LastInLine

Seriously, I didn't know about this. Is this real? I found this on another website doing my typical daily research on ... whatever.

"post acute withdrawal syndrome (PAWS). Millions of recovering alcoholics and problem drinkers are bored and restless and agitated for MONTHS and don’t know it’s a medical, chemical problem that has been thoroughly documented by doctors as being a period of imbalance and repair in the brain during which the standard reaction to all conscious thought is malaise, aggravation, boredom and imbalance. "

Has anyone heard about this. Because wow, this makes perfect sense if it's real. It's both scary and encouraging at the same time. It sounds exactly like what I'm experiencing right now, but I don't want it to last for months! At the same time, if it's going to pass eventually, then huge sigh of relief...

I even started thinking tonight (I'm 58), maybe I just woke up after a 12 year drunk and life passed me by and now I'm too old to enjoy life. That's a seriously depressing thought. I still look young for my age, despite the dark circles still visible under my eyes from my many, many months of horrible insomnia caused by drinking. I don't want to be too old to enjoy life, that would really suck after missing the past 12 years by being drunk.

trailmix

hi lastinline,

There is a thread about PAWs here that you might find interesting:

https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...ht-go-mad.html (For those tortured by PAWS (Post Acute Withdrawal Symptoms) and who fear they might go mad)

DaisyBelle7

I think I’ve read about that, too. I liken it to a complete change in lifestyle. I’ve gone through my entire adulthood, binge drinking (I’m 50). Now, newly sober, I don’t really know what to do. I’m feeling a lot of emotions that I used to push down with alcohol. I’m reassessing my friend circle. I’m watching A LOT of TV.

I believe, as with most other things, it varies depending on the individual. Maybe having an understanding of what’s happening will cause us to work toward re-wiring our brains more quickly?

Dee74

I'm not a Dr but...Paws is Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome - it usually kicks sometime after 30 days if it happens at all.

It doesn't happen to everyone

This is a good link if you've not seen it -

https://digital-dharma.net/post-acut...r-immediately/

I think you're just experiencing the normal detox of mind and body healing that happens after years of drinking

Surrendered19

Oh, PAWS is definitely a real thing and explains what so many of us experience in the first months of sobriety. I am two months in and I experience some of the symptoms but they usually do not last. I am still so rewarded daily from not feeling like I am going to die tonight, that other symptoms I might have to deal with in the future are not prominent yet.

Sunnyday13

I have experienced this in the past. For me it was bouts of irritability, with my initial happiness and relief from quitting turning into a flat mood and some loss of joy.
BUT... first, many do not experience this. For those who do, it is usually intermittent and often just in short episodes. I have been sober now for about 3 weeks. I am currently still in a pink cloud. But I am aware I may experience PAWS going forward. I look at it as something to understand and accept, have tools ready, and not over-react to transient mood changes.
With or without PAWS, sobriety is so so worth it!!

least

I had bouts of that in early recovery. For my first year or so, I'd have problems with my memory, or be unable to concentrate or feel irritable for no reason. I looked at it as my brain healing after being used to alcohol dulling my senses. It took a while, but it was bearable and worth the effort.

Cityboy

Pretty sure I'm better off than I was before irregardless.

D122y

Pretty much any weird abnormal feeling I get is my PAWS.

Thanks.

sortofhomecomin

I'm pretty sure PAWS is a real thing, but some people get it worse than others. I don't think we should let a fear of PAWS persuade our addict brains to dissuade us from quiting. Incidentally, and not to go on a rant about AA, in all the AA meetings I attended I was literally the only person to even mention PAWS. Whether this is because most of the attendees were long term sober, or because AA hasn't moved with the times, or for some other reason, I do not know.

Dee74

To be fair I've not yet meet a doctor who's heard of paws let alone understands it, so a group of laypeople - any group of laypeople - not knowing about it is pretty much par for the course.

With reference to this forums rules about no recovery debates, we can discuss PAWS without bringing AA into it.

let all do that - thanks

Dee
Administrator
SR

ZIP

Irritability, moodiness, frustration, tiredness. I experienced these issues when I stopped drinking. But they slowly dissapated during my first 60 days of being AF.
Much of the symptoms were, in my case, associated with the health, environment, and lifestyle change I was undergoing:

Tiredness? I was quite tired for weeks...no more booze to knock me out at night. Laying awake sober...and trying to quiet my mind.

Moodiness? Hell yeah...no more using booze to relax, celebrate, lighten the mood, take the edge off, drown sorrow, etc.

Irritability? Yup...I was one pissed off guy. My garage beer fridge--all of my beloved craft IPAs and whiskeys were now gone. My garage was my go-to place, where I comfortably drank in isolation. It was now just a place to park the car.

Frustration? Certainly....what do I do now? What activity should replace my regular drinking environment, and drinking time?

The longer I remained sober, though, things just started to click back into place. I suppose it's a matter of seriously riding it out...easier for some, more difficult for others.

Derringer

They were ahead of the times.

It was termed "restless, irritable and discontent" by Dr Silkworth, who wrote the chapter The Doctors Opinion, which proceeds the 12 chapters written by Bill Wilson in the big book.

He worked with all kinds of alcoholic folks, from the mild to the wild.

He had plenty of success helping a lot of people get and stay sober, but there was a certain type he had categorised as 'hopeless'. In other words, no matter how many times he dried them out, sent them to psychiatrists, sent them to clergymen and church, they would be back in a worse state than last time sooner or later.

He was a huge advocate of the 12 step process.

Because it seemingly produced a literal miracle that he nor any others that worked in the same field had seen before.

Dee74

I like asking for things in a polite way with dignity and respect all round.
I really hate going medieval - this is a group of adults after all....

but sometimes and some days on this board it's like you guys are only reading the posts you wanna read....

Now we've heard one from each 'side', thats it.

The OP did not mention AA.
AA has no stance on PAWs I'm aware of.

I'm now telling you all - AA is off topic in the thread.

Take off topic discussion to PM or off site - but don't post it here, cos it will be removed.

Dee
Administrator
SR

August252015

I'm flipping your oh no to the positive - PAWS was incredibly real for me, and the best part of learning about it was that it clarified SO much of what was going on with my early sobriety. I found Dee's link the most instructive thing possible - stuff stopped "surprising" me as much, my understanding that it would take (a lot, for me) of time to heal but there were actual reasons not my imagination, so on.

Like I said on another thread last night, I was absolutely a 2 yr mark-er, as some severe cases are. That had to be OK. It was terrifying to go thru plenty of stuff I experienced, but I just knew deep down it was worth the chance at an increasingly better life.

I'd also highly recommend the book Living Sober - it's about the first yr of sobriety. As my husband said when we had our first date 20 yrs after high school, and he was a month sober: "I didn't quite believe you when you said everything is better sober, but I wanted to know more."

VinnyMcM

I’m right there with you Last. There are some good moments but it’s also a mental struggle for me as well.

I’m really hoping that PAWS is in fact, very real. That means there is hope that this feeling will go away. Irritable, moody, boredom, etc. Just overall not pleasant to be around currently. I just can’t shake it. Only 40 days in so still early. I’m relying on time being the main healer at this point.

Still have no thoughts about drinking thankfully.

Andante

First off, It's hard for anyone to mention feelings along the lines of "Irritable, Restless and Discontented" without it attracting the notice of AAs since their program is designed to provide relief from those specific feelings.

There still seems to be a lot of confusion about what "PAWS" (Post-Acute Withdrawal Syndrome) is or isn't. In simplest terms, PAWS is when symptoms of alcohol withdrawal persist or recur beyond the normal period for acute withdrawal of a week or so for most people. Feeling "irritable, restless, and discontented" in early sobriety is entirely normal; PAWS is not. I had my share of "IRD" feelings to work through in sobriety as well, but I feel like they were mostly separate from PAWS.

In general, I think the "PAWS" term is most useful when it's applied to symptoms of neurological damage that take a while to go away after sobering up for good. Although these symptoms can include various types of emotional distress, in my case they were more about severe brain fog, insomnia, headaches, tremor, aphasia (inability to remember particular words), poor coordination, and general memory and cognitive impairment. Dealing with these symptoms day to day could certainly cause me to feel "irritable, restless, and discontented," but in this case the "IRD" was more an effect than a cause. In any event, no amount of work on my recovery had much direct effect on the PAWS symptoms -- the best I could hope for was to learn how to get better at coping with them and working around them.

Because it's so hard to draw a clear distinction between what is PAWS and what is "normal" recovery, there will always be a faction that wants to lump everyone's experience together as "normal," while at the other end will be a faction that wants to fob off every unpleasant or challenging aspect of sobriety onto "PAWS." The truth, as with most things human, is much more complex. Everyone's experience differs in all aspects of life, and nowhere does it seem to differ more than in the area of alcoholism recovery.

Swiftly

Really interesting.....

I'm so glad this is getting talked about and I must say I find it astonishing how some people dismiss such a dominant part of some peoples recovery. I assume it's because they didn't experience it so they don't think anyone else will!

Really glad there are others out there and on this site who encourage free speech on this

Hawking22

Oh, it is SO freaking real..."Feeling Good" by David Burns and "Sober but Stuck" by Dan F. are good reads to fight PAWS. I always get mad because I never get the "pink cloud" everyone else seems to get and PAWS seems to onset earlier for me than everyone else in recovery.

August252015

So, this prob sound weird to anyone who hasn't heard me say it before.

Of the (apparently!) many ways I choose not to think about recovery, or dislike words folks often use (ie trigger or slip), I've never set right with *pink cloud*. Bear with me.

Pink is my favorite color. I can quote you Audrey Hepburn among my favorites who describe its perfection. In fact, my current blog is named after my worldview phrased one way: a life filled with pink.

I look at the sky as pink, pink clouds as harbingers of best days to come, pink as the color of recovery. Painting life that way makes something view-able as fleeting a condition of your new life.