ducky12

Hi all,
My husband is reacclimating back home from sober living. Last weekend, I met a friend for dinner while he stayed home- we hadn’t seen each other in a while and it was the only weekend that worked for me and my friend. My friend offered me a glass of wine while at her house which I accepted. When I returned home he asked if I had a glass of wine. I replied yes. He has been extremely upset at me since. I committed to him that when he returns it will be to a sober home. That I would never drink in front of him such as long as needed or ever. While he has been acclimating back it has been a sober home and I’ve never had a drink in front of him. I guess I am looking for advice here, if I have and enjoy a cocktail with friends or co-workers once and a while, outside of my house and no where near him, is that okay? I want to know the boundaries and ensure I do nothing to impact his recovery. He is now saying that I am the one with the drinking problem (insists that I fess up to this for all the reasons he believes fit- which is far from the truth), and that if I need to even ask whether or not when or if I can drink- makes it more clear to him that I have a problem. I want nothing more than his continued sobriety, I have done nothing but support and champion him, but I will not admit to having a problem I don’t have. I just want to know the boundaries but if I can’t talk about them and he is not clear, then I don’t know. Desperately trying to be supportive, maybe I messed up? Am I thinking about this wrong?

LumenandNyx

Wow. If what you wrote is accurate, it looks to me like your husband needs some more quality time with a therapist.

Okay, of course it's okay for you to have a cocktail. You're not an alcoholic and you ARE an adult. Perhaps your husband needs to start behaving like one too instead of making you out to be the bad guy because you can drink and he can't. That's ridiculous. It's not right of him to say those things, or fair, or acceptable behavior. And he needs to cut that crap out. He's backfiring.

Don't be desperate. Be authentic. You're a dose of life and if he can't handle you - then perhaps he needs more time in the sober living house.

Bekindalways

Ugh Ducky, this doesn't sound fun to deal with. As you have heard here, "you didn't cause it; you can't control it and you can't cure it." You are fine having a glass of wine when not with him. This is not a problem and has nothing to do with him. That he is so upset about it is a problem. Sounds like something he should talk to a sponsor or an AA group about.

How are you doing? Do you have some good support?

dandylion

ducky----I don't see it as a problem if you have a drink with friends when you are out with others.
What I detect and suspect about his unreasonable upset with you is this----that he is resentful towards you to some extend as he may see you as someone who has interfered with his ability to drink when he wants to. This is common for newly recovering alcoholics---even toward their loved one. Second---he may be cuing up, in his own mind, a "reason" for a future relapse---that you caused it....
This is also a common thing that alcoholics do---to find a way to blame others....

ducky12

Thank you. His sponsor advised him to remove himself from a situation that made him uncomfortable. However when I try to get an answer from him he says “I don’t want you to drink around me, I want to trust that you will not have a drink”. When I reply that I have trusted him so many times after 5 years of being treated horribly, he says I am deflecting from the point and trying to turn it back on him. Seems my one shortcoming over the past 5 years is more for him to bear than all I have dealt with over the years. I want to be supportive but I am a grown woman who has picked up all the peices time and time again. If I want to enjoy an adult beverage away from him once as a while I’m not sure why this is an issue, but maybe I’m wrong.

dandylion

ducky-----please read my post again----there are two reasons why it is an issue with him.
This is a time for boundaries, I think.
You have a right to have a drink when you are not with him and out with others--if you want to. If he is not happy about that----he can get happy in the same pants that he got unhappy in.
Why even talk and argue about it. Why demand an answer from him. This only causes further argument and accomplishes nothing constructive.
Remember not to JADE----(unless you want to)
Jade----justify your position
A---argue a point
D---defend yourself
E----explain yourself.

By not JADING----you spare yourself the needless stress and conflict of endless stupid arguments

trailmix

Well, this is not his boundary or yours, this is his rule, there is a big difference.

He can't make a boundary for you, or a rule for that matter, he is not your Dad and you are not a child.

Boundaries are for the person themselves. Say for instance you know that you never want to live with an alcoholic or someone who drinks. Your boundary might be - I will never live with someone who is an alcoholic. Now, that has nothing to do with the other person, it's all about you. So the next step would be, what is your plan if this should happen. It might be, if the person I'm living with turns out to be an alcoholic they will have to leave or I will.

Now, on that same note, a rule would be, if the person I am living with is drinking, they will have to quit drinking.

See the difference? In the boundary, it's all within your own power, you are controlling yourself, you are not actually asking the other person to do anything. You might share your boundary in some instances, but it's really not necessary but if you did, it's completely up to them if they decide to follow it or not.

In the second example, of a rule, you have given all the power to the other person, for your life decision. What if they don't want to change? What if they refuse? You can't change people.

So that's the basic difference.

Your Husband is just trying to force his control, to make a rule for you. That's never ok in adult relationships, it's insulting and disrespectful. I hope he is getting some support, it doesn't sound like someone in recovery.

Another good example of a boundary.

SmallButMighty

Hi Ducky, I agree with everything , everyone else has said to you on this topic.

I don't think you are wrong to have a drink with friends. You are an adult, you have that right. You don't have to answer to anyone else about that. You having a drink while not in his presence will not determine whether he decides to drink or not. He may very well SAY that if he falls off the wagon, but it wont be true. He is feeling resentful because you are able to drink responsibly and he can not. He is jealous. He is probably uncomfortable in his own skin as he adjusts to a life without alcohol and his feelings of resentment are part of that discomfort. That is NOT your burden to bare. Only he can figure out what to do with those feelings. Don't stuff your feelings away trying to protect his, that will only hurt both of you.

I once had my AXH yelling in my face, with fury in his eyes " YOU'RE A NORMY!!!.... YOU'RE A NORMY!!!" ( 'Normy' is a term used to mean someone who can drink alcohol non-problematically) He was not drunk at the time, but he was white-knucking his sobriety. He was so angry because he had a drinking problem and I did not. Like that was somehow my fault. I know now that it wasn't really me he was angry with. He was angry about the situation he found himself in. (Sick with alcoholism and depression and his wife with one foot out the door) He was in a lot of pain, both from his alcoholism and the underlying causes of it, so that he was deflecting that away from himself and onto the closest target... and at that point this target wasn't standing for his crap anymore, which also added fuel to his fire.

I hope you husband is getting a lot of support from the people who are trained to help him. Or from people in AA who can understand how he is feeling right now. Preferably both.

You keep living your best life. Denying yourself something because he is making unreasonable demands is not fair to you.

Hang in there, early sobriety is a rough road for both spouses.

FallenAngelina

To see this as a shortcoming is to take responsibility for being able to influence his drinking and his sobriety - and of course, you cannot. That you choose to have cocktails outside the home not a shortcoming. It is your boundary, your option, your value, your choice.




There's no wrong when it comes to values and boundaries, there is only what is right for you. You choose your values, you choose your boundaries. If someone, even a beloved recovering alcoholic, is upset by your values and your boundaries, that is that person's upset to work with. It's not for you to be wrong about.

Regarding drinking around an alcoholic: To place the blame of possible relapse on you (which is what your husband is doing) is going against everything that he is (hopefully) learning in his program. Nobody, nobody, nobody is responsible for his drinking except for him. Nobody is responsible for his sobriety except him. You do not owe him support and you do not owe him vows of your own abstinence. Those two things, your support and your parameters around abstinence, are yours to offer, if and how you choose. Blame runs rampant in alcoholic/codependent relationships and that's why programs focus so heavily on halting the blame and taking personal responsibility. I totally understand having a supportive, sober home, but if keeping someone sober were as easy as drinking or not drinking ourselves, then there would be no need for this forum and absolutely no need for AA.

BlownOne

That's called manipulation and it's dry drunk behavior. Your consumption of alcohol has absolutely NO bearing on his sobriety. For him to make you swear not to drink or to accuse you of having a problem are all signs of untreated alcoholism. Real recovery looks and smells like real recovery. There are no mind games, manipulations, false accusations, guilt trips, etc. He would be totally focused on making himself the best version of himself he can possibly be. That is not what's happening with him. Fair warning.

Refiner

I would like to chime in here with a few others, your husband is obviously NOT in recovery. He may not be drinking, but he’s still got his manipulative, blaming, alcoholic thinking. May I suggest he’s not ready to leave sober living and that you need to have this conversation with him?

mylifeismine

You having a drink away from him with friends is none of his business.
He should not be asking. You don't have to agree to abstain from alcohol
for him to be successful in his sobriety- that is very unsound thinking.
I would suggest you might say to him in a calm moment that it is not
healthy for either one of you for him to question if you had a drink while away
from him because it is irrelevant to his sobriety. If he gets upset, you
could suggest he call his sponsor or attend a meeting but the questioning
must stop. Some spouses do not stop drinking in the home, so you are
being supportive. My RAH would never question me about having a drink
with friends, never. Are you going to alanon? It is crucial for you
to have a support system , especially now.

As others have said, he is being manipulative and accusatory and setting you
up to be blamed for something you have no control over. That is not
true recovery. The hallmark of true recovery is to stop blaming others
and accept personal responsibility for one's actions.

Hawkeye13

Speaking with the hat of a drinker (not from family perspective though I am both) I smell a relapse coming, and most likely soon. He is just looking for an excuse to hang it on.

As others have said above, this is not what real recovery looks or feels like. I hope you can get him to consider moving back into sober living, and you need a plan for what you will do if he resumes drinking.

ducky12

Thank you to everyone, I have been re- reading your posts and it is comforting. The strange thing is he says he has no desire to ever pick up a drink again and knows he can’t. I know there is a difference between can’t and won’t but he seems genuine in this regard.

Bekindalways

Ducky, I take it that he is only a few months into sobriety? I never lived with my qualifier when he was getting sober. Everyone tells me it it beyond difficult possibly harder than living with an alcoholic.

To help you, at this time, to not JADE (justify, argue, defend, excuse), you might look into practicing "grey rock". With grey rock, if the topic of your drinking comes up, you only respond with: "Hmmm", "you may be right", "Mmm hmm", "that's a point". It might not work for you, but for this coming year you need all the tools you can get!

Let us know how you do.

SparkleKitty

I find it helpful to separate the commitment to not-drinking from the commitment to recovery. They are two separate things.

Sobriety is not-drinking.

Recovery is taking responsibility for one's own emotions and for dealing with them without the broken coping mechanism of addiction. If he's unable to handle your actions (having a drink with friend) as things separate from himself then it's the recovery side that has a shortcoming.

BlownOne

SparkleKitty is dead on. The stopping drinking is the easy part. The hard part is learning how to live your life productively without alcohol, so you don't come emotionally unglued when life throws you curveballs or you don't get your way. It's basically learning how to adult all over again. It can be a big adjustment for some of us recovering alcoholics, and it takes time. And it can cause some pretty major issues for the people who have to deal with us every day as we learn to grow and adapt. We don't all do it gracefully, and there's no law that says you have to stick around and take the abuse. This recovery thing is his responsibility. Nothing you or anyone else does can effect it, no matter what he says or whatever trip he tries to lay on you. Hugs to you. I know it's hard. Do what's right for you in the meantime. You aren't responsible for his happiness or recovery. He is.

ducky12

Hi all,
Back again. My husband has been home now for a bit, and it has been a bit rocky to say the least. He is very quiet and kept to himself, constantly on his phone throughout the times he is at home. I try to make conversation but it’s a bit like pulling teeth. In the evenings he then expects that I snuggle him on the couch and ...ya know. After trying to get him to be open and solicite more dialogue throughout the earlier part of the day, it’s hard to want to be close to him in the evenings. When I decline and simply want to relax after a long work day, he gets very upset and angry that I’m not fulfilling his needs- saying I am cold and distant. As mentioned earlier in this thread I committed to a sober house and not drinking in his presence as he acclimated back- which I have been committed to. The other night he walked by me and accused me of smelling like alcohol, which is ridiculous. He got accusatory and very mad. He laid into me all night trying to get me to admit to something that was untrue. After working 13 hours that day, I was exhausted, I couldn’t take anymore. I took a prescribed sleeping pill and went to bed. The next morning he accused me of taking medication so I would not drink or that I needed to take it to relax to be around him. This is so off base- all of it is. I’m at a loss and it doesn’t seem that I can do anything right. But I will keep my boundaries and stand my ground on what is fact and truthful. I’m just so tired. I knew this was going to be hard but I feel like I’m tip toeing on eggshells.

dandylion

ducky-----well, he might be technically "sober"----meaning just that his blood alcohol level being zero. Just putting down the drink is a far cry from being in recovery. Recovery also deals with thinking and attitudes and behaviors which need to change is sobriety can be maintained. Also---do you know for sure that he is not sipping on the side?
Even when a person is judiciously working an program of sobriety----the first year of being in recovery can be very, very difficult on the sober partner.
in fact, those who know me, on this forum, are familiar with me saying that it would be wonderful and merciful, all around, if the alcoholic could go live, isolated, in the Mountains of Nepal, for the first year of sobriety----thus, giving the alcoholic time to focus on their sobriety, and giving the partner/family a break---some peace and time to sort themselves out, also. lol.

I would like to say, to you----his behavior to you amounts to emotional Abuse. Even if you haven't thought of it that way, before.
I is selfish and it is Wrong. He has no right to do these things. Being sober---or not---does not give permission to be abusive---does not make it o.k.
Another fact---giving in to his demands and walking on eggshells does not help him to remain sober at all. It is just allowing him to be abusive to another person. That is not a part of sobriety.

You have every right to have your own boundaries---and, if he does not respect them (which he doesn't have to), then it is YOUR responsibility to enforce your boundaries. Whatever that means (****if he is physically abusive, then you would need the advice and help of those who can help you to stay safe).
While we are on this subject---intimacy is a voluntary thing, and, no woman should feel obligated if she doesn't want to. Married or not.

Perhaps, the time has come to consider some form of separation in order to be fair to yourself and give you some space away form the emotional abuse?
You matter, in this world, just as much as he does.

trailmix

This all sounds just awful and I can just imagine it. Dandylion's words about his recovery (or lack thereof) are so true.

Now what about you? What is this giving you? Stress, anxiety, exhaustion? Is that what you would like out of your marriage. You ARE important, you deserve to be treated nicely, always. We all slip, we all snap once in a while, we are human, we generally apologize and move on. His view of you right now is nothing like that. It is possible he is treating you this way because he is blaming you for having to be sober? Sounds irrational (and it is) but entirely possible.

However, I'm no psychiatrist and who knows how his mind is working right now, so the only question is, what are you going to do about it.

If you have had enough, if this is wearing you down, perhaps time to get out of there or ask him to leave (whichever is easier), at least for several months?