Here we go again...and I hate it.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 8
Here we go again...and I hate it.
It's been YEARS since I've been here. And yet, I know that I am dealing with a chronic addiction issue, so why am I surprised? H has stayed sober for long periods of time, but in the last few weeks I found bottles, bags, etc. Interesting that it's all starting over again. I love him dearly and don't like to see him fooling himself. We have had two calm conversations about the situation. I expressed my dislike of his lying and hiding. He expressed that he just wants to be "half-a-bubble" off sometimes. He wants to be "normal" and live a "normal life" and drink "moderately". He doesn't like my asking why alcohol is so important that he must hide it from me. If he felt good about drinking he would just do it and accept my reactions/feelings about it as my own. Not sure he understands how this works.
I expressed that I will not drink with him. And seemed to pretend he didn't know that when I told him I wouldn't drink when he stopped originally that I meant it. (I haven't had a drink for almost a decade.) That his health is that important to me. I told him I will not support his drinking as I have never in our 32 year marriage seen him able to drink "moderately". That his hiding his drinking likely indicates he is already not drinking "moderately". There is no end to the way he can justify these types of actions.
I am slightly anxious, as we have built a good life together. We have a tiny farm and animals I love and gardens I've created from bare ground. It's almost as if he saw it as the perfect opportunity to start drinking again. He is extremely high-functioning and I think he actually believes this time will be different. I asked him how he will know or decide if he is unable to drink "moderately". He cannot answer that question. So, for now, we are just continuing to talk. He wanted praise for staying sober for the last few days and I told him doing the right thing for himself should be enough. I'm not feeling kind at the moment. I really don't want to think too far ahead, but I'm not sure where to go from here. Thanks for reading. I have no one to talk to as this all came to a head in the last few days. Our kids are grown and live nearby. I am deciding when or how to talk to them about it. I don't want to burden them, but feel they need to know. Please advise?
I expressed that I will not drink with him. And seemed to pretend he didn't know that when I told him I wouldn't drink when he stopped originally that I meant it. (I haven't had a drink for almost a decade.) That his health is that important to me. I told him I will not support his drinking as I have never in our 32 year marriage seen him able to drink "moderately". That his hiding his drinking likely indicates he is already not drinking "moderately". There is no end to the way he can justify these types of actions.
I am slightly anxious, as we have built a good life together. We have a tiny farm and animals I love and gardens I've created from bare ground. It's almost as if he saw it as the perfect opportunity to start drinking again. He is extremely high-functioning and I think he actually believes this time will be different. I asked him how he will know or decide if he is unable to drink "moderately". He cannot answer that question. So, for now, we are just continuing to talk. He wanted praise for staying sober for the last few days and I told him doing the right thing for himself should be enough. I'm not feeling kind at the moment. I really don't want to think too far ahead, but I'm not sure where to go from here. Thanks for reading. I have no one to talk to as this all came to a head in the last few days. Our kids are grown and live nearby. I am deciding when or how to talk to them about it. I don't want to burden them, but feel they need to know. Please advise?
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 5,450
So what is behind your feeling that they "need to know"? Are you looking for support from them for yourself? I think that's pretty valid, if you want them to understand what you are dealing with. As long as the expectation isn't that they can somehow control the situation or influence his decisions--they are as powerless over his addiction as you are. How do you think they will respond to this information?
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Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 8
Thank you for asking those questions. I don't know if I should talk to them about it. It could be nothing but me unthinkingly burdening them in a misguided effort to have someone to talk to about it. I think it would be wiser for me to find outside counseling. There's nothing any of us can do for him, so I'm not sure what the benefit of discussing it with them would be. If something drastically negative happens, maybe then it would be appropriate. I just don't know.
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 5,450
For what it's worth, I don't think there's a "correct" response, but it's good to ask questions about one's motives and take time before making a decision. Outside counseling benefitted me terrifically, perhaps it will afford the same for you.
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,631
hi sugahcube, yes, you know where this is heading (and it isn't any place that is good), so you are wise to listen to yourself on that.
The only thing you can do is have your own boundaries - not rules for him (he won't follow them, and why should he) just what you will and won't do and what you (not him) will do about that, should the occasion arise.
I think it's perhaps a good thing that you told him that doing the right thing for himself should be enough. It's dangerous to get in to a position where you are his "cheerleader", when he drinks again, do you become the anti-cheerleader?
Your idea of getting some outside counselling and/or Al Anon is spot on. Preferably someone familiar with addictions.
The only thing you can do is have your own boundaries - not rules for him (he won't follow them, and why should he) just what you will and won't do and what you (not him) will do about that, should the occasion arise.
I think it's perhaps a good thing that you told him that doing the right thing for himself should be enough. It's dangerous to get in to a position where you are his "cheerleader", when he drinks again, do you become the anti-cheerleader?
Your idea of getting some outside counselling and/or Al Anon is spot on. Preferably someone familiar with addictions.
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Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: uk
Posts: 2,428
Sorry to read of the situation.
I wanted to say well handled when he was looking for you to praise him for not drinking. That is such a dangerous path once we are on it.
My AH was seeking for similar from me. Urgh.
I wanted to say well handled when he was looking for you to praise him for not drinking. That is such a dangerous path once we are on it.
My AH was seeking for similar from me. Urgh.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 8
I don't want to be the person that is responsible for his perceptions of "success" or "failure", you know? And, frankly, it should seem obvious to him that it's a bizarre thing to ask someone for praise for temporarily not engaging in bizarre behavior. I keep telling him he has to do this for himself. But even after all this time he doesn't seem to grasp why. Baffling.
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Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Blue Ridge Mountains
Posts: 816
So sorry to hear he has started drinking again after a long sobriety period- so
disheartening and of course, my worst fear with my RAH. Just curious if
you have ever been to alanon or had a sponsor?
I do think the first thing to go is rational behavior/thinking with a relapse, and
when they start drinking, they are exactly where they left off, no matter how
much they deny or try to lie to themselves. Did he follow a
recovery program?
disheartening and of course, my worst fear with my RAH. Just curious if
you have ever been to alanon or had a sponsor?
I do think the first thing to go is rational behavior/thinking with a relapse, and
when they start drinking, they are exactly where they left off, no matter how
much they deny or try to lie to themselves. Did he follow a
recovery program?
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
Sugacube------I wonder how long is "he has stayed sober for long periods of time"? Also, when you say that he is "extremely high functioning"....what are your criteria for saying that?
It is the fondest dream of every alcoholic to drink "normally"---like a non-alcoholic would. They will. often, try it over and over, again, in an effort to see if it will work....but, of course, face failure, every time.
Also, hiding evidence of their drinking seems to be in the alcoholic manual. First of all---it is logical, as they usually know that we are against it---so they want to stay out of trouble with us. Another reason is that to continue their drinking Requires a lot of denial on the part of the alcoholic (it is a disease of denial)-----so, it seems that the alcoholic in an odd way, try to "hide" the evidence from themselves. lol---lots of alcoholics hide it when there is no reason to do so---even when they live alone...or, live with another heavy drinker. Maybe, still trying to manifest that IMAGE of being a "normal" non-alcoholic drinker....1?
One reason that he is soliciting praise from you, may be because he is trying to be sober to please you and get you off of his case about drinking.
Also, it sounds like he is trying to be sober by just "white knuckling"----is that true?
I don't know your age, but, from what you have shared, I am going to take a guess that you might be somewhere between 50 and 55 yrs. I see from your previous post that you have been at this level of concern for the last ten years.
My concern is for you. As you well know---alcoholism is progressive, and it gets worse, over time. I would hate to see you in this same position, ten more years from now.
That would put you at about usual retirement age----by my imaginary math...lol.
My suggestion to you would be this----Start, now, working on a PLAN.....and, be very goal oriented, with the plan.
What are your desires and potential options. What are your legal rights and obligations, long term? (call that legal information gathering).
I can really relate that you love your animals and small farm (I was born and spent early years on a farm, myself). How can you keep the farm, no matter what he does?
Perhaps you could take a side job and save enough money over the next several years to buy him out of his half. Or, perhaps you could sell the farm and take your half and buy another small farm---a place to take your animals and take some of your prized flowers and shrubs/tree starters.
Another plan might be to save and buy a used trailer and move it to a corner of the farm---and, let him live there---away from you and so that he can peacefully drink hjmself into a "normal" oblivion.
If your main goal is to keep your farm and beloved animals---then, I would go by the old adage---"Where there is a will. there is a way". My grandmother told me that about a gazillion times as I was growing up.
It is the fondest dream of every alcoholic to drink "normally"---like a non-alcoholic would. They will. often, try it over and over, again, in an effort to see if it will work....but, of course, face failure, every time.
Also, hiding evidence of their drinking seems to be in the alcoholic manual. First of all---it is logical, as they usually know that we are against it---so they want to stay out of trouble with us. Another reason is that to continue their drinking Requires a lot of denial on the part of the alcoholic (it is a disease of denial)-----so, it seems that the alcoholic in an odd way, try to "hide" the evidence from themselves. lol---lots of alcoholics hide it when there is no reason to do so---even when they live alone...or, live with another heavy drinker. Maybe, still trying to manifest that IMAGE of being a "normal" non-alcoholic drinker....1?
One reason that he is soliciting praise from you, may be because he is trying to be sober to please you and get you off of his case about drinking.
Also, it sounds like he is trying to be sober by just "white knuckling"----is that true?
I don't know your age, but, from what you have shared, I am going to take a guess that you might be somewhere between 50 and 55 yrs. I see from your previous post that you have been at this level of concern for the last ten years.
My concern is for you. As you well know---alcoholism is progressive, and it gets worse, over time. I would hate to see you in this same position, ten more years from now.
That would put you at about usual retirement age----by my imaginary math...lol.
My suggestion to you would be this----Start, now, working on a PLAN.....and, be very goal oriented, with the plan.
What are your desires and potential options. What are your legal rights and obligations, long term? (call that legal information gathering).
I can really relate that you love your animals and small farm (I was born and spent early years on a farm, myself). How can you keep the farm, no matter what he does?
Perhaps you could take a side job and save enough money over the next several years to buy him out of his half. Or, perhaps you could sell the farm and take your half and buy another small farm---a place to take your animals and take some of your prized flowers and shrubs/tree starters.
Another plan might be to save and buy a used trailer and move it to a corner of the farm---and, let him live there---away from you and so that he can peacefully drink hjmself into a "normal" oblivion.
If your main goal is to keep your farm and beloved animals---then, I would go by the old adage---"Where there is a will. there is a way". My grandmother told me that about a gazillion times as I was growing up.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 8
Thank you for your thoughtful words. I am concerned, too. And I have started investigating some of these options or ideas. The longest he has stayed sober is about 3 years at a time. Then a couple of years at a time each time after that. In between there have been days or weeks of hidden drinking, then back to not drinking again. I can tell when it's happening. He has a look.
When I say high-functioning I mean he is consistently kind and affectionate, he has never missed a day of work, he is on top of bills, repairs, farm maintenance, family events, helping our kids when they need it, there for me through some recent health issues, etc. He's never "obviously" drunk. NO slurring or stumbling or odd behavior. But I can see it in his eyes and occasionally smell it. Most of the hiding seems to be because he is worried about my reaction. Oh, well. He will have to figure that out for himself. I am going to have to work through my options. Part of the talk we had drove home the idea that drinking may be the one thing we can't see eye-to-eye on. To the point of incompatibility. I felt it was important that he was the one the saw that conclusion. I don't feel scared or incapable. I'm just disappointed to find myself having to revisit all of this again.
I know that I will be okay if this all goes sideways. I'm not the one afraid to be alone. And I understand I may not be able to have what I want. Life can be that way. We shall see.0
When I say high-functioning I mean he is consistently kind and affectionate, he has never missed a day of work, he is on top of bills, repairs, farm maintenance, family events, helping our kids when they need it, there for me through some recent health issues, etc. He's never "obviously" drunk. NO slurring or stumbling or odd behavior. But I can see it in his eyes and occasionally smell it. Most of the hiding seems to be because he is worried about my reaction. Oh, well. He will have to figure that out for himself. I am going to have to work through my options. Part of the talk we had drove home the idea that drinking may be the one thing we can't see eye-to-eye on. To the point of incompatibility. I felt it was important that he was the one the saw that conclusion. I don't feel scared or incapable. I'm just disappointed to find myself having to revisit all of this again.
I know that I will be okay if this all goes sideways. I'm not the one afraid to be alone. And I understand I may not be able to have what I want. Life can be that way. We shall see.0
Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: NY, ny
Posts: 28
Oh my goodness, I am going through similar...but, my AH has never gone sober. He is getting worse, when he pushes too far, he steps back, but this time, I feel different than all of the other times. I feel detached and in my head I think I have started mourning all the good times we've had, the holiday traditions coming up...first time in years my anger level is not an "anger". I don't know, something is different for me. I'm sad. I wish you strength.
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