(((((Seeking Wisdom)))))): Thanks for much for welcoming me into this community and for sharing your story. I am so sorry that you lost your husband to this terrible disease. Thanks for enlightening me about the downward progression. I am very concerned for my husband who still thinks he does not have a problem and who thinks he can just "stop" .... but doesn't. He has said: "I'm not going to be a puritan" when I tell him that certain people who are unable to control their drinking shouldn't drink at all, and that includes him. I'm not sure if this is related but I'm also dealing with his infidelity. I just found out about the latest (1 of 2) affairs. It's ended but I' concerned that, due to his avoidance issues, that eventually I'll find myself down the road back in the same boat. We're going to start marital counseling, but it's my feeling that unless he gets into IC to deal with his issues, including alcohol, we'll never beat the problem. I'm sure that the alcohol consumption has something to do with his poor choices. He's such a brilliant guy with a really nice way about him. He's the last person in the world you'd suspect that has this dark side. I wonder if showing him your story would help him see the slippery slope he's on or would drive him further in denial. I think I'll e-mail it to him to read while he's at work and cold sober. Thanks again for writing.

Hugs,

lola

((((WhatAboutMe)))))): Thanks for the warm welcome...and so sorry to hear about your husband. I agree, it's so sad to stand by and watch the progression when you know what needs to be done to stop it. I'm going to read everything I can get my hands on and keep suggesting that he seek help. Thanks again and have a great day!

Hugs,

lola

Welcome lola.

I was just getting ready to post about functional alcoholics, when I saw your post. I think the most frustrating part about this, is that they are functioning! We don't have that option to say that he is completely useless, therefore, we have to tolerate much more....or "feel" like we should tolerate it, because after all, he is FUNCTIONING...(providing for the family).

I don't have a solution, just an observation.....it's going to take twice as long for a functioning alcoholic to hit bottom.....see above (25 years?! & 15 years?!) For those like me, that say every single day, when will this end???! ...looks like it's gonna be awhile.

lola, in addition to the counseling, I'd suggest testing for STD's.

In my case as the downward progression continued, the choices he made were less than discerning. In the last year, he refused to have sex, laying the blame at my unattractive feet. I found out later he had contracted a disease he would not bring himself to tell me about. If you start hearing a lot of blame for his affairs, I hope you'll know it has NOTHING to do with you, anymore than the drinking does.

That is just one example of all I have realized in hindsight about the emotional manipulation of alcoholism.

Take care.

HolyQow: You're absolutely right...that's the hard part. They get up in the morning, go to work, bring home a check and actually function, which increases the denial factor and makes the spouse look like an alarmist. It's a bad position to be in.

denny57: Supposedly the 2 affairs my husband had were emotional and not physical. But who knows. Great point about the testing. I probably should force him to use condoms when we're together. Pretty sad state of affairs but I choose to live in the world of reality, not reality. Thanks for the word of caution, and take care.

Lola...hope to be back to post more later,but I wanted to welcome you,too! So much about your story sounds so familiar (also thanks...this helps me remember it's not "just me" when I start almost believeing that I might be "over-reacting"...NOT!)

Glad you are here...it's a great place with great people. It has helped me very much! Hope you stick around!

I agree; for me, reality doesn't have to equal bitter or cynical, either. It just is. Ask any addict, they lie. About everything.

Lola,
My AH too was a functioning A. Now I see the downward spiral - drinking at work and almost losing his job (it's yet to come), never remembering conversations that took place either the night before or 5 mins. ago, he has alcoholic liver disease which he dismisses at "fatty liver", is 53 and looks 67 (wrinkles, spider veins all over his face and severe rosacea) which is a shame because he really was a good looking guy, sometimes can't even do menial tasks correctly, etc. He constantly drinks and drives and used to sit in my space and refuse to leave when he was drunk (but then I tried a different boundary technique and it works for me). He was sober for over 14 years but has been drinking for the past three or so. I have come to the conclusion that he will never stop drinking, he's too far into it to ever come back, yet I stay with him because deep down I do love him and I also don't want to struggle financially at this stage of my life. Keep reading and posting and you'll learn so much about this disease and how to take control of your life and feel better.
QT

I meant to say that I choose to live in the world of reality, not FANTASY....My brain cells aren't firing today!

WELCOME!
2 affair and has threatened you--sounds like abuse to me--also sounds like you are starting to see it all more clearly for what it is....that you are reaching out for support is a big step--plus going to counceling is fantastic
Good to have you here--keep posting!

Pick-a-name: Thanks for the welcome! I surely plan to stick around -- this is a great site with wonderful folks like yourself!

Denny57: Yes, lie they do. I've hidden booze bottles in the basement. When they "disappeared" he refused to own up to it!

((((Queenteree))))) I feel for you and I can relate to what you said about your reason for staying. I love my husband also and, at 52, it would be foolish to start all over again financially. But he must stop or at least seriously reduce his drinking. I e-mailed him today and copied "Seeking Wisdom's" e-mail from last night. I told my husband I love him and am deeply concerned about the slippery slope he's on with his drinking. I told him he needs help. He was moved by the message and recognized that his alcohol consumption has increased due to his increasing tolerance for it. He said he must now drink more in order to get to that relaxed state. However he attributed his forgetfullness to the stress of everyday life and to the fact that's it's been too long since we've taken a real vacation. He said that we need to schedule one so that he can gather strength for the changes he needs to make in his life. So I'm encouraged that he is beginning to recognize that he has a problem. And of course I plan to bring up the issue in counseling next month. Thanks for writing and for sharing your story.

Sunflower: My favorite flower! Thanks, too for the welcome. I'm going to take advantage of all the terrific resources here and it's wonderful to make new friends like yourself!

Hi, Lola.

I know I'd rather plan a life with a functional non-drinker than a functional drinker.

Although I have used the term in the past, I've never fully understood the term "functional alcoholic". It always, to me, seemed laden with the sense of hanging on by fingertips. You say that he doesn't drink during the day, yet have found a bottle in his desk drawer. And I'm not certain that you can say that his work is not affected by his drinking - all you know is that he hasn't lost his job yet. In fact, there's a lot of yet's about a functional alcoholic that I just don't miss being around. Waiting for the other shoe to drop is unbelievably stressful.

I guess I would have classed my ex as functional when I met him and throughout our relationship. Charming, professional job, well turned out, blah, blah, blah. Things was, he was only functional when someone else (i.e. a partner with cash) was picking up the slack for him. In the 2 1/2 years since I left, he has not made any money from the business we created (and that was growing at over 100% pa) and has burned through all his credit to the tune of perhaps $100,000. He has been hospitalised with seizures. The fiancee after me left. He is about to be evicted from his rented house. That doesn't sound very functional to me, but it is clear now that this was always going to happen when he didn't have an enabler around to keep him afloat. Watch out ladies in the UK - he'll be on the hunt for a new one!

When I left, Jazzman pointed out to me that, rather than pushing over the first domino (which was my fear), I was simply walking out from under the one I'd been holding up for the past few years.

You know, it always puzzle me when anyone brushes off calling out the police because of their partner - like it's some casual thing. Surely, it's amajor sign that something is really very wrong.

Hope you stick around here - there is loads of great info on here, particularly in the sticky posts at the top of each of the boards.

For clarity, I should say that I'd rather have a relationship with a functional non-problem drinker, otherwise I would be displaying double standards, given that I drink. But not drink drink.

Hi Minnie...Thanks for your feedback. As you know, we have something in common in that my husband and your former husband have a drinking problem. With respect to other factors though, our situations are quite different. My husband has never depended on my income as his safety net. In fact, I've always depended on his. He's self employed, runs his own business, and pays the bills. I, on the other hand, recently started a business that allows me to do what I love but that doesn't bring in much in the way of dollars right now. I've never been in a situation where my husband looked to me to bail him out of any financial shortfall he may be experiencing. If I were to walk away from the marriage, I'd have to go back to a 9-5 to support myself which, frankly, I'd prefer not to have to do. Who knows? If things don't work out here I may have to. But I've decided to stay for now.

To your point about the police: I'm puzzled that you would think that I felt it was a casual thing that I "brushed off." My husband has never put his hands on me. If he did, you can bet your bottom dollar that I'd be gone. Has he lost in temper and tried to intimidate me when he was angry? Yes. But all that ended when I called the police. Since that time he has never tried to bully me again. If he did, I would leave. But I'm giving him a chance to redeem himself.

I love my husband and am fighting to save my marriage by going to marriage counseling. I've also informed him that, unless he gets individual counseling for his alcohol addiction and other issues, I'll leave. Finally, we are negotiating a divorce settlement agreement with an attorney in the event that the reconcilation efforts don't work and we decide to go our own separate ways. I did this to send my husband a very clear message that if there aren't some major changes happening soon, I'm gone.

Please don't be so quick to judge another's situation. We all handle things the best way we can given our own unique situations and personalities. Take care. lola

Apologies, Lola. Sometimes I don't quite manage to convey my thoughts in the way that I intend. I do my upmost not to judge individuals, and keep any comments to my experiences and my view on others' situations (rather than the person) and I am sorry if I fell short of that goal in this instance.

I didn't mean to imply that you are bailing out your husband financially. I admit that I did that with my ex and it has been a hard lesson to learn. However, I wasn't really referring to financial support, but to the practical support and the framework that enables the drinker to maintain the illusion that the drinking is not that much of an issue. See? I still can't put it into words. All I can say is that I believe the term functional alcoholism relates to a temporary situation at best and is an an oxymoron at worst. I lived with someone going through that "stage", as did others that I have met on SR, and the common theme is one of "going through the motions" and "just about keeping it together". It was a soul-less existence for me and certainly for him and all the more frustrating because the "what could be" seems so tantalisingly close.

I wish you all the best, Lola. You do not need to justify your actions to me or anyone else and I'm sorry if you felt that I was asking you to do that. Sometimes I may be way off beam, but I hope that more often my posts stimulate thought or discussion. It was only by being asked questions (here or in counselling) that I was able to make the decisions that were vital for saving my own skin, even if I couldn't save his.

Lola,
Your husband and mine sound similar. My AH never hit me or was abusive toward me. He has (when drunk at times) refused to leave the room I was in and would just sit there and be defiant (my boundary is for him to go upstairs when he's drunk). Once, we got into an argument when he was drinking and he did throw a lamp (not at me, at the wall) and like you, I called the police. Unfortunately the police said he could break anything he wanted in his house. Still, he knows I won't tolerate such stuff. Also, like you, I depend on him financially, he makes the most money and pays all the bills, and like you, at my age, I don't want to have to struggle. I work, but the majority of my money is my money (which I usually use to help out my daughter and her two kids - she is a single mom who gets no child support). He does all outside stuff around the house, swiffers the floors and cleans the bathroom. The majority of the time when he is drunk, he is a mush, loving, kissy, talking on and on, all that stuff that annoys me when a drunk man does it (even sober, he's lovey/dovey). I'm glad your trying to make him realize his alcohol use is getting out of control. I tell my husband that at times too, and he knows I tell me because I love him. I know he realizes it, but sometimes he just can't do a thing about it, it takes control of him. I just want you to understand that, even though they might know that and want to change that, it doesn't always happen that way. It's not that easy for them, trust me, no matter how much they may want to. I think it's great that you're working as a team to give your marriage the chance it needs, but you also really need to take care of you, and concentrate on you if you're planning to stay in it for the long haul (like I am). Keep reading and posting, and I'll keep my fingers crossed that things keep looking positive for you both.

Minnie....Thanks very much. I know you meant well and I do appreciate your responding to my post. I just wanted to be crystal clear that I take the issue of domestic violence very seriously and will not tolerate it from my husband or anyone. I experienced the brunt of it as a child at the hands of my stepfather, who was suffering -- and therefore my mother and siblings -- from a debilitating mental illness. As a child I didn't have a choice, but as an adult I do.

You've given me some things to think about with respec to "functional alcoholic." I'm sorry that your marriage ended but it seems that you're in a better place now and I'm happy for you...

Until next time,
lola

Queenteree: Yes, we seem to have a lot in common in our situations. I'm sorry that your husband still drinks to excess but I'm glad that he is a lovey dovey drinker and not an angry, hostlle one. The problem here is that, due to the infidelity (emotional affairs), there have been many, many aruguments, and I didn't stop to notice if my husband had that glazed look in his eyes before starting them. Now I know better and will not have any heated discussions with him if I see the signs he's been drinking. It's hard for me because I enjoy a drink when out to dinner. But I do not like the "tipsy" feeling. I need to feel like I'm aware and in control at all times. I like a good time, but don't have to have an alcohol high to have one.

I want to be there for the long haul with my husband. But he must be willing to at least try to stop the drinking. I must admit I have a lot to learn about this issue. I did not know that this is a progressive thing. I thought that being a "functional alcoholic" meant that I can expect 10 years from now what I'm seeing today. But now with the occasional memory lapses and from what I'm learning from you guys, I'm getting very concerned. I don't take his inability to stop personally -- I've seen many great documentaries about the difficulties of stopping. But I want him to recognize that he has a problem and to see that he's willing to address it. What's working against us is his denial and avoidance issues. When I ask him why he drinks, he says it's just to relieve stress and relax. But I think it goes much deeper than that. I'm just taking it one day at a time for now....and remember to take care of myself too.

Welcome, glad you found us. list of books can be found under classic reading in the stickeys at the top of where you started your thread.

Keep coming back, and remember to take what you can use and leave the rest.

Might use index at botom here where you see "forum jump", and read "stories of recovery" might see something there to share with him.

Caring, understanding hugs to you both

I think I've just worked out why the term "functioning alcoholic" doesn't sit very well with me.

When the topic of of functioning alcoholics on here comes up, people are mainly defining the term as someone who is still able to function within society, in spite of having a drinking problem. In my experience, drinkers at that stage need to drink in order to function in society. Subtle difference in language, major difference in the reality.