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There is so much pain.......

Old 12-18-2006, 07:34 PM
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There is so much pain.......

As I read these threads I am enveloped by all the pain here. My own, yours, our childrens. Its such an enigma, all this.... Why do we stay with these people? Why do we love these people? I know all the book learning, I understand the "stockholm syndrome" but God, they just hurt us and hurt us and it never ever stops. They do not, can not love anyone, anything. Mothers walking away from their children. Fathers leaving sons and daughters. Wives leaving husbands and vice versa, and for what? A f***ing bottle. A substance when held in your hand, eludes your grasp and seeps into the sewer. Its robs them and us of pride and our dignity. It creates strangers where lovers once stood. It takes our love, our money, our dreams, our familys and our futures. And we just stay and take it, or we're sad when we lose them. How far from God have we gotten as a human race, that we have allowed this evil into our lives, and continually allow it to steer the course of our existance. I do believe I am numb to life. I have allowed myself to follow pain and to believe I deserve it somehow. I'm sorry I need to vent and to put into words my view of this beast that devouers everything in its path. Please know that, you people who are here, are truly in my heart and I hope someday we all break free of these bindings of hurt and pain.
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Old 12-18-2006, 07:53 PM
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good evening findmyself

i know why i stayed. i became sick, too. and it happened so slowly and gradually, that i didn't even notice till i was almost invisible.

i felt tremendous love for my husband, i knew him when he was grand. i knew him when he was kind, loving, funny, ambitious, and compassionate for life.

i just couldn't believe that the man was gone, and a stranger was in his place. i wanted to believe that he would save himself, and yes, us, from this horrible thing that happened in our life. i wanted to believe the tears streaming from his face were washing away the disease of alcoholism. i wanted to believe that the promises from his lips were as honorable as they once were....when he was grand. it tore my heart out to see this man turn into a monster from his addiction.

i stayed because i thought i could save him, since he couldn't save himself. i stayed because of love. and i left because of love. love for myself. i had to be reduced to a simple, breathing, form of human tissue, with no feelings except of misery, loss, and hopelessness, before i could fight my way back to life.....my own life.

i stayed because i believed. and i left because i understood.

love to you and all others
jeri
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Old 12-18-2006, 07:56 PM
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I used to think that alcoholics do not, cannot love anyone or anything except their bottle, but I was wrong. They can and do love deeply, only not in the way that we need to be loved. It's important to remember that alcoholism is a progressive disease that not only has a physical and emotional hold on the addicts in our lives, but it harms them mentally as well by attacking the frontal lobe of their brain, thus damaging their ability to think clearly and act logically.

If it were cancer eating away at their brains we'd be full of compassion for them. But when it's alcohol eating away at their brains, we struggle to find compassion. It's not just the addicts who have wandered far from God, we've done so, too, by losing our ability to feel true compassion for those less fortunate than us.

After losing their loved one to the disease of alcoholism, a wise member of this forum once asked, did the alcoholic fail us or did we, as a society, fail the alcoholic? I think the answer is the latter.

Tonight I say a prayer for all those who are struggling with alcoholism--the addicts, their family, their friends, and their loved ones and I ask God to help us always treat the people we love with compassion.
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Old 12-18-2006, 08:39 PM
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Why did I stay ? For the very reason that Jeri stated....22 years and then in the end the disease won. The hooch won, the bottle won, his disease won. I thought he was strong enough to fight - for us. I begged him to fight - for us. And he turned his back on me and his children and life as he knew it. He drank away everything that was anything. And it has been 1 and a half years since he left and am I ok? No way. Not even close. I never will be. I could never be what I was before he did what he did. He has changed my soul forever. No amount of prayer, no amount of money, no amount of anything will make it right. Time and only time will help heal me. And to what extent? Only time will tell that. I pray and I don't want anyone here to think that I don't believe in God because I do - it's just that right now I have so much anger that I can't even pray. One day I will though....with all the damage that they cause I dont have much sympathy for them. Alot of you do but I dont. Not yet. I cant. How can I when they dont give a dam how much they destroy and maim and scar....and when they finally do? What are we supposed to do? Say there, there, its okay? I have no more cheeks to turn folks...then when we dont forgive them now it's our fault again because now its on us and is OUR problem???? C-mon you guys - get real here...this whole situation is insidious and thats all there is to it. How did our lives ever get to this degree??? Our only crime is that we loved someone...and helping our loved ones now makes us co-dependent?? Yup - I guess I'm guilty that for sure.
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Old 12-18-2006, 08:51 PM
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Hi Findmyself,
I struggle with it too...I just can't understand it all. I think it's just too big for me to really get. I'm sorry you are hurting.

Like Janit, I'm not ready to forgive my A yet. Deep down I love him, but I am not able to separate him from the drinking. I hope I get there...I don't want to hate him. Right now, I get through the days by pretending that he never existed. Yes, I can speak about him here, but it's almost like I am speaking about a person I once casually knew. It is so very sad.
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Old 12-18-2006, 08:55 PM
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janitw....i know, i know....(((sigh))).... reading your post just breaks my heart. there's days i just shake my fist at god. and days that i just don't understand. and i feel like a four year old, saying....but, but, but, I DON'T UNDERSTAND....WHY....HOW COME....WHY FOR.....I JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND.

for me, feeling this way for years just about destroyed me....i just knew i had to do something else, or i would poof.

the anger is always there.....just like the alcoholism....waiting, patiently, for it's opportunity to take over again in my life. it lies in wait, with me as it's only barrier between my sanity, and it's chance to bloom to full life again.

it's a constant struggle....that, along with the heartache. but i've got to get in a different place in my mind, or i'll be just as bad off as the alcoholic....bitter, resentful, mean, broken.

it all just basically, sucks.

some days are really good, some are just days, and some days are just in the chit bucket.

love to you janitw
jeri
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Old 12-18-2006, 09:02 PM
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I stay with mine because he has changed. Altho the damage is done. Im not really sure if I belong here but I dont know where else I fit either. Mine never got the chance to progress to the darker levels.
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Old 12-18-2006, 09:08 PM
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Cecilia, yes, you belong here.
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Old 12-18-2006, 09:21 PM
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Sometimes I feel like everyone else is still in the path of the hurricane and its done past me by and Im just rakin up debris. And the more I read the more I think HOLY COW what the hell am I complaining about.
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Old 12-18-2006, 10:00 PM
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God, janit your so right. If I make dinner i'm accused of trying to keep him home and making him feel guilty. If I don't cook dinner, I'm a lazy B***h, who doesn't care about him and how hard he works. If I buy a new ipod for my daughter, i'm a money hungry witch that just spends HIS money and uses him, but when he wants a new hunting bow for $1800.00 its him feeding his family. He can spend days away from home sitting in a bar and "not have time to do anything around the house cause he works long hours" But I (I work 40+ hours a week) should have more than enough time to wash HIS laundry. He hunts 20+ hours a week, but has no time to spend with his family, But If I go out with friends on a Friday night(and not make dinner) I an less than human. This is CRAZY. Its not reality. AND I STAY GOD, I STAY. And as you say, my crime? I loved someone. I promised to love,honor and stay in SICKNESS and in health. You know what? Its in sickness and in sickness. I am being punished for doing what I said I would do. I can not win, no matter what I do. I am damned if I do and Damned if I don't. And if and when I do leave....... It will haunt, and dog me for the rest of my life because I will never be able to come to grips with all this. I will always harbor resentment and anger for all of this. I would not be human if I didn't. And you know what would put me over the edge? Him getting sober and wanting me to understand his poor miserable little life. Him wanting me to forgive him. I'm really not worried about this happening so, guess I'll calm down a little here. He will never get sober and I will never get my head on straight. What a waste of time, love and life.
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Old 12-18-2006, 10:13 PM
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And dear former doormat, I must take a bit of exception with your cancer senerio. My daughter is recovering from cancer. She had cancer thru no fault of her own so compassion came easily. Hy AH brought this on himself. My daughter knew she was sick and went thru chemo. Even though it was hard for her, she faced it and got well. My AH knows hes sick, and he does not wish to do the work to get well. So...... the compassion is not there and I do not see the connection. If my AH was told he had cancer tomorrow, he would go get help to cure it because it involves him. He wants to live. That is an occasion he could rise to, because it his life, not me or his daughter. They (for the most part) would all go get help for cancer, because it hurts them. Thats the selfishness of all this crap.
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Old 12-19-2006, 07:54 AM
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Praying that you'll find compassion for ALL who suffer one day soon.
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Old 12-19-2006, 08:14 AM
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Originally Posted by findmyself View Post
He will never get sober and I will never get my head on straight. What a waste of time, love and life.
findmyself- he may never get sober, but you can "get your head on straight"! You don't even have to feel sorry for him, I have trouble buying the disease concept too. But you can take some steps to make yourself feel more peaceful and happy, whether you stay or go. Don't take the self-defeating mindset that you're being punished- you can find ways of improving your own situation through detachment and setting boundaries. And if you do decide to leave one day, it is only my opinion, but God doesn't frown on people who do the right thing for themselves, I think it's what He wants for all of us- to make good choices and make the best of the life He gave us. I believe God will help us out-- but we need to do some of the work, too. Take that first step.

I would never tell anyone they're not entitled to their rage until I walked a mile in their shoes. I don't feel rage and anger towards my ex-- but I never married him, lived with him, had kids with him, depended on him financially, none of that. If I did, I might feel much differently. Sometimes I wish I had more anger than I do, in fact! But the point is, your rage is having an effect on YOU and the quality of your OWN life, your own happiness, and for that reason alone you need to discover some new ways of dealing. You can't control or change him but you can manage your own reactions and your oen life. Have you tried Al Anon? Or reading any recovery-related books? I know it sounds corny but you don't have to feel so helpless or see yourself as a victim, there are things you can do while you sort things out.

Hope you don't take any offense... I see you're new here (unless it's a new name?), I hope you stick around, this place has helped me immensely to develop a healthier perspective, and it's still evolving, it's all a process... hugs to you.
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Old 12-19-2006, 09:05 AM
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deax, Yes im new here. And yes, have NEW rage. I will never take offense at what I hear in this place, because I know we are all in the same boat. I am grateful to have found this place of comfort. I am here to seek advice, and last night was here to vent, because its the only place I can. I call it NEW rage, because of going thru my daughters cancer alone (had the alcoholic 20+ years). I am signing papers tonight to refinance our mortgage, because we are in financial trouble due to medical bills. I do not know if we will be able to handle this new burden and of course as usual, he's out drinking the funds we so need to live in our home. I am having a hard time right now and am continually amazed at his cold uncaring attitude towards his family in light of our situation. I ordered all of Melody Beatties(spell) books on co-dependancy last night. I'm going back to alanon and trying to find alateen for my daughter. Thanks for listening. All of you. I appreciate everyone's words, even if I don't happen to agree with all of them. Who knows what seeds we plant now, for things that bloom in the future.
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Old 12-19-2006, 09:36 AM
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One thing that really helped me to find clarity through the anger was not taking it personally. For a long time, I was wrapped up in that victim blanket of how could he do this to me? How could he do this to the kids? Why didn't he care enough about us to stop it? Once I stopped taking it personally and took a (sort of) rational look at the facts, it was easier to make a decision that was right for me, instead of one based on anger at him. I hope that makes sense.

It's okay and even neccessary to feel the anger. What's harmful is staying in it. Feel it, process it, and get on with life. Staying in the anger only hurts you .

L
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Old 12-19-2006, 09:41 AM
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Well I am so sorry to hear about your daughter and I wish her all the best in her continued recovery from cancer and I wish peace for you and the rest of your family. What your husband is doing especially in light of the circumstances would **** me off too. Can you set up a separate bank account he can't access, for starters? A savings for yourself or something? The Melody Beattie books are great- I've only read Codependent No More (which I go back to often) and am in the process of reading Beyond Codependency now. Those books are a great place to start.

Others will be along to offer better advice than I can. But welcome, and I'm glad you're here.
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Old 12-19-2006, 01:11 PM
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Thanks Jeri (((((((((((((Jeri))))))))))))))
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Old 12-19-2006, 01:39 PM
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Hello Findmyself - I can sooooo relate to what you wrote too hun. I couldnt even drive a grocery cart correctly according to my ex...lol We took our vows seriously but they did not because if they did they would realize that they are duty bound to stay as healthy as they can for their families. But with addiction - addicts have their own code of rules - their rules and only their rules apply. I remember back to 6 months before my ex left us he said to me and I quote: "Do you think a sober Wayne is going to love you any more than this drunk one?" as he sprayed the kids and I with beer....I told him we would take our chances...and he just laughed and walked out of the room...see what I mean about the scars....not just to me - I'm a big girl I can take the verbal blow...but to the kids??? Now your treading where angels fear to goooo...anyway hun..you just do what you have to do to keep your sanity for as long as you can and when it's all said and done things will change when you make them change and not a minute before.

Deax - you are right when you said you might feel differently if you had had children with your ex, or depended on him financially, or many other things...trust me the pain is the pain but the levels are different with each one of us...
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Old 12-19-2006, 02:09 PM
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Findmyself, yes you are new here and filled with new rage (and understandably so). You're refinancing to help cover the medical bills, yet you see him drinking the funds away that you need to survive. You are bearing the weight of everything on your shoulders, trying to keep afloat and have a home for your dear daughter, while he is in his own alcoholic world, a world where nothing matters except them and everything is alcohol coated. But I'm glad you came here. I came here only two or so months ago, and I am really much better since. I wish you and your daughter well, and you will be in my prayers.
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Old 12-19-2006, 04:25 PM
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Others much wiser than me h.ave said it all much better than me.

I would like to add that some men just dont suffer well. Im not excusing your AH. Im just saying that maybe he cant cope and hes running away like alkies do. Hes scared because his daughter is sick and hes angry because he cant fix it. Some men mask their insecurities by picking fights. I remember when I was in the hospital for cancer surgery. Mine was so angry and nitpicky. Nobody could figure out why I didnt just smack him. I would have if I didnt know him so well.
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