How Do You Know When To Get Out?
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: My Own Private Hell
Posts: 25
How Do You Know When To Get Out?
Sorry in advance for the length of this! But I do need your help! Some of you have read my posts, but here's the "quickie" version. Married 14 years, 2 kids -- 7 and 4. I don't drink, but assumed my AH was the "normal" one, though in retrospect, I hated always having to drive after parties, would get stressed out if he was slurring his words, etc. didn't think he was an alcoholic, though, since this was not an everyday thing! after our son was born, he left me in the hospital bed to "celebrate" and have a drink down the street. i was sad but rationalized it by thinking, "i'm falling asleep, he wants to get out", etc. when i was about to deliver our daughter he insisted on going to his office xmas party and was still a little buzzed when he had to drive me to the hospital. why i didn't throw a fit, i don't know. yes, i do -- codie! 4 years ago he had me sign a power of attorney to refinance our mortgage for a lower rate -- turned out he cashed out $75k equity to pay off debts from a failed business. i found out a year later. said he couldn't tell me because i'd be too upset. then a dui for him, two couples shrinks, two shrinks for me, anti-depressants for me later, i found in december he was at it again -- using our equity line without telling me to float money for his business -- even though he knew it had devastated me the first time around. paid huge amex bill with equity -- bills were never sent to our house/never paid with household money -- when i demanded to see all bills huge amount was for bars and liquor stores -- oh and lots of charges for those "hangover" vitamins! i asked for divorce on 1/22. on 1/25 he announces he is an alcoholic, quits drinking, starts going to meetings daily (sometimes 2x), gets a sponsor, etc. he has been sober one month.
i went to al-anon meetings and was told repeatedly not to do anything for six months. so now we are in this limbo. i am so depressed. wearing my pjs, just feeling miserable. he has been bugging me to go on anti-depressants again, and now i am so miserable i have an appointment tomorrow. so here is my question -- this is a man i once loved, great father, loves me very much, he is very much against this divorce -- on the outside it all looks great -- nice house, cute kids, cute couple -- but i have no idea what to do. finished "codependent no more" today and know i have work to do. but here is my big codie question and i need outside perspective -- what if this is as good as it gets? what if love is not this shiny, pink thing? what if love is dirty and messy and patched up with tape in reality? what if as messed up as my relationship has been and as sad as i have become what i have is still pretty good? how do you know when it's time to get out? i've already crossed boundaries i thought i would never cross, codie that i am... what if everyone is flawed and now that he's sober it might all be different? he has said if we divorce it will be because of me, and the thought of affecting my kids in this way breaks my heart. i thought i did my homework -- talked to a lawyer, gave my speech, and then he threw in the alcoholic thing and it goofed everything up for me. i wish i had the clarity of an outside perspective. i know none of you can tell me what to do, but how bad does this seem? would you leave if you were me?
i went to al-anon meetings and was told repeatedly not to do anything for six months. so now we are in this limbo. i am so depressed. wearing my pjs, just feeling miserable. he has been bugging me to go on anti-depressants again, and now i am so miserable i have an appointment tomorrow. so here is my question -- this is a man i once loved, great father, loves me very much, he is very much against this divorce -- on the outside it all looks great -- nice house, cute kids, cute couple -- but i have no idea what to do. finished "codependent no more" today and know i have work to do. but here is my big codie question and i need outside perspective -- what if this is as good as it gets? what if love is not this shiny, pink thing? what if love is dirty and messy and patched up with tape in reality? what if as messed up as my relationship has been and as sad as i have become what i have is still pretty good? how do you know when it's time to get out? i've already crossed boundaries i thought i would never cross, codie that i am... what if everyone is flawed and now that he's sober it might all be different? he has said if we divorce it will be because of me, and the thought of affecting my kids in this way breaks my heart. i thought i did my homework -- talked to a lawyer, gave my speech, and then he threw in the alcoholic thing and it goofed everything up for me. i wish i had the clarity of an outside perspective. i know none of you can tell me what to do, but how bad does this seem? would you leave if you were me?
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: northern minnesota
Posts: 269
hi,
love definately isnt all pink and fluffy clouds in my opinion. its work. and its a choice. we choose who we love. its not like a fatal disease. we have a choice when to work at it, when to quit working at it, and when to cut our losses in order to maintain our own sanity.
as for the question is this as good as it gets. who knows. only you.
make a list of whats good and whats bad. try not to use feelings.... but actions.... try not to use words... but actions. then see how it stacks up.
only you can make the decisions that your life brings to you.
the serenity prayer says:
grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change.
the courage to change the things I can
and the wisdom to know the difference.
you can change the line of credit. get rid of it. you can control your finances if you want to.
you can change how you feel about love, and life. if you want to.
I would make a list of things I want,, things I need and things I hope.
Change the things that you must because you need to.
Accept the things you cannot change and either move on, or forgive and accept.
Then do something for you. We give a lot and dont take. Sometimes all of us need to take something that is "just for me". perhaps steps towards an education. a vacation. whatever. do something for you.
good luck. sounds like you are starting to see without the rose colored glasses all of us seem to have at some point regarding alcoholism.
quietsins
love definately isnt all pink and fluffy clouds in my opinion. its work. and its a choice. we choose who we love. its not like a fatal disease. we have a choice when to work at it, when to quit working at it, and when to cut our losses in order to maintain our own sanity.
as for the question is this as good as it gets. who knows. only you.
make a list of whats good and whats bad. try not to use feelings.... but actions.... try not to use words... but actions. then see how it stacks up.
only you can make the decisions that your life brings to you.
the serenity prayer says:
grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change.
the courage to change the things I can
and the wisdom to know the difference.
you can change the line of credit. get rid of it. you can control your finances if you want to.
you can change how you feel about love, and life. if you want to.
I would make a list of things I want,, things I need and things I hope.
Change the things that you must because you need to.
Accept the things you cannot change and either move on, or forgive and accept.
Then do something for you. We give a lot and dont take. Sometimes all of us need to take something that is "just for me". perhaps steps towards an education. a vacation. whatever. do something for you.
good luck. sounds like you are starting to see without the rose colored glasses all of us seem to have at some point regarding alcoholism.
quietsins
Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: In Search of Finding ME!
Posts: 1,246
Everyone's time of knowing "when to get out" is different. Our bottoms are different just as the alcoholic's is.
I'd immediately say that if you or your children are in danger - it's definately time to get out. However, it doesn't seem to sound to me that you are in physical danger. But I often think that sometimes people forget about the emotional danger.
Of course educating yourself about alcoholism and codependancy are a great step to your recovery. I'd also suggest attending Alanon meetings as they are really helpful to many people. And personally, I think it would benefit you greatly to see a counselor.
Side note - you commented about feeling guilty if you end the marriage because of your children. I am not sure how much your children are aware of the situations at your home (his drinking, etc) but in some cases it seems the children can be better off without the drama of living with an A parent. We have a forum here at SR for Children of Alcoholics - I've seen the damage done to my own children - as well as to other children I know that have been brought up in this environment. Do not feel guilty for doing something in the best interest of yourself and your children if leaving is what you feel is best. Guilt is a horrible thing - I have issues with it myself - and I can tell you that it can keep you stuck in places forever. It can hinder your growth and only make your life worse. There are some things that are yours to own - other feelings and situations that are not yours to own. Do not take the blame for everything.
Keep educating yourself - and start working on YOU!
And as was pointed out to you already - don't just listen to his words....pay attention to the actions.
While I don't know about your ah - I do know that many (as mine did as well) go through what is called the "honeymoon phase" where they try to "be good" and "do the right thing". Only time will really tell if he's serious about his recovery. Hopefully you'll get serious about your own.
Oh - and I'm curious - were the financial issues brought about when he was under the influence?
I always thought that ah made bad financial decisions when he was drinking and that was the cause of our dilemma. Found out that wasn't the case with him. He's just totally financially irresponsible - and I was the one that thought it was alcohol-induced all those years. He, too, kept me in the dark about some debts that he owed and like you, I was furious and hurt when I found out that I'd been snowed yet again. I found that with ah - his drinking and his financial issues are two different things - but both leading to the irresponsibility factor. That was our situation though.
I'd immediately say that if you or your children are in danger - it's definately time to get out. However, it doesn't seem to sound to me that you are in physical danger. But I often think that sometimes people forget about the emotional danger.
Of course educating yourself about alcoholism and codependancy are a great step to your recovery. I'd also suggest attending Alanon meetings as they are really helpful to many people. And personally, I think it would benefit you greatly to see a counselor.
Side note - you commented about feeling guilty if you end the marriage because of your children. I am not sure how much your children are aware of the situations at your home (his drinking, etc) but in some cases it seems the children can be better off without the drama of living with an A parent. We have a forum here at SR for Children of Alcoholics - I've seen the damage done to my own children - as well as to other children I know that have been brought up in this environment. Do not feel guilty for doing something in the best interest of yourself and your children if leaving is what you feel is best. Guilt is a horrible thing - I have issues with it myself - and I can tell you that it can keep you stuck in places forever. It can hinder your growth and only make your life worse. There are some things that are yours to own - other feelings and situations that are not yours to own. Do not take the blame for everything.
Keep educating yourself - and start working on YOU!
And as was pointed out to you already - don't just listen to his words....pay attention to the actions.
While I don't know about your ah - I do know that many (as mine did as well) go through what is called the "honeymoon phase" where they try to "be good" and "do the right thing". Only time will really tell if he's serious about his recovery. Hopefully you'll get serious about your own.
Oh - and I'm curious - were the financial issues brought about when he was under the influence?
I always thought that ah made bad financial decisions when he was drinking and that was the cause of our dilemma. Found out that wasn't the case with him. He's just totally financially irresponsible - and I was the one that thought it was alcohol-induced all those years. He, too, kept me in the dark about some debts that he owed and like you, I was furious and hurt when I found out that I'd been snowed yet again. I found that with ah - his drinking and his financial issues are two different things - but both leading to the irresponsibility factor. That was our situation though.
One brief hour...
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Anywhere, USA
Posts: 1,412
loves me very much,
I've even said that about my AH and really--- if they "loved us so much," why have they continued repeatedly to show us that they and their alcoholism is what is most important to them? Why have they neglected us, disrespected us, lied to us and abused us (emotionally, physically or whatever) time and time again? Love is NOT pink and fluffy but IT IS DEFINITELY NOT THIS.
I think that everyone's honeymoon phase wears off. Good relationships do take constant effort from BOTH people. There needs to be a mutual respect there and a dignity regarding the sanctity of the releationship at all times. If two people are on the "same emotional page," this very real and everlasting love exists in my opinion. With an A though, you are NEVER ever on the same page. You are never even on the same wavelength if you are sober and he/she is drunk 95% of the time.
When you sit and think about "is it better out there?," think about it in terms of you being alone. I'm finding that another relationship or what the future may hold for me in the love dept. is the last thing I need to be thinking about right now. It is all about me!!! What is best for me??? For me, I enjoy being alone and being my own good company and my own boss. Give me an animal as a companion and I'm a happy camper. I would much rather have that serenity than deal with what I'm dealing with now. If I meet someone I think is "great," believe you me when I say I will TAKE MY SWEET TIME with this person and not be blinded by the infatuation phase. I will be much smarter if I enter a relationship in the future. I will be very aware that pink and fluffy only lasts for so long no matter how great the person. Sleep well and a big hug to you.
Honk if you're a codie!
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: State of Codependency
Posts: 121
Hi warriorprincess,
"he has said if we divorce it will be because of me, and the thought of affecting my kids in this way breaks my heart."
That is manipulation at its finest. He is taking no responsibility for his actions. You didn't come up with the idea of divorce all on you own. It was a reaction to what he has put you and your family through.
And seems to me that he's bugging you to go on anti-depressants again because he doesn't like to see the results of his actions = you being sad.
Stay strong. Keep going to your meetings.
Prayers for you and your family.
"he has said if we divorce it will be because of me, and the thought of affecting my kids in this way breaks my heart."
That is manipulation at its finest. He is taking no responsibility for his actions. You didn't come up with the idea of divorce all on you own. It was a reaction to what he has put you and your family through.
And seems to me that he's bugging you to go on anti-depressants again because he doesn't like to see the results of his actions = you being sad.
Stay strong. Keep going to your meetings.
Prayers for you and your family.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: My Own Private Hell
Posts: 25
ladies, thanks so much for your kind words. you all are the best! standing strong, the financial stuff did happen when he was drinking, but i don't know what to think about that anymore. first he said he had to be secretive about the finances because i was too sensitive and it would stress me out. then he said he had to be secretive because i had dominated him thru-out the marriage and this was his way of being independent. then he said it was because he was depressed and was medicating himself with alcohol. i read "marriage on the rocks" (great book) and it talks about how many alcoholics have a sense of grandiosity -- never wanting to save for a rainy day because they are sure they'll be rich by then, etc. that was my husband. wouldn't set up college savings for the kids. no will. no life insurance. no retirement savings. oh well. we are just in this horrible trap. miserable together but it seems so impossible to be apart. going to the psych today and will see what he thinks. i know there is a part of me that resisted anti-depressants b/c i wanted to experience what i am going thru, but i can't stay in my pjs all day. maybe it would give me some clarity.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: TX
Posts: 371
i am so depressed. wearing my pjs, just feeling miserable. he has been bugging me to go on anti-depressants again, and now i am so miserable i have an appointment tomorrow.
You know, it's hard to give an answer for this. Only you will know if you can't get through your day to day life w/o help. He could always throw this back at you.(mine did, you have pills = I have bottle) So I quit. Then I realized that those pills made me tolerate more from him than I should have. It wasn't ME. It was my LIFE. Even at that moment I didn't get it. I'm still trying to get IT.
on the outside it all looks great -- nice house, cute kids, cute couple -- but i have no idea what to do
That's the same for most of us who have hidden these sorts of problems from the world. We cushioned everything, not only for them, but for us. What is on the INSIDE? How do you feel INSID? not worrying about the outside and what people will think. They don't know, they can't judge what they don't know.
what if this is as good as it gets? what if love is not this shiny, pink thing? what if love is dirty and messy and patched up with tape in reality.
I think that is something that most wives of A's have questioned before making any decisions in their lives. I can imagine that those who have made those changes would tell us that, This isn't as good as it gets! That love isn't pink and shiny, but it isn't dirty and messy and hurtful either. Tape... is tape... it doesn't usually stick or last.
To Stay or Go? I can't give any answers to that either.... unfortunately.. that's a daily question or stuggle I face.. We'll know.
You know, it's hard to give an answer for this. Only you will know if you can't get through your day to day life w/o help. He could always throw this back at you.(mine did, you have pills = I have bottle) So I quit. Then I realized that those pills made me tolerate more from him than I should have. It wasn't ME. It was my LIFE. Even at that moment I didn't get it. I'm still trying to get IT.
on the outside it all looks great -- nice house, cute kids, cute couple -- but i have no idea what to do
That's the same for most of us who have hidden these sorts of problems from the world. We cushioned everything, not only for them, but for us. What is on the INSIDE? How do you feel INSID? not worrying about the outside and what people will think. They don't know, they can't judge what they don't know.
what if this is as good as it gets? what if love is not this shiny, pink thing? what if love is dirty and messy and patched up with tape in reality.
I think that is something that most wives of A's have questioned before making any decisions in their lives. I can imagine that those who have made those changes would tell us that, This isn't as good as it gets! That love isn't pink and shiny, but it isn't dirty and messy and hurtful either. Tape... is tape... it doesn't usually stick or last.
To Stay or Go? I can't give any answers to that either.... unfortunately.. that's a daily question or stuggle I face.. We'll know.
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