Bunker

I have been on this forum for a number of years. Here I am again starting all over yet again. Day 8 of sobriety. I know the drill. The withdrawal is over (thank goodness), the detox is over. Now the boulder needs to be rolled up the mountain again knowing full well it will not get to the top.

Over the last 10 years I have had stints of sobriety. 4 months, 6 months and my PB last year 10 months. Despite my firm resolve and commitment at the beginning of every sober journey I end up back at day one again time and time again.

It is bizarre that a reasonably normal reasonably intelligent person can do this to him/herself.

I have read a lot on these pages over the years. I have enormous respect for those many members who stopped and stay stopped. It seems that is not me. I no longer resolve never to drink again. It is pointless. My best plan now is to not drink for as long as I can and hopefully beat my previous PB.

Every consecutive day put together not drinking is a victory. It is not a success story, but it is the best I can do.

Surrendered19

Hi Bunker. My brief experience interacting with recovering and actively using addicts is that, as a group, we are a very smart bunch. Above-average intelligence is my take and I'll bet there is no correlation to relapse rates and IQ's. There might even be a reverse correlation. But I don't know. It just doesn't seem to me that smarts has much to do with it.

Right now all I'll beg of you is to keep trying. I have no doubt you can stay sober forever and you should keep exploring that. Is there anyway you can rethink some of it? Can you change your view of sobriety to be a positive thing worth keeping and working on and something that brings happiness to you? I don't know what gets you but I think boredom gets many people and so I've spent some time thinking about boredom and rethinking it. I have concluded that solitude and quiet and calm are worthy pursuits all by themselves and sometimes our nag-headed heads aren't used to those sensations and thus we conclude we are bored.

Anyway, I'm glad you have that heavy sumbich rock headed back up to the top again. One of these times you'll get it up there.

ZIP

Stick with it Bunker.
"I will not drink today."
Walking each day sober is far better than crawling through the day drunk.

Fallow

Wow I relate to so much of what you said. Welcome back. It is nice to identify but I don't enjoy the thought that I will never complete the sobriety mission. I definitely have that feeling though. I haven't given up on it just yet.

I like listening to speaker tapes and on one from Mark H he says that the only time he has a desire to quit drinking is when he is drinking.

That sums it up for me. I don't have the desire to stay sober forever now that I am sober. But I do know that if I start drinking again I will either die or acquire the desire to quit drinking again at some point. So why start again when I know I will just want to quit again?

Dee74

Hi Bunker
Nothing personal but I've seen this 'lasting recovery is not possible for me' mindset here a lot lately and I loathe it.

If you can sign on here and type coherently you have as much hope and chance as I did of being sober forever

I'm just an ordinary guy who was in deep as an all day everyday drinker.

I committed to change - I knew it had to be more than a fad or a diet mindset because my life was all about drinking, so my life had to change, permanently and for good.

I was terrified of that - I didn't want my life to change - but it did - and for the better.

SR helped me do that - I spent a lot of time on here not only helping myself but others too, even when it seemed like my recovery was sound, I still worked on it. I think that stopped me from being complacent.

I focused on building a sober life I loved.

Other people have achieved the same results with meeting based approaches like AA or SMART etc, some have tried book based approaches like Rational Recovery and many more have asked for help from their doctor or counsellors. Some have gone to rehab.

I'm not sure what you've tried in the past but I think the idea that the best you can hope for is a run of months is AV BS - I hope you'll reconsider.

what do you think brings you back to drinking?

This is a fight for your life - why would you stop fighting in the 10th round?

D

Obladi

Hi Bunker,

I can understand where you're coming from and I also agree with Dee. I've been at this quitting thing for a good (bad?) number of years, and though there's no evidence that I can make this quit be the last one, there's no evidence against it either. Frankly, I don't think about "forever." I don't think about "One day at a time" either. What I know is that I don't drink now. Given that it's always now and never will be any time other than now, it's working for me.

Here's what I think: I think it's not possible to stay stopped by trying to do what someone else did. I mean, obviously, other people provide the examples and can provide great ideas on tactics and strategies and programs and mantras. But in the end, it's up to each of us to find what works for us. I can't "do" you anymore than you can "do" me. I'm convinced there is a way for every one of us and while the way might look extremely similar in groups of people, in the end it gets down to how each of those people personalized their "program" to work for them.

Every day you don't drink is, indeed, a victory.
What's in the way of winning the war, do you think?

O

MissPerfumado

I don't know why it is that I finally got it at that particular time in my life and managed to stop. I sometimes describe it in words that sound almost religious, like when I spilled the truth of my drinking to the doctor and knew it was all over. That part was pure surrender and felt like it came from nowhere. It was the end of denial.

But surrender can look like many things and it doesn't have to look like the bright light and the wave of relief that I felt. It can be just the feeling of 'I have had enough and I can't go on like this.' All it takes is the recognition that you really need to stop. Sounds to me like you have that.

I know however why I stayed stopped. It was a combination of:

• working at it - like coming on here everyday and creating a plan
• taking it seriously and prioritising it - so I let other things like work take a back seat as much as I could
• being selfish - cutting off friendships if I needed to, tending to myself if that was needed
• taking no risks - covering all angles I could think of, being extra careful, reworking my plan regularly
• not entertaining the thought of drinking again - pushing it out of my mind if I had to
• being accountable - confessing it to people close to me
• doing what was in front of me - one day at a time, focussing on what it takes not to drink for now
• educating myself - reading up on what alcohol does to a person
• changing things that needed changing - like schedules and routines

There are probably a few more I haven't thought of. It wasn't magic though. It was a combination of adding what would help and removing what would hurt.

Like Dee said, we are all ordinary folk. These are ordinary steps. You have made the commitment to stop, you really can put together what you need to follow through. I know you can.

Verdantia

Hey, Bunker, I'm sorry you don't feel permanent sobriety is possible, and I get it--I have rolled that boulder up the hill too many times, but I always felt that there was a point to the struggle in the end--that it is at least a possibility. And it is--it took a big trauma for sobriety to finally sink in for me, but I now have 4 and a half years; at one time I'd had 15 years before I relapsed so I know I have to guard my sobriety even more jealously this time around. I find each quit harder than the last, and I don't think I have another one in me--one drink would be my last. Complacency is a huge enemy of mine, but I know if I never have that first drink I will never have to suffer again. Wishing you strength for the sober journey.

fini

Bunker, telling yourself it is not possible for you is a good way to keep drinking in your life.
it’s also not true.
your brain is not so extra-specially-more-screwed-up than anybody else’s here

nice try, though, from that AV !

Ringside

There is no boulder; there is no mountain; there is no top of the mountain. Perhaps consider changing your framework?

PuckLuck

So many great replies in this thread.

MythOfSisyphus

I got really tired of rolling the rock back up the hill too, Bunker. I drank like a fish for 25 years and assumed it would kill me. But just short of eight years ago I decided I would never drink again and that I would never change my mind. So far I haven't, and I haven't. There's nothing special about me, and if I can do it anyone can.

Bunker

Thanks MP. What I have tried so far is this: AA, counseling, seeing a psychiatrist, medication, speaking to my GP, telling all my friends and getting their support, telling my family and getting their support, developing new hobbies, doing new courses and getting additional qualifications, playing my sport of choice as regularly as I can, reading everything I can get on alcoholism, visiting SR daily, gratitude, keeping a diary, meditation and mindfulness. There are probably more. Nothing could keep me sober long term. Making yet again another resolve that I will not keep is heartbreaking. One can call it AV, one can call it rationalisation, one can call it weakness. It does not really matter. I am doing the best I believe I can.

Sober45

I'm finding, for me, that a lot of this comes down to what I choose to believe and mind games. Like Ringside stated, change the framework. Perspective is everything and that is something we can always work on. If I say to myself "I'll never be able to stop", I'll never be able to stop...end of.

I told my husband in the first couple months I was on SR so much because "i'm brainwashing myself"...and i did. If Jim Jones could convince a 1000 people to follow his cult and kills themselves, surely, I can convince myself not to drink and be happy about it.

One thing that still gets me is saying "never again". For some reason, thinking long term conjures up a lot of anxiety. So I have a little mind game I play. Some may disagree (especially older members). But I've decided I can drink again when I'm 75. So now I have 30 years of guaranteed sobriety ahead of me. I'm going to re-evaluate this decision at age 74. Maybe I'll push it 80 then, who knows.

MaximusD

Sober, I have heard of that trick before. Another one is that I will drink on the 4th of July in 2150 (Ill be dead and if not then maybe I will drink )

Bunker, I feel it is kind of a negative mindset too. Just like most people on here I have quit probably a 1000 times and failed. I resolve to never stop trying as one day it will stick.

Abraham

Hey I still tell myself I'm going to drink maybe some time. I just never do. So far. All those months of not drinking are good for you. It does not sound like you are doing too bad(better than I was before I finally quit). Keep on trying. It will stick one of these times. Probably this time.

MythOfSisyphus

BTW, Bunker, that's a great avatar!

ZIP

Hey Bunker.
I don't want this to read as a speech...just tossing out an observation.
With all of this effort you've listed, I'm wondering if you should examine your drinking triggers or habits.

I did a lot of the same work you've listed. But, the bottom line was my personal alcohol habit. I had morphed into a reclusive alcohol addict, drinking alone at home. Every night...until I passed out in bed.

So, attending counseling, meetings, disclosure to relatives and friends etc, was a good move for me. But, it was only a start. I, myself, had to break that habit of drinking alone at home. Had I not done that, I would have simply failed in all efforts. Because...I was alone and had a well-stocked refrigerator.

It's like the story of a guy who needs to quit booze, but hangs out in bars trying to drink soda pop. Or, the guy who has a job he despises, so he self-medicates every day after work. Something has to change...

Sometimes, you just have to shake up the lifestyle.

fishkiller

My guess is the AV gets the best of you each time and is now winning the fight by convincing you that you will never be able to quit permanently.

You CAN quit permanently but it obviously ain't going to be easy.

Bunker

ZIP, very valid points. So the question is how? Despite my best efforts what more do I do? What do I change? I really do not know.