lessgravity

Riding the train ride today - hustling from one work meeting to another, having spent the morning getting my son out the door to his first day of school, up late last night working, not stressed out but definitely stretched thin, trying to do the right thing - and I'm watching a man drunk on the seat in front of me. He's older than me, probably mid 50s, has this sweet drunk smile, clutching a black plastic bag with his choice of poison in it. And I'm struck with these conflicting feelings of both envy and anger.

Envy, sprung from the depths of my AV, relating to the total lack of care this grown man has for the responsibilities of adult life. On his way to some city park on this beautiful late summer day, to ride the buzz and shirk all the tasks that we each have to do to make this world function best. And my anger was just that - the sacrifices that those of us who are sober make every day to do the right thing. To make sure the bridges are built safely, our kids are taken care of , to make sure the simple, integral aspects of life are tended to. Not that you can't be a person who is trying to live with integrity while still choosing to drink - but thank goodness the train conductor wasn't obliterated like the guy in front of me...

This is a sentiment I've expressed before. I'm very aware of the judgement I'm feeling. I spent much of my life in that state of mismanagement, irresponsibility and selfish protracted adolescence. Even then I was aware the rest of the world wasn't making the same choices I was. And even then I was thankful for that. Part of my drive to get sober was as simple as a desire to be a part of functional society. Grateful to be here now, doing my part.

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August252015

Good share, less. I get mixed feelings about things I observe from "this side" too.

FreshStartOk

I'm not sure being jealous of a homeless bum is that healthy

I'm only joking. I do get it, the commitments of being an adult are grinding sometimes. I think about being a monk before a drunkard though. Whatever buzz they have is ridiculously expensive in every sense.

saoutchik

Thoughtful post LG. I suspect that that drunk man, when not drunk, would give a lot to be sober and have a family to care about and who, in turn might care for him. I was 54 when I quit and although I was working I did not have family responsibilities but that did not make me feel carefree, just lonely.


I am envious of some of the young people I see enjoying a drink in the bars and cafes where I live. They don't seem to drink with the same intensity that I used to and they do such sensible, grown-up things like eat as well as drink.

I guess we can have empathy for our fellow strugglers addictions without condoning or excusing some of the behaviors that go with it.

entropy1964

I do understand some of that envy. I have one 'friend' in particular who continues to relapse. Blame the world for her problems. Hate the world because they don't understand her. A couple of months ago the chaos she was relating to me was mind boggling. I asked her when she was going to quit drinking and she said she wasn't ready. I said, are you not an alcoholic anymore? Matter of fact. I guess I just thought, WOW. To be able to drink with impunity. But then again, I KNOW she is miserable. I know she is destroying herself and her loved ones. I know she is dangerous and only lucky she hasn't hurt someone or herself. That envy is from inside me, looking at the outside of her. They are completely disparate.

That poor guy on the train? I doubt he's having any fun at all being who and what he is. And homelessness is one of the most horrible conditions an addict can find themselves in. I remember viscerally the feeling I had when I was in a psych ward with a particular homeless guy (I have been in facilities with many)...the way he described his abject fear at night while sleeping outside, by the river. I dunno. There was something about the way he described it. I have never felt such sadness for a person I barely knew.

Kdon853

Selfish protracted adolescence. I like that . I was a man child. The party was never going to stop and the hell with everyone else. I’m glad that party is over.

SoberCAH

I would become envious while watching others drink, whether modestly or abusively, because I knew that I couldn't do it without risking everything.

I accept that now, but it took a little while.

That man you saw on the train sounds like a lost soul to me.

I used to be him, for many years.

I'm glad I'm not now.

Fusion

Yes, Less, I was once akin to that guy on the train. Like him, I was totally abdicating responsibility by drinking, a childlike state, with no care for my future or that of the planet.

It feels good to stop drinking, and be fully present, responsible and accountable.

Fearlessat50

Thanks for this post, less. Agreed. Even scarier, there are those more functional alcoholics with huge responsibilities who are getting obliterated while performing them. There are drunk train conductors, airline pilots, bus drivers, etc out there.

I know what you mean. But I do not feel envy. . Despite the drunk smile, that guy is miserable inside. He most likely hates himself. He has made a mess of his life. He may be caught in the relapse cycle and unable to get out. Or perhaps he is so far gone, he no longer cares. He may be mentally ill, maybe at least in part due to alcoholism. He’s experiencing a slow horrifying death.

I just remembered a time taking the ferry home from work. I was already drunk from a work party (imagine that), had more wine on the ferry. I was by myself, feeling comfortably drunk and may have had that same smile on my face, but inside feeling awful about myself wondering if others noticed I was drunk and also being envious of whatever beautiful perfect life I imagined they had (was struggling with parenting and marital issues at the time). I actually fell asleep/passed out, and one of the ferry employees came to wake me up and ask me to leave the boat. I was the last one. I have never told anyone that before and typing this out makes me feel deeply embarrassed and almost want to cry recalling that incident. I didn’t think much of it later. I might have laughed it off? I don’t know. I guess when I see drunk people now, I may get sad or angry but I try to have compassion too.

Your posts are always thought provoking.

Dee74

Thanks Less - honest as always

Having been through my own protracted adolescence, and then a decade or more of building a life I love to live, I can't say I get envious anymore ....I do have a great sense of empathy tho and pity - I remember how soul crushing that life was to lead.

No anger either - I get more angry at jerks like the guy who cut me off and smacked into me in the supermarket cos waiting 30 secs for the old guy in front of me to select strawberries was apparently too long to wait.

time for me to remember:

I'm generally content tho - I wish that for everyone reading too

BeABetterMan

ThatWasTheOldMe

//I spent much of my life in that state of mismanagement, irresponsibility and selfish protracted adolescence.//

I don't know you, but it's highly unlikely for alcoholism to be a state of mere irresponsibility and a wish to extend one's adolescence. There were likely factors growing up and natural propensities in your brain toward at least anxiety - if not some sort of full on depression or poor self esteem - that contributed significantly.

Most people diagnosed with alcohol use disorder receive a dual diagnosis. Not "hey dude, you're a just a jerk drunk."

least

I either feel sad, for them wasting their life on alcohol, or angry at the destruction alcohol can cause. I know a guy who hadn't been out of prison too long, got drunk and drove home in a blackout, and killed a lady when he slammed into her car while going well over the speed limit.

I get angry cause it's an avoidable loss of life, yet it keeps happening.

nez

I am not envious when I see a drunk because I know that I could have that lifestyle back in heartbeat if I want it.

I feel sadness when I see a drunk because I remember all too well the hopelessness and despair of my active alcoholism. I couldn't imagine life with alcohol and I couldn't imagine life without alcohol. I was at the jumping off place.

It was not my choice to be in that hell, but my choices are what got me there. I grieve when I see another human being doing that to themselves.

NessunDorma

I guess like one or two others I genuinely no longer envy those who can drink. It’s hard not to seem smug or overly evangelical but over the years I lost the wish even to drink small amounts of alcohol. FWIW the happiest and most successful person I know, now in her late 20s, has never drunk. She’s obviously not so content just because she has always been sober but shows me you really don’t need drink. And for me complete abstinence was wonderfully liberating.

But I do feel empathy for people like the bloke you describe, it is very likely that that sort of drinking comes at a cost that greatly outweighs the benefits, it certainly did for me. I used to drink on the train and bought miniatures so I could carry on drinking through the walk from the station to our front door. Then stash the empties in my bag. Desperate, just desperate. And so different to now.

Kaily

I expect he was envious of you too Less...

FreshStartOk

It's interesting - I listen to a lot of Ayya Khema who was a buhddist nun. On a recent talk she said all emotions other than compassion and love can be got rid of.

That's a very tall order, but thinking about it, it has foundations in common sense. When you are at peace thinking your biological condition is better - your heart rate is down, you deal with things better.

Bringing that into reality when someone is rude for example is very hard, but apparently it's perfectly possible with practice. Like Least saying gratitude is good - you can consciously bring things into being.

DriGuy

In regards to the thread title, if not the thread content, I'm not so sure drunks and dry drunks don't rule the world. For what it's worth, I read in a piece of fiction, a description of the meeting between an American envoy and the Russian delegation to form the critical alliance of WWII. It was either The Winds of War or Remembrance of War that placed the meeting somewhere in Russia.

The Russians filed into the room in great numbers, some already drunk, and others in the process. An alliance was quickly hammered out and the party began. The next morning the American envoy wakes up hung over on a couch and surveys the aftermath of the meeting, with an abundance of Russian diplomats still sleeping it off on chairs, tables, or on the floor, in hall filled with overturned furniture and litter.

It made me wonder how much happens in politics this way.

FreshStartOk

Churchil said he took more out of drink than it took from him. He was a sociopath no doubt, and very inept before WW2

lessgravity

Lately I've been feeling a decent amount of anger and frustration with my self for the amount of years I wasted drinking. Sure I pushed and stumbled forward through school and into a career, creating a family and generally moving towards some objectively admirable ends. But if I am honest with my self, I wasted years as a drunk - squandering so much, living essentially for the alcohol. The residual effects of those decisions, of the sacrifices I made to drink over and over, are with me to this day - in real form re debt and bad habits and in psychic form as well.

I'm working every day to make up for years of irresponsibility, for that damaging protracted adolescence. It's frustrating at times and if I get stuck looking back rather than bding present anger and self-criticism abounds.

Here’s to the clarity of sobriety, regardless of the facts it presents. Chopping wood, carrying water.

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L
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