First AA retreat
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 18
First AA retreat
Hello all!
Been a few weeks but wanted to chime in.
Still sober!! Amazingly enough still plugging away, been going to a meeting or two every week, going really well.
On Monday a guy who used to attend that meeting popped back in due to scheduling and mentioned that there was a men's retreat this weekend and invited me to go. I signed up and arrived yesterday afternoon, spent the night and was there this morning.
Everyone was extremely friendly, very positive and welcoming. At the same time there was definitely a very religious undertone. I did the organized religion thing for a lot of years and this was a mirror image of those type of conventions. By lunchtime today I'd had all the holy I could handle and came home.
Was pretty disappointed, it seems there are still a number of folks who interpret higher power as god/jesus with token lip service to other ideas.
Not going to quit meetings by any means but wanted others to be aware of what they might be getting into. If I had known it was going to be a revival I wouldn't have spent the time/money and would be ahead for my effort.
Best of luck to all!
Been a few weeks but wanted to chime in.
Still sober!! Amazingly enough still plugging away, been going to a meeting or two every week, going really well.
On Monday a guy who used to attend that meeting popped back in due to scheduling and mentioned that there was a men's retreat this weekend and invited me to go. I signed up and arrived yesterday afternoon, spent the night and was there this morning.
Everyone was extremely friendly, very positive and welcoming. At the same time there was definitely a very religious undertone. I did the organized religion thing for a lot of years and this was a mirror image of those type of conventions. By lunchtime today I'd had all the holy I could handle and came home.
Was pretty disappointed, it seems there are still a number of folks who interpret higher power as god/jesus with token lip service to other ideas.
Not going to quit meetings by any means but wanted others to be aware of what they might be getting into. If I had known it was going to be a revival I wouldn't have spent the time/money and would be ahead for my effort.
Best of luck to all!
No Dogma Please
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,562
I don't like the God/Christianity aspect of 12 Step (which I encountered more strongly in the AA fellowships I checked out vs NA CA etc) in Los Angeles. But I could brush it off and take the best and leave the rest, or whatever that saying is. I did cringe whenever I heard things like "That's a Godshot" or "Take a piece of paper out of the GodBox and read it."
It was even more intense when I attended meetings in Bucks County PA when I visited my mom. My stint in AA would have been even shorter if that were my initial experience. I actually like the serenity prayer, it's not really a prayer if you leave off the word God at the beginning. Ending with the Lord's Prayer is just not OK with me. I'm a stone cold agnostic, and I'm certainly not a Christian.
Thank God (he said ironically) that there are secular sobriety methods for me to use. In LA if I'd really wanted to pursue 12 Step there were a number of meetings that very specifically were geared towards the agnostics.
It was even more intense when I attended meetings in Bucks County PA when I visited my mom. My stint in AA would have been even shorter if that were my initial experience. I actually like the serenity prayer, it's not really a prayer if you leave off the word God at the beginning. Ending with the Lord's Prayer is just not OK with me. I'm a stone cold agnostic, and I'm certainly not a Christian.
Thank God (he said ironically) that there are secular sobriety methods for me to use. In LA if I'd really wanted to pursue 12 Step there were a number of meetings that very specifically were geared towards the agnostics.
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 16,945
I think it’s a good idea to ask to see and agenda for any conference or retreat before paying money and going. And that would apply whether it’s an AA retreat, a work conference, a yoga retreat or anything for that matter.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: US
Posts: 5,095
I have a deep respect for AA. I have learned so much in the meetings over the years...much of it without even really realizing I was learning. I learned ideas about about emotional maturity that wouldn't have even dawned on me....which kind of stuns me now because they are so, well, basic. I know that AA is always there.... I have a place to go and people to connect to who understand me in a way that no one else can. I am so grateful for that.
The idea that half measures avail us nothing....I get that. And I agree...but in a different way than I personally interpreted the message earlier on. For me, staying on a fence kept me powerless...in other words, I internalized that if I wasn't spiritually fit, I couldn't stay sober. And, for me, as a non believer, that was a very dangerous place to be. So God wasn't my power, but I wasn't either. I was indeed powerless. I had to choose. Was it me? Or was it a higher power that stood between me and a drink. I finally decided it was me. That isn't to say that I am a higher power, I recognize I believe very realistically the immense limits of my own 'power'. But it did allow me to plant, very firmly, the responsibility of my abstinence.... in my own lap. It was that final understanding that I alone choose to drink. That I alone am 100% responsible.
I went to a retreat. Beautiful location. Lots of good people. But frankly, for me, it was weird as fluck. No other way for me to look at it. I hung in the first night and then high tailed it outta there first light. Ha. Well. Yeah. So that's on me. I know many who absolutely love the experience and go year after year. Just wasn't my cuppa.
The trick is to not then isolate. Think all or nothing. If the meetings are good, the people are good, keep going and learning. Stay open. Stay honest.
The idea that half measures avail us nothing....I get that. And I agree...but in a different way than I personally interpreted the message earlier on. For me, staying on a fence kept me powerless...in other words, I internalized that if I wasn't spiritually fit, I couldn't stay sober. And, for me, as a non believer, that was a very dangerous place to be. So God wasn't my power, but I wasn't either. I was indeed powerless. I had to choose. Was it me? Or was it a higher power that stood between me and a drink. I finally decided it was me. That isn't to say that I am a higher power, I recognize I believe very realistically the immense limits of my own 'power'. But it did allow me to plant, very firmly, the responsibility of my abstinence.... in my own lap. It was that final understanding that I alone choose to drink. That I alone am 100% responsible.
I went to a retreat. Beautiful location. Lots of good people. But frankly, for me, it was weird as fluck. No other way for me to look at it. I hung in the first night and then high tailed it outta there first light. Ha. Well. Yeah. So that's on me. I know many who absolutely love the experience and go year after year. Just wasn't my cuppa.
The trick is to not then isolate. Think all or nothing. If the meetings are good, the people are good, keep going and learning. Stay open. Stay honest.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 79
I've only attended 1 AA meeting in my area in the last ~20 years, but it did seem to have a different "feel" than my home group NA meeting. As others have, I would certainly encourage you to keep attending AA if you feel like it's helping even a little bit. Sorry to hear you had a bad experience with the Retreat.
I have a deep respect for AA because without it, NA would have never existed, and without NA I really have to wonder where I would be right now in my life.
Originally Posted by MindfulMan 
I don't like the God/Christianity aspect of 12 Step (which I encountered more strongly in the AA fellowships I checked out vs NA CA etc) in Los Angeles. But I could brush it off and take the best and leave the rest, or whatever that saying is.
Originally Posted by Frickaflip233
I have a deep respect for AA. I have learned so much in the meetings over the years...much of it without even really realizing I was learning. I learned ideas about about emotional maturity that wouldn't have even dawned on me....which kind of stuns me now because they are so, well, basic. I know that AA is always there.... I have a place to go and people to connect to who understand me in a way that no one else can. I am so grateful for that.
The idea that half measures avail us nothing....I get that. And I agree...but in a different way than I personally interpreted the message earlier on. For me, staying on a fence kept me powerless...in other words, I internalized that if I wasn't spiritually fit, I couldn't stay sober. And, for me, as a non believer, that was a very dangerous place to be. So God wasn't my power, but I wasn't either. I was indeed powerless. I had to choose. Was it me? Or was it a higher power that stood between me and a drink. I finally decided it was me. That isn't to say that I am a higher power, I recognize I believe very realistically the immense limits of my own 'power'. But it did allow me to plant, very firmly, the responsibility of my abstinence.... in my own lap. It was that final understanding that I alone choose to drink. That I alone am 100% responsible.
I went to a retreat. Beautiful location. Lots of good people. But frankly, for me, it was weird as fluck. No other way for me to look at it. I hung in the first night and then high tailed it outta there first light. Ha. Well. Yeah. So that's on me. I know many who absolutely love the experience and go year after year. Just wasn't my cuppa.
The trick is to not then isolate. Think all or nothing. If the meetings are good, the people are good, keep going and learning. Stay open. Stay honest.
The idea that half measures avail us nothing....I get that. And I agree...but in a different way than I personally interpreted the message earlier on. For me, staying on a fence kept me powerless...in other words, I internalized that if I wasn't spiritually fit, I couldn't stay sober. And, for me, as a non believer, that was a very dangerous place to be. So God wasn't my power, but I wasn't either. I was indeed powerless. I had to choose. Was it me? Or was it a higher power that stood between me and a drink. I finally decided it was me. That isn't to say that I am a higher power, I recognize I believe very realistically the immense limits of my own 'power'. But it did allow me to plant, very firmly, the responsibility of my abstinence.... in my own lap. It was that final understanding that I alone choose to drink. That I alone am 100% responsible.
I went to a retreat. Beautiful location. Lots of good people. But frankly, for me, it was weird as fluck. No other way for me to look at it. I hung in the first night and then high tailed it outta there first light. Ha. Well. Yeah. So that's on me. I know many who absolutely love the experience and go year after year. Just wasn't my cuppa.
The trick is to not then isolate. Think all or nothing. If the meetings are good, the people are good, keep going and learning. Stay open. Stay honest.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 18
Originally Posted by ScottFromWI
I think it’s a good idea to ask to see and agenda for any conference or retreat before paying money and going. And that would apply whether it’s an AA retreat, a work conference, a yoga retreat or anything for that matter.
The issue was not the program, it was the execution. Meetings/discussions/workshops that could have been extremely helpful and constructive while staying religiously neutral invariably spiraled into affirmations of faith, praise to our great lord and savior jesus christ, praying etc. There was mention a few times of "or whatever higher power you believe in.." as an aside, but it was a footnote at best.
Most of the people there were probably served very well by the confirmation of their beliefs, but if AA claims to be non religious this wasn't a good showing. It could have been just as helpful, perhaps even more so by staying on message and off the pulpit.
It's inevitable, any organization as faith based as AA is going to have members who see it as an extension of their religion. Unfortunately the organizers/moderators didn't do a better job setting the tone.
Again, this isn't to convince anyone that they should/shouldn't be religious or that they should/shouldn't go to a retreat etc- just a head's up that what is described and what is delivered might look a little different to some.
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,378
I'm sorry the retreat was not what you thought it would be Kingpin.
Live and Learn.
I think Scotts point is great - make sure what you're signing up for neforehand - that applies to everything.
As for AA - if it's working for you, I wouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater over this one experience.
D
Live and Learn.
I think Scotts point is great - make sure what you're signing up for neforehand - that applies to everything.
As for AA - if it's working for you, I wouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater over this one experience.
D
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 18
Thanks Dee, and others who have replied.
Sorry if I explained poorly earlier, but I agree with what it seemed like what Scott was saying: if its going to be a religion-centric retreat and that's not your thing, don't go.
That makes perfect sense.
However, that isn't at all what was described to me. I was sold on a really chill bunch of guys getting together to support each other and work on ourselves/our sobriety. What I actually ran into was a program that said for example:
"9:30-11:00 am group discussions on steps 1-3"
Well that sounds great, something for everyone, new/experienced/christian/atheist/young/old etc etc. We look at things objectively, respect where different people are coming from, find ways to encourage and support each other- awesome.
But that isn't what actually happened. The "workshop" was a praise the lord and pass the ammunition, testify to the spirit, get on your knees and thank jesus he saved you commitment to being good little born agains. They hadn't started handling snakes or speaking in tongues before I left but who knows.
Again, and I can't overstate this- if that's your thing and it keeps you sane/sober get it get it, more power to you. At the same time, in the interest of full disclosure people ought to know that that's what they may be getting into.
Like I said my local group has been amazing and I have no intention on quitting meetings or anything like that. Have one tomorrow evening that I am genuinely looking forward to. I'm not upset that the retreat was what it was, just call a spade a spade.
Sorry if I explained poorly earlier, but I agree with what it seemed like what Scott was saying: if its going to be a religion-centric retreat and that's not your thing, don't go.
That makes perfect sense.
However, that isn't at all what was described to me. I was sold on a really chill bunch of guys getting together to support each other and work on ourselves/our sobriety. What I actually ran into was a program that said for example:
"9:30-11:00 am group discussions on steps 1-3"
Well that sounds great, something for everyone, new/experienced/christian/atheist/young/old etc etc. We look at things objectively, respect where different people are coming from, find ways to encourage and support each other- awesome.
But that isn't what actually happened. The "workshop" was a praise the lord and pass the ammunition, testify to the spirit, get on your knees and thank jesus he saved you commitment to being good little born agains. They hadn't started handling snakes or speaking in tongues before I left but who knows.
Again, and I can't overstate this- if that's your thing and it keeps you sane/sober get it get it, more power to you. At the same time, in the interest of full disclosure people ought to know that that's what they may be getting into.
Like I said my local group has been amazing and I have no intention on quitting meetings or anything like that. Have one tomorrow evening that I am genuinely looking forward to. I'm not upset that the retreat was what it was, just call a spade a spade.
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,378
Some people reading this thread might be fundamentalist Christians - probably no snake handlers but certainly some who have Pentecostal beliefs.
Its not my bag, but more power to them and their faith
Generally I'd never go away anywhere without knowing at least some of the people fairly well, but that's just me.
You tried it didn't like it and came home.
Still sober, still committed.
At least you know now right?
D
Its not my bag, but more power to them and their faith
Generally I'd never go away anywhere without knowing at least some of the people fairly well, but that's just me.
You tried it didn't like it and came home.
Still sober, still committed.
At least you know now right?
D
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 18
Originally Posted by Dee74
Generally I'd never go away anywhere without knowing at least some of the people fairly well, but that's just me.
D
D
Thought AA was AA- all in this together, your higher power is as good as my higher power, or his higher power, or her higher power etc etc.
Sometimes that just isn't so. Sometimes those aligned with the almighty are just right and you're just wrong and they're just being patient and patronizing whilst you meander your way toward their way of thinking.
I do know now, and hopefully others do as well and can make a more informed decision moving forward.
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,378
Even the best of us can sometimes patronise others and fall into thinking our way of thinking is, if not the best, better than theirs...
I'm an outsider to AA but my point is that people believe what they believe, you believe what you believe and the fact that someones AA is not your AA (or vice versa) shouldn't and doesn't weaken AA.
I think it makes any group stronger to have a multiplicity of discourses beliefs and ideas - and from what I've read here from AAers, I think it proves the idea that a HP of your understanding- whatever that is - works.
D
I'm an outsider to AA but my point is that people believe what they believe, you believe what you believe and the fact that someones AA is not your AA (or vice versa) shouldn't and doesn't weaken AA.
I think it makes any group stronger to have a multiplicity of discourses beliefs and ideas - and from what I've read here from AAers, I think it proves the idea that a HP of your understanding- whatever that is - works.
D
No Dogma Please
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,562
Originally Posted by Dee74
Even the best of us can sometimes patronise others and fall into thinking our way of thinking is, if not the best, better than theirs...
I'm an outsider to AA but my point is that people believe what they believe, you believe what you believe and the fact that someones AA is not your AA (or vice versa) shouldn't and doesn't weaken AA.
I think it makes any group stronger to have a multiplicity of discourses beliefs and ideas - and from what I've read here from AAers, I think it proves the idea that a HP of your understanding- whatever that is - works.
D
I'm an outsider to AA but my point is that people believe what they believe, you believe what you believe and the fact that someones AA is not your AA (or vice versa) shouldn't and doesn't weaken AA.
I think it makes any group stronger to have a multiplicity of discourses beliefs and ideas - and from what I've read here from AAers, I think it proves the idea that a HP of your understanding- whatever that is - works.
D
Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
Kingpin, something you might be interested in that doesnt have the religious tones are AA roundups. also if theres AA picnics in your are. both have been pretty good experiences for me.
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