Perspective is everything
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Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 316
Perspective is everything
I apologize in advance for the lengthy nature of this post. I'm piecing together things now with this new lens using what I've learned here on SR.
It seems I express myself best when I journal. Most of what you see below is what I sent my AH at the time via email, I stopped fighting with him while he was drunk long ago. And instead fumed about it until I could get my thoughts down in an email.
We got married in 2009, I was a young and naive 24 year old. I had no idea at all what addiction truly meant and calling someone an alcoholic in my mind simply meant the person had an easy choice and they chose the selfish route. Boy, does reading through all of this make me feel like a COMPLETE fool. These are just a few examples from the many of these I have over the years. How did I not see? I really thought at the time I was just arguing with someone who was making this selfish choice and if he would just grow up and see what he'd be missing without us, he'd make the easy choice to moderate his drinking or just quit. I know now that's not the case.
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2/9/2010
Me: I used to think that it was that I was drinking with you and it was just a habit we had gotten into together, but lately you've been drinking alone (not by yourself, but when others are not drinking). And it's never one drink, its several, several drinks. I just do not know how this became your outlet for stress and your relief from a hard day. I wish I was enough to help you unwind from a long and stressful day.
Him: The problem is you are the source of most of my stress. I can handle a lot of stress outside of the home, if i feel like we are ok, but lately i have felt hopless.
Me: Can we please work on this? I'd never want to say 'you should only drink once a week' but last night really just drove it home... the very thought of drinking once a week was just unfathomable to you. I do think you feel like you have to drink to have fun and I think this is something we should try and remedy now, instead of waiting a few years for it to become a problem (I'm not trying to be dramatic, just honest about how I feel).
Him: I am going to cut back signifigantly on my drinking. It is not helping me loose weight, and overall it is not healthy. Having said that i am not going to commit to a once a week thing. Bc sometime i will break it and you will lecture me about this promise, and i am not going to set myself up for that.
3/18/2013
Me: I am concerned about my husband’s alcohol consumption to the point where I feel like I ne to ask for some outside advice. After a somewhat heated discussion Friday night over his decision to drink Friday after he’d promised me that he’d have 3 nights of no drinking that week and couldn’t even give me 1, Saturday morning he promised me that after our St Patrick’s Day celebration he’d agreed to have only 7 drinks over the course of Sunday through Friday of the next week. He then ‘renegotiated’ the number of drinks after he realized we were having a couple over from Church Sunday afternoon and said if he could drink as much as he wanted Sunday, he’d only have 5 drinks over the course of Monday through Friday.
I worry that my husband doesn’t realize what an affect alcohol has on him and that he doesn’t see that it is adversely affecting our relationship as well as his health. It has been a contributing factor to his weight gain which has led to him not being able to sleep in the same bed with me on most occasions because he snores now. It has been the main source of our arguments as a couple and is the one common theme amongst all of our fights. I am scared that we have been talking about his need to drink excessive amounts of alcohol since we moved back. I remember as far back as when he lived with my parents in January of 2010 that we were having this exact same discussion. There have only been a handful of days since January 2010 where he didn’t have 1 drink.
I worry that my husband is headed down a path that will damage his health and our relationship and that could ultimately affect how my son views alcohol and his father’s relationship with alcohol. I feel like a lot of the reasons he feels it is acceptable to drink as much as he does is because it is a learned behavior from his own father, but that is just speculation through observation of their drinking relationship together.
Please help me figure out what I can do to help my husband see that he has an unhealthy relationship with alcohol. So far I have been unsuccessful in helping him see the adverse affect it is having on our marriage, his health, and our family.
6/9/2014
Me: I also cannot stress to you enough how much anxiety this whole situation gives me... I have lost an incredible amount of sleep over these years worrying about this problem, not to mention how much I think about it during the day. Not every day, but when we go through periods of this I cannot get it off my mind. It terrifies me for our children to watch you go through what I see your dad go through every time we see him, every evening that you talk to him on the phone and he sounds wasted. It's sad and troublesome and just depressing to watch your dad be an active alcoholic and knowing that you have that in your family makes it so real that you could become a full blown have to drink every night alcoholic. I would hope you wouldn't be so naive to think it couldn't happen to you based on your current relationship with alcohol and needing/wanting it to have a good time. You're so much smarter than that. He doesn't care what it's doing to him and that he won't be around to see his grandchildren grow up and it's just a sad life, not to mention what his wife has to deal with on what I'm sure is a daily basis. It's not something I want for our family and I'll be damned if I just sit back idly and watch it happen to our family and our marriage. I'd like to think you have control over the situation and can make a change, but if that doesn't happen this time we should find someone for you to talk to about all of this that can help because clearly I am not that person for you.
Him: I got too drunk. I am sorry, there is no excuse. It is not fair to you. I am embarrassed of myself. I am going to do better. I know you have heard it before, but legitimate progress has been made this last month (not including the last two days). I said in our last big talk that there would be setbacks, and I hope that is all this was.
I hope I can begin to earn some of your trust back this week, and if you approve, then I would like to have a make-up night at Bob's this Saturday (I wont drink anything beforehand).
I am sorry that I have put you through this for so long. Please do not give up on me.
6/15/2015
Me: Our fighting mainly occurs in the evening... and usually starts by me being frustrated with his daily drinking. He says that he drinks because he enjoys it and wants to have a good time. He cannot seem to have a good time with me without wanting to drink. Why is that? I get that he enjoys it but it's not the same as eating a piece of candy or consuming some other food or drink, it's alcohol, it alters your feelings and your state of mind. He is choosing alcohol over our marriage and his health. I could go on and on about this but I'm just tired of dealing with it.
Maybe we should see a counselor.
12/1/2015
Me: We're back here again. I went to collect my thoughts and realized quickly that I'd done this a hundred times before so I may as well just reference back to the many previous emails I've written you in the past. You haven't been doing better. I've been bothered for some time not with the frequency in which you drink, especially when it's just a night at home with your family. There's no reason you should have drank last night, especially 3 large glass of wine that cause you to slur your words and look/act inebriated. I truly cannot stand to be around the person you become on nights last night. Why is that not enough motivation for you to change?
You have no idea how discouraging it is to read back through these emails I've written you over the years about the SAME PROBLEM. And to read your responses. It seems you're not only lying to me, you're lying to yourself. How much longer until you realize that YOU are the only person who can make positive changes in your life? And that YOU DO have control over these things that cause both of us so much unhappiness?
Him: I understand. You are right about pretty much everything. Things are rough in my life right now, but it is probably never going to be a cake walk. I gotta put up or shut up.
I am sorry that I have gotten you to a place where you are done with me again. I'll try to do better.
10/25/2016
Me: Things have not changed with you FOR YEARS AND YEARS. Reading back through this email string is incredibly depressing. The last 2 nights while your dad and his wife have been here with our family, somehow you ended up drinking both nights by yourself, slurring your words, and saying/acting like you'd been drinking. It's awkward and embarrassing and infuriating. Even more so depressing is the fact that nothing has changed in the past 11 months. I read through this email I sent you on 12/1/2015 and you've made NO progress. NONE.
I literally want to cry. What have I gotten myself into. This keeps me up at night (alone, by myself in a bed away from you because you cannot seem to make effort to lose weight so you won't snore).
10/23/2018
Me: I cannot do this anymore. I way laying in bed tonight thinking I need space from you, that you make me physically sick and miserable and that we need to figure out a way to separate from each other. And then I realized it was this time last year, right before Thanksgiving that I felt the same way. I wanted you to spend Thanksgiving at your dad's house and for us to figure out a way to separate. We are no further now than we were then.
Looking back through these emails is just awful. I felt the same way this time in 2016. These emails date all the way back to 2013. I just cannot do this anymore. We are in the same place. You are still drinking or taking something and lying to me about it. You were clearly inebriated last night and LYING TO MY FACE about it.
The bad outweighs the good too much now. We are in the same place we were TEN YEARS AGO. The original email I wrote here talks about how I felt this way in JANUARY OF 2010. What are we still doing together?! Please let me go. I'm so unhappy with you, you make me miserable. I cannot keep going through this with you anymore. You are not good for my health and I truly believe me and the boys would be better off on our own without you than for us to continue living in the same house with you.
12/2018
He gets a DWI while driving to get pizza with my 3 year old.
1/19/2019
Well, in no uncertain terms have we agreed that he would not drink, and if he wanted to drink, he would politely ask me if he could have a beer and I'd say yes or no. He's asked a couple of times, and a couple of nights ago I told him yes to a single beer with dinner and it was fine. Not this night though, he took it upon himself to 'ask forgiveness' as he explained to me 'because he knew he'd be in trouble but he wanted to do it anyway' is what he told me. So again, I explain to him in no uncertain terms that he has lost the luxury of making his own decisions with drinking right now, that he's got A LOT to make up for and that in order to earn my trust back he has to follow this agreement to the letter. He seemingly seems fine with it once again, that's the plan going forward. We even discussed it more this morning, he says he's 100% crystal clear on what needs to happen
4/9/2019
Letter to my therapist:
And all I keep thinking is these things never get better on their own. The line of thinking generally speaking is that only after a life changing event do people like him change. Well we had our life changing event back in December, and it hasn't changed his decisions in our family regarding his drinking much at all. What does that say about our future?
I have no idea how much he drank tonight and frankly I don't care, all I do know is that he was tipsy with the boys and tipsy at dinner and it's just unacceptable.
I don't know why I haven't left him yet, what it's going to take. I'm in a vicious cycle with a person who won't change for us.
I feel right now in this moment as though are problems are so enormous, especially in nights like tonight, where all I can think about honestly is that we are only together for the kids and that this is miserable.
Funny on the rare nights where he doesn't drink we have such a nice time together and I really enjoy his company and these thoughts don't cross my mind at all. The same as how I feel on our normal lunch outings, This is what must keep me with him, the times when he's not drinking I don't hate him at all. I just wish it wasn't so rare of an occurrence.
What in the world do I do. Probably what I've always done. Bottle it up, push it down, and wait for the next time I feel so full of frustration that I explode into an email (ha!).
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As you've seen, I've threatened to leave quite a bit and said I'm done many times. All of those were futile efforts to get him to change. I know now that I'm dealing with something much bigger than an immature, selfish husband who just needs to make that easy choice to drink less or not at all. I'm finally there, in a place where his choice to continue drinking will cause me to make my choice to leave. I honestly feel like I have no other option, because staying and living out this cyclical drama with him is just too much. I'm so much better off on my own with my children than I am fighting with someone who doesn't want to change. I spoke with my good friend about this today and my dad called me today to check on things. They both know the situation and are both super supportive of me leaving if he decides he needs to keep alcohol in his life. I feel numb about it really, almost as if my head is forcing me to put one foot in front of the other and not allowing my emotions to take hold. Which is a good thing probably.
Thanks for listening. I really think I'd be in the same place I was months ago if I hadn't found this forum. I cannot believe for the longest time I'd ask myself constantly 'is this normal?' because clearly, piecing all of this together is NOT normal and I haven't been crazy and controlling this whole time.
He's at his second outpatient meeting tonight, he hasn't drank since last week. It's a bit overwhelming to think that the choice he has to make in the next 2 months could completely undo mine and my kids life as we know it. But I know we'll be okay, I have to escape if he chooses to continue drinking.
It seems I express myself best when I journal. Most of what you see below is what I sent my AH at the time via email, I stopped fighting with him while he was drunk long ago. And instead fumed about it until I could get my thoughts down in an email.
We got married in 2009, I was a young and naive 24 year old. I had no idea at all what addiction truly meant and calling someone an alcoholic in my mind simply meant the person had an easy choice and they chose the selfish route. Boy, does reading through all of this make me feel like a COMPLETE fool. These are just a few examples from the many of these I have over the years. How did I not see? I really thought at the time I was just arguing with someone who was making this selfish choice and if he would just grow up and see what he'd be missing without us, he'd make the easy choice to moderate his drinking or just quit. I know now that's not the case.
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2/9/2010
Me: I used to think that it was that I was drinking with you and it was just a habit we had gotten into together, but lately you've been drinking alone (not by yourself, but when others are not drinking). And it's never one drink, its several, several drinks. I just do not know how this became your outlet for stress and your relief from a hard day. I wish I was enough to help you unwind from a long and stressful day.
Him: The problem is you are the source of most of my stress. I can handle a lot of stress outside of the home, if i feel like we are ok, but lately i have felt hopless.
Me: Can we please work on this? I'd never want to say 'you should only drink once a week' but last night really just drove it home... the very thought of drinking once a week was just unfathomable to you. I do think you feel like you have to drink to have fun and I think this is something we should try and remedy now, instead of waiting a few years for it to become a problem (I'm not trying to be dramatic, just honest about how I feel).
Him: I am going to cut back signifigantly on my drinking. It is not helping me loose weight, and overall it is not healthy. Having said that i am not going to commit to a once a week thing. Bc sometime i will break it and you will lecture me about this promise, and i am not going to set myself up for that.
3/18/2013
Me: I am concerned about my husband’s alcohol consumption to the point where I feel like I ne to ask for some outside advice. After a somewhat heated discussion Friday night over his decision to drink Friday after he’d promised me that he’d have 3 nights of no drinking that week and couldn’t even give me 1, Saturday morning he promised me that after our St Patrick’s Day celebration he’d agreed to have only 7 drinks over the course of Sunday through Friday of the next week. He then ‘renegotiated’ the number of drinks after he realized we were having a couple over from Church Sunday afternoon and said if he could drink as much as he wanted Sunday, he’d only have 5 drinks over the course of Monday through Friday.
I worry that my husband doesn’t realize what an affect alcohol has on him and that he doesn’t see that it is adversely affecting our relationship as well as his health. It has been a contributing factor to his weight gain which has led to him not being able to sleep in the same bed with me on most occasions because he snores now. It has been the main source of our arguments as a couple and is the one common theme amongst all of our fights. I am scared that we have been talking about his need to drink excessive amounts of alcohol since we moved back. I remember as far back as when he lived with my parents in January of 2010 that we were having this exact same discussion. There have only been a handful of days since January 2010 where he didn’t have 1 drink.
I worry that my husband is headed down a path that will damage his health and our relationship and that could ultimately affect how my son views alcohol and his father’s relationship with alcohol. I feel like a lot of the reasons he feels it is acceptable to drink as much as he does is because it is a learned behavior from his own father, but that is just speculation through observation of their drinking relationship together.
Please help me figure out what I can do to help my husband see that he has an unhealthy relationship with alcohol. So far I have been unsuccessful in helping him see the adverse affect it is having on our marriage, his health, and our family.
6/9/2014
Me: I also cannot stress to you enough how much anxiety this whole situation gives me... I have lost an incredible amount of sleep over these years worrying about this problem, not to mention how much I think about it during the day. Not every day, but when we go through periods of this I cannot get it off my mind. It terrifies me for our children to watch you go through what I see your dad go through every time we see him, every evening that you talk to him on the phone and he sounds wasted. It's sad and troublesome and just depressing to watch your dad be an active alcoholic and knowing that you have that in your family makes it so real that you could become a full blown have to drink every night alcoholic. I would hope you wouldn't be so naive to think it couldn't happen to you based on your current relationship with alcohol and needing/wanting it to have a good time. You're so much smarter than that. He doesn't care what it's doing to him and that he won't be around to see his grandchildren grow up and it's just a sad life, not to mention what his wife has to deal with on what I'm sure is a daily basis. It's not something I want for our family and I'll be damned if I just sit back idly and watch it happen to our family and our marriage. I'd like to think you have control over the situation and can make a change, but if that doesn't happen this time we should find someone for you to talk to about all of this that can help because clearly I am not that person for you.
Him: I got too drunk. I am sorry, there is no excuse. It is not fair to you. I am embarrassed of myself. I am going to do better. I know you have heard it before, but legitimate progress has been made this last month (not including the last two days). I said in our last big talk that there would be setbacks, and I hope that is all this was.
I hope I can begin to earn some of your trust back this week, and if you approve, then I would like to have a make-up night at Bob's this Saturday (I wont drink anything beforehand).
I am sorry that I have put you through this for so long. Please do not give up on me.
6/15/2015
Me: Our fighting mainly occurs in the evening... and usually starts by me being frustrated with his daily drinking. He says that he drinks because he enjoys it and wants to have a good time. He cannot seem to have a good time with me without wanting to drink. Why is that? I get that he enjoys it but it's not the same as eating a piece of candy or consuming some other food or drink, it's alcohol, it alters your feelings and your state of mind. He is choosing alcohol over our marriage and his health. I could go on and on about this but I'm just tired of dealing with it.
Maybe we should see a counselor.
12/1/2015
Me: We're back here again. I went to collect my thoughts and realized quickly that I'd done this a hundred times before so I may as well just reference back to the many previous emails I've written you in the past. You haven't been doing better. I've been bothered for some time not with the frequency in which you drink, especially when it's just a night at home with your family. There's no reason you should have drank last night, especially 3 large glass of wine that cause you to slur your words and look/act inebriated. I truly cannot stand to be around the person you become on nights last night. Why is that not enough motivation for you to change?
You have no idea how discouraging it is to read back through these emails I've written you over the years about the SAME PROBLEM. And to read your responses. It seems you're not only lying to me, you're lying to yourself. How much longer until you realize that YOU are the only person who can make positive changes in your life? And that YOU DO have control over these things that cause both of us so much unhappiness?
Him: I understand. You are right about pretty much everything. Things are rough in my life right now, but it is probably never going to be a cake walk. I gotta put up or shut up.
I am sorry that I have gotten you to a place where you are done with me again. I'll try to do better.
10/25/2016
Me: Things have not changed with you FOR YEARS AND YEARS. Reading back through this email string is incredibly depressing. The last 2 nights while your dad and his wife have been here with our family, somehow you ended up drinking both nights by yourself, slurring your words, and saying/acting like you'd been drinking. It's awkward and embarrassing and infuriating. Even more so depressing is the fact that nothing has changed in the past 11 months. I read through this email I sent you on 12/1/2015 and you've made NO progress. NONE.
I literally want to cry. What have I gotten myself into. This keeps me up at night (alone, by myself in a bed away from you because you cannot seem to make effort to lose weight so you won't snore).
10/23/2018
Me: I cannot do this anymore. I way laying in bed tonight thinking I need space from you, that you make me physically sick and miserable and that we need to figure out a way to separate from each other. And then I realized it was this time last year, right before Thanksgiving that I felt the same way. I wanted you to spend Thanksgiving at your dad's house and for us to figure out a way to separate. We are no further now than we were then.
Looking back through these emails is just awful. I felt the same way this time in 2016. These emails date all the way back to 2013. I just cannot do this anymore. We are in the same place. You are still drinking or taking something and lying to me about it. You were clearly inebriated last night and LYING TO MY FACE about it.
The bad outweighs the good too much now. We are in the same place we were TEN YEARS AGO. The original email I wrote here talks about how I felt this way in JANUARY OF 2010. What are we still doing together?! Please let me go. I'm so unhappy with you, you make me miserable. I cannot keep going through this with you anymore. You are not good for my health and I truly believe me and the boys would be better off on our own without you than for us to continue living in the same house with you.
12/2018
He gets a DWI while driving to get pizza with my 3 year old.
1/19/2019
Well, in no uncertain terms have we agreed that he would not drink, and if he wanted to drink, he would politely ask me if he could have a beer and I'd say yes or no. He's asked a couple of times, and a couple of nights ago I told him yes to a single beer with dinner and it was fine. Not this night though, he took it upon himself to 'ask forgiveness' as he explained to me 'because he knew he'd be in trouble but he wanted to do it anyway' is what he told me. So again, I explain to him in no uncertain terms that he has lost the luxury of making his own decisions with drinking right now, that he's got A LOT to make up for and that in order to earn my trust back he has to follow this agreement to the letter. He seemingly seems fine with it once again, that's the plan going forward. We even discussed it more this morning, he says he's 100% crystal clear on what needs to happen
4/9/2019
Letter to my therapist:
And all I keep thinking is these things never get better on their own. The line of thinking generally speaking is that only after a life changing event do people like him change. Well we had our life changing event back in December, and it hasn't changed his decisions in our family regarding his drinking much at all. What does that say about our future?
I have no idea how much he drank tonight and frankly I don't care, all I do know is that he was tipsy with the boys and tipsy at dinner and it's just unacceptable.
I don't know why I haven't left him yet, what it's going to take. I'm in a vicious cycle with a person who won't change for us.
I feel right now in this moment as though are problems are so enormous, especially in nights like tonight, where all I can think about honestly is that we are only together for the kids and that this is miserable.
Funny on the rare nights where he doesn't drink we have such a nice time together and I really enjoy his company and these thoughts don't cross my mind at all. The same as how I feel on our normal lunch outings, This is what must keep me with him, the times when he's not drinking I don't hate him at all. I just wish it wasn't so rare of an occurrence.
What in the world do I do. Probably what I've always done. Bottle it up, push it down, and wait for the next time I feel so full of frustration that I explode into an email (ha!).
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As you've seen, I've threatened to leave quite a bit and said I'm done many times. All of those were futile efforts to get him to change. I know now that I'm dealing with something much bigger than an immature, selfish husband who just needs to make that easy choice to drink less or not at all. I'm finally there, in a place where his choice to continue drinking will cause me to make my choice to leave. I honestly feel like I have no other option, because staying and living out this cyclical drama with him is just too much. I'm so much better off on my own with my children than I am fighting with someone who doesn't want to change. I spoke with my good friend about this today and my dad called me today to check on things. They both know the situation and are both super supportive of me leaving if he decides he needs to keep alcohol in his life. I feel numb about it really, almost as if my head is forcing me to put one foot in front of the other and not allowing my emotions to take hold. Which is a good thing probably.
Thanks for listening. I really think I'd be in the same place I was months ago if I hadn't found this forum. I cannot believe for the longest time I'd ask myself constantly 'is this normal?' because clearly, piecing all of this together is NOT normal and I haven't been crazy and controlling this whole time.
He's at his second outpatient meeting tonight, he hasn't drank since last week. It's a bit overwhelming to think that the choice he has to make in the next 2 months could completely undo mine and my kids life as we know it. But I know we'll be okay, I have to escape if he chooses to continue drinking.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Southern US
Posts: 510
Oh, FWN.....first of all (((((HUGS))))).
I also keep an online journal. I can be really sad to go back and see just how long the saaaaaaaaaaaaame olllllllllllllllllld thing has been going on.
I've been with my AH 13 years total; married for the last 7. Tonight he came home drunk after this BIG heart-to-heart last night about actually getting into recovery and having a plan....today he was supposed to not drink and go to a meeting. "I PROMISE!"
A condo has come available in the community I lived in before i got married. I told him I think daughter and I need to move in there until he gets off the booze, and has some kind of a recovery going on. I also reminded him about the futon that is to be delivered tomorrow. He didn't remember anything about it....so he stormed out and went to the bar. Now, as I type this, he's doing his "We've been married so long, I don't want to lose you" schtick.
It's scary to think about the complete upheaval of leaving. But, like you, there just comes a time when you reach your limit.
Why do they have to push the envelope so f-ing far?
I also keep an online journal. I can be really sad to go back and see just how long the saaaaaaaaaaaaame olllllllllllllllllld thing has been going on.
I've been with my AH 13 years total; married for the last 7. Tonight he came home drunk after this BIG heart-to-heart last night about actually getting into recovery and having a plan....today he was supposed to not drink and go to a meeting. "I PROMISE!"
A condo has come available in the community I lived in before i got married. I told him I think daughter and I need to move in there until he gets off the booze, and has some kind of a recovery going on. I also reminded him about the futon that is to be delivered tomorrow. He didn't remember anything about it....so he stormed out and went to the bar. Now, as I type this, he's doing his "We've been married so long, I don't want to lose you" schtick.
It's scary to think about the complete upheaval of leaving. But, like you, there just comes a time when you reach your limit.
Why do they have to push the envelope so f-ing far?
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 316
LPS - Right?!?! The worst part is all of those heart felt conversations, the sober mornings and days where things feel normal and fine. It's what keeps us holding on. But at some point, at least for me, the bad outweighs the good even if it's the same old same old. We get one life, and I know it could be so much more than what it is right now.
I just cannot believe how much I've repeated myself over the years and let him talk me out of my anger and frustration, with the 'I'm going to do betters' and him also managing to make it about my control.
How does he know all of the right things to say to keep me here?!?!?!
I just cannot believe how much I've repeated myself over the years and let him talk me out of my anger and frustration, with the 'I'm going to do betters' and him also managing to make it about my control.
How does he know all of the right things to say to keep me here?!?!?!
Member
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,637
To be honest fwn, he didn't really say much.
Him: I am going to cut back signifigantly on my drinking. It is not helping me loose weight, and overall it is not healthy. Having said that i am not going to commit to a once a week thing. Bc sometime i will break it and you will lecture me about this promise, and i am not going to set myself up for that.
Translation: I'm promising nothing
Him: The problem is you are the source of most of my stress. I can handle a lot of stress outside of the home, if i feel like we are ok, but lately i have felt hopless.
Translation: If you would stop talking about this I would be much happier.
Him: I got too drunk. I am sorry, there is no excuse. It is not fair to you. I am embarrassed of myself. I am going to do better. I know you have heard it before, but legitimate progress has been made this last month (not including the last two days). I said in our last big talk that there would be setbacks, and I hope that is all this was.
Translation: I left a big out in my promise so you can't come back at me with that now - want to go to dinner?
Him: I understand. You are right about pretty much everything. Things are rough in my life right now, but it is probably never going to be a cake walk. I gotta put up or shut up.
I am sorry that I have gotten you to a place where you are done with me again. I'll try to do better.
Translation: I'll "try" but we both know how that works.
Him: I am going to cut back signifigantly on my drinking. It is not helping me loose weight, and overall it is not healthy. Having said that i am not going to commit to a once a week thing. Bc sometime i will break it and you will lecture me about this promise, and i am not going to set myself up for that.
Translation: I'm promising nothing
Him: The problem is you are the source of most of my stress. I can handle a lot of stress outside of the home, if i feel like we are ok, but lately i have felt hopless.
Translation: If you would stop talking about this I would be much happier.
Him: I got too drunk. I am sorry, there is no excuse. It is not fair to you. I am embarrassed of myself. I am going to do better. I know you have heard it before, but legitimate progress has been made this last month (not including the last two days). I said in our last big talk that there would be setbacks, and I hope that is all this was.
Translation: I left a big out in my promise so you can't come back at me with that now - want to go to dinner?
Him: I understand. You are right about pretty much everything. Things are rough in my life right now, but it is probably never going to be a cake walk. I gotta put up or shut up.
I am sorry that I have gotten you to a place where you are done with me again. I'll try to do better.
Translation: I'll "try" but we both know how that works.
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Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 40
Oh, my goodness FWN..... (((((hugs))))). You commented on one of my threads that we are in a very similar place... I think we might be twins or something.
This is EXACTLY how I feel and I couldn’t put it into words. My AH moved out Friday and I feel like I’ve been on autopilot. I have felt ‘hints’ of this intense grief, and I have had plenty of crying episodes, but the dam hasn’t broken yet. It is agonizing on so many different fronts - the second guessing yourself, especially after meaningful conversations where you feel like you’re making headway... the grief.. the shock... the disbelief... it feels like you’re being hit from every different direction.
I can’t offer much in the way of advice, but please be reassured that you are absolutely not alone. I know our situations aren’t exactly the same, but we are on this path right next to each other. I’m here to listen and offer any support that I can <3
I feel numb about it really, almost as if my head is forcing me to put one foot in front of the other and not allowing my emotions to take hold.
I can’t offer much in the way of advice, but please be reassured that you are absolutely not alone. I know our situations aren’t exactly the same, but we are on this path right next to each other. I’m here to listen and offer any support that I can <3
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Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Southern US
Posts: 510
Yes, alcoholic promises are like a bucket with a hole in the bottom. They don't hold anything.
AH said last night "I just want to please your every need"
Me: It would please me greatly if you would not ingest any alcohol whatsoever tomorrow
AH: Okay, I will do my very best. I love you
That translates to me, "I want to say what you want to hear, but when push comes to shove tomorrow, I'm going to choose to drink, because I have a "disease" and I can't help myself".
AH said last night "I just want to please your every need"
Me: It would please me greatly if you would not ingest any alcohol whatsoever tomorrow
AH: Okay, I will do my very best. I love you
That translates to me, "I want to say what you want to hear, but when push comes to shove tomorrow, I'm going to choose to drink, because I have a "disease" and I can't help myself".
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 316
LPS - Such mind games, do they even know they’re doing it?!
I know I cannot go back to that place of negotiation, where he is promising me X number of drinks or X number of nights not drinking etc. etc. it’s exhausting and it is not a cycle I want to start again. I know if I agree to it, it will never end and I will have more emails like the ones above.
I am still trying to comprehend my feelings that I wrote in all of those emails over all of that time and how just living in a day-to-day can keep you here. Why is that? I took a few vacations away from AH these past couple of months and it made a huge difference seeing things from the outside. But then when I’m in it like I am right now, it’s like I’m blinded.
Saudad - Thank you, I’m sure it is hard for you right now with him moving out. Seems like there’s a possibility I may be right there with you soon.
I know I cannot go back to that place of negotiation, where he is promising me X number of drinks or X number of nights not drinking etc. etc. it’s exhausting and it is not a cycle I want to start again. I know if I agree to it, it will never end and I will have more emails like the ones above.
I am still trying to comprehend my feelings that I wrote in all of those emails over all of that time and how just living in a day-to-day can keep you here. Why is that? I took a few vacations away from AH these past couple of months and it made a huge difference seeing things from the outside. But then when I’m in it like I am right now, it’s like I’m blinded.
Saudad - Thank you, I’m sure it is hard for you right now with him moving out. Seems like there’s a possibility I may be right there with you soon.
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
Oh goodness. I did all of that for YEARS. He was dry for a year, until he was not anymore. As someone else said above, an addict talking is a bucket with a hole in the bottom.
You cannot change how someone else acts no matter how hard you try, but you can control your own reactions.
Do what is best for YOU and your children.
Huge hugs.
You cannot change how someone else acts no matter how hard you try, but you can control your own reactions.
Do what is best for YOU and your children.
Huge hugs.
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 6,780
I did all that for years too fwn - many of us did. You aren't alone. 
It took me a while but once I really started MY recovery, I realized quickly that we might be facing the same "problem", but our solutions were very, very different. In fact, we'd also been speaking different languages for a long time too - using the same words, but each holding entirely different meanings for them.
Here's the other AHA in it for me - I can't make him understand my POV exactly either & that's OK. He doesn't have to validate my experience for it to be real. It IS real.
Originally Posted by fortworthnative 
I took a few vacations away from AH these past couple of months and it made a huge difference seeing things from the outside. But then when I’m in it like I am right now, it’s like I’m blinded.
Here's the other AHA in it for me - I can't make him understand my POV exactly either & that's OK. He doesn't have to validate my experience for it to be real. It IS real.
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 6,780
Originally Posted by hopeful4
As someone else said above, an addict talking is a bucket with a hole in the bottom.
Another compared it to trying to nail jello to a tree.
Both visuals stick with me to this day. I just had an incident with an active, half-loaded drunk when I met my SIL for the first time & all I could see in my head were oreos & jello & trees & I couldn't stop from LOL. Like - BELLY LAUGHING you guys....
I also hear that line from Labyrinth, "you have no power over me!"
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,427
I know I cannot go back to that place of negotiation, where he is promising me X number of drinks or X number of nights not drinking etc. etc. it’s exhausting and it is not a cycle I want to start again. I know if I agree to it, it will never end and I will have more emails like the ones above.
This will never work anyway. You cannot control his drinking, nor should you--it will destroy your health and mental peace if nothing else.
What I see is someone who really doesn't want to quit and resents the he-ll out of you for not just letting him keep drinking. He has a right to drink, but you have an equal right to not be around an active alcoholic.
It may be simply that you two have different priorities, and they may not meet in the end.
This will never work anyway. You cannot control his drinking, nor should you--it will destroy your health and mental peace if nothing else.
What I see is someone who really doesn't want to quit and resents the he-ll out of you for not just letting him keep drinking. He has a right to drink, but you have an equal right to not be around an active alcoholic.
It may be simply that you two have different priorities, and they may not meet in the end.
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 6,780
Originally Posted by fortworthnative
I totally agree with you from my heads point of view, but my emotions get played with so much when things seem so “normal” in times like this when he’s sober. Ugh!!
Give yourself some slack, you're growing a baby, managing an active household wit young children & trying to wrap your head around the totality of addiction. Baby steps - this is your life, not a race.
You're doing great honestly!
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 316
Thank you, everyone. This has all been so therapeutic for me. I have a completely different perspective than the person I was who was in that cycle illustrated above and I’m sad I didn’t see or understand this much sooner.
If he chooses to continue drinking, what’s in it for me? More misery. More lies. More deception. More heartache. What’s in it for him? He gets to do what he wants when he wants and have a wife and a family there to appear as if everything is okay. What a WASTE of my time and my life.
Honestly I need to prepare myself for him choosing alcohol. Nothings different for him this time than it was any of those other times above. I’m the one who has changed.
If he chooses to continue drinking, what’s in it for me? More misery. More lies. More deception. More heartache. What’s in it for him? He gets to do what he wants when he wants and have a wife and a family there to appear as if everything is okay. What a WASTE of my time and my life.
Honestly I need to prepare myself for him choosing alcohol. Nothings different for him this time than it was any of those other times above. I’m the one who has changed.
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
Love that honeypig!!!
Amen is right! I know that hurt comes with this situation, but the change you have made in yourself will carry you through how you process everything that happens to you in the future, in a much more healthy way for your own wellbeing.
Huge, huge hugs!
Amen is right! I know that hurt comes with this situation, but the change you have made in yourself will carry you through how you process everything that happens to you in the future, in a much more healthy way for your own wellbeing.
Huge, huge hugs!
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