Control or Good Idea
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 23
Control or Good Idea
Hi There,
My hubby and I are at a stand-off essentially and I was hoping for some opinions;
We are at the breaking point essentially and for me to continue to support him and be in the relationship I told him I need to see more work on his recovery. Currently he goes one night per week of Celebrate Recovery. They aren't doing step studies and the group is tiny with sometimes only two or three men there. I said for me to be comfortable with trying to patch things up, I need to see something else. I am not dictating what that something else is but it has to be something at the very least that takes him out of the home and it is a positive thing for his life and recovery.
He says I am controlling his recovery and it would never work that way and that it is extremely codependent of me. I truly feel the opposite and just setting up my boundaries and what I can live with.
I feel he needs AA; he got sober in AA but has some resentments towards it and states it isn't an option anymore. I say he is giving excuses and isn't as truly committed as he is trying to make me believe.
Just some back story, he was sober for about 13 years and fell off the wagon about two years ago. He isn't a daily drinker but when he gets depressed he hits the bottle and chaos ensues.
Any comments and thoughts would be so appreciated.
Thank you
My hubby and I are at a stand-off essentially and I was hoping for some opinions;
We are at the breaking point essentially and for me to continue to support him and be in the relationship I told him I need to see more work on his recovery. Currently he goes one night per week of Celebrate Recovery. They aren't doing step studies and the group is tiny with sometimes only two or three men there. I said for me to be comfortable with trying to patch things up, I need to see something else. I am not dictating what that something else is but it has to be something at the very least that takes him out of the home and it is a positive thing for his life and recovery.
He says I am controlling his recovery and it would never work that way and that it is extremely codependent of me. I truly feel the opposite and just setting up my boundaries and what I can live with.
I feel he needs AA; he got sober in AA but has some resentments towards it and states it isn't an option anymore. I say he is giving excuses and isn't as truly committed as he is trying to make me believe.
Just some back story, he was sober for about 13 years and fell off the wagon about two years ago. He isn't a daily drinker but when he gets depressed he hits the bottle and chaos ensues.
Any comments and thoughts would be so appreciated.
Thank you
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,637
Hi Edge, just my opinion, of course but yes, it's probably a good idea and yes it's also controlling.
His recovery is his. A boundary is for you, not a "rule" or instruction for him.
A boundary would be, if he does not show more interest in true recovery by <insert what that means to you like attending AA, actually QUITTING drinking etc> then we will have to separate. I will give him 1 week to show me that.
That's for you, not for him. You have shared with him what you would like to see him do and that's fair, you have been clear, that should be the end of the conversation on that. The boundary is what YOU want and what YOU are prepared to do if that is not followed through on, he doesn't have to do anything, it's all about you.
You can share that boundary with him, or not, that's up to you but if you do you need to be prepared to actually follow through.
He's been back drinking for two years, I'd hazard a guess he has no intention of quitting right now.
You are correct. Follow your instinct on this.
His recovery is his. A boundary is for you, not a "rule" or instruction for him.
A boundary would be, if he does not show more interest in true recovery by <insert what that means to you like attending AA, actually QUITTING drinking etc> then we will have to separate. I will give him 1 week to show me that.
That's for you, not for him. You have shared with him what you would like to see him do and that's fair, you have been clear, that should be the end of the conversation on that. The boundary is what YOU want and what YOU are prepared to do if that is not followed through on, he doesn't have to do anything, it's all about you.
You can share that boundary with him, or not, that's up to you but if you do you need to be prepared to actually follow through.
He's been back drinking for two years, I'd hazard a guess he has no intention of quitting right now.
Originally Posted by Edge2007 
I say he is giving excuses and isn't as truly committed as he is trying to make me believe.
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Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 34
I am not sure of the answer either. I am in a similar boat in wanting certain things to be done in order to show active recovery steps and I struggle with the “am I trying to control?” or “is this a boundary for me?”
I wish I could be more helpful but please know that you are not alone! My AH says the same type of things “you are trying to control my recovery” and “you don’t have all the answers” when he is unhappy with my new found strength in holding my ground.
I wish I could be more helpful but please know that you are not alone! My AH says the same type of things “you are trying to control my recovery” and “you don’t have all the answers” when he is unhappy with my new found strength in holding my ground.
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,637
Originally Posted by SorNS
My AH says the same type of things “you are trying to control my recovery” and “you don’t have all the answers” when he is unhappy with my new found strength in holding my ground.
You have told him this is the way it is. You use the breathalyzer, only a zero reading will allow you to see the children etc.
You are not 'requiring" him to do anything. He can go sit in the bar and drink all day if he wants.
That's a boundary, which is about protecting you and your children.
If he wishes to be part of your lives, this is what you require. He can do that - or not, you are not forcing him to do anything.
Requirements for returning to the family home, whatever they are, are a relationship discussion and that doesn't have to happen very often, otherwise it is just controlling. He is either doing what is required or not, again, not in your control.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 23
Thanks for the responses. Very appreciated
Essentially it is a boundary AND control I guess. I am saying this is what I require to be able to continue in the relationship with you and if you don't do it you have to leave (and sticking to it). What a splitting hairs type of situation!
I understand it is his recovery but I guess I know that the small effort he is making won't ultimately work in the long run so it is up to him to do more or go.
Essentially it is a boundary AND control I guess. I am saying this is what I require to be able to continue in the relationship with you and if you don't do it you have to leave (and sticking to it). What a splitting hairs type of situation!
I understand it is his recovery but I guess I know that the small effort he is making won't ultimately work in the long run so it is up to him to do more or go.
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,637
I totally get the splitting hairs idea. It seems almost petty.
Then you look at the bigger picture and at least to me, it's not at all.
You have to take yourself out of his recovery because it really is his and anything less than that is trying to control. You didn't Cause it, can't Control it and can't Cure it.
By saying it once, you are stating your intention - this is what I require or leave. More than once is just a shot at control that you don't actually have.
Stating it is sharing your personal boundary and there is nothing wrong with that at all if you want to, that's your call, some people do, some don't.
Then you look at the bigger picture and at least to me, it's not at all.
You have to take yourself out of his recovery because it really is his and anything less than that is trying to control. You didn't Cause it, can't Control it and can't Cure it.
By saying it once, you are stating your intention - this is what I require or leave. More than once is just a shot at control that you don't actually have.
Stating it is sharing your personal boundary and there is nothing wrong with that at all if you want to, that's your call, some people do, some don't.
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Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 34
Trailmix - you are so wise and thank you for your replies.
You may think I have boundaires in regards with the breathalyzer test and access to the kids and with that I agree.
However I still monitor AND ask AND check AND wonder about his meeting schedule. It is definitely a lot less now that he is no longer living under the same roof as me but I still drive myself crazy with trying to “manage” his disease.
I am still in a place where the three C’s actually cause me to laugh. I still believe (as ridiculous and crazy as I know it is) that I did cause or a least contribute to it, I can cure it (by sheer nagging and threatening) and I can control it by........I don’t actually know how. As is read “Codependency No More” I am stunned by how it resonates with me. I am stunned to know that I am completely unhealthy and have become invisible. I know there is a better way and I am striving to find it.
You may think I have boundaires in regards with the breathalyzer test and access to the kids and with that I agree.
However I still monitor AND ask AND check AND wonder about his meeting schedule. It is definitely a lot less now that he is no longer living under the same roof as me but I still drive myself crazy with trying to “manage” his disease.
I am still in a place where the three C’s actually cause me to laugh. I still believe (as ridiculous and crazy as I know it is) that I did cause or a least contribute to it, I can cure it (by sheer nagging and threatening) and I can control it by........I don’t actually know how. As is read “Codependency No More” I am stunned by how it resonates with me. I am stunned to know that I am completely unhealthy and have become invisible. I know there is a better way and I am striving to find it.
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,637
Originally Posted by SorNS
I am still in a place where the three C’s actually cause me to laugh. I still believe (as ridiculous and crazy as I know it is) that I did cause or a least contribute to it, I can cure it (by sheer nagging and threatening) and I can control it by........I don’t actually know how.
An analogy about causing it. Let's say I overeat to calm myself and manage my emotions. You owe me $50.00 and I'm depending on you paying me back today as you said you would. Well, as it turns out, you have no gas in your car and unless you spend some of the money you can't return it today!
I bake a cake and eat half of it, but all the icing (I really like icing).
Are you responsible for that? I can see how you might think you are but you really aren't. How I choose to react to something or deal with it is entirely up to me. I could have chosen to jump on the treadmill or go for a walk, but I didn't.
If I had chosen the walk would you then think, well at least by not paying her back today she burned an extra 300 calories! I doubt it.
So it's just misplaced guilt on your part really. I'm a grown-up, what I chose to do about something is up to me.
I don't know how long he has been drinking, how many years, but I imagine a lot of "nagging and threatening" has happened. Andddd - doesn't work. If it did, few would be alcoholics, also, if you could love people out of alcoholism, this forum would not exist.
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Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,618
Originally Posted by SorNS
I am not sure of the answer either. I am in a similar boat in wanting certain things to be done in order to show active recovery steps and I struggle with the “am I trying to control?” or “is this a boundary for me?”
I wish I could be more helpful but please know that you are not alone! My AH says the same type of things “you are trying to control my recovery” and “you don’t have all the answers” when he is unhappy with my new found strength in holding my ground.
I wish I could be more helpful but please know that you are not alone! My AH says the same type of things “you are trying to control my recovery” and “you don’t have all the answers” when he is unhappy with my new found strength in holding my ground.
"Controlling" behavior to me is issuing a lot of you-statements and demands: You have to stop drinking, you must take all your breathalyzers as scheduled, etc, etc. Which is futile.
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Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 681
Originally Posted by trailmix
Yes and I understand why someone would want to monitor, as it affects you, but the truth is, it changes absolutely nothing, zero. Your monitoring of his meetings is meaningless, to him and ultimately to you. He will either attend, or not.
An analogy about causing it. Let's say I overeat to calm myself and manage my emotions. You owe me $50.00 and I'm depending on you paying me back today as you said you would. Well, as it turns out, you have no gas in your car and unless you spend some of the money you can't return it today!
I bake a cake and eat half of it, but all the icing (I really like icing).
Are you responsible for that? I can see how you might think you are but you really aren't. How I choose to react to something or deal with it is entirely up to me. I could have chosen to jump on the treadmill or go for a walk, but I didn't.
If I had chosen the walk would you then think, well at least by not paying her back today she burned an extra 300 calories! I doubt it.
So it's just misplaced guilt on your part really. I'm a grown-up, what I chose to do about something is up to me.
I don't know how long he has been drinking, how many years, but I imagine a lot of "nagging and threatening" has happened. Andddd - doesn't work. If it did, few would be alcoholics, also, if you could love people out of alcoholism, this forum would not exist.
An analogy about causing it. Let's say I overeat to calm myself and manage my emotions. You owe me $50.00 and I'm depending on you paying me back today as you said you would. Well, as it turns out, you have no gas in your car and unless you spend some of the money you can't return it today!
I bake a cake and eat half of it, but all the icing (I really like icing).
Are you responsible for that? I can see how you might think you are but you really aren't. How I choose to react to something or deal with it is entirely up to me. I could have chosen to jump on the treadmill or go for a walk, but I didn't.
If I had chosen the walk would you then think, well at least by not paying her back today she burned an extra 300 calories! I doubt it.
So it's just misplaced guilt on your part really. I'm a grown-up, what I chose to do about something is up to me.
I don't know how long he has been drinking, how many years, but I imagine a lot of "nagging and threatening" has happened. Andddd - doesn't work. If it did, few would be alcoholics, also, if you could love people out of alcoholism, this forum would not exist.
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Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 108
Originally Posted by Edge2007
I say he is giving excuses and isn't as truly committed as he is trying to make me believe.
Obviously, you have a lot more invested in your marriage. But if someone really wanted to change their life and save a relationship, wouldn't they do whatever it takes? I do think, in my relationship, I was very controlling in terms of always trying to persuade, argue, threaten, etc. my ex to get help. All my attempts to control his relationship with alcohol did nothing or maybe made it worse.
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Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 108
Originally Posted by Edge2007
Thanks for the responses. Very appreciated
Essentially it is a boundary AND control I guess. I am saying this is what I require to be able to continue in the relationship with you and if you don't do it you have to leave (and sticking to it). What a splitting hairs type of situation!
I understand it is his recovery but I guess I know that the small effort he is making won't ultimately work in the long run so it is up to him to do more or go.
Essentially it is a boundary AND control I guess. I am saying this is what I require to be able to continue in the relationship with you and if you don't do it you have to leave (and sticking to it). What a splitting hairs type of situation!
I understand it is his recovery but I guess I know that the small effort he is making won't ultimately work in the long run so it is up to him to do more or go.
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Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 565
Originally Posted by SorNS
My AH says the same type of things “you are trying to control my recovery” and “you don’t have all the answers” when he is unhappy with my new found strength in holding my ground.
It's also a classic deflection maneuver to try and get the focus off them and on to your obvious flaws...
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 6,047
I'm a bit both ways on this. I know I stopped drinking without a program, and my only ongoing support is here on SR. Not everyone likes AA or gets something from it; I would have gone if I felt I needed to, but luckily I was strong enough on my own.
I don't think AA would necessarily stop your AH from drinking. What I don't know is how he's handling recovery. Is he acting like a dry drunk, or making you uncomfortable? There would be a case for him going if he isn't handling sobriety well and needs further support.
If you want him to go to AA because you feel that will make you less nervous, then that's about you, not him. He may have reached that equilibrium in himself were he is comfortable about sobriety. I did, even though I struggled for a long time before that.
I don't think AA would necessarily stop your AH from drinking. What I don't know is how he's handling recovery. Is he acting like a dry drunk, or making you uncomfortable? There would be a case for him going if he isn't handling sobriety well and needs further support.
If you want him to go to AA because you feel that will make you less nervous, then that's about you, not him. He may have reached that equilibrium in himself were he is comfortable about sobriety. I did, even though I struggled for a long time before that.
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I read these responses and wanted to share my thoughts as the alcoholic.
Nothing will make anyone stop drinking til we choose to - period.
My parents and I developed a very enmeshed and complicated relationship - as I began my descent to insanity as an adult in my 30s. Ultimately, we are ALL grateful they stuck by me - and we have a very good relationship that has involved work by everyone in my now 3 years and 2 wks sober.
My thoughts from your specifics above-
A breathalyzer is a terrible idea. I learned how to beat it; it was a constant source of tension and resentment, and a version of my parents trying to run an in-home rehab.
I knew that they were 99.9999% unlikely to follow thru on any "this is it" type ultimatums. So the cycle continued, thru me living with them, not living with them, getting caught hiding bottles everywhere (even at my own place)...on and on.
Your conviction that he has to choose, and commit to recovery is absolutely correct. However, you cannot dictate it to him, do it for him, and learning and accepting that is HARD. Very. Boundary-learning for ALL of us took time, it was confusing, it involved them trusting me as I demonstrated ACTION, and me beginning to trust MYSELF that I could live sober.
This whole thing is so complicated- I am firmly in the "camp" that addiction is a family disease. Everyone has to heal - and is responsible first and foremost for their own way of that.
Many people leave their alcoholic spouse; many don't. It's a very personal thing. I wish you the best and the outcome of your own peace with your choices.
Nothing will make anyone stop drinking til we choose to - period.
My parents and I developed a very enmeshed and complicated relationship - as I began my descent to insanity as an adult in my 30s. Ultimately, we are ALL grateful they stuck by me - and we have a very good relationship that has involved work by everyone in my now 3 years and 2 wks sober.
My thoughts from your specifics above-
A breathalyzer is a terrible idea. I learned how to beat it; it was a constant source of tension and resentment, and a version of my parents trying to run an in-home rehab.
I knew that they were 99.9999% unlikely to follow thru on any "this is it" type ultimatums. So the cycle continued, thru me living with them, not living with them, getting caught hiding bottles everywhere (even at my own place)...on and on.
Your conviction that he has to choose, and commit to recovery is absolutely correct. However, you cannot dictate it to him, do it for him, and learning and accepting that is HARD. Very. Boundary-learning for ALL of us took time, it was confusing, it involved them trusting me as I demonstrated ACTION, and me beginning to trust MYSELF that I could live sober.
This whole thing is so complicated- I am firmly in the "camp" that addiction is a family disease. Everyone has to heal - and is responsible first and foremost for their own way of that.
Many people leave their alcoholic spouse; many don't. It's a very personal thing. I wish you the best and the outcome of your own peace with your choices.
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