How to handle holidays?
Southern through and through
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In.....trouble :-)
Posts: 1,453
How to handle holidays?
Ok all you guys and gals with more experience that I, please help me out here.
If you're not familiar with my story, here's brief recap. My A is my 20 year old daughter who started drinking at 14. Has just graduated from IOP and is going to AA meetings. NOT everyday like I'd like, but hey, I know I'm supposed to keep my mouth shut and let her work her program. (Keeping mouth shut...now that is another whole topic in itself!) She's sober 37 days and for that I am very grateful!!!
She lives at home. We provide EVERYTHING....nice home, car, gas $$$, tuition for college (she is going back in Jan.)
Our family tradition has been to go to my parents (4 hours away) for Christmas. We have done this our entire life. We go there, spend a few days, do the extended family get together, which she has always looked forward to, have Christmas with my family, leave and go spend Christmas afternoon with husband's family and then home. ALWAYS have done this and never had anyone complain.
So my daughter has told me she wants to stay home and spend Christmas with her boyfriend and his family. She 'says' his family has invited her to stay with them, but I'm not sure. Boyfriend is 25 and has an apt of his own. His family is in town and so is he. She can see him anytime she wants. Boyfriend is NOT a drinker, but as sick as she is in his own way. He hasn't a clue about dealing with an alcoholic and has yet to attend any Al Anon meetings. He's more like, "just have faith and pray about it. God will handle it." He isn't the type to encourage her to attend meetings. If it comes down to a meeting or him, well, she'd better chose him cause he is so dern insecure! He knows how to play mind games with her. Her IOP folks TOLD her to NOT have relationship with him or anyone else. She won't listen. She's going to do it HER way.
My family (out of town) is not aware of my daughter's problem. I have chosen not to tell my parents, who are in their late 70's, because I know my parents and I know how they worry. My dad is recovering from very serious illness and there is no way I'm adding any stress to his plate. If she chooses not to go, two innocent grandparents will be so very hurt.
When my daughter told me of her desire to stay home, I asked her what about her grandparents? She doesn't care how it will hurt their feelings. It's ALL about her at this point and what she is comfortable with. She says she isn't ready to face family and them asking about school and her having to lie, pretending she's still in school. Hmmmmmm, seems she doesn't have a problem lying to people IN TOWN when they ask about school. See, I think it's just an excuse to get what SHE wants. And I know she doesn't really care about being around me, her mom, cause I am the person in the house that will call her on the carpet, so to speak. I'm not going to be manipulated anymore.
So here lies the problem. She says she wants to stay home. There is no way I am leaving a 20 yr old, WHO IS BASICALLY 14 emotionally (her doc and counselor have confirmed this....emotionally stopped developing at age drinking begain). I simply do no trust her and her lack of maturity. I know the *#$* is going to hit the fan (pardon my french) when we tell her she IS going with us. She can RUIN our Christmas there. Normally I would say she isn't the type to do that, but I'm not really sure at this point.
My husband and I have agreed to pare down the trip, to make it as short as possible, but we do not think it is right to change our entire Christmas because she doesn't want to go. And let me add that we have another daughter, 23, who is feeling like why should her Christmas be changed also. This daughter now hates coming home because last time she was home, my A daughter pitched one holy anger fit and it scared my other daughter. She had NEVER seen her act like that. The other daughter is just getting over an abusive relationship and I KNOW that when she heard my daughter screaming and totally out of control, it reminded her of the ex boyfriend who was abusive.
My gut says set the rules and tell her that's the way it's going to be. But I'm telling you, I'm scared to death of the reaction I'll get. To be honest, I'm not as pulled together as some of you long time Al Anon's on here. (I'm sure that statement didn't come as a surprise to you.) I don't always say the right thing, act the right way. Heck, I'm hanging on by a thread here.
But WHY, why should my family's whole Christmas be dictated by what our alcoholic daughter wants? That just doesn't seem fair. I'm sick of walking eggshells, worrying about us having the discussion about what we're doing for Christmas. I feel in my gut that my daughter's main reason for wanting to stay home is PURELY SELFISH. And if there is one thing I've learned, alcoholics are selfish people, wanting what they want when they want it. And if they don't get it, they blame everyone else. Yep, I'm ready for my daughter to heap blame on us, in some way, if we lay down the law re Christmas holidays.
Leaving her home, by herself, is NOT an option. No way. Help, please??????
If you're not familiar with my story, here's brief recap. My A is my 20 year old daughter who started drinking at 14. Has just graduated from IOP and is going to AA meetings. NOT everyday like I'd like, but hey, I know I'm supposed to keep my mouth shut and let her work her program. (Keeping mouth shut...now that is another whole topic in itself!) She's sober 37 days and for that I am very grateful!!!
She lives at home. We provide EVERYTHING....nice home, car, gas $$$, tuition for college (she is going back in Jan.)
Our family tradition has been to go to my parents (4 hours away) for Christmas. We have done this our entire life. We go there, spend a few days, do the extended family get together, which she has always looked forward to, have Christmas with my family, leave and go spend Christmas afternoon with husband's family and then home. ALWAYS have done this and never had anyone complain.
So my daughter has told me she wants to stay home and spend Christmas with her boyfriend and his family. She 'says' his family has invited her to stay with them, but I'm not sure. Boyfriend is 25 and has an apt of his own. His family is in town and so is he. She can see him anytime she wants. Boyfriend is NOT a drinker, but as sick as she is in his own way. He hasn't a clue about dealing with an alcoholic and has yet to attend any Al Anon meetings. He's more like, "just have faith and pray about it. God will handle it." He isn't the type to encourage her to attend meetings. If it comes down to a meeting or him, well, she'd better chose him cause he is so dern insecure! He knows how to play mind games with her. Her IOP folks TOLD her to NOT have relationship with him or anyone else. She won't listen. She's going to do it HER way.
My family (out of town) is not aware of my daughter's problem. I have chosen not to tell my parents, who are in their late 70's, because I know my parents and I know how they worry. My dad is recovering from very serious illness and there is no way I'm adding any stress to his plate. If she chooses not to go, two innocent grandparents will be so very hurt.
When my daughter told me of her desire to stay home, I asked her what about her grandparents? She doesn't care how it will hurt their feelings. It's ALL about her at this point and what she is comfortable with. She says she isn't ready to face family and them asking about school and her having to lie, pretending she's still in school. Hmmmmmm, seems she doesn't have a problem lying to people IN TOWN when they ask about school. See, I think it's just an excuse to get what SHE wants. And I know she doesn't really care about being around me, her mom, cause I am the person in the house that will call her on the carpet, so to speak. I'm not going to be manipulated anymore.
So here lies the problem. She says she wants to stay home. There is no way I am leaving a 20 yr old, WHO IS BASICALLY 14 emotionally (her doc and counselor have confirmed this....emotionally stopped developing at age drinking begain). I simply do no trust her and her lack of maturity. I know the *#$* is going to hit the fan (pardon my french) when we tell her she IS going with us. She can RUIN our Christmas there. Normally I would say she isn't the type to do that, but I'm not really sure at this point.
My husband and I have agreed to pare down the trip, to make it as short as possible, but we do not think it is right to change our entire Christmas because she doesn't want to go. And let me add that we have another daughter, 23, who is feeling like why should her Christmas be changed also. This daughter now hates coming home because last time she was home, my A daughter pitched one holy anger fit and it scared my other daughter. She had NEVER seen her act like that. The other daughter is just getting over an abusive relationship and I KNOW that when she heard my daughter screaming and totally out of control, it reminded her of the ex boyfriend who was abusive.
My gut says set the rules and tell her that's the way it's going to be. But I'm telling you, I'm scared to death of the reaction I'll get. To be honest, I'm not as pulled together as some of you long time Al Anon's on here. (I'm sure that statement didn't come as a surprise to you.) I don't always say the right thing, act the right way. Heck, I'm hanging on by a thread here.
But WHY, why should my family's whole Christmas be dictated by what our alcoholic daughter wants? That just doesn't seem fair. I'm sick of walking eggshells, worrying about us having the discussion about what we're doing for Christmas. I feel in my gut that my daughter's main reason for wanting to stay home is PURELY SELFISH. And if there is one thing I've learned, alcoholics are selfish people, wanting what they want when they want it. And if they don't get it, they blame everyone else. Yep, I'm ready for my daughter to heap blame on us, in some way, if we lay down the law re Christmas holidays.
Leaving her home, by herself, is NOT an option. No way. Help, please??????
Last edited by Hangin' In; 12-11-2002 at 10:00 AM.
Paused
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: oh
Posts: 51
(((hangin)))
Isn't this time of year lovely? Sorry you are going through this. I don't have any great answers (as usual) but I was wondering if she would even abide by the law if you laid it down? I think you are right, she shouldn't be thinking of her self after all this and it sounds like she relies on you for support, so you have that "threat" to use....but I worry that if you lay down the law and she walks, then what? I know, I know...boundaries.....Hang in (hangin in) and hopefully Anns or MG will come along soon 
Southern through and through
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In.....trouble :-)
Posts: 1,453
In response to Piggle
thanks.
I might add that on MOST days she is trying very hard to be compliant and get along with the family. So do I know if she would even abide by the law? Who the heck knows when one of her fits of rage will kick in????
I might add that on MOST days she is trying very hard to be compliant and get along with the family. So do I know if she would even abide by the law? Who the heck knows when one of her fits of rage will kick in????
Paused
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wyandotte, Mi
Posts: 42
Not to step on any toes or anything here, but does she have a specific problem with going?
MAYBE she is being just purely selfish, but maybe not.... How long has she been with her boyfriend, and does it seem fairly serious? Are they maybe looking at starting traditions of their own? For the longest, we drug one of my sisters kicking and screaming to family events... and it just spoiled it for everyone. Hard to have a jolly old time when someone's determined to be a sourpuss. Would it be possible to check with this bf's mom to see if that offer was actually extended? And the not wanting to lie, even though she does around town... do you actually want to encourage more lies?
I wouldn't walk on eggshells, enjoy the holidays... make your plans, have fun! Now, if your daughter attending certain family functions is part of the conditions of her living at your house, then absolutely. Has there been a discussion of terms?
I don't know the whole story, and these are just some questions that came to mind reading the post. Please don't feel like I'm attacking or anything, I guess I'm just playing devil's advocate if you will... arguing the other side...
MAYBE she is being just purely selfish, but maybe not.... How long has she been with her boyfriend, and does it seem fairly serious? Are they maybe looking at starting traditions of their own? For the longest, we drug one of my sisters kicking and screaming to family events... and it just spoiled it for everyone. Hard to have a jolly old time when someone's determined to be a sourpuss. Would it be possible to check with this bf's mom to see if that offer was actually extended? And the not wanting to lie, even though she does around town... do you actually want to encourage more lies?
I wouldn't walk on eggshells, enjoy the holidays... make your plans, have fun! Now, if your daughter attending certain family functions is part of the conditions of her living at your house, then absolutely. Has there been a discussion of terms?
I don't know the whole story, and these are just some questions that came to mind reading the post. Please don't feel like I'm attacking or anything, I guess I'm just playing devil's advocate if you will... arguing the other side...
Southern through and through
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In.....trouble :-)
Posts: 1,453
Babysteps,
Thanks for your response.
She and the bf have been dating 4 months, not what I'd call a long term relationship. But in their eyes, they are 'in love.' There is no way I can tell you all the details, but her doctor, counselor and her dad and I have all agreed that the bf is verbally abusive to her. She's even shared some of what he says to her with us. So don't think I am just not liking him cause he has an earring or tatoo or something. I KNOW this boy has serious problems of his own. The people at her IOP group confronted her about him. A woman there even spoke with my daughter about how abusive relationships escalate. Did she hear it? Doesn't look like it.
And no, I don't want to encourage her to lie. But as her parent and guardian, her dad and I see much more damage being done by letting HER dictate what the family does, using her alcoholism' as an excuse to stay home. Babysteps, I know my daughter and I know how she manipulates. She's done it for years. Through Al Anon and her treatment, I've had my eyes open to it and I'm not going to be on the receiving end anymore.
One day she is screaming at us that she hates us. The next day we get a note telling us how much she loves us and knows she couldn't have gotten this far without us.
And no, we never sat down and laid out rules for the year such as "If you are living here, you will go to family Christmas." NEVER ever has she ever indicated she'd want to do otherwise. Her bf plays mind game with her. She admitted it early on, but I'm afraid he's gaining ground and has her convinced WE are the enemy when, in fact, he (as agreed by all who are treating her) is the one who is bad for her.
I cannot feel comfortable even if I did talk to the bf's family. She lies just as easily as so looks at us. She could easily tell us she is staying there and then have a good ole spend the night party with him the entire time. Keep in mind I have a daughter who is emotionally 15. If this were your daughter, would you leave her on her own for 4 days?
Thanks for your response.
She and the bf have been dating 4 months, not what I'd call a long term relationship. But in their eyes, they are 'in love.' There is no way I can tell you all the details, but her doctor, counselor and her dad and I have all agreed that the bf is verbally abusive to her. She's even shared some of what he says to her with us. So don't think I am just not liking him cause he has an earring or tatoo or something. I KNOW this boy has serious problems of his own. The people at her IOP group confronted her about him. A woman there even spoke with my daughter about how abusive relationships escalate. Did she hear it? Doesn't look like it.
And no, I don't want to encourage her to lie. But as her parent and guardian, her dad and I see much more damage being done by letting HER dictate what the family does, using her alcoholism' as an excuse to stay home. Babysteps, I know my daughter and I know how she manipulates. She's done it for years. Through Al Anon and her treatment, I've had my eyes open to it and I'm not going to be on the receiving end anymore.
One day she is screaming at us that she hates us. The next day we get a note telling us how much she loves us and knows she couldn't have gotten this far without us.
And no, we never sat down and laid out rules for the year such as "If you are living here, you will go to family Christmas." NEVER ever has she ever indicated she'd want to do otherwise. Her bf plays mind game with her. She admitted it early on, but I'm afraid he's gaining ground and has her convinced WE are the enemy when, in fact, he (as agreed by all who are treating her) is the one who is bad for her.
I cannot feel comfortable even if I did talk to the bf's family. She lies just as easily as so looks at us. She could easily tell us she is staying there and then have a good ole spend the night party with him the entire time. Keep in mind I have a daughter who is emotionally 15. If this were your daughter, would you leave her on her own for 4 days?
Paused
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Wyandotte, Mi
Posts: 42
Ahhh, gotcha And understand much better now! The emotional growth thing came up in our meeting last night... kinda cool timing. Completely agree with you now... 4 monthes isn't long, and ANY relationship this early into recovery isn't a good idea... especially one that looks so bad!
Again, wasn't trying to be a snot, or come down on you or anything... Sometimes I need an outside look at a situation I'm dealing with, and thought it might help.
Right now my girl's only 5, but I already have nightmares! My parents always joked that you're kids will be twice as bad as you were, so in my case I was in for a World of pain
And understand much better now! The emotional growth thing came up in our meeting last night... kinda cool timing. Completely agree with you now... 4 monthes isn't long, and ANY relationship this early into recovery isn't a good idea... especially one that looks so bad!Again, wasn't trying to be a snot, or come down on you or anything... Sometimes I need an outside look at a situation I'm dealing with, and thought it might help.
Right now my girl's only 5, but I already have nightmares! My parents always joked that you're kids will be twice as bad as you were, so in my case I was in for a World of pain
Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,431
I may be way off the wall here, but here goes.....
I wouldn't change my plans. I'd just go without her, and enjoy it as always.
If there's a problem when you return, you can deal with it then.
Just because she doesn't go doesn't mean you need to explain her problems....you can say I'm sorry, we all miss her being with us but she had all ready made other plans....smile and say she's 20 you know.
I just can't see using force doing anything but creating additional stress, strain and resentments. And would you enjoy yourselves in those circumstances.
I say consider it her loss. In time, she'll probably see it that way too. ...........especially is she misses out on her Christmas presents.
She may wind up mad at him, for this situation, instead of you.
just an opinion,
live
I wouldn't change my plans. I'd just go without her, and enjoy it as always.
If there's a problem when you return, you can deal with it then.
Just because she doesn't go doesn't mean you need to explain her problems....you can say I'm sorry, we all miss her being with us but she had all ready made other plans....smile and say she's 20 you know.
I just can't see using force doing anything but creating additional stress, strain and resentments. And would you enjoy yourselves in those circumstances.
I say consider it her loss. In time, she'll probably see it that way too. ...........especially is she misses out on her Christmas presents.
She may wind up mad at him, for this situation, instead of you.
just an opinion,
live
Paused
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Idaho
Posts: 3
Hi Hangin' In,
I wanted to add my 2 cents...I completely agree with Liveweyerd's post. I imagine that your newly sober daughter will indeed ruin Christmas if she is forced to go. Why risk a scene at your parent's house? Why disrupt Christmas for your other daughter who deserves to enjoy the holidays? You said yourself:
"But WHY, why should my family's whole Christmas be dictated by what our alcoholic daughter wants? "
It absolutely shouldn't be, so don't let her!!! The fact is, she is 20 and should be able to make the decision of whether or not she wants to spend Christmas with family or with a verbally abusive boyfriend.....I bet she will realize later that she didn't make the right decision.....but she needs to be able to make that decision. The bottom line is, you can't contol her - and by trying the situation will only get worse.
- Barely
I wanted to add my 2 cents...I completely agree with Liveweyerd's post. I imagine that your newly sober daughter will indeed ruin Christmas if she is forced to go. Why risk a scene at your parent's house? Why disrupt Christmas for your other daughter who deserves to enjoy the holidays? You said yourself:
"But WHY, why should my family's whole Christmas be dictated by what our alcoholic daughter wants? "
It absolutely shouldn't be, so don't let her!!! The fact is, she is 20 and should be able to make the decision of whether or not she wants to spend Christmas with family or with a verbally abusive boyfriend.....I bet she will realize later that she didn't make the right decision.....but she needs to be able to make that decision. The bottom line is, you can't contol her - and by trying the situation will only get worse.
- Barely
Southern through and through
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In.....trouble :-)
Posts: 1,453
Ok guys,
I see what you are saying and I did ask for opinions, but....
(yep, you knew it was coming.... ) I cannot feel comfortable leaving her home. 20 may be her chronological age, but I'm telling you I'm dealing with a 14/15 year old. And I do not feel comfortable leaving someone that immature at home, alone, for 2-4 days.
If I let her stay home, I feel like we will be letting the tail wag the dog here. She is still living under our roof and still taking our money to do everything she wants. (And don't tell me to tell her to move out. There is no way. She's has an ongoing medical condition that requires her being on our insurance. That means staying in school to be covered. And if she moves out, we will NOT be paying for anything. I can't ignore her health (and this is something totally unrelated to her alcoholism.) All I'm asking for is for her to take HERSELF out of the spotlight FOR ONCE and think of her grandparents who would love to see her. They adore her. I don't think 2-4 days away from the boyfriend is that much to ask.
I see what you are saying and I did ask for opinions, but....
(yep, you knew it was coming....
) I cannot feel comfortable leaving her home. 20 may be her chronological age, but I'm telling you I'm dealing with a 14/15 year old. And I do not feel comfortable leaving someone that immature at home, alone, for 2-4 days.If I let her stay home, I feel like we will be letting the tail wag the dog here. She is still living under our roof and still taking our money to do everything she wants. (And don't tell me to tell her to move out. There is no way. She's has an ongoing medical condition that requires her being on our insurance. That means staying in school to be covered. And if she moves out, we will NOT be paying for anything. I can't ignore her health (and this is something totally unrelated to her alcoholism.) All I'm asking for is for her to take HERSELF out of the spotlight FOR ONCE and think of her grandparents who would love to see her. They adore her. I don't think 2-4 days away from the boyfriend is that much to ask.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,431
Dear Hangin'
There are quite a few moms here and I'm sure they'll be along shortly (or sooner or later) who have experience dealing with these kinds of dilemnas.
You do have a few days before it needs to be resolved, don't you.
They always tell me to breathe and pray.
hugs,
tena
I am remembering your great sense of humor in earlier posts.
I laughed about your jokes about the gym for days.
There are quite a few moms here and I'm sure they'll be along shortly (or sooner or later) who have experience dealing with these kinds of dilemnas.
You do have a few days before it needs to be resolved, don't you.
They always tell me to breathe and pray.
hugs,
tena
I am remembering your great sense of humor in earlier posts.
I laughed about your jokes about the gym for days.
Nature Girl
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: By The Lake
Posts: 60,328
Hangin
I am a mom. as you know, and I don't have any great answer for you.
My son has not contacted us for a couple of weeks now, and we have no idea if he will join us for Christmas or what shape he will be in at that time. My nephew, who usually also comes to our house Christmas day, is also using, and his young boys (who I adore and love to have at Christmas) will be with his Ex, who has custody now. Our friend and adopted family William (who is from El Salvadore and has no other family here) relapsed after several years sober, and it is unlikely he will join us either.
As you can see, this is not shaping up to be a Walton's Christmas, but my husband and I will still have a nice Christmas. We will go to my brothers for part of the day, and come home to our turkey and whoever is here. We will probably invite some people over and just have a quiet but sane time.
My point is that we cannot plan around unpredictable people, nor should we let their plans spoil ours.
Go ahead with whatever you want to do, and plan to enjoy the day. If your daughter doesn't go, it is not the end of the world. It is just one day, just another 24 hours, and we can all survive it with or without help from our dysfunctional family members. Just because one person doesn't fit into the plan, doesn't mean everyone else should have a bad day.
Have fun, celebrate the joy of the season, and let the rest go.
I am a mom. as you know, and I don't have any great answer for you.
My son has not contacted us for a couple of weeks now, and we have no idea if he will join us for Christmas or what shape he will be in at that time. My nephew, who usually also comes to our house Christmas day, is also using, and his young boys (who I adore and love to have at Christmas) will be with his Ex, who has custody now. Our friend and adopted family William (who is from El Salvadore and has no other family here) relapsed after several years sober, and it is unlikely he will join us either.
As you can see, this is not shaping up to be a Walton's Christmas, but my husband and I will still have a nice Christmas. We will go to my brothers for part of the day, and come home to our turkey and whoever is here. We will probably invite some people over and just have a quiet but sane time.
My point is that we cannot plan around unpredictable people, nor should we let their plans spoil ours.
Go ahead with whatever you want to do, and plan to enjoy the day. If your daughter doesn't go, it is not the end of the world. It is just one day, just another 24 hours, and we can all survive it with or without help from our dysfunctional family members. Just because one person doesn't fit into the plan, doesn't mean everyone else should have a bad day.
Have fun, celebrate the joy of the season, and let the rest go.
Southern through and through
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In.....trouble :-)
Posts: 1,453
I hope this makes you smile
Anns,
I hope you will take this the way it is intended.....as a compliment.
When I saw you had replied to my post, my reaction was,
"Oh my gosh, the Godfather (or should I say GodMOTHER) of Al Anon is going to tell me I'm way off base and to get my co-dependent self together and DETACH!"
Thanks for being gentle with me, Anns. I'm weighing all the options and guess Christmas is going to come and go. But it won't only be one day. If we go out of town, it will be FOUR days...four days of her unchaperoned. She is VERY immature....might be 20 but acts more like 15, thus leaving her for 4 days is scary. She forgets to lock the house, stuff like that.
So can I travel 250 miles away from home, leaving an immature daughter by herself, oh wait...no, she will be with her verbally abusive and mind-game playing boyfriend ...and enjoy my 4 days?
Honestly, I don't think that is possible for me. I realize I am telling on myself and how poorly I am working my program, but there's no sense in lying about it. It's where I am right now.
Man, oh man, I wish there were a CRASH course in Al Anon! Going to try and go to a meeting tonight, but we haven't been having much success in finding one that meets regularly around where we live. All the more reason for me to say "THANK GOODNESS FOR THIS BOARD!" And thanks everyone for all of your input, even if I didn't like what you said. That'll teach me to ask for advice, won't it?
I hope you will take this the way it is intended.....as a compliment.
When I saw you had replied to my post, my reaction was,
"Oh my gosh, the Godfather (or should I say GodMOTHER) of Al Anon is going to tell me I'm way off base and to get my co-dependent self together and DETACH!"
Thanks for being gentle with me, Anns. I'm weighing all the options and guess Christmas is going to come and go. But it won't only be one day. If we go out of town, it will be FOUR days...four days of her unchaperoned. She is VERY immature....might be 20 but acts more like 15, thus leaving her for 4 days is scary. She forgets to lock the house, stuff like that.
So can I travel 250 miles away from home, leaving an immature daughter by herself, oh wait...no, she will be with her verbally abusive and mind-game playing boyfriend ...and enjoy my 4 days?
Honestly, I don't think that is possible for me. I realize I am telling on myself and how poorly I am working my program, but there's no sense in lying about it. It's where I am right now.
Man, oh man, I wish there were a CRASH course in Al Anon! Going to try and go to a meeting tonight, but we haven't been having much success in finding one that meets regularly around where we live. All the more reason for me to say "THANK GOODNESS FOR THIS BOARD!" And thanks everyone for all of your input, even if I didn't like what you said.
That'll teach me to ask for advice, won't it? Last edited by Hangin' In; 12-12-2002 at 02:53 PM.
Nature Girl
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: By The Lake
Posts: 60,328
Hangin
LOL - "The Godmother???" arghhh . You KNOW that whatever I say here is said with love in my heart, and I do love you and care. Also, I am capable of some very lousy advice too...so don't book your life on my sayso LOL. I think I recently told someone to pretend they were crazy, and it was probably not the best suggestion they ever got.
If you would be miserable going, then stay home, be all means. What I am really trying to say is that the key to your happiness is held by you, and not anyone else (including me LOL). If you would be happier having an at-home Christmas, do that, but be sure to plan lots of fun for yourself and the rest of your family that will be with you. Just as you cannot control your daughter, do not let her decisions control you or your happiness.
Take time to heal and to work your program. And learn to sleep like a baby - there will be no horse heads in your bed from me LOL.
******{Hangin}}}}
LOL - "The Godmother???" arghhh
. You KNOW that whatever I say here is said with love in my heart, and I do love you and care. Also, I am capable of some very lousy advice too...so don't book your life on my sayso LOL. I think I recently told someone to pretend they were crazy, and it was probably not the best suggestion they ever got.If you would be miserable going, then stay home, be all means. What I am really trying to say is that the key to your happiness is held by you, and not anyone else (including me LOL). If you would be happier having an at-home Christmas, do that, but be sure to plan lots of fun for yourself and the rest of your family that will be with you. Just as you cannot control your daughter, do not let her decisions control you or your happiness.
Take time to heal and to work your program. And learn to sleep like a baby - there will be no horse heads in your bed from me LOL.
******{Hangin}}}}
Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,431
LOL
Ann,
that was me that you advised to pretend dementia..........I was totally okay with that advice!
Loved it in fact,
Best wishes, hangin' in.
I hope you know I didn't mean to offend.
You know what they say about everybody having an opinion!
Ann,
that was me that you advised to pretend dementia..........I was totally okay with that advice!
Loved it in fact,
Best wishes, hangin' in.
I hope you know I didn't mean to offend.
You know what they say about everybody having an opinion!
Southern through and through
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In.....trouble :-)
Posts: 1,453
Live,
No, I wasn't offended at all. Like I said in earlier post, I ASKED for advice and ya'll offered. I appreciate it. Getting different slants on my situation helps me see more than just my view.
I come here to learn and hopefully show support for others, also.
If ya'll told me JUST what I wanted to hear, there would be no use in frequenting this board.
Thanks to all of you. This place has been a 'God send' for me.
Hugs.
No, I wasn't offended at all. Like I said in earlier post, I ASKED for advice and ya'll offered. I appreciate it. Getting different slants on my situation helps me see more than just my view.
I come here to learn and hopefully show support for others, also.
If ya'll told me JUST what I wanted to hear, there would be no use in frequenting this board.
Thanks to all of you. This place has been a 'God send' for me.
Hugs.
Paused
.gif)
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Altoona, PA
Posts: 70
Hangin in---you've got my empathy, if not a solution to your dilemma. My daughter is older than yours is, but I'm not sure how the holidays will be for us either. I smiled inside when I read that one of the other ladies said that her Christmas wasn't looking like a Walton's holiday---and I wonder how many of us have ever had those kind??? My daughter has been out of rehab for several weeks now----and has YET to go visit her grandmother!!! This is my mother and she is in the throes of dementia. Sadly, my dad just returned home from the hospital after 7 weeks in the acute setting and a rehab hospital to help him gain his strength----and she only went to see him there for 2 brief visits. Don't get me wrong---she's working her program, and I'm very proud of her, but you've got it right when you say that they can't forget about themselves too often and think of others. I'm dreading the holidays this year---mainly because my other daughter's fiancee is an alcoholic and will have tons to drink at their house. My recovering daughter doesn't want to be around any of it---but sadly, I want to share the holidays with my grandchildren. They are only 7 years and 11 months----and will be little for such a short period of time. Here it goes, girls----I WANT TO TRY TO FIX IT ALL-----and know that I can't!!! I guess I've always been the one to smooth things over, and I have to back off from that. Hangin', I know that you're a lot like me, and wish that you didn't have to go through any of this either. I agree with many of the other ladies though that you shouldn't change your plans. I know that it wouldn't be the same without your daughter (believe me---I've been there!!)---but the holidays are about family, and if she doesn't want to join----then it's HER LOSS!!! (What changes we have to make to our way of thinking!!) Give her the space to make this choice----and pray that she doesn't do damage to herself or your home. You owe it to yourself and the rest of your family to keep things as stable as possible. Don't make excuses for her---I'd just say she had other plans. As far as telling your parents about her addiction----I found it easier to tell mine about my daughter's problems early on because I didn't WANT to have to get to the point of trying to make excuses for her. My mom, as confused as she gets sometimes because of the dementia---still asks questions and wishes my daughter well. I'm sure she's hurt by the fact that she hasn't visited----but realizes that I am not in control of my daughters choices. Hopefully, you will gain some insight from the ladies on the board and will be able to make the choice that will work for you. I've found that the more I push---the further the gap gets!!! TRY to have the best holiday you can!!!! Love ya, LACEE
Paused
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Climbing outa da Black Hole
Posts: 146
Hangin' In
What do YOU want to do? For YOU? If your daughter was not in the picture at all, what would Hangin' In want to do?
I just had a thought, is there any compromise in the picture at all? Maybe you could go without her for 1 day, or 2 days? Or maybe she would be more willing to go if it was only for 1 or 2 days? Just a thought.
I have spent many a destroyed Christmas'es based on others feelings, & wants. This year, I have decided to just be true to myself and my feelings.
Good Luck! You'll make the right choice!
What do YOU want to do? For YOU? If your daughter was not in the picture at all, what would Hangin' In want to do?
I just had a thought, is there any compromise in the picture at all? Maybe you could go without her for 1 day, or 2 days? Or maybe she would be more willing to go if it was only for 1 or 2 days? Just a thought.
I have spent many a destroyed Christmas'es based on others feelings, & wants. This year, I have decided to just be true to myself and my feelings.
Good Luck! You'll make the right choice!
Southern through and through
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In.....trouble :-)
Posts: 1,453
Lacee & Gypsy,
Thanks for your responses. I learn something every time I read the responses here.
Regarding just going ahead and leaving my daughter here and 'pray she doesn't do damage to the house or herself'...gosh, I'd be absolutely miserable 4 hours away worrying about what 'might'...(yes, I know MIGHT) be going on at home. And Lacee, as good as it sounds, there is NO WAY my family is going to accept, "oh, she had other plans" without KNOWING something is up. Talk about upsetting my parents then!!!! My family is very close and if this daughter didn't show, my parents would KNOW FOR SURE there is trouble in paradise. My parents are already facing another stressful family situation coming up this week. I'm not trying to sound like a martyr, really, but there is just no way I'm going to drop the bomb of, "Hey Mom and Dad, your grandaughter is an alcoholic" as we arrive a few days before Christmas. My parents are HUGE worriers...(I come by it honestly... ) and talk about spoiling someone's Christmas!!!! I know in time they can adjust to the idea. But I know I'm just in my 2nd month of knowing of her alcoholism and I am STILL VERY MUCH STRUGGLING, trying to learn how to handle it all. No way will I tell my parents before Christmas and expect them to be able to enjoy Christmas. They'd freak!
Today my husband and I went for our 'exit' session with the doctor who worked with our daughter at the IOP treatment center. He's seen our daughter now for nine weeks and knows her pretty well. We told him of our Christmas dilemma and he said that we should not change our plans and that we should tell her she is going with us as customary. He reiterated that her emotional age is 14/15 and leaving her home would not be wise thing to do. He used the phrase of "letting the tail wag the dog" if we were to let her call the shots.
I know ya'll are probably screaming, "OK HANGIN' IN, don't ask for our slant anymore!" In fact I'm screaming at me sometimes too. I DO know I'd look at this situation in a TOTALLY DIFFERENT light if she were self supporting, living outside the home. But she is still living at home with us providing everything and I mean everything.
And yes, Gypsy, my husband and I have already discussed this (amongst ourselves) and said we'll pare the trip down. We think we can cut it down to 48-54 hours.
Bottom line is I have an alcoholic daughter at the maturity level of a 14/15 year old. She and her verbally abusive, mind-game playing boyfriend (can you tell I don't like him??? )have this fantasy of some fantastically romantic Christmas spent together. Girls....don't you remember how you felt at 15, thinking you were SO IN LOVE? THAT IS WHAT I'M DEALING WITH except she is 20 and thinking like this with a sick 25 year old!
I know, I know, I KNOW!!!!!!!!!! ARRRRRRRRRRGHHHHHHHH!!!! DETACH, HANGIN', DETACH!!!!! But even if I detach, Christmas is still coming..........
I think it stinks, PURELY STINKS that my daughter can't think of anyone but herself!
Now ya'll go ahead....just mug me and drag me to 12 Al Anon meetings......and please make them all in ONE DAY! That would at least take up one day and I wouldn't have to be home dealing with this!!!!
And despite what I write, I really do appreciate you gals and your take on all this. Ya'll are the best! And I know....I win the 'hard headed' prize!!!
Thanks for your responses. I learn something every time I read the responses here.
Regarding just going ahead and leaving my daughter here and 'pray she doesn't do damage to the house or herself'...gosh, I'd be absolutely miserable 4 hours away worrying about what 'might'...(yes, I know MIGHT) be going on at home. And Lacee, as good as it sounds, there is NO WAY my family is going to accept, "oh, she had other plans" without KNOWING something is up. Talk about upsetting my parents then!!!! My family is very close and if this daughter didn't show, my parents would KNOW FOR SURE there is trouble in paradise. My parents are already facing another stressful family situation coming up this week. I'm not trying to sound like a martyr, really, but there is just no way I'm going to drop the bomb of, "Hey Mom and Dad, your grandaughter is an alcoholic" as we arrive a few days before Christmas. My parents are HUGE worriers...(I come by it honestly...
) and talk about spoiling someone's Christmas!!!! I know in time they can adjust to the idea. But I know I'm just in my 2nd month of knowing of her alcoholism and I am STILL VERY MUCH STRUGGLING, trying to learn how to handle it all. No way will I tell my parents before Christmas and expect them to be able to enjoy Christmas. They'd freak!Today my husband and I went for our 'exit' session with the doctor who worked with our daughter at the IOP treatment center. He's seen our daughter now for nine weeks and knows her pretty well. We told him of our Christmas dilemma and he said that we should not change our plans and that we should tell her she is going with us as customary. He reiterated that her emotional age is 14/15 and leaving her home would not be wise thing to do. He used the phrase of "letting the tail wag the dog" if we were to let her call the shots.
I know ya'll are probably screaming, "OK HANGIN' IN, don't ask for our slant anymore!" In fact I'm screaming at me sometimes too.
I DO know I'd look at this situation in a TOTALLY DIFFERENT light if she were self supporting, living outside the home. But she is still living at home with us providing everything and I mean everything. And yes, Gypsy, my husband and I have already discussed this (amongst ourselves) and said we'll pare the trip down. We think we can cut it down to 48-54 hours.
Bottom line is I have an alcoholic daughter at the maturity level of a 14/15 year old. She and her verbally abusive, mind-game playing boyfriend (can you tell I don't like him???
)have this fantasy of some fantastically romantic Christmas spent together. Girls....don't you remember how you felt at 15, thinking you were SO IN LOVE? THAT IS WHAT I'M DEALING WITH except she is 20 and thinking like this with a sick 25 year old!I know, I know, I KNOW!!!!!!!!!! ARRRRRRRRRRGHHHHHHHH!!!! DETACH, HANGIN', DETACH!!!!! But even if I detach, Christmas is still coming..........
I think it stinks, PURELY STINKS that my daughter can't think of anyone but herself!
Now ya'll go ahead....just mug me and drag me to 12 Al Anon meetings......and please make them all in ONE DAY! That would at least take up one day and I wouldn't have to be home dealing with this!!!!
And despite what I write, I really do appreciate you gals and your take on all this. Ya'll are the best! And I know....I win the 'hard headed' prize!!!
Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,431
Okie, dokie, so she's going!
She does want a home to come back to, and that monetary support from the powers that be.
Just don't expect to her to be happy about it.
ah, well, it's hard to hold a grudge forever, she'll get over it. Sometime.
I'm trying to insert some funny here, okay?
That's what I got from my meeting, tonite...laughter...and the stuff we were talking about isn't in the usual realm of funny,
but laughter can be such good medicine,
hugs,
live
She does want a home to come back to, and that monetary support from the powers that be.
Just don't expect to her to be happy about it.
ah, well, it's hard to hold a grudge forever, she'll get over it. Sometime.
I'm trying to insert some funny here, okay?
That's what I got from my meeting, tonite...laughter...and the stuff we were talking about isn't in the usual realm of funny,
but laughter can be such good medicine,
hugs,
live
Southern through and through
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In.....trouble :-)
Posts: 1,453
Live,
I'm with you....LOVE a good laugh. To make my post brighter, let me say that my daughter, the "A", and I were going to have our family picture made for our church's pictorial directory tonight. She has very curly hair. We laughed all the way there at the possibility of her just taking a brush to it and making it stand out about 3 feet from her head. We weren't sure the photographer would be able to get her WHOLE head in the picture! I swear, with her curls and a brush, she can have ONE BIG HEAD OF HAIR!
So just know things aren't always awful at our house. We actually DO get along from time to time and laugh at ourselves, just like we did tonight. I cherish those times with her.
Wish I had a meeting to go to tonight like you had. Meetings here are twice a week, but sometimes no one shows. Oh well....I'll catch 'em when they are there...
I'm with you....LOVE a good laugh. To make my post brighter, let me say that my daughter, the "A", and I were going to have our family picture made for our church's pictorial directory tonight. She has very curly hair. We laughed all the way there at the possibility of her just taking a brush to it and making it stand out about 3 feet from her head. We weren't sure the photographer would be able to get her WHOLE head in the picture! I swear, with her curls and a brush, she can have ONE BIG HEAD OF HAIR!
So just know things aren't always awful at our house. We actually DO get along from time to time and laugh at ourselves, just like we did tonight. I cherish those times with her.
Wish I had a meeting to go to tonight like you had. Meetings here are twice a week, but sometimes no one shows. Oh well....I'll catch 'em when they are there...
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
