Caring about someone in recovery whilst in recovery yourself
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Cornwall
Posts: 60
Caring about someone in recovery whilst in recovery yourself
Hi,
I'm an alcoholic and usually spend time in the "Newcomers to Recovery" forum but I have an issue that I am trying to deal with on top of my own recovery.
I have a friend who I care very much about. We both entered recovery and AA at roughly the same time ( She is 6 days longer than me and 4 days longer in AA) and go to 2 AA meetings a week that we both attend (we do do other meetings on our own but share 2 meetings that we started to go to together and both consider our home meetings).
We have known each other for about 2 1/2 years and for the first 18 months we were facilitating each others drinking and doing things that couples do. Over the last 6 - 8 months our relationship has changed and is more a close friendship, we share our thoughts, feelings and problems with each other and support each other in our sobriety.
We made an agreement at the turn of the year that we would just be friends and go for days out, evenings to the theatre/cinema or just meet up for walks. and it has been a more comfortable and positive relationship ever since.
However in the last 2 months things have changed dramatically. She now rarely talks to me outside of meetings, rarely messages or replies to me online and is ignoring any attempts by me to plan to do things away from AA. We used to meet for coffee before one of our meetings but this is now happening less and less and if I mention a trip out it is met with silence.
We are both doing the Steps, although she is slightly further ahead (I am just getting through Step 2) and I put a lot of it down to the amount of time the Steps can take up and how they can make you feel but I am not so sure just recently.
I guess I am trying to deal with my own sobriety and recovery and trying to deal with hers as well. I know that I shouldn't be worried about things I can't change but it's hurting me that we have gone from being so close and sharing so much to being just people we meet at AA meetings. I could accept it a lot more if she would actually tell me what she is feeling and thinking as she did up until recently and the fact that she can't makes me feel like I have done something wrong or something to upset her.
Sorry to just blurt all that out, I know I should be more understanding but trying to deal with both our recoveries is proving hard.
Thanks for listening and any words of wisdom would be very much appreciated.
I'm an alcoholic and usually spend time in the "Newcomers to Recovery" forum but I have an issue that I am trying to deal with on top of my own recovery.
I have a friend who I care very much about. We both entered recovery and AA at roughly the same time ( She is 6 days longer than me and 4 days longer in AA) and go to 2 AA meetings a week that we both attend (we do do other meetings on our own but share 2 meetings that we started to go to together and both consider our home meetings).
We have known each other for about 2 1/2 years and for the first 18 months we were facilitating each others drinking and doing things that couples do. Over the last 6 - 8 months our relationship has changed and is more a close friendship, we share our thoughts, feelings and problems with each other and support each other in our sobriety.
We made an agreement at the turn of the year that we would just be friends and go for days out, evenings to the theatre/cinema or just meet up for walks. and it has been a more comfortable and positive relationship ever since.
However in the last 2 months things have changed dramatically. She now rarely talks to me outside of meetings, rarely messages or replies to me online and is ignoring any attempts by me to plan to do things away from AA. We used to meet for coffee before one of our meetings but this is now happening less and less and if I mention a trip out it is met with silence.
We are both doing the Steps, although she is slightly further ahead (I am just getting through Step 2) and I put a lot of it down to the amount of time the Steps can take up and how they can make you feel but I am not so sure just recently.
I guess I am trying to deal with my own sobriety and recovery and trying to deal with hers as well. I know that I shouldn't be worried about things I can't change but it's hurting me that we have gone from being so close and sharing so much to being just people we meet at AA meetings. I could accept it a lot more if she would actually tell me what she is feeling and thinking as she did up until recently and the fact that she can't makes me feel like I have done something wrong or something to upset her.
Sorry to just blurt all that out, I know I should be more understanding but trying to deal with both our recoveries is proving hard.
Thanks for listening and any words of wisdom would be very much appreciated.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 25,373
I'm a double winner so I'll give my two cents.
If she doesn't want to talk about why she's becoming distant, then she doesn't want to talk about it. She doesn't have to talk about it.
Some people are in our lives for a lifetime and some for a season.
I think you would find some relief if you would continue on with your Step work and branch out to other people in the fellowship. Maybe start going to different meetings than she goes to and it will make this easier. You're not dealing with "both" your recoveries. Only yours.
Was this at one time a romantic relationship, you don't really say? Those are tough at any time, and I've never been successful at going from romantic to friendship. YMMV, but breakups are always difficult.
If she doesn't want to talk about why she's becoming distant, then she doesn't want to talk about it. She doesn't have to talk about it.
Some people are in our lives for a lifetime and some for a season.
I think you would find some relief if you would continue on with your Step work and branch out to other people in the fellowship. Maybe start going to different meetings than she goes to and it will make this easier. You're not dealing with "both" your recoveries. Only yours.
Was this at one time a romantic relationship, you don't really say? Those are tough at any time, and I've never been successful at going from romantic to friendship. YMMV, but breakups are always difficult.
Guest
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 8,674
Glad you are sharing- this is definitely stuff to get out. I strongly agree with what bimini said, every word.
While I did have 4 1/2 mo sober before I started dating my now husband, who had a month (we dated in high school so there was a background, not a stranger thing)...being able to put my own sobriety first no matter what, no matter where he has been in his path, is critical. We have definitely had different paths in AA.
I don't know if you are working with a sponsor, tho I can assume bc you describe the steps, but it would definitely be valuable here. Certainly something to bring up if you have one.
Space is hard for me- ie letting someone do their thing. I've also learned that worrying about someone else and their sobriety can be damaging to mine. In fact, I'm getting concerned about my sponsee right now, and coincidentally read a page in the BB this morning where I had made a note: "put my (emotional) sobriety first." That's always the rule.
Take care of yourself- keep going - and, meant kindly, being still early in sobriety ...relationships including friendships can be very supportive and/or potentially destructive.
While I did have 4 1/2 mo sober before I started dating my now husband, who had a month (we dated in high school so there was a background, not a stranger thing)...being able to put my own sobriety first no matter what, no matter where he has been in his path, is critical. We have definitely had different paths in AA.
I don't know if you are working with a sponsor, tho I can assume bc you describe the steps, but it would definitely be valuable here. Certainly something to bring up if you have one.
Space is hard for me- ie letting someone do their thing. I've also learned that worrying about someone else and their sobriety can be damaging to mine. In fact, I'm getting concerned about my sponsee right now, and coincidentally read a page in the BB this morning where I had made a note: "put my (emotional) sobriety first." That's always the rule.
Take care of yourself- keep going - and, meant kindly, being still early in sobriety ...relationships including friendships can be very supportive and/or potentially destructive.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
when ya do the 4th step inventory- that being the resentment,fears, and sex relations inventorIES- you should learn whats behind the fears and insecurities.
....but trying to deal with both our recoveries is proving hard.
its not 2 recoveries you have to deal with. only 1-yours.
her recovery is her recovery and yours is yours.
shes working through her own baggage. allow her that and work on your own baggage.
what does your sponsor say about it?
....but trying to deal with both our recoveries is proving hard.
its not 2 recoveries you have to deal with. only 1-yours.
her recovery is her recovery and yours is yours.
shes working through her own baggage. allow her that and work on your own baggage.
what does your sponsor say about it?
Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,103
I know I should be more understanding but trying to deal with both our recoveries is proving hard.
I guess I am trying to deal with my own sobriety and recovery and trying to deal with hers as well.
People do change and especially when they are focused and committed to their recovery. Maybe her actions are speaking instead of her using words, words you want to hear so that you can then change something about yourself to attempt to please her. Maybe it’s as simple as you were part of her drinking past, a past she is working hard to get away from.
Clearly this friendship means more to you then it appears it does to her. Maybe respect what it is she is saying with her actions and back off of asking her to go out for days out, theater/cinema and coffee before meetings. Take a giant step back from this friendship and focus on just you and your recovery.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 6,262
One of my favorite AA sayings: "having a relationship is like pouring Miracle Grow on your character defects". There's a very good reason it's advised to avoid relationships in the first year: getting sober is one of the hardest endeavors on earth and can be easily screwed up with a relationship. You must learn to stand alone, it's not a buddy/couple undertaking. So let her go for a while and jump into recovery. Congrats on your hard work.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Cornwall
Posts: 60
Thank you all for your input!
To clarify some points. I met her online and we were friends initially and then became what I guess you would call friends with benefits. When we met I was serving a court ordered community sentence and close to doing something very stupid. At that point my drinking had gone from Binging every few days to drinking every day. She saw beyond what I had been and what others saw me as and effectively saved me from myself.
On her part she had just split from her husband and was exploring what a single life had to offer. As far as I am aware I am the only person she has met since her separation. She gave me hope and a sense of worth even when she was descending into a serious drinking problem. My background didn't bother her, she saw me for who I really am rather than what I had been convicted of.
I was the person she went to when she was having problems and on more than one occasion I was her voice of reason when she was considering doing something that would be detrimental to her wellbeing. I never told her what to do, just voiced my concerns about her actions and she did the same for me.
She is the reason I sought help for my alcohol problems and is the person who took me to my first AA meeting. I had a choice of trying to preserve our friendship and seek help and the rooms of AA or to carry on drinking and lose everything she had worked to show me I could be and have.
I do have a sponsor and he is guiding me through step 2 at the moment and is unwilling or unable to advise me on this. The thought of Step 4 does scare me, it will be going back over a lot of things that I brought up during counselling sessions and I had an emotional crash when I was going through that.
I guess I am letting her recovery have an effect on me but we always had an honest and open friendship where we could voice any issues we have with each other and I currently feel lost and adrift with regards to our friendship.
I think it's the not knowing where I stand that is the problem. If it is just a case of dealing with the changes brought on by our sobriety then I can deal with that whether it be a temporary thing or more permanent. I just need to know so I can process and deal with it. Neither of us want a relationship, as NYCDoglv said relationships can screw you up, but it's the friendship that I am struggling with and want to preserve.
To clarify some points. I met her online and we were friends initially and then became what I guess you would call friends with benefits. When we met I was serving a court ordered community sentence and close to doing something very stupid. At that point my drinking had gone from Binging every few days to drinking every day. She saw beyond what I had been and what others saw me as and effectively saved me from myself.
On her part she had just split from her husband and was exploring what a single life had to offer. As far as I am aware I am the only person she has met since her separation. She gave me hope and a sense of worth even when she was descending into a serious drinking problem. My background didn't bother her, she saw me for who I really am rather than what I had been convicted of.
I was the person she went to when she was having problems and on more than one occasion I was her voice of reason when she was considering doing something that would be detrimental to her wellbeing. I never told her what to do, just voiced my concerns about her actions and she did the same for me.
She is the reason I sought help for my alcohol problems and is the person who took me to my first AA meeting. I had a choice of trying to preserve our friendship and seek help and the rooms of AA or to carry on drinking and lose everything she had worked to show me I could be and have.
I do have a sponsor and he is guiding me through step 2 at the moment and is unwilling or unable to advise me on this. The thought of Step 4 does scare me, it will be going back over a lot of things that I brought up during counselling sessions and I had an emotional crash when I was going through that.
I guess I am letting her recovery have an effect on me but we always had an honest and open friendship where we could voice any issues we have with each other and I currently feel lost and adrift with regards to our friendship.
I think it's the not knowing where I stand that is the problem. If it is just a case of dealing with the changes brought on by our sobriety then I can deal with that whether it be a temporary thing or more permanent. I just need to know so I can process and deal with it. Neither of us want a relationship, as NYCDoglv said relationships can screw you up, but it's the friendship that I am struggling with and want to preserve.
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 8,674
Thanks for sharing more. I really have to reiterate what we are saying about focusing on you. Step 2 is SO early. Every step is critical and yep, 4 and then 5 are intense - as they should be.
I guess my fundamental question is a bit like what I just put to my sponsee who has an entangled relationship situation of her own: what's most important to you?
For me, it was and is always my sobriety. I adore my husband and don't want to do life without him - but if it ever came down to it, I'd pick sobriety. And, gently, you aren't married to the lady.
I'd also add that it sounds a bit like you were using her as a sponsor - at least more than a supportive friend in AA. And that's one reason same-sex relationships and sponsorship is the deal - dealing with all our 'stuff' whether convictions (been there), bad relationship choices (yep), dishonesty in its many forms...we just don't tend to keep it to 'just that' with someone of the opposite sex. (side note- I'm just raising this from the standpoint of hetero relationships as I can't speak to what gay people experience on this). And truthfully, I only have one guy friend in AA, know his wife, and my husband knows both of them, and it's 99% program and related life stuff that we share, mostly at meetings.
I heard something early on that clicked: "look for the people who have what you want." There's a lot of fretting and supposing and wondering in your situation, and that doesn't bring peace...becoming "happy, joyous, and free" as AA describes starts as a one-person process and can then include others in healthy and mutual relationships.
I think someone suggested a bit up in the thread that you take her lead and take a step back, go to different meetings...all this is saying to focus on you.
I guess my fundamental question is a bit like what I just put to my sponsee who has an entangled relationship situation of her own: what's most important to you?
For me, it was and is always my sobriety. I adore my husband and don't want to do life without him - but if it ever came down to it, I'd pick sobriety. And, gently, you aren't married to the lady.
I'd also add that it sounds a bit like you were using her as a sponsor - at least more than a supportive friend in AA. And that's one reason same-sex relationships and sponsorship is the deal - dealing with all our 'stuff' whether convictions (been there), bad relationship choices (yep), dishonesty in its many forms...we just don't tend to keep it to 'just that' with someone of the opposite sex. (side note- I'm just raising this from the standpoint of hetero relationships as I can't speak to what gay people experience on this). And truthfully, I only have one guy friend in AA, know his wife, and my husband knows both of them, and it's 99% program and related life stuff that we share, mostly at meetings.
I heard something early on that clicked: "look for the people who have what you want." There's a lot of fretting and supposing and wondering in your situation, and that doesn't bring peace...becoming "happy, joyous, and free" as AA describes starts as a one-person process and can then include others in healthy and mutual relationships.
I think someone suggested a bit up in the thread that you take her lead and take a step back, go to different meetings...all this is saying to focus on you.
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Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 25,373
I say this from a place of experience.
She is not your closure. You are.
No matter whether she talks to you about the *why* or not, you have to be okay with letting her go and moving on. Otherwise you continue to torture yourself over this. It's just going to take a little time to get past it. Keep working on those Steps!
As a woman I can tell you that I do not want to be friends with a man I've previously slept with. It's too emotional and too complicated and it makes moving on to a new relationship nearly impossible for me.
I have to make a clean break.
She may or may not ever be any closer to you than she is right now. You have to find a way to deal with that. I've had it happen to me and I've done it myself. There is no painless, all-ends-tied-up, everyone-is-happy way to end it: and to me it sounds like that's what she's trying to do in the least confrontational way possible. Not everyone wants to stay friends with ex-lovers and that's okay.
She is not your closure. You are.
No matter whether she talks to you about the *why* or not, you have to be okay with letting her go and moving on. Otherwise you continue to torture yourself over this. It's just going to take a little time to get past it. Keep working on those Steps!
As a woman I can tell you that I do not want to be friends with a man I've previously slept with. It's too emotional and too complicated and it makes moving on to a new relationship nearly impossible for me.
I have to make a clean break.
She may or may not ever be any closer to you than she is right now. You have to find a way to deal with that. I've had it happen to me and I've done it myself. There is no painless, all-ends-tied-up, everyone-is-happy way to end it: and to me it sounds like that's what she's trying to do in the least confrontational way possible. Not everyone wants to stay friends with ex-lovers and that's okay.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 11,417
Agree with bim--seems like slow fade "trying to be nice" but want to end things behavior.
I also see the complications of someone recently divorced, early in sobriety, and finding herself as an individual again.
It's hard, but I suggest you try to respect that and give her space.
I also see the complications of someone recently divorced, early in sobriety, and finding herself as an individual again.
It's hard, but I suggest you try to respect that and give her space.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 2,909
I do have a sponsor and he is guiding me through step 2 at the moment and is unwilling or unable to advise me on this.
If it is just a case of dealing with the changes brought on by our sobriety then I can deal with that whether it be a temporary thing or more permanent. I just need to know so I can process and deal with it.
It is just a case of dealing with changes. I just need to process and deal with it.
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 8,674
That is a REALLY good point from Aries. I hadn't thought to pose the question if she had relapsed.
If so - I hope she can return to sobriety- but I would even MORE strongly suggest you stay on your side of the street.
If so - I hope she can return to sobriety- but I would even MORE strongly suggest you stay on your side of the street.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
on step 2- the timing couldnt be better to get through that and onto step 3 and beyond.
dont waste time sitting on steps. this is life or death.
step 2 is simple- There is a power that wants me to live.
do you agree with that? if so, onto step 3.
dont waste time sitting on steps. this is life or death.
step 2 is simple- There is a power that wants me to live.
do you agree with that? if so, onto step 3.
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