriend she would not be upset with the time i spend on these forums.
Recovering Nicely
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 935
Update on Conversation
Hi All, Talked to RAH this morning. He said at first he misunderstood me cause he thought I was mad that he was putting all of his energy into AA right now, until I explained that it was just the phone nos. of the women. He apologized for upsetting me and said he understands where I was coming from. He brought up the incident when I got the ride home from that guy and he was all mad. He said they said at rehab that everybody should take a list of all numbers and keep in touch. He said he already told the women no exchanging numbers, and that the guys there made fun of him. Anyway, I guess I have to believe him (I don't think he's ever lied to me, except about drinking). Maybe he's not the one quacking, maybe I'm just looking for excuses. I really hope not.
the girl can't help it
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: splendraville
Posts: 5,599
I don't know why they just can't help hurting us((((queenteree))). Here is hoping you will both have the space and detachment it takes to be who you really are.
You may or may not know I have been asking my H to leave for well over a year now. My H is a womanizer he says he is not but, I know different he uses crack too. I told him last night I don't know how I got hooked up with someone who has to such obvious "deal breakers" for me. I told him that I am not judging him as wrong just what he does is hurtful to me and that makes it wrong for me...
I asked him did he enjoy being with me he said no he does not and I then asked him how soon could he move. I don't want any big drama I ain't trying to be mean I am just done done done....
You may or may not know I have been asking my H to leave for well over a year now. My H is a womanizer he says he is not but, I know different he uses crack too. I told him last night I don't know how I got hooked up with someone who has to such obvious "deal breakers" for me. I told him that I am not judging him as wrong just what he does is hurtful to me and that makes it wrong for me...
I asked him did he enjoy being with me he said no he does not and I then asked him how soon could he move. I don't want any big drama I ain't trying to be mean I am just done done done....
Let Go Let God
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: jersey shore
Posts: 437
Hey QT . sorry I am jumping in to this late but I have real strong opinions on this subject .. Let me share .
The first rehab my ah went into was last May (06) . he went in on a Tues and I delvd our 4th child via c-section alone in a new hospital 3 days later (I was 2 wks early , go figure) After 4 days in the hospital , I came home to my other 3 kids , all in grammar school . No time to heal , lunches needed to be made , homework was due and the baby was nursing ! After he came out of rehab , about 4 days after I was out of the hospital he left for the day to help his uncle who lived 2 hrs away ... huh ??? About 2 wks after that I got a phone call from a member of HIS family telling me how sorry she was for what happened . I didnt understand and when she realized I had no idea what she was talking about she tried to back pedal ... Eventually she told me .. Abt 1 wk after he was out of rehab he went to his moms for the day , met his new girl(just a friend!!!)friend at the house and went horseback riding with her and spent the day together . I was livid . While I was in the hospital delivering a baby , he was making nicey nice with some chic in a rehab ????
I told him under no circumstances does any woman , married or not , have any right to become friends with a man who is another womans husband ... NO WAY ! He has plenty of female friends who are married to his high school buddys who he has known long before he met me that he can call if he nds a womans view on something. This just does not fly in my world.
The truth was right in front of me ... he was still drinking and so was she . he wasnt serious yet about his recovery or about us ... he was still defensive and argumentative .. I agree with Laurie , awakening my arse !
Stick to your guns .. there is no reason your ah needs to put himself in that position , its not about you being a little jealous , its about you seeing whats right in front of you .
big (())s
The first rehab my ah went into was last May (06) . he went in on a Tues and I delvd our 4th child via c-section alone in a new hospital 3 days later (I was 2 wks early , go figure) After 4 days in the hospital , I came home to my other 3 kids , all in grammar school . No time to heal , lunches needed to be made , homework was due and the baby was nursing ! After he came out of rehab , about 4 days after I was out of the hospital he left for the day to help his uncle who lived 2 hrs away ... huh ??? About 2 wks after that I got a phone call from a member of HIS family telling me how sorry she was for what happened . I didnt understand and when she realized I had no idea what she was talking about she tried to back pedal ... Eventually she told me .. Abt 1 wk after he was out of rehab he went to his moms for the day , met his new girl(just a friend!!!)friend at the house and went horseback riding with her and spent the day together . I was livid . While I was in the hospital delivering a baby , he was making nicey nice with some chic in a rehab ????
I told him under no circumstances does any woman , married or not , have any right to become friends with a man who is another womans husband ... NO WAY ! He has plenty of female friends who are married to his high school buddys who he has known long before he met me that he can call if he nds a womans view on something. This just does not fly in my world.
The truth was right in front of me ... he was still drinking and so was she . he wasnt serious yet about his recovery or about us ... he was still defensive and argumentative .. I agree with Laurie , awakening my arse !
Stick to your guns .. there is no reason your ah needs to put himself in that position , its not about you being a little jealous , its about you seeing whats right in front of you .
big (())s
Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 240
Your post brings back an overwhelming feeling of anger that I have with regard to this very subject! My AH went to rehab back in early March. I went attended 2 family days and couple counseling while he was there for a total of 3 visits. He was d/c on a Friday. On the following Wednesday, he had to go out of town on "business". He drove to another state to meet up with some woman he met in rehab. She even met me during one of the family visits. He stayed there for 3 nights..."on her couch". I drove there and dragged him home. I don't know if anything physical happened between them - he actually spent one of those three nights in the ER for alcohol poisoning, but the intent and emotional connection was certainly there. Of all the rotten things my AH husband has done, the thought of infidelity never, never, never crossed my mind during our entire marriage - not when he was drunk or sober.
He kept saying "She understands me. You'll never know what it's like to be an alcoholic. (You think?!?) Blah, Blah, Blah."
The pig. I could kick myself for not leaving him there. I firmly believe that connections between men and women in recovery is just asking for trouble. But I'm a little jaded on the subject...Glad to hear that your AH is understanding of your feelings and has at least discussed the subject of his new friends with you beforehand.
He kept saying "She understands me. You'll never know what it's like to be an alcoholic. (You think?!?) Blah, Blah, Blah."
The pig. I could kick myself for not leaving him there. I firmly believe that connections between men and women in recovery is just asking for trouble. But I'm a little jaded on the subject...Glad to hear that your AH is understanding of your feelings and has at least discussed the subject of his new friends with you beforehand.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: where the streets have no name
Posts: 1,078
Emotions 101;
Jealousy.. can be counterproductive and even disabling. Its like resentment in a way, that is like holding on to hot coals in your hand... it will only burn you.
One thing I have learned is you can cancel reason. logic, the application of otherwise normal thoughts and reactions when dealing with an addict until they are significantly recovered.
Remember one of the prime directives... you cannot control it. Therefore why frustrate yourself with counterproductive emotions.
If my AW were to break through denial and enter rehab, I'd be so happy that a chance at becoming reacquainted with the lovely person I used to know could help me stay detached awaiting the final result.
Why get angry about something you KNOW you cannot control?
Jealousy.. can be counterproductive and even disabling. Its like resentment in a way, that is like holding on to hot coals in your hand... it will only burn you.
One thing I have learned is you can cancel reason. logic, the application of otherwise normal thoughts and reactions when dealing with an addict until they are significantly recovered.
Remember one of the prime directives... you cannot control it. Therefore why frustrate yourself with counterproductive emotions.
If my AW were to break through denial and enter rehab, I'd be so happy that a chance at becoming reacquainted with the lovely person I used to know could help me stay detached awaiting the final result.
Why get angry about something you KNOW you cannot control?
Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: OHIO
Posts: 959
JMHO - but here it is....
The 13th step starts out with of what? FRIENDSHIP...seldom do two recovering male and female people decide to just hop in the sack together....of course it has to start out with friendship first and then it goes to another level.....thats usually when marriages start to feel the influence of this new friendship...
Time will tell what he is doing with his new friends hunny - just keep your ears and eyes open...and be prepared for just about anything...
Hugs to you girl..
Janit
The 13th step starts out with of what? FRIENDSHIP...seldom do two recovering male and female people decide to just hop in the sack together....of course it has to start out with friendship first and then it goes to another level.....thats usually when marriages start to feel the influence of this new friendship...
Time will tell what he is doing with his new friends hunny - just keep your ears and eyes open...and be prepared for just about anything...
Hugs to you girl..
Janit
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Join Date: Feb 2007
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Hello? Why can't he have men friends? Why does he need to keep in touch with the women?
Men stick with men, women stick with women in recovery, ESPECIALLY early recovery.
Earthworm
Men stick with men, women stick with women in recovery, ESPECIALLY early recovery.
Earthworm
Originally Posted by queenteree 
Hi All,
Tonite I spoke with RAH from rehab and he said he finally got it, had his spiritual awakening. I was very happy for him. Then he said when he comes home he's going to keep in touch with Lisa, Christine, etc. Oh yeah, that's great news to hear. There are guys there that he can keep in touch with, but with the women! Single (divorced) women yet. Call me jealous (and yes I am a little bit), but I don't believe a married man should keep in touch, be friends with and be there for a single/divorced woman who he met in rehab. If they were married, it may be a different story, but from stories I have heard, I really have my doubts about this. I flat out told him that I don't feel comfortable with the situation, and that if it were me having single/divorced men friends that I would go out with for coffee, be there for them in crisises, etc., I don't think he would appreciate it. He said he's sorry he told me this, now "we're arguing" (according to him). I told him I wasn't arguing, I just simply stated my point and that I don't want to mess with his recovery, so he should do what's best for him, and if that means having women friends, so be it. Then he said "no, you're mad". I told him "I gotta go" and hung up the phone. He called me back but I let the answering machine pick up. So here I am, babysitting my two granddaughters, working all the time he's up there, traveling 8 hours on a Saturday to visit him, doing his laundry, paying the bills and he has the nerve to say this to me. What does he think I am, stupid? Call me oldfashioned, but I don't believe married men should have single/divorced women as friends, especially if they haven't known them a long time and met them in rehab. I know many of you won't agree, but I know what I have read here and also know of with people I know. But you know what, I was kind of expecting this, and I guess right now they're all telling him that he shouldn't let me mess with his recovery and should move out. So tomorrow I will take off from work and take care of business, such as me moving out and putting the house up for sale. I said from the get go I didn't think I had what it took, and I draw the line with single/divorced women friends. Thanks for listening.
QT
Tonite I spoke with RAH from rehab and he said he finally got it, had his spiritual awakening. I was very happy for him. Then he said when he comes home he's going to keep in touch with Lisa, Christine, etc. Oh yeah, that's great news to hear. There are guys there that he can keep in touch with, but with the women! Single (divorced) women yet. Call me jealous (and yes I am a little bit), but I don't believe a married man should keep in touch, be friends with and be there for a single/divorced woman who he met in rehab. If they were married, it may be a different story, but from stories I have heard, I really have my doubts about this. I flat out told him that I don't feel comfortable with the situation, and that if it were me having single/divorced men friends that I would go out with for coffee, be there for them in crisises, etc., I don't think he would appreciate it. He said he's sorry he told me this, now "we're arguing" (according to him). I told him I wasn't arguing, I just simply stated my point and that I don't want to mess with his recovery, so he should do what's best for him, and if that means having women friends, so be it. Then he said "no, you're mad". I told him "I gotta go" and hung up the phone. He called me back but I let the answering machine pick up. So here I am, babysitting my two granddaughters, working all the time he's up there, traveling 8 hours on a Saturday to visit him, doing his laundry, paying the bills and he has the nerve to say this to me. What does he think I am, stupid? Call me oldfashioned, but I don't believe married men should have single/divorced women as friends, especially if they haven't known them a long time and met them in rehab. I know many of you won't agree, but I know what I have read here and also know of with people I know. But you know what, I was kind of expecting this, and I guess right now they're all telling him that he shouldn't let me mess with his recovery and should move out. So tomorrow I will take off from work and take care of business, such as me moving out and putting the house up for sale. I said from the get go I didn't think I had what it took, and I draw the line with single/divorced women friends. Thanks for listening.
QT
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Lost in NC
Posts: 416
Rehab romances are very common.
They are just kindred souls who have so much in common. (BS) In reality, they just enable each other. They can blame their spouses and the world for their addictions, and their wife and husbands just don't understand.
They are just kindred souls who have so much in common. (BS) In reality, they just enable each other. They can blame their spouses and the world for their addictions, and their wife and husbands just don't understand.
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 3,812
Steve.... this is only my view... but
I dont think Jealousy is counter productive.... I dont think Anger is either.
If you looking into the stages of grief you can not heal without anger.... IMHO jealousy is just a primal emotion that is like a gut feeling... like Fear is primal... when the hair on the back of your neck stands up... you might want to pay attention.
If Im feeling jealous I need to look at why the feeling is there.... for me there is usually a really good reason (Im not a usually a jealous person) and I need to pay attention to that emotion... just like I do with Fear and Anger.
When my ex-abf entered treatment I was jumping for joy.... till I found out that the road in early recovery was much harder then the end of his drinking career.... he also did the 13th step because "I did not understand him like the fellowship could" yea frigging right! When someone cheats... I dont give a diddly squat if they use recovery as a reason.... It still hurts, still wrong and still a deal breaker.... end of story.
I dont think Jealousy is counter productive.... I dont think Anger is either.
If you looking into the stages of grief you can not heal without anger.... IMHO jealousy is just a primal emotion that is like a gut feeling... like Fear is primal... when the hair on the back of your neck stands up... you might want to pay attention.
If Im feeling jealous I need to look at why the feeling is there.... for me there is usually a really good reason (Im not a usually a jealous person) and I need to pay attention to that emotion... just like I do with Fear and Anger.
When my ex-abf entered treatment I was jumping for joy.... till I found out that the road in early recovery was much harder then the end of his drinking career.... he also did the 13th step because "I did not understand him like the fellowship could" yea frigging right! When someone cheats... I dont give a diddly squat if they use recovery as a reason.... It still hurts, still wrong and still a deal breaker.... end of story.
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Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,431
Steve, I can't find common sense in your statements.
Nor recognition of a time-proven rule of thumb.
Think I am a stick in the mud, not at all. However my husband and I did not contract in our marriage to keep friends only opposite sex. I can go out to dinner, spend a weekend, 2 weeks with long term male friends if I want and I prefer he visit his former female friends without dragging me along.
But we don't have broken trust, irresponsibility, neglect, addiction issues.
However, my exabf just called a bit ago and was wishing I was there to run people off, esp exgfs and wanna-be gfs. He is an addict and has to put it kindly and lightly relationship problems. His 13th stepping and 14th stepping has pretty much ruined his chances at a good relationship.
And he is single!
When we are married we make a vow to forsake all other. Often mistaken as all others. It really means we forsake anything that would compromise or threaten our union. We promise to love, honor and cherish.....Want me to get out my several page booklet of our own researched and chosen vows?
That man has made a public, private and legal commitment to live by his vows.
They made their contract and now he wants to unilaterally break them.
FOUL! calls the ump
Nor recognition of a time-proven rule of thumb.
Think I am a stick in the mud, not at all. However my husband and I did not contract in our marriage to keep friends only opposite sex. I can go out to dinner, spend a weekend, 2 weeks with long term male friends if I want and I prefer he visit his former female friends without dragging me along.
But we don't have broken trust, irresponsibility, neglect, addiction issues.
However, my exabf just called a bit ago and was wishing I was there to run people off, esp exgfs and wanna-be gfs. He is an addict and has to put it kindly and lightly relationship problems. His 13th stepping and 14th stepping has pretty much ruined his chances at a good relationship.
And he is single!
When we are married we make a vow to forsake all other. Often mistaken as all others. It really means we forsake anything that would compromise or threaten our union. We promise to love, honor and cherish.....Want me to get out my several page booklet of our own researched and chosen vows?
That man has made a public, private and legal commitment to live by his vows.
They made their contract and now he wants to unilaterally break them.
FOUL! calls the ump
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Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: WA Rainforest
Posts: 209
QT, stick to your guns.
They do bond with each other in rehab, that's normal, and they are very selfish in early recovery, that's normal too. BUT for him to specify keeping in touch with the women, and not the men, well that's common but NOT ok! Recovering addicts really should try to stick to their own gender (unless they're gay). He's just trying to pull something on you. Sounds like the jealous type to me, which means insecure and immature.
Expect him to put AA first, and his recovery first, if he's serious about it, but keep in mind that often they use 'recovery' as an excuse to keep drinking and womanizing.
I do hear resentments, but who could blame you?? You're on a roller coaster, like it or not. You may need your own space to work on your own issues like the build up of resentments, and then you wouldn't have to watch all the nonsense he goes through in early recovery.
They do bond with each other in rehab, that's normal, and they are very selfish in early recovery, that's normal too. BUT for him to specify keeping in touch with the women, and not the men, well that's common but NOT ok! Recovering addicts really should try to stick to their own gender (unless they're gay). He's just trying to pull something on you. Sounds like the jealous type to me, which means insecure and immature.
Expect him to put AA first, and his recovery first, if he's serious about it, but keep in mind that often they use 'recovery' as an excuse to keep drinking and womanizing.
I do hear resentments, but who could blame you?? You're on a roller coaster, like it or not. You may need your own space to work on your own issues like the build up of resentments, and then you wouldn't have to watch all the nonsense he goes through in early recovery.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 413
Originally Posted by steve11694
It is understandable how a newly recovering alcoholic can relate better to others in recovery than to their non alcoholic SANE RATIONAL loved ones.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 157
Wow, I really needed this thread today. It is weird when you finally come out of the fog of denial, living with an addict for so long. It hurts, but setting boundaries and enforcing them is really your only chance. I am glad he called you back and said he understood about not contacting any women. Good luck.
Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: England
Posts: 3,410
QT, forgive me if I am picking up the wrong end of the stick here, but there's something puzzling about these two parts of your conversations.
How was he going to keep in touch with them if he had already told them that he wasn't going to exchange numbers?
I have plenty of male friends that I have had for a long time and I would certainly not stop meeting them alone on occasion if I were in a relationship. We are friends, not potential lovers. And if, however unlikely, any of them did make a move on me, I have a tongue in my head to say "back off, buddy". And if my partner could not trust me and the strength of our relationship, then we're not right for each other anyway.
All that said, I am hugely aware of the power of group experience and the intensity of emotion and connection it provides. Heck, don't we experience it on here? So, I think it is imperative that the rules of same-gender only fraternisation that usually apply in rehab should be followed when one gets out as well.
Hope you've had a good weekend, QT.
Originally Posted by queenteree
Then he said when he comes home he's going to keep in touch with Lisa, Christine, etc.
Originally Posted by queenteree
He said he already told the women no exchanging numbers, and that the guys there made fun of him.
I have plenty of male friends that I have had for a long time and I would certainly not stop meeting them alone on occasion if I were in a relationship. We are friends, not potential lovers. And if, however unlikely, any of them did make a move on me, I have a tongue in my head to say "back off, buddy". And if my partner could not trust me and the strength of our relationship, then we're not right for each other anyway.
All that said, I am hugely aware of the power of group experience and the intensity of emotion and connection it provides. Heck, don't we experience it on here? So, I think it is imperative that the rules of same-gender only fraternisation that usually apply in rehab should be followed when one gets out as well.
Hope you've had a good weekend, QT.
Recovering Nicely
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 935
Hi All,
I would like to clarify one point that I didn't make clear: originally when he told me he was going to keep in touch with Laurie, Christine, etc., he also mentioned guys names (that was the "etc" part). I was upset about the women part. Also, he was never a drunk that went out to bars and womanized. He was always home drunk, always talking and hugging, etc. ME, which annoyed me cause he was drunk. When he said he already told the women no exchanging of numbers, it was cause he then understood where I was coming from. See this rehab has a list of all the numbers and they say each person should take the list. When I went up to see him yesterday, I met several of the men who he intends on keeping in contact with. There wives were there and we kind of clicked too. I told him how for the last two years I was very depressed and lonely, that he made me feel like crap when he'd go on his benders and drink and sleep upstairs with no regard for me, I plainly told him everything I'd ever told you guys. And he said to me that he had no clue that he had truly hurt me that much. He knew he hurt me with his drinking, but he had no clue to what extent. I also told him that while I love him I am no longer in love with him and I don't know if that could ever come back (even though I think it could). He promises me he is going to do this and I won't regret staying with him. He wants me to be in love with him again, and will do whatever it takes for that to happen. And he says for the first time in his life, he knows and admits he's an alcoholic and can never have one drink again (cause even after he went to rehab the first time and stayed sober for 14 years, he never once admitted he was an alcoholic). I still will keep my eyes and ears open, and won't let my guard down. You never can when you're married to an A. But I will give him the benefit of the doubt and let him earn my trust back.
I would like to clarify one point that I didn't make clear: originally when he told me he was going to keep in touch with Laurie, Christine, etc., he also mentioned guys names (that was the "etc" part). I was upset about the women part. Also, he was never a drunk that went out to bars and womanized. He was always home drunk, always talking and hugging, etc. ME, which annoyed me cause he was drunk. When he said he already told the women no exchanging of numbers, it was cause he then understood where I was coming from. See this rehab has a list of all the numbers and they say each person should take the list. When I went up to see him yesterday, I met several of the men who he intends on keeping in contact with. There wives were there and we kind of clicked too. I told him how for the last two years I was very depressed and lonely, that he made me feel like crap when he'd go on his benders and drink and sleep upstairs with no regard for me, I plainly told him everything I'd ever told you guys. And he said to me that he had no clue that he had truly hurt me that much. He knew he hurt me with his drinking, but he had no clue to what extent. I also told him that while I love him I am no longer in love with him and I don't know if that could ever come back (even though I think it could). He promises me he is going to do this and I won't regret staying with him. He wants me to be in love with him again, and will do whatever it takes for that to happen. And he says for the first time in his life, he knows and admits he's an alcoholic and can never have one drink again (cause even after he went to rehab the first time and stayed sober for 14 years, he never once admitted he was an alcoholic). I still will keep my eyes and ears open, and won't let my guard down. You never can when you're married to an A. But I will give him the benefit of the doubt and let him earn my trust back.
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