Cookie314

Has anyone else found their relationship with alcohol seriously changed by their experiences with their alcoholic? I remember a couple years ago when describing the fact that I had stopped drinking to my therapist, she stopped me and asked "why?" I was so confused by this because to me it seemed logical to stop drinking while wanting my AH to stop. Wasn't it cruel to drink in front of him? Doesn't my stopping show support for him to stop as well? She told me "you are allowed to have your own relationship with alcohol. He has to work through his difficulties with drinking in his own way, but that shouldn't determine how you drink."

That always stuck with me. While I did still largely stop drinking (thanks in no small part to quarantine and my no alcohol in the house boundary coming together), I allowed myself to feel ok with drinking when out somewhere without my AH. I still don't feel comfortable having alcohol around him, but out alone with friends and family, I'll have one or two.

This has put me in such an odd state sometimes, because I find now I'm hyper aware of my own drinking. To the degree that I know for a fact that I've had 6 drinks through the course of this year, and remember each instance I had them. (I'd say this makes me a cheap date, but my love of steak prevents that.)

It almost feels like an obsession of my own now. As if spending so long concerning myself over my husband's intake has transferred over to me. I don't know if it's entirely unhealthy, since it means I no longer drink enough to get sick the next day, but it feels a little odd as well.

As I wait for my AH to return home from rehab next week (the calm before the storm I'm sure) I find myself thinking about what my relationship with alcohol will be once I'm moved out. When he's no longer sharing a house with me, what will my boundaries be for myself and my guests? I don't think I'll have to keep the ban on any alcohol in the house, but I also don't know how much I'll really want to go fetch it and bring it over. It'll be interesting to see how I feel at the time.

For those of you who have had their relationship with alcohol change, what are your thoughts? Do you maintain boundaries against it in your home? Do you feel anxious when having it, or hyper aware of yourself when you have? Did you stop drinking around your addict when they were still drinking or in recovery? Do you even want a relationship with alcohol after everything you've been through?

Freshstart1111

Last year I became very angry with alcohol. It caused my marriage to end. And I was seeing what it was doing to some very good people in my life. I was angry about its effects on people. I was angry about how it is marketed as such a great thing when I saw how it ruins relationships and peoples lives.
So I needed to decide what my relationship with it was going to be. I was already divorced so my AXHs drinking didn’t factor in. I thought about what drinking was for me. I realized I mostly had drinks because everyone else was. It was amazing to really step back and see so many people revolve events around drinking. I didn’t want to do that anymore. That was my whole life with my XH.
So, like you, I could count how many drinks total I’ve had in the last year. Now I have a drink if I feel like it, not just because I am getting together with friends. 99 times out of a 100 I don’t feel like it. I feel better physically when I don’t drink. Even just one. I would just rather feel like myself now.
Friends asked. I told them what i wrote here. They get it. I sometimes wonder if people think I don’t drink because ‘I’ have a drinking problem. But I’ve learned not to care what they think. I know that I do have a problem with alcohol, just not a drinking problem.

Freshstart1111

To add to my post, I just can’t stand now when someone says “I need a drink”. No, you really don’t.

ironwill

That is a great question Cookie. I have never been a big drinker before the discovery of my RAW issue with alcohol. I put up a boundary of no Alcohol in the house. After getting my self better educated with what alcohol really does to a person. My eyes were opened and surprised just how much our culture is inundated with alcohol around us. How much it is pushed to us at events and social gathering. That you need to be drinking to have a good time. While my wife said I didn't have to give it up. I knew and could see the problems it can cause and removed it from my life. This is why I decided to stop drinking. I wasn't going to be an enabler of alcohol. It had caused me too much pain. While I still have friends who i think drink to much. I know that only they can determine if they have a problem with alcohol.

Cookie314

To freshstart, yes I know exactly what you mean! For a while I felt so angry at alcohol, like it was a kind of demon or something that destroyed my loved one. I've cooled on that some, as I feel more strongly now that addiction itself is worthy of much more of my ire. Yet emotionally there's a lot wrapped up with alcohol now that it's difficult to detach myself from. I still enjoy some alcohol, since I like the taste of discovering new beers and wines, but my desire for it overall has decreased significantly.

To ironwill, it's amazing isn't it? I never realized before how much alcohol was truly advertised before all this. Google and other platforms also make it much more difficult to stop those ads than you'd think too. The best they can do is try to reduce the frequency, but can't stop them completely, and the steps to set that are a pain.

No other drug is so central to our culture either. Drinking is part of everything. The closest I can imagine is trying to be on a diet and setting constant adds for ice cream and such. Though of course for an addict it's an entirely different level of challenge.

PeacefulWater12

Maybe coming at it not from the angle which you were asking from, Cookie, but late AH and I drank alcoholically together for a few years, I then realised I needed to quit as the alcohol along with the manic lifestyle was making me ill.

AH tried everything he could to sabotage my quit. Verbal criticism, leaving glasses of my drink of choice around our home.

He was a whisky drinker but he changed to vodka which was my drink for a while as further temptation to me.

He desperately didn't want to lose me as his drinking buddy. Well not me personally, of course, as people are interchangeable to drinkers, I mean a drinking buddy in general. Also if he was the only drinker in the home, it would be more transparent as to how much time and money was being wasted on alcohol.

Cookie314

I used to drink more to fit in with his family's lifestyle, but he didn't pressure me like that when I wanted to stop. I'm sorry you had to put up with that, it sounds really difficult to reach your own recovery with someone constantly shoving it in your face.

OKRunner

Two things have changed since my exposure to my AXBF. The first is that I, too, have noticed how many liquor stories, alcohol billboards, liquor advertisements, etc., there are. I live in a small college town where sports rule and I never noticed the extent to which alcohol plays a role in this town. But now I do. I'm in my 40s, but I see all of the fraternity and sorority beer bashes, cocktail events, etc. I see the bajillions of liquor stores right across the street from our beautiful main university buildings. I see all the liquor stores at the corner of all of the faculty neighborhoods, including the nice neighborhood where I live. I see liquor everywhere. It breaks my heart. I Googled the name of my state and alcoholism the other day. Turns out my state has the highest or second highest, depending on who is counting, relative rate of alcohol use disorder in the nation. It breaks my heart.

The second thing is that I went from barely ever drinking to refusing to drink anything whatsoever. My problems are sweets and sugar, not alcohol, but sure I'd have a glass of wine on Thanksgiving, a glass of champagne on New Years Eve, or a margarita or beer on July 4th to be polite in the old days (that is, before meeting my AXBF). Now, I refuse to drink at all. To me, and after watching my beautiful AXBF ruin himself physically and mentally and the love that we had with alcohol -- now I think alcohol is poison. I want no part of it. Not even one glass. Not even one can. Not one shot. I've never seen something with so little value kill or ruin so many people, relationships, families, hearts, lives, careers.

Some people wish for world peace. Some people wish to cure cancer, or to end hunger. Sure, I wish and pray for all of those things too. But if I could snap my fingers and fix one problem in this world it would be to rid it of it alcohol and drugs and end addiction. The past year has been eye opening for me in the worst way. I wouldn't wish what my AXBF has gone through, and what he continues to go through on a daily basis as an addict in the throes of active addiction, on anyone -- not even my worst enemy. I wouldn't wish what I've gone through on anyone, not even my worst enemy. It's just horrible, awful, and painful beyond belief.

edoering

You know, I don’t know if my relationship to alcohol (and even weed) would have changed naturally with age or if it is mostly because of my relationship, but it has definitely changed. Now I pretty much have no interest in alcohol or weed anymore, though I don’t hate it enough to feel strictly, just not interested.

When I was younger, even though I didn’t drink a lot, it was associated with soothing family events or relaxing after a long week with friends. In hindsight it wasn’t actually soothing or relaxing, but my young brain wanted to believe that. Now, I’m more aware of how it affects my body, down to little nuances, so I’m also more aware of how long it really takes my body to fully recover (mostly hydration is the slowest thing to adjust back, and it messes a little with my fitness goals). PLUS it’s associated with a lot more pain and stress now.

So yeah, if I want to relax I just go and spend the same amount of time with friends and family as I used to, “unplug” and enjoy, but just don’t bother with alcohol. Again, not strict, so I do have an occasional drink depending on event or mood, but only if I want to. And unsurprisingly, I almost NEVER want to

Cookie314

It definitely causes me greater anxiety than it used to. My relationship with it wasn't always healthy either. I definitely used to have that heavy partying mindset in college, and our mutual friend groups (even before my AH and I met and started going out) were all heavy drinkers. I slowed down a lot as I got older and moved away from the party scene, and as my body got more sensitive to it (or I should say I stopped ignoring how bad it made me feel, I've always gotten wicked hangovers). Then while I was with my AH and we went out with his family, they all were OK driving drunk, which made me uncomfortable, but the way I responded was to enable them and be the DD every time. How convenient I was to them, huh? I basically became a built in chauffer. I really don't miss it. I'll still probably have a couple when I'm with friends or family, but nothing like I used to.

Eauchiche

I am WTCU all the way. Absolute Tea totaler.
I am not this way because I am angry at anyone or anything.
I just cannot find a single good thing about alcohol use, unless it’s used as a disinfectant or solvent.

Boondock

I mentioned a couple of these subjects in separate threads here recently....One being: Alcohol has never done anything good for anybody and there isn't one positive attribute to it outside of industrial usage. Also the barrage of advertisements is astounding and the way it is represented is almost to the point of it being healthy or a wholesome activity. It's such a false depiction of the reality of it. I think it should be like cigarettes it shouldn't be advertised at all.

LifeRecovery

Cooke314

So my relationship with alcohol has not changed. I have lived with an eating disorder from when I was a young child and because of my tendencies toward addiction did not drink significantly even during high school / college. I was afraid of losing control. One of the hard things about food disorders is that there is a duality to it. Food is both good and can be bad and there is a balance to it for health. I can honestly say that I personally have never had a negative consequence with my alcohol consumption, and have never been intoxicated.

So consuming alcohol is not my challenge, but I had plenty of challenges about other people's relationship with alcohol. Frankly my co-dependency was as nuts as their alcohol use.

When everything hit the fan with the relationship that got me here, I got into Al-Anon and I got a huge taste of my crazy. It was the holidays and I was in the grocery store purchasing a liquor for a baking item. I saw another Al-Anon member in the store after I had the liquor in my hand. I was SO anxious about his opinion of me buying alcohol that I was a crazy mess. I think I had a traumatic response - hot, cold, flushed, anxious and kind of shaky. I kid you not I ran around the store avoiding this gentleman, like a stalker would....except I was trying to avoid him seeing me because of my shame and embarrassment not because I was checking up on him. I was not sure what it meant if he saw me buying alcohol. I was so flustered by it that I rang up and walked out of the store without asking the clerk to take the theft tag off of it.....and did not know about the tag until many days later. It is funny to me now how I reacted, and I giggle picturing myself Mission Impossible in the grocery store. What was more serious was how crazy the idea of someone else's opinion of me drove me to this behavior. I suspect that my ex's opinion of me also dictated a lot of crazy making behavior in me also. An opinion that was often impaired with alcohol use.

So for me my relationship with alcohol has not shifted, it was not the problem. My relationship with what others think of me had to. I love the AA Slogan of "What other people think of me is none of my business." Sorry this post may be swinging off topic a little but as I learned to trust myself a little more my relationship with myself eased the rest fell into place. It was when I did not trust myself that I was not creating boundaries, I was creating rigidity.

It was so brave of you to ask the question and that is your recovery coming through. I finally asked in an Al-Anon meeting the same question. For me the question / story was a way of coming out of shame and sharing the challenges.

Cookie314

Eauchiche, what does WTCU stand for? Won't touch something?

LR, I think that fear of outside judgement is definitely a hallmark of both codependency, and what a lot of us a loved ones of addicts struggle with. It's certainly part of my changing relationship. I'm more worried about what particular people think of me than other people in a general sense, but perhaps I feel it more sharply because of that.

The other weekend I was out with my mom, sister, and her fiance. My mom and I got there first, and I wanted to order a beer. I knew we would be there for at least two hours, so I ordered a single tall one (which was 22 oz, so just shy of 2 standard beers, but with us being there for a couple of hours and having food I felt that was fine) instead of the shorter ones. She sees the drink come out in the tall glass, and exclaims "oh my God cookie!" It sent me into a rabbit hole in my head for a bit of obsessing over what I had ordered, and if my thinking was wrong, or is she overreacting, should I have just ordered nothing, but I can still enjoy some if I want, I'm not the one with the problem, though maybe obsessing over it like this is a problem... You get the idea. There's a lot more anxiety around alcohol than there ever used to be.

Eauchiche

Women’s Christian Temperance Union.
They let guys join too

Cookie314

Oooh ok. I looked it up and found that, but wasn't sure if it was something different or not.

schnappi99

Sorry late to the thread, it is an interesting topic. I also stopped drinking when my wife's drinking reached the big event stage. At first it only seemed fair- if she wasn't drinking I shouldn't also. I was in Alanon for a while, listening to AA speaker tapes and so on, and realized I didn't have a clear idea about my own relationship to alcohol; to me it was fun and then a hangover- so as an experiment I stayed stopped to see what happened. Mostly it was just a simplification; didn't spend any more time choosing and buying alcohol- and I do (still) very much appreciate waking up the next day feeling great. I realized that alcohol simply didn't add anything significant or useful and I find I don't particularly think about alcohol for months at a time.

6 years later, she's decided to drink again (at least on date-nites- but that is her business). I joined her a few times with wine and so on but didn't like the next morning gross; so I'll stick with iced tea and she can have the martini.

Not drinking emphatically shows how much alcohol is integrated into people's lives; half the office at work collects and drinks boutique whisky and talk about it endlessly, sometimes having tastings during work hours and so on. Whenever we have people over we buy some beer and wine as inevitably as cleaning the house in preparation.

My ultimate boundary is if she resumes the old alcohol abuse- the daily drinking at home; sodden sloppy behavior, passing out etc- then either my wife has to leave or I leave with our daughter and I immediately begin separation and divorce. As far as bringing it home, my response is to let her know I'd rather not have it in the house (unless for guests); I don't intend to join in. Obviously if she resumes hidden drinking I can only respond to her behavior as per my boundary (I am not going to be around frequent or abusive drinking).

As to how the marriage has changed, I suppose it has. She isn't in any noticable sort of recovery, no investment in spiritual practice at all- we don't have a lot in common these days; but though the Alanon work I can serve and not bring conflict, which at least helps keep things civil and peaceful and that is a BIG change from the old days.

Rachel1411

As someone who divorced an alcoholic (who later died from alcoholic liver disease), I am bothered ethically by 1) overconsumption of alcohol by anyone, anytime, 2) people who drink and then drive, not really knowing if they're over the legal limit, 3) television shows and commercials that make it look like every celebration, every happy moment, requires free-flowing alcohol, 4) people who shame you for not drinking to excess...I had a co-worker say, "have another drink; why don't you lighten up?"; and especially 5) parents who tolerate underage drinking so their kids "fit in" with the crowd. My experiences with an alcoholic have had a profound impact on my relationship to alcohol. I wish it didn't exist.

One month after my XAH died, my sons were back for Xmas and we were eating at a restaurant on Xmas Eve with my then three-year-old granddaughter. A man seated behind us was drunk and out of control, throwing out the F-bomb and a variety of vulgarities. My son very nicely asked him to stop swearing in front of his daughter. The man started coming at him, fists raised, but his friends held him back. (Good for him as my son is a military fitness expert who would have landed him on his rump.) We all just looked at each other and shook our heads. Oh, the power of alcohol to destroy lives and cause chaos...

Cookie314

To Schnappi, interesting. So your wife went through 6 years of sobriety, and then started drinking again? What made her restart it? How did you come up with the boundary for acceptable drinking? I'm not sure I could handle any return to drinking from my AH, but I suppose that's part of why I'm filing for divorce.

To Rachel, I'm so sorry he passed away. It's terrible to lose someone. I agree that I notice ads for alcohol so much more now, and I hate it too. I mentioned before how much I hate that it's so difficult to shut those off. I'm glad your son was able to avoid that needless fight, alcoholism chaos incarnate.

schnappi99

She definitely didn't drink for those 6-ish years, I don't think it was a white-knuckling sort of restraint. Some of it certainly was guilt because of what went on while things were bad, some of it was due to my pre-Alanon ultimatum delivered the evening of the big dramatic reveal. When she resumed having drinks when we were out, we talked a bit about it, thankfully I had my Alanon hat on and made it clear her drinking is her business. I do regret the ultimatum and continue to make living amends for it. A spouse as judge, jury, executioner is not a good look. She said she likes the taste of the martini's, the chips of ice in it, smell of the olives and so on. As far as acceptable drinking, if we're out on date-nite and she's not driving then I don't have a problem with her having a drink or 2. If it turns into several nights a week or she starts bringing booze home for her own use, that exceeds my comfort level. Sodden drunken behavior is way past my boundary.

I arrived at my boundaries such as they are through talking to my Alanon folks, sponsor, friends in program and so on. It is in part guided by me relinquishing alcohol; I really don't want to be around it's frequent or substantial consumption.